Extension Ladder Stifness?

[pcmeiners]

"So being near the top of a 28' aluminum ladder when thunder rolled in, wind started whipping the tops of the 100 foot tall oaks around....a storm chase's dream."

Guess you never did electric work off a ladder, or worried about tool grounding, or worked in bad weather around electric on a ladder, or as I mentioned, have a utility line electrify your aluminum ladder. 28' ladder, child's play.

 

[NUTTSGT]

I took some pictures a while back at ladder testing. Fascinating and I never saw our ladders flex like that before.

Same boys test our ground ladders and ladder truck.

Was that a "yearly" non-destructive test?
That thing is flexed pretty good.

Every year.... it's amay watching the ladders get tested. It makes you feel better about using them.

 

[Jagmandave]

I'm under orders to stay the hell off the ladder and call someone to do the job - it pisses me off, but orders are orders......so they say. Mine come from the bride, but my heart doc concurs. I've had too many of my older friends get seriously hurt from ladder falls. I am allowed on the 6 ft fiberglass, but that's it.

 

[Stelzer]

There is little difference in stiffness between Type 1 & II. Ladder safety is very important to me. I will not climb more than 2 steps on anything less than Type 1A.

More often than not, it's the person climbing the ladder and not whether it's type 1 vs. 2. I have well over 20 ladders, been climbing them as a Painting Contractor for 35 years, and I wouldn't hesitate for 1 second before going past the 2nd rung on a type 2. Ladder safety is important to me as well. I use 'em in the winter for Christmas light installs as well for the last 28 years, even the type 2. It doesn't matter to me one bit. Ladder safety is still important then too. It isn't unsafe to use type 2 unless you're using them outside the parameters in which they were designed.

Doesn't seem OP knows what he wants either.
You can have sturdiest
You can have lightest
You can't have both.
Decide which is more important to you and your needs.
If the highest you're going is 24', opt for Type 1. Any higher and you'll have to choose what's most important to you.
Between 24'-32', most of mine are Type 2. Both my 40's are Type 1 because if I'm going that high, I want the most stable. For all other occasions, I don't care.

 

[Beemer]

Doesn't seem OP knows what he wants either.
You can have sturdiest
You can have lightest
You can't have both.
Decide which is more important to you and your needs.
If the highest you're going is 24', opt for Type 1. Any higher and you'll have to choose what's most important to you.
Between 24'-32', most of mine are Type 2. Both my 40's are Type 1 because if I'm going that high, I want the most stable. For all other occasions, I don't care.

Actually I have a 28' Type 1 and an 8' step Type 1A.
One is too short to get on the roof and the other too heavy to bother with for that task.
I need to fill the gap in both height and weight.
I am presuming that the use of C rails on the Werner Type 2 ladders (noticed in the shorter ranges) affects the stiffness compared to the I beam rails like on my 28 ft.
I'm focusing on a 20 ft. as fitting the need. Type unknown for the moment because now it's coming down to weight, but ultralight is not the goal.

Appreciate your input. I'm thinking your abundant use and experience lead to comfort on any type ladder.

 

[Beemer]

"So being near the top of a 28' aluminum ladder when thunder rolled in, wind started whipping the tops of the 100 foot tall oaks around....a storm chase's dream."

Guess you never did electric work off a ladder, or worried about tool grounding, or worked in bad weather around electric on a ladder, or as I mentioned, have a utility line electrify your aluminum ladder. 28' ladder, child's play.

Who needs a stinkin ladder?

 

[nadogail]

My ladder climbing days have been over for several years.

Fortunately I have survived all the "dumb stuff" i did in years past.

 

[finn]

Yes. All the ladders from 7 fire departments get tested on the same day. I stayed to watch ours go through the test. If you handle them often like we do the flex was surprising. We’ve never had a ladder fail. When I took this picture the ladder being tested was 20 years old.

Sort of like the flex on an airplane wing in bumpy turbulence.

 

[pcmeiners]

"I'm thinking your abundant use and experience lead to comfort on any type ladder."

Abundant use does lead to comfort, also stupidity. I should know done a lot of stupid thing on a ladder.

 

[tez929rr]

I had a corporate job in a manufacturing plant when I got out of the service. We used a lot of temporary help at the time and even back then in the late 80’s we were prohibited from putting a temp on a ladder, ever.

 

[tjansson]

I have a 32' 1A aluminum Werner. I'm 180 lb and usually will have another 10-20 lb in tools, materials, etc. I think it's fine, stiff enough, at full extension. Light enough. I can put it up solo and move it around while vertical.

 

[Beemer]

I have a 32' 1A aluminum Werner. I'm 180 lb and usually will have another 10-20 lb in tools, materials, etc. I think it's fine, stiff enough, at full extension. Light enough. I can put it up solo and move it around while vertical.

Looked it up; 67 pounds!
Not a retirement ladder.

 

[tjansson]

Looked it up; 67 pounds!
Not a retirement ladder.

Oh wow, I guess I don't know my own strength!

 

[Beemer]

I took some pictures a while back at ladder testing. Fascinating and I never saw our ladders flex like that before.

That's interesting.
Is that an official (OSHA?) test procedure?
A ladder is more loaded in compression than bending so it peaks my interest if that is a government mandated test.

I have witnessed a few building structural load tests and it takes some intestinal fortitude to be around when the required test live (over) load is incrementally applied. Think about overloading a floor while standing on it. At the time the test requirement was to double the live load. One test was to qualify a floor for 100 psf live load so that meant applying 200 psf test load. That is significant.

I'm curious how the ladder test load is established.

 

[tez929rr]

The box has a fill line - IIRC he told me it was 500lbs total with water to the fill line. He used an electric hoist to raise and lower it. The standard is NFPA1932.

Here is the meat of the report.

 

[Beemer]

The box has a fill line - IIRC he told me it was 500lbs total with water to the fill line. He used an electric hoist to raise and lower it. The standard is NFPA1932.

Here is the meat of the report.

Thanks for that.
I'll look at the standard for a bit of education.

I'm not sure how a horizontal bending test load correlates to a more vertical compression load, or more accurately combined compression and bending loads, but someone must have figured it out. It would be interesting to chase that information.

 

[Beemer]

Resurrecting this to share an interesting observation.
Comparing certain extension ladder lengths Type 1 ladder specs between Warner and Louisville, the base ladder dimensions (widths etc) and rail type are the same for both companies.
Somewhere I read that both product lines were made in Mexico so that brings me to wonder if they are both the same ladder structure with each company's accessories bolted on.
Another item is that both companies use a "modified I beam" rail on types 1 and 2 extension ladders and an actual I beam beginning on the 1A.
Chevy vs GMC?

Any opinions?

Here is something else that popped up that might indicate an association:

Ladder-maker Werner Co. to close Louisville plant, ship jobs to Mexico

The maker of ladders and other products will shutter its plant in the Jeffersontown area by March of 2019, citing "business pressures."

www.wdrb.com

 

[AL`]

"I seriously doubt that any FG ladder is lighter than aluminum." - Beemer

Cheap, non professional aluminum ladders are lighter than FG ladders , you are correct.

I was inclined to agree with Beemer at first blush. Not a Pro, but I have a 28 ft fiberglass Louisville Ladder with 300 lb rating to reach our second story roof and eaves. It's not exactly light. But my previous experience with aluminum ladders is with much shorter ladders and I couldn't tell you what their weight ratings were. Only that they were super light in comparison.

So I just looked up the product weight on Home Depot for a 28 ft FG Werner ladder and a 28 ft AL Louisville Ladder with equal weight ratings of 300 lb.

Not much difference and I doubt one could tell working with either one.

28 ft FG ladder - 59.5 lbs
28 ft AL ladder - 55 lbs

Of course, working with a 28 ft ladder in upright postion and at full extension tends to amplify the perceived weight.

 

[Beemer]

Al,
Five pounds is noticible to me especially past my current load capacity.

 

[AL`]

Al,
Five pounds is noticible to me especially past my current load capacity.

Understood sir. And you weren't wrong. The comparably rated and size FG was heavier, but I was surprised they were that close because my previous experience with aluminum ladders was that they were very light. I figured the weight difference would separate more than that at longer lengths.

 

[Beemer]

Understood sir. And you weren't wrong. The comparably rated and size FG was heavier, but I was surprised they were that close because my previous experience with aluminum ladders was that they were very light. I figured the weight difference would separate more than that at longer lengths.

Surprizingly a similar, not proportional, weight difference occurs at shorter lengths. At 16 feet length the difference is 6 pounds in the Type 1A. So length doesn't seem to make much difference.

 

[Beemer]

Resurrecting this to get opinions on manufacturer, for aluminum ladders; Werner vs Louisville?

Type 2 Werners seen at the local HD appeared very light weight material and one had dented rails and two other had torn through steps. No doubt from mishandling, perhaps forklift at the store, but they didn't seem like they might suffer from use.

By the specs comparing the brands in shorter type 1 ladders, the Louisville's were heavier, perhaps indicating slightly thicker materials, but perhaps just the applied accessories.

So, any opinions on the brands? Those are what are available around here.

 

[PCustoms]

Resurrecting this to get opinions on manufacturer, for aluminum ladders; Werner vs Louisville?

Type 2 Werners seen at the local HD appeared very light weight material and one had dented rails and two other had torn through steps. No doubt from mishandling, perhaps forklift at the store, but they didn't seem like they might suffer from use.

I've had my Werner for 6 years, and while I wish it were a beefier ladder (I got fat) there's no damage to it.

The fact that home depot has damaged goods isn't surprising, but having damaged ladders is a major liability issue.

Wouldn't buy a ladder from that store regardless of brand.

 

[Beemer]

Wouldn't buy a ladder from that store regardless of brand.

Me either but I use them to get up close and touch them.

Sherwin Williams has Werner and I trust them more and is less expensive than the "real" ladder store.

 

[Tynee]

Resurrecting this to get opinions on manufacturer, for aluminum ladders; Werner vs Louisville?

Type 2 Werners seen at the local HD appeared very light weight material and one had dented rails and two other had torn through steps. No doubt from mishandling, perhaps forklift at the store, but they didn't seem like they might suffer from use.

By the specs comparing the brands in shorter type 1 ladders, the Louisville's were heavier, perhaps indicating slightly thicker materials, but perhaps just the applied accessories.

So, any opinions on the brands? Those are what are available around here.

In a previous life, I climbed ladders all day every day. That's been a long time ago, but back then there was no noticeable difference in initial quality or longevity between Louisville and Werner.

 

[Beemer]

In a previous life, I climbed ladders all day every day. That's been a long time ago, but back then there was no noticeable difference in initial quality or longevity between Louisville and Werner.

So go with price, tipping the scale to Louisville.