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Ever evolving garage plans...

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laurie71

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If it's that close to standing on the J-bolt and a panel break, I'd step the actual stud to the side to clear the bolt, and 'sister' a 2x4 to it as panel nailer on the break. Structurally sound (unbroken column between plates) and greatest nailing area for the panels.

My .02 YPU (Yankee Purchasing Unit) on the subject. :)

Yeah, that might be the best compromise. This is a non-bearing gabel wall so I have little leeway in terms of structural integrity, but I suspect this isn't going to be the only time I encounter this problem...
 
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TractorJeff

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Concrete guy sent me an updated quote. I'll clear it with the wife, then sign it to get scheduled! Following your Thread with interest as mine will be a Menards Building also!
 
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laurie71

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Concrete guy sent me an updated quote. I'll clear it with the wife, then sign it to get scheduled! Following your Thread with interest as mine will be a Menards Building also!

Congrats! Getting quotes for the concrete work took forever here, good to hear you've cleared that hurdle! Do you have a build thread going yet?
 
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laurie71

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Thursday didn't see any framing get done, as I spent the day thinking about the stud / j-bolt conflict while running errands and generally getting done everything I could that wasn't this...

Friday I decided to just get on with what I could, so I started nailing off the first 12' section of wall up to the problem stud. One of the errands I ran the day before was to pick up some drill bits, which allowed me to drill for the 3 j-bolts that pass through this plate. With the holes drilled, I dropped the plate over the bolts to check for fit:

IMG_0403.jpgIMG_0402.jpg

Success! Then I nailed off the first six studs, leaving the 'problem' stud for later.

I was away for the weekend, so I didn't get back out there until today. The first thing I did was to precisely measure the j-bolt locations. I gave the concrete crew a framing schedule and a j-bolt placement spec: "no more than 12' apart, and not more than 6" from each corner." So, they placed the first bolt at 6" from the corner, then put one in every 6' from the edge. If they'd gone 6' from the first bolt everything would have worked out, but they measured from the edge of the slab...

Yup, that meant every one of them is where a stud needs to go! :3gears:

At least they put in twice as many as minimally required, so I can't complain too much. And as it turns out, they were off by just enough that alot of them miss, but there will be multiple conflicts, probably all the way around. Which made me realize: I should have hit this problem at 6' from the edge; what's up with that?

IMG_0410.jpg

What's up with that is that I'd accidentally mislocated that stud, thus avoiding the problem. It's not a critical stud location, as the sheathing wont break over that stud; I'll just have to adjust my nailing pattern to compensate.

Luckily, I correctly measured each stud from the end of the plate, rather than marking, measuring another 24", marking, measuring another 24"... All the other studs were correctly marked and placed.

Measuring out the j-bolt locations as installed, I realized I has another problem. The first 16' sill plate would be captured by three bolts; the second would also be captured by three bolts; and the last 4' fill piece would be captured by... none! :eyecrazy:

There is a bolt in that corner, but it's 6" from the edge in the wrong direction; it'll capture the end of the adjoining wall, but misses this one. That had me scratching my head, too. Then I had an epiphany; if I just move the 4' section to the middle, I'd have two bolts through the 16'er and one through the 4'er in the middle.

This is what we're aiming for:

bolts.jpg

With that plan in mind, I started framing from the other end toward the middle. That went quickly, then I came back to that problem stud. You can see that it's close:

IMG_0407 2.jpg

The bolt, nut, and fender washer (which I picked up while running around on Thursday) are centered on the edge of the stud. If I hold it back about 3/4" I should be OK.

I decided to nail it on location up top (as I already trimmed the top plate to length and needed stud to nail off the connecting plate to). At the bottom, the stud turned out to have just a bit of twist that worked to my advantage:

IMG_0420.jpg

Result: first 12' section is framed up:

IMG_0428.jpg

[continued in next post...]
 
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laurie71

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[continued...]

For the second wall section things went a lot faster, due to the lessons I learned on the previous section. I started by measuring and marking j-bolt locations on the sill plate, then stud locations on the sill and top plate.

IMG_0411.jpgIMG_0416.jpg

There was one conflict that needs to be addressed, and I forgot about it when I nailed it, so I'll have to do some trimming and whittling to get the fender washer on that bolt. The rest of the bolts just clear the studs they're near.

This time I layout out all the studs on edge, and correctly crowned each one as I set it in place. The second picture shows that j-bolt I mentioned in the last post that's not going to contribute anything to this wall...

IMG_0415.jpgIMG_0417.jpg

One sill plate runs slightly long and will need a trim cut; the other I think is OK as is:

IMG_0425.jpgIMG_0424.jpg

So now I have two 12' sections completed.

IMG_0423.jpg

Still no sheathing on site, though, and I want to get the walls at least part sheathed before standing them. That didn't stop me from trying to get one up, or at least figure out how I was going to do so. But that led to some new problems and lessons learned.

Lessons learned today:

  • some of my 2x6 stock is 1/8 - 1/16" short; I don't think that's enough to matter once the walls are in compression from the roof load, but it's disconcerting to have gaps...
  • the smooth shank nails Menards supplied pull out pretty easily; I'll need to angle them in more to get a better hold so framing members don't separate
  • toe nailing the studs to the plate to try and prevent separation just makes it harder to get everything back tight when it pulls apart anyway!
 

TractorJeff

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No, I haven't started a build thread yet as it may not go any further than a concrete slab for this year? Good to know about the bolts as we haven't bought the kit yet so I don't have any finalized drawings to share with the concrete guy. I'll markup up the one page from the Design Center to give him for the bolt placement. He says he maybe here in 2 weeks?
 
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laurie71

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TractorJeff, I don't know if you ever went back to the begginning of the thread, but I started posting in the early planning stages, long before the project got started. I got a lot of useful advice as I worked out what I was going to be doing.

This building isn't from a Menards kit; I designed it myself to meet our needs. I just used their estimation tool to build the initial materials estimate. I looked at some of their kits, though, in the early stages. Never spent the money for a full set of plans, so I don't know how much detail they have -- but if there isn't a specific bolt placement schedule, I'd definitely recommend providing that information to avoid the problem I have.
 
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laurie71

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Back while I was waiting for delivery from Menards, I thought it might be useful to get the materials list from the estimate (or the portion I actually placed the order for) into Sketchup so I could figure out which materials might be tight (or short).

This is the 3D representation of what I was expecting to have delivered:

Lumber Package.jpg

Next I started moving lumber around to get a representation of the result of framing:

Framing.jpg

It seems to me like I have way too much lumber... The stairs aren't built, and a lot of the material on the ground is for that. The pile of 2x4s I can't think of any use for except bracing the walls when I stand them. But look at all those 2x6s (the ones standing on end)... even once I add horizontal fire blocking in all the stud cavities, it looks like I'll have a lot of those to spare.

One useful thing this exercise told me: I don't have enough treated 2x6-16s to plate all around the perimeter and then cut out for the openings after the fact. I'll need to be strategic about how I build and stand the front gable wall.

I also realized that the string materials come in two different lengths. Either (a) the estimate assumes a landing, and two different sets of stringers; or (b) they expect me to two of each length and sister them in a staggered configuration to achieve the required length.

The other thing building this model let me do was produce a detailed framing plan. If I get hit by a bus, my wife can hire someone to come and put the building together... :bounce:

Framing Plan.jpg

I have that printed at 3' x 4' (1'3" x 4' if you ignore the unused space). It should be super handy to have when I frame the openings.
 

TractorJeff

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Well, its not so much a kit as I am using the estimator to build my design but in the constraints of the Computer Program. Today I went in while getting my truck serviced and he looked it up and said it was old. He started to rebuild it on their computer system which has way more options but way less speed. He got about halfway thru when the computer crashed and dumped the work. All he could suggest is to come back in during the week as weekends are always computer busy.
I'm disappointed and may just figure out the materials list, then shop a couple of other box stores where I generally get a 10% discount anyways. (In a Quandary)
 
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laurie71

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Ah, OK, same thing I did more or less. I'd advise going in on a weekday, and asking to speak to the estimator; the guys at the materials desk can drive the software but the estimator can do more, including finding anything that needs to be special order (e.g. non-stocked overhead doors) and get that sorted out. I gave him my building specs and two days later he gave me a materials list and pricing.

You can still take that to other stores for comparison quotes, although I had mixed results from that.
 

TractorJeff

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Yeah, right now its raining. Maybe I regenerate it, then call the Estimator with updates and see if he'll do the same for me. I got the OK to purchase the materials, so maybe we can at least get the rough framing down before the Snow gets to deep?
Keep going on yours and when we get further I'll start a Thread.
 

TractorJeff

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Waiting this morning for an Email to see if the purchase can occur this week with the 11% Sale.
Need to ask how tall your walls came out to be?
Also what did the pitch on the roof end up being?
This will generate your overall height.
 
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laurie71

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Sorry I missed your query TractorJeff; my studs are just over 12' putting me at about 12' 4 1/2" to top of ceiling. I went with an 8:12 pitch for the roof.
 

TractorJeff

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Right now its all paid for and should be delivered before Thanksgiving as I am fantasizing that I will have a 4 day weekend to work on it. Now if ALL the people who promised to help will show up?
I'm calculating 12' 4 1/2" also, with a 4:12 pitch on (4' 8") and 1/2" sheeting to get to 17' 1"?
I'm hoping that the Building Inspector will let an inch or two slide as it would **** to have to cut 1" from every single 2 x 6!
 
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