FINALLY! Dewalt Launches 12V Tools

[Stuey]

IMO not having a bulky battery hanging off the handle is an advantage for wrenching. For construction stand up would probably be better. FWIW Milwaukee also has a high cap flat bottomed battery. http://www.milwaukeetool.com/Produc...-11-2402&CategoryName=SC:+M12+Cordless+System

Ah, okay, I've seen those before.

I've got one XC battery, it rules.Plan on getting one or 2 more. So far I have 90 degree drill, 3/8 chuck drill, Impact and 1/4 driver plus I bought the 12V grease gun. Miwaukees stuff works

I think that if/once other companies start losing part of their compact cordless market share to Dewalt, they might come out with similar styled batteries of their own. Probably not, though, for ergonomic and weight saving reasons.

There's gotta be something wrong with the sample you're using then, because mine has a crazy amount of torque... that was one of the first things I noticed about it when I got it.

I recently used mine to wire a guest room we're remodeling and I shot holes through 2x4's with a 5/8 bit all day.


We're talking about the chuck drill, right, not the 1/4 hex bit driver?

Yep, it was the chucked drill.

That's also why I'm very eager to do my own independent testing. Just in case any of the other brands' demo tools were early models, broken down, or whatnot.

The M12 drilled holes perfectly fine, but as mentioned it was suggested that I lean in b/c others discovered that when pushed too hard, the M12 stalled.

In the end, I'm not sure if Dewalt will be king of the hill, but the 12V MAX tools will most definitely hold their own against the other brands' tools.

 

[iandh]

Ah, okay, I've seen those before.


I think that if/once other companies start losing part of their compact cordless market share to Dewalt, they might come out with similar styled batteries of their own. Probably not, though, for ergonomic and weight saving reasons.


Yep, it was the chucked drill.

That's also why I'm very eager to do my own independent testing. Just in case any of the other brands' demo tools were early models, broken down, or whatnot.

The M12 drilled holes perfectly fine, but as mentioned it was suggested that I lean in b/c others discovered that when pushed too hard, the M12 stalled.

In the end, I'm not sure if Dewalt will be king of the hill, but the 12V MAX tools will most definitely hold their own against the other brands' tools.

Yeah I just did a test with mine and leaned in really hard with a 1/2" spade, to where the bit dug in and wasn't cutting any longer, and the current protection kicked in and the drill stopped. I think just about any drill could stall though, if you push the bit in hard enough to make it dig.

Even my DC converted drill press will stall if you put in enough pressure, but that's on purpose... it helps protect the part, the drill, and the bit at the same time.

Because of that, it's REALLY hard for me to call that a negative... once you see magic smoke rising from the windings of a drill because you pushed it past it's limits, current protection sounds like a great idea. That has actually happened to me, BTW.

FYI I also tried a 1-1/4" spade on low gear, and it shot a clean hole through a dry 2x4 with no stalling whatsoever, in fact the drill was shaking me around a bit.




One of the things that makes the M12 drill superior IMO is that it hits 1500 RPM on high speed, and a lot of drills won't do that. 1000-1200 just doesn't cut it when using smaller bits that need higher spindle speeds.

With higher RPM comes lower torque, so it would be a bit unfair to criticize the M12's lack of torque in high gear without also mentioning it's superior speed in the same sentence.



I am an open minded guy though, and as I said, if Dewalt truly has a superior product, I'll switch to it. The days of me carting around big, bulky, awkward cordless tools are over. These new 12v tools are the best thing that could have happened to the cordless tool industry IMO.

 

[Stuey]

I need to do a bit of testing before I'm ready to draw any reliable conclusions, and will hopefully have access to the full product line ahead of or soon after its nationwide launch.

With the M12 drill, what does it do when the over current protection kicks in? I still have a RA version in my possession, and I don't recall if there's an audible warning, but I recall at least an LED. I'll check it later. At the Dewalt test site, the M12 gave no such audible or visual warning. It genuinely felt like it was stalling, but I couldn't be sure.

 

[Bolster]

So much of what makes me switch to a new platform (and I'm looking right now, my Makita NiMH system is getting old and creaky) is:

How many other tools will fit the battery?

Do we have any idea of DeWalt's other offerings in what they generously call 12V?

EDIT: Asked and answered.

http://toolguyd.com/2010/06/dewalt-12v-max-lithium-ion-cordless-system-preview/

 

[Bolster]

They sure are making a big deal about the "patented handle design." What's so special about it? Sure looks like my Hitachi.

 

[Stuey]

Quite a few people asked about Dewalt's future roadmap, and it seemed like a few ideas were in the investigative stages.

From what we were told, the handle was designed by industrial engineers, and dozens of simulations and prototypes were considered before the final design was accepted.

I have to say, the handle is comfortable to use. I REALLY liked the way the handle feels.

I asked about the one-handed bit entry and release and how it compared to Wera's Rapidaptor. One of the project leaders told me that they worked around Wera's patent by engineering a different way to secure the bits.

One great thing these tools have going for them is that the 1/4" hex bit holders can hold 1" insert bits.

I think that there may be a huge market for these tools, even if nobody switches from their current 12V compact platform.

 

[Coptool]

Alright here are my initial impressions obviously, some work left to do as they only provide Torque numbers for the impact tools and even those no RPM or BPM so no real apples to apples in here but take a look anyway if you are interested.

http://www.coptool.com/blog/2010/06/dewalt_finally_arrives_at_the.html

Also more photos in this facebook album

 

[Monte]

DCF610S2 only single speed ? hmmm and a bit slow ?? + more expensive ??
the size looks like the old 9.6 volt cordless drills..... ?

 

[iandh]

With the M12 drill, what does it do when the over current protection kicks in? I still have a RA version in my possession, and I don't recall if there's an audible warning, but I recall at least an LED. I'll check it later. At the Dewalt test site, the M12 gave no such audible or visual warning. It genuinely felt like it was stalling, but I couldn't be sure.

The drill stops, and the battery indicator light flashes a couple times. Then you release the trigger, and it resets immediately.

As I said before I actually find it to be more of a plus than a minus. Either way, I'm sure any Dewalt marketing guys would be more than happy to make it out as a minus, even though it's a really great intentional feature.

I've damaged more than one drill by pushing it to its limits and frying the motor windings.


Either way, in low gear, the M12 has more torque than you could ever want IMO. Like I said, I knocked out a hole with a 1-1/4 spade bit pushing as hard as I could, and it never skipped a beat. That's pretty badass for a 10.8v tool, no matter what anyone says.

As I mentioned befre as well, the high gear RPM was a HUGE factor in my decision. I do a lot of small work with drills 1/8" and less, and that is just a necessity unless you want to be sitting there all day and also breaking/flexing bits.

I have a feeling that Milwaukee purposely made a decision to sacrifice torque for speed in this case.


At the moment, until I have RPM numbers, the M12 remains the best driver on the market, for my needs.

edit: It looks like in the link above, the new Dewalt also hits 1500rpm... being that it is roughly the same form factor and power, I'd be surprised if there is any huge difference in high gear torque. Either way, because of that I will consider it once I see how the reviews turn out.

 

[walrus]

In the end, I'm not sure if Dewalt will be king of the hill, but the 12V MAX tools will most definitely hold their own against the other brands' tools.

I haven't seen their 12 v stuff yet, it better be more reliable than their other cordless tools if its going to be king of the hill.

 

[iandh]

I haven't seen their 12 v stuff yet, it better be more reliable than their other cordless tools if its going to be king of the hill.

I do know the Dewalt stuff 5 years ago and older was pretty sturdy, but since 5 years ago I've been a Bosch only guy, and now have become a Milwaukee guy with my M12 stuff.

I have heard mixed opinions about Dewalt's newer cordless tools, such as the standard "black and decker" comment.

OTOH, I heard bad things about Milwaukee cordless tools as well, and the M12 stuff is SUPERB. I really like all of the tools I have. They aren't exactly powerhouses, but they are adequate tools with decent quality and the right price.

A 5 year warranty doesn't hurt either.

 

[nissan_crawler]

completely worthless to me, way to big and clunky.

I hope those batteries last better than all their other ones.

 

[Stuey]

completely worthless to me, way to big and clunky.

I hope those batteries last better than all their other ones.

Wait to see them in person before you call them "too big and clunky." From the initial images, I questioned just how compact they could be, but they really are nicely sized.

 

[Garage_Mahal]

Why did they abandon compatibility with their earlier 12v tools? Argh! That's part of the reason I chose DeWalt.

 

[IndyGarage]

Regardless of how they may look, they are truly smaller than the conventional 12V NiCad tools that came before the 12V Li-ion bust.

The Dewalt guys passed around the new 12V and the old 12V, and there was a substantial size and weight difference.

I haven't made up my mind yet as to which I prefer more, but size wise the Dewalt and Bosch have completely different advantages.

That was always the advantage of the Panasonic 12Vs; from the beginning they were smaller than everything else and way more powerful.

And I have never had a better battery than a panasonic.

I now have Milwaukee M12's and V28's and I'm very happy with them, but if I wanted to go back to a "conventional" style 12v - it would be panasonic all the way.

 

[Stuey]

Why did they abandon compatibility with their earlier 12v tools? Argh! That's part of the reason I chose DeWalt.

imo, there probably would have been too compromises to do so.

Most notably, the new "12V" line really only provides 10.8V of operating power.

That was always the advantage of the Panasonic 12Vs; from the beginning they were smaller than everything else and way more powerful.

And I have never had a better battery than a panasonic.

I now have Milwaukee M12's and V28's and I'm very happy with them, but if I wanted to go back to a "conventional" style 12v - it would be panasonic all the way.

I've heard a lot of good things about Panasonic. I assume they're quite popular elsewhere, but I don't seem them often around here for sale or even in use.