Fencing Pliers, Windmill Tools and Cavemen

[Private Lugnutz]

...a couple months ago I found a pair of these laying in the middle of Orchard Street between 40th & 56th.

Obviously someone with no appreciation for caveman tools tossed them out the window of his truck in disgust!

 

[d42jeep]

I did a quick search on eBay. I’ll be waiting to find one for $2.00 at a garage or estate sale.
-Don

 

[Mintgrun]

I wasn't sure whether I'd shared the fencing pliers I have, but it turns out I started a thread about them.

Ancient Fencing Tool

I had never heard of F.Faust. The little bit of searching I have done has not been productive. I think these are sort of cool, so I thought I would share. I'll bet they work well for pulling/pounding staples.

www.garagejournal.com

It was a short thread in which GJ member, notlob shared an image from an auction that displayed a nice variety of fencing tools; including a pair very similar to mine. (#158)

They're marked P. FAUST. San Antonio Tex PAT MAY 8, 1888.



I checked the patents from May 8, 1888 on DATAMP; but don't see any reference to these.





Tom

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I saw those, or an example that looked very similar to those, on DATAMP, Tom. I'm sure I can find them again very easily. I'm on the road, but I will post later.

 

[LOW1]

I wasn't sure whether I'd shared the fencing pliers I have, but it turns out I started a thread about them.

Ancient Fencing Tool

I had never heard of F.Faust. The little bit of searching I have done has not been productive. I think these are sort of cool, so I thought I would share. I'll bet they work well for pulling/pounding staples.

www.garagejournal.com

It was a short thread in which GJ member, notlob shared an image from an auction that displayed a nice variety of fencing tools; including a pair very similar to mine. (#158)

They're marked P. FAUST. San Antonio Tex PAT MAY 8, 1888.



I checked the patents from May 8, 1888 on DATAMP; but don't see any reference to these.





Tom

Nice, but are those really fencing tools? Seems more like general purpose stuff?

 

[Mintgrun]

Definitely not all fencing tools; just a bunch of tools that share similar features. I'm not even sure mine are fencing tools. We'll see what the patent says, when Lugz digz it up.

 

[four.cycle]

It's preposterous that McLeod was granted a patent in 1904, just six years after the 1898 Morris,...

I was hoping that you would catch the screwiness here.... none of it makes sense.
What else did Ryman have his fingers in?
How about McLeod?

my jumping in was very deliberate - I've spent days puzzling over these goofy things - there seems to be no end to them.

 

[four.cycle]

I wasn't sure whether I'd shared the fencing pliers I have, but it turns out I started a thread about them.

maybe we can get LOW1 to edit the thread title to include "windmill tools"

 

[four.cycle]

sorry for the multiple posts... I have too many browser windows open and thought I already posted this.

was not able to find your "Faust" and I'm thinking maybe looking for "fencing pliers" is not the right direction. is there ANY possibility that a farrier could use that device?

I just stumbled across this searching for your "Faust" - there are several models here I have not seen before:

Meeker's www.AntiqBuyer.com patented antique wrench past sales

Meeker's www.AntiqBuyer.com sells antique patented wrenches & farm tools

www.antiqbuyer.com

 

[JeepYJ]

Tekton has quite a good description of fencing pliers and their uses.

10-1/2 Inch Fencing Pliers | PSP10010 | TEKTON

10-1/2 inch fencing pliers. An all-in-one, compact, versatile fencing tool for working with wire, nails, and staples. PSP10010.

www.tekton.com

 

[AC-WC]

Agree with others who stated it beats having to walk all the way back to the barn to get the right tool. I've found them exceptionally useful for hi-tensile/electric fencing at mom's. Way more convenient than having the 'right' tool and remembering where I laid it as I moved to the next post

 

[larry_g]

was not able to find your "Faust" and I'm thinking maybe looking for "fencing pliers" is not the right direction. is there ANY possibility that a farrier could use that device?

I would suspect that some of those tools may be aimed at packaging and crating people. A hundred plus years ago a lot of materials were secured with wire. Fruit and vegetable crates. Bags of loose material. Hay and other farm goods.

lg
no neat sig line

 

[LOW1]

maybe we can get LOW1 to edit the thread title to include "windmill tools"

Your wish is my command

 

[nadogail]

If I could only have one tool to work on a fence with; I would want a pair of Fence Pliers.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

a nice variety of fencing tools; including a pair very similar to mine. (#158)

That's a cool and helpful shot! I have #150. #151 is a Cronk.

Here's the patent I was thinking of, Tom. On closer inspection, not yours and probably not #158, either. Same style or approach, for sure.

 

[four.cycle]

I do not believe this is all of them:

Button / Alphonso Button, East Saginaw, MI / multi-tool / patent 159561 Feb 9 1875 Alphonso Button / * manufacturer unknown / https://datamp.org/patents/displayPatent.php?number=159561&typeCode=0 /

Erdman & Phillips / Erdman & Phillips, Philadelphia, PA / "multi-tool" / patent 276793 May 1 1883 Robert Erdman and William Phillips /

Hawks / Moses L. Hawks, Chicago / "Victor" can opener multi-tool, "Climax" vegetable parer / patent 647602 Apr 17 1900 & 706823 Aug 12 1902 & 911239 Feb 2 1909 & RE12965 Jun 1 1909 Moses L. Hawks / https://www.collectorsweekly.com/stories/124518-1900-victor-can-and-bottle-opener /

I.C.I. / I.C.I., Philadelphia, PA / "I.C.I. No. 3 Handy Tool" multi tool / ca. 1910 / pat. pend. /

Mathews / Mathews "Never Stall" / see Thomas & Sons, Dayton, OH / patent 933860 / https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...stall-multi-tool-or-the-windmill-tool.488405/ /

McLeod / William H. McLeod, Kansas City, KS / multi-tool / patent 770380 Sep 20 1904 & 829168 Aug 21 1906 William H. McLeod /

National / National Hatchet Co., Marshalltown, IA / "Ranchman" multi-tool / patent 607448 Jul 19 1898 & 784959 Mar 14 1905 John R. Morris /

Red Viking / Red Viking, Box 228, Bloomfield, IN / multi-tool /

Ryman / K.L. Ryman, Newark, NJ / "Ranchman" multi-tool / see also Streiby & Foote /

Steger / Steger Sales Corp., Oklahoma City, OK / "Famous 8-in-1" multi-tool / patent 1739658 Dec 17 1929 J.O. Smith / (* manufacturer not definitively established 03/02/21 *) /

Thomas / J.H. Thomas & Sons, 2256 Wayne St., Dayton, OH / patent 933860 Sep 14 1909 F.J. Stolle / "15 in 1" "Windmill" multi-tool / https://www.garagejournal.com/forum...stall-multi-tool-or-the-windmill-tool.488405/ /

 

[four.cycle]

and then there are these gems:


Mr. Fireplace Mr. O'Tool multi-tool (photo: ebay)

unknown 1909 multi tool (patent )(photo: ebay)

unknown 1909 multi tool (patent )(photo: ebay)

unknown 1909 multi tool (patent )(photo: ebay)

unknown 'Household Favorite' multi tool (photo: ebay)

unknown 'Household Favorite' multi tool (photo: ebay)

 

[Debcrow]

Fencing Tools........

500mg Foil Test Weight and a Epee Test Gauge

 

[IMCA38]

I have two pairs, a pair of Channellock as seen in earlier post, and a pair of Diamond (Diamalloy). I’ve heard several say that Diamonds are the gold standard. Interesting how the Diamonds have a shorter tang for digging staples.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Interesting how the Diamonds have a shorter tang for digging staples.

That is interesting. We were talking about the shorter hammer poll upthread. Now I am wondering when that happened in the tool's evolution. I don't yet have quite enough interest to do this, but it would make for a good timeline study and chart of the kind that I have done for stinkdriver handle composition, ratchet-action open end wrenches, and a few other tools.

I do not believe this is all of them:

I'm not sure what "them" refers to, but if you look at DATAMP's database tree, they have 493 tools binned under "Agricultural tools"! Seventy-one (71) of those are "Fencing tools," but a lot of those are stretchers and other tools. They have an even more big fat whoppin' 609 patents under "Combination tools," where all the 9-in-1's etc fall. It's @LOW1 's thread, but I am not going to get that far afield here.

A lot of other tools in a family of tools that pinch, ply, pry, pull, and snip would lend themselves to mending fences, and that helps demonstrate the evolution, I think. Take the gas pliers and the pliers just above those on the right in the pic. The handles on both of them have some serious staple and nail pulling provisions on the ends, and they have wire cutters on the pivots. Above those are WWI "trench pliers" used with barbed wire. The pliers on the left bottom that look like fence pliers are actually for cobblers, believe it or not. The hammer head jaw faces are knurled for tapping.

 

[IMCA38]

Recently, I also came across a Red Viking multi tool in an online auction. Made me curious and I set out to learn a little more about them. Pictures are from other tool sites.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

That would make a nice all-purpose camper! But you're killing me. I am trying to resist going Fully Multi on this thread.

 

[four.cycle]

"... what "them" refers to ..."

The "windmill tools".

 

[Outwest]

I would rate Moore Makers as the gold standard today. Have a pair in every truck as well as hanging off saddles. Not great at one thing, but having them to make repairs, they are irreplaceable. I have a couple pair of Moore Makers, a couple Channellock, a couple pair of Cresents, and a pair of Diamonds that I can think of. I have literally worn a pair of Channellocks out and the pin broke. I no longer use them as a primary tool when building fence, but for repairs they are very useful, especially when they are all you have. I’m doubtful most of you could imagine the miles of range fence I have covered over the years. These pliers have saved the day multiple times cutting wire off cattle and the occasional horse. One of those that I don’t leave home without it items for me.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I would rate Moore Makers as the gold standard today.

 

[matthew]

It is because small farmers tended to be tighter than a cold tick on a warm dog.

I remember my uncle talking about how my grandfather always saved every bolt out of everything. “I never understood that until I realized that the price of bolts hasn’t changed since I was a kid, and if they’re now cheap to replace with new, they were expensive relative to wages a few decades ago.” I’m sure growing up in the depression also influenced grampa, and old habits were there forever.

I also remember him mending fences, but it’s the way he used a hammer to tension the wire that I recall, not the fencing pliers or the staples he probably reused…

 

[jagwinn]

I have a pair...stamped "DROP FORGED 8910 ENGLAND...10-1/2 inches, red painted handles.

 

[RTM]

Recently, I also came across a Red Viking multi tool in an online auction.

Great planes trading? Those green backgrounds make his stuff stand out.

There are also made in Germany versions of that in several catalogs at ITCL.

 

[four.cycle]

^ yes... Red Viking was one of the more recent iterations of "multi-tool"...

..... not a clue what they were attempting to patent here...

 

[IMCA38]

Great planes trading? Those green backgrounds make his stuff stand out.

There are also made in Germany versions of that in several catalogs at ITCL.

Could be.
The photo in the online auction I referenced was poor, so I searched Red Viking multi tool on Google to find better photos.

 

[Outwest]

A few that were handy. Knipex mini bolt cutters are indispensable with high tensile wire.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Thanks for the pics, @Outwest. I had never heard of Moore Maker, so I went to their website. Interesting niche (for brevity, dehorners, knives, fence pliers and related "ranch" tools) and an even more interesting, short, modern non-vintage history. If you think about the arc of US hand tools, they reached their heyday in middle of the last century, conglomeration and imports killed nearly everyone off, and the survivors were behemoths. I'm trying to think of comps for someone starting a hand tool production business in the US in the 80's, and frankly can't. All the similar size companies that come to mind, Wilde, Chapman, Enderes, are much older than that. Bondhus maybe? Again, very interesting. Maybe someone who buys modern tools will know of others.

 

[LOW1]

. I'm trying to think of comps for someone starting a hand tool production business in the US in the 80's, and frankly can't. All the similar size companies that come to mind, Wilde, Chapman, Enderes, are much older than that. Bondhus maybe? Again, very interesting. Maybe someone who buys modern tools will know of others.

Perhaps Lie Nielsen woodworking tools?

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I'm not a sawdust maker, but I bet there might be a few in that genre.

 

[four.cycle]

-> run a search within the list (in notepad): keywords: "est. 198"

 

[Debcrow]

Early Crescent 1907 Fence Pliers. Notice there is no claw like most have and that the above pictured Moore Pliers are pretty identical.
I suspect these are the Crescent version of the Red Devil 1906 Pliers after they bought out Smith & Hemenway in the mid 1920's.

 

[Rkcubed]

I’ve looked for some time for a windmill wrench that wasn’t beat up or rusted.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I’ve looked for some time for a windmill wrench that wasn’t beat up or rusted.

Very nice example! Congrats.

 

[csp]

My grandfather's Diamalloy fencing pliers Currently using them while installing 800ft of woven wire to keep our dog located inside the property lines. These have been used to maintain fences around our pastures for 75+ years. I've had them since the mid 1990s.

I set them down and lose them constantly since their patina blends in with the ground so much. I've been tempted to shoot some bright color on the handles, but can't bring myself to do it. It just dawned on me to try some spray plastidip since it's easy to remove.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

I picked these up at the flea this morning if only because of the Craftsman branding, which was unexpected. Who made them? I wondered. First thing I did was compare to my Crescent. Fairly good clone, except for lacking a pronounced flat area on either shoulder behind the cutters and pivot. Skipping around in some catalogs, I found a Dunlap in the 1948, none in the 1954, none in the 1957, and then I found them - same model number - in the 1960. Sprechen sie Deutsche mitt me, baby!