My guess is that you are right. Thanks for weighing in!
LP makes 1x trim in 4, 6, and 8" widths. I think I can only get my hands on the 6" easily. I could always use a different material for the band trim though - even real solid cedar.
First timer build thread: modern workshop / shed
- Thread starter gamp945
- Start date
My guess is that you are right. Thanks for weighing in!
LP makes 1x trim in 4, 6, and 8" widths. I think I can only get my hands on the 6" easily. I could always use a different material for the band trim though - even real solid cedar.
Vintage Veloce
Well-known member
I think you are correct. Also, the original design may assume only 8' siding panels, and this a break in the siding may have been planned anyway.
Really the trim piece isn't that complicated even with flashing , and with a door there, that wod ha e required trim anyway. So the designer added the band for that and esthetics.
Yes - the original design specs 8' siding panels, but I've been planning on using 10' panels for both the sheathing (zip system) and siding (LP smartside) and I will therefore have no horizontal breaks. The 8' panels may very well be why the band flashing was designed the way it was in the original plan.
So you think it would be a problem to just add a band and caulk at both top and bottom? I should add flashing above the door at least - but what about the rest of the bottom of the trim? If I just add the band on top of the siding, there would be no way to integrate flashing on the top of the band.
Vintage Veloce
Well-known member
Yes, I do think it would be "not good". The flashing provided a slope for the water to run off the top and a drip edge away from the siding. Without it water may accumulate on top of the board and become a problem. You don't want to merely count on the caulk and the paint being the protection, you want a good mechanical solution under that stuff. It isn't accidental that any properly installed window has drip edges on top of the outside casing and bottom of the outside sill.
That said, slapping the board up and caulking it may work fine if the eave above provides good weather protection. Stuff like this, I consider if I am building just to last a couple years, or if I want it good for my lifetime. ;-)
Update:
I have been able to get all the LP smartside panels fastened to the roof framing to create the ceiling, and yesterday I got a coat of white exterior paint on it. It dried in the hot weather for about 9-10 hours before nightfall when it started to get rained on pretty good. I'm really hoping that the paint was sufficiently dry and that this won't cause problems. I did use high-quality paint (Valspar Duramax satin exterior) so I'm hoping for the best. The LP smartside product itself will be fine if it gets wet during construction; the individual strands in the siding are wax coated and all the wood is borate treated, so LP claims you can wait up to 6 months before painting the panels.
One change I made on the roof (ceiling) panels: the Family Handyman crew seemed to install the LP Smartside ceiling panels via **** joints with no spacing between panels. I called LP and confirmed that when used as soffit/ceiling material, there should be a 3/16" gap between **** joints.
Also, I plan to use OSI Quad Max caulk to fill the **** joint gaps. OSI's instructions state: "Not recommended for field joint/**** joint applications on pre-finished exterior claddings and trim materials." However, the manufacturer clarified that "prefinished" means pre-painted (baked) paint finishes from the factory, not primed panels like LP smartside, or field-painted panels.
Question:
I need to decide what product to use for the roof beams. The plans call for 2x12x20 SPF lumber. The plans do not spec treated lumber, even though these beams are exposed. I'd rather use something rot-resistant, but if I use treated lumber, it will likely cause a significant delay while I wait for the lumber to dry so that it can be painted. Also, the price for 2x12x20 treated SPF has jumped from about $30 per board to $70 in the last year. That's about $600 for just the ceiling beams ($70 x 9 beams). Does anyone have a suggestion about what to do here? Should I just use non-treated beams (a bit cheaper, quickly paintable)? Do I suffer the cost and wait for the treated beams to dry? Or should I be looking at a different type of lumber altogether for the beams (engineered beams? Cedar? Redwood?) Each beam is spec'd as a triple 2x12.
I have been able to get all the LP smartside panels fastened to the roof framing to create the ceiling, and yesterday I got a coat of white exterior paint on it. It dried in the hot weather for about 9-10 hours before nightfall when it started to get rained on pretty good. I'm really hoping that the paint was sufficiently dry and that this won't cause problems. I did use high-quality paint (Valspar Duramax satin exterior) so I'm hoping for the best. The LP smartside product itself will be fine if it gets wet during construction; the individual strands in the siding are wax coated and all the wood is borate treated, so LP claims you can wait up to 6 months before painting the panels.
One change I made on the roof (ceiling) panels: the Family Handyman crew seemed to install the LP Smartside ceiling panels via **** joints with no spacing between panels. I called LP and confirmed that when used as soffit/ceiling material, there should be a 3/16" gap between **** joints.
Also, I plan to use OSI Quad Max caulk to fill the **** joint gaps. OSI's instructions state: "Not recommended for field joint/**** joint applications on pre-finished exterior claddings and trim materials." However, the manufacturer clarified that "prefinished" means pre-painted (baked) paint finishes from the factory, not primed panels like LP smartside, or field-painted panels.
Question:
I need to decide what product to use for the roof beams. The plans call for 2x12x20 SPF lumber. The plans do not spec treated lumber, even though these beams are exposed. I'd rather use something rot-resistant, but if I use treated lumber, it will likely cause a significant delay while I wait for the lumber to dry so that it can be painted. Also, the price for 2x12x20 treated SPF has jumped from about $30 per board to $70 in the last year. That's about $600 for just the ceiling beams ($70 x 9 beams). Does anyone have a suggestion about what to do here? Should I just use non-treated beams (a bit cheaper, quickly paintable)? Do I suffer the cost and wait for the treated beams to dry? Or should I be looking at a different type of lumber altogether for the beams (engineered beams? Cedar? Redwood?) Each beam is spec'd as a triple 2x12.
Alright fellas, I got the walls up!
I've got them plumb and level (thanks to the 12' and 14' treated shims), but I'm having trouble with getting the walls square. There is about 1" difference between the diagonal measurements. Is this close enough to call "square" on a 12 x 14 building? I would adjust the walls to get them into square, but alas, the concrete guy strikes again and the pad is not square. If I adjust the walls to get into square, the treated sill plates will be hanging off the edge of the slab. Any suggestions on what to do?
I've got them plumb and level (thanks to the 12' and 14' treated shims), but I'm having trouble with getting the walls square. There is about 1" difference between the diagonal measurements. Is this close enough to call "square" on a 12 x 14 building? I would adjust the walls to get them into square, but alas, the concrete guy strikes again and the pad is not square. If I adjust the walls to get into square, the treated sill plates will be hanging off the edge of the slab. Any suggestions on what to do?
LOL, I must be asking too many questions because it seems I'm being ignored now 
Or maybe because what I'm doing is so simple to most folks here.
Minor update:
Yesterday I bolted the frame down to the slab. I used 1/2 x 8" Titen HD bolts (photo below). I bought a rotary hammer just in order to drill the bolt holes. I got a Bosch "Bulldog" GBH18V-26DK15. I considered just renting a rotary hammer for the job which would have cost me about $60. But I wasn't sure exactly how long it would take a first-timer like me to figure out, so that could have extended to $120 for two days. Anyway, I purchased the Bosch rotary hammer for about $160 and now I have one on hand to do any concrete fastening or demolition jobs in the future.
I also purchased plain old 2x12x20 PT lumber for the roof beams. They were $65 each and I need 9 beams so this wasn't cheap. I've got them drying out right now so that I can stain them before I put them up. The stain manufacturer (ReadySeal) specifies 12% moisture content and right now I'm sitting at about 15-20%. The rain isn't helping I'm trying to keep them covered in plastic when it rains but it is hard to predict when it is going to shower and they sometimes get wet.
The next step is to stain the roof beams and put them in place. I might have to put them up without stain in order to avoid a delay and then stain them in place once they have dried out enough.
.jpeg)
Or maybe because what I'm doing is so simple to most folks here.Minor update:
Yesterday I bolted the frame down to the slab. I used 1/2 x 8" Titen HD bolts (photo below). I bought a rotary hammer just in order to drill the bolt holes. I got a Bosch "Bulldog" GBH18V-26DK15. I considered just renting a rotary hammer for the job which would have cost me about $60. But I wasn't sure exactly how long it would take a first-timer like me to figure out, so that could have extended to $120 for two days. Anyway, I purchased the Bosch rotary hammer for about $160 and now I have one on hand to do any concrete fastening or demolition jobs in the future.
I also purchased plain old 2x12x20 PT lumber for the roof beams. They were $65 each and I need 9 beams so this wasn't cheap. I've got them drying out right now so that I can stain them before I put them up. The stain manufacturer (ReadySeal) specifies 12% moisture content and right now I'm sitting at about 15-20%. The rain isn't helping
I'm trying to keep them covered in plastic when it rains but it is hard to predict when it is going to shower and they sometimes get wet.The next step is to stain the roof beams and put them in place. I might have to put them up without stain in order to avoid a delay and then stain them in place once they have dried out enough.
Last edited:
I'm using 5/4 PVC for my band detail, attached directly to the sheathing. 3/8 hardipanel siding underneath and 1.5 wide pvc battens. I could only get PVC battens in 3/4 inch depth but I've been ripping an 1/8" off the back to get them to line up with the bands. I planned to use a Z flashing as you've drawn but couldn't find one dimensionally correct for the 5/4 board. With 18" overhangs, I decided there wasn't a lot of risk of water intrusion.
Vintage Veloce
Well-known member
On staining your beams... I did my ceiling with a sprayer... and that was a bad idea. Highly toxic, even though I wore a quality mask. Be careful with your choices there.
On the building squareness... assuming it isn't a structural problem and the inspector doesn't care I think that is OK. You will have to decide how you want to put the ceiling beams in...
On the building squareness... assuming it isn't a structural problem and the inspector doesn't care I think that is OK. You will have to decide how you want to put the ceiling beams in...
amkluttz
Well-known member
I have never regretted taking the time to do my staining/painting before having to put something up. I have cursed myself many times for being in a hurry and just throwing trim work up and having to go back and finish it later. When you are in a time crunch sometimes pre-painting/staining isn't an option.
It's looking good, I'm interested to see how this turns out.
I agree with you completely. Unfortunately I think it might take 1-3 months (!) for the PT beams to dry out to 12%. After talking to ReadySeal tech support yesterday they confirmed that it is imperative to apply to 12% moisture content wood because their oil-based product is absorbed deep into the wood (unlike other stains and sealers which sit on the surface like paint) and if it hits a moisture barrier then it will fail to absorb properly and require early re-application.
Unfortunately this means I need to install now and stain later. On the plus side, it should be easier to allow the wood to dry once the roof is installed since it will be protected from rain vs. laying on stickers on concrete right now, and constantly needing to be covered/uncovered with plastic sheeting.
On future builds, this is definitely something I'll keep in mind. I'll buy my PT wood *months* in advance of when I have time to do the build.
Small question!
I'm putting up the three triple-2x12 roof beams. The plans call for nails to hold these three beams together (i.e., from side-to-side, as shown in the photo below). I'm thinking about using GRK structural screws (rated for PT) instead. I'm thinking since the wood is still not quite dry (around 15%-20%), it will likely shrink/move a bit after being installed. In order to limit movement, I'm thinking of using screws with an appropriate-sized pilot hole to fasten each side to the middle beam. My hope is that this will prevent the beams, installed flush and pretty, from becoming wonky-looking once dried out. I'm thinking nails may not provide the same holding power as screws.
I know that screws are not usually used in framing - but I'm thinking that fastening the beams together doesn't need the same shear strength that nails provide - and anyway, GRK structural screws will fair similarly to a nail I think. Any cautions before I proceed? Thanks as always!
I'm putting up the three triple-2x12 roof beams. The plans call for nails to hold these three beams together (i.e., from side-to-side, as shown in the photo below). I'm thinking about using GRK structural screws (rated for PT) instead. I'm thinking since the wood is still not quite dry (around 15%-20%), it will likely shrink/move a bit after being installed. In order to limit movement, I'm thinking of using screws with an appropriate-sized pilot hole to fasten each side to the middle beam. My hope is that this will prevent the beams, installed flush and pretty, from becoming wonky-looking once dried out. I'm thinking nails may not provide the same holding power as screws.
I know that screws are not usually used in framing - but I'm thinking that fastening the beams together doesn't need the same shear strength that nails provide - and anyway, GRK structural screws will fair similarly to a nail I think. Any cautions before I proceed? Thanks as always!
wasfast
Well-known member
Screws in this case would be superior and not back out later.
Id be curious how much a Paralam or similar beam would be instead of multiple built up 2 x 12's.
Id be curious how much a Paralam or similar beam would be instead of multiple built up 2 x 12's.
Thanks, wasfast.
I spent a bit (OK, more than a bit) of time researching alternate beam options. I finally decided to just go with PT pine because I just needed to dive in and get started.
The only engineered wood beam option I could find locally would be a Glulam. Of course, there are other engineered beam options, but the Glulam was the only one available pressure treated. I asked my engineer about this and they OK'd a 3.5 x 9.25 Glulam. However, the pricing was way out of reach for me - something like $400 each - and they would have taken up to a month to get in.
In addition, using the triple 2x12 method has allowed me to build this by myself - I would not be able to hoist up a single glulam beam alone. I should mention that this is probably not a wise choice as I've had a few close calls with dropping these heavy beasts. Incidentally, I'm surprised at the variability in the weight of the boards - some are heavy, and others are HEAVY.
For a future build I would spend more time looking at an engineered wood option and trying to find a reasonable price. It would be nice to not have to deal with the imperfections of 20-foot pieces of Southern yellow pine and have a perfectly straight beam.
Progress report from today: Rain. Lots of rain.
It appears that I sealed the sill plate well with the shims and sill sealer, because I now have a kiddie pool in the backyard. I haven't cut out the sill plate in the doorway yet so there is no real way for water to exit. The only visible leaks were from each of the control joints cut into the middle of each side of the slab. I worry a bit about what this water is doing to the borate treated lumber, i.e., leaching the treatment out.
.jpeg)
I spent a bit (OK, more than a bit) of time researching alternate beam options. I finally decided to just go with PT pine because I just needed to dive in and get started.
The only engineered wood beam option I could find locally would be a Glulam. Of course, there are other engineered beam options, but the Glulam was the only one available pressure treated. I asked my engineer about this and they OK'd a 3.5 x 9.25 Glulam. However, the pricing was way out of reach for me - something like $400 each - and they would have taken up to a month to get in.
In addition, using the triple 2x12 method has allowed me to build this by myself - I would not be able to hoist up a single glulam beam alone. I should mention that this is probably not a wise choice as I've had a few close calls with dropping these heavy beasts. Incidentally, I'm surprised at the variability in the weight of the boards - some are heavy, and others are HEAVY.
For a future build I would spend more time looking at an engineered wood option and trying to find a reasonable price. It would be nice to not have to deal with the imperfections of 20-foot pieces of Southern yellow pine and have a perfectly straight beam.
Progress report from today: Rain. Lots of rain.
It appears that I sealed the sill plate well with the shims and sill sealer, because I now have a kiddie pool in the backyard. I haven't cut out the sill plate in the doorway yet so there is no real way for water to exit. The only visible leaks were from each of the control joints cut into the middle of each side of the slab. I worry a bit about what this water is doing to the borate treated lumber, i.e., leaching the treatment out.
michaelsmith1441
New member
Great work! I like it. Keep up the great work
wasfast
Well-known member
Understand I'm not trying to "armchair quarterback" your project. PT lumber for anything cosmetic is not all that awesome. For roof rafters, I'm not clear why PT would be needed (i.e. no direct ground contact). Less rot potentially I guess.
I really like the basic design you started with. It has some cool factor for the type of building it is.
I also chuckled at the "water feature" you got.
I really like the basic design you started with. It has some cool factor for the type of building it is.
I also chuckled at the "water feature" you got.
wasfast, I'll take all the advice I can get since I really don't know what I'm doing
I'm hoping that the PT beams will look good after removing the green tint (with oxalic acid) and adding a couple coats of good stain (ReadySeal "pecan"). The engineer that I was required to hire (for the city) specified PT lumber for the beams - I suppose because they are exposed. The big concern was the 5-foot overhang - which becomes a wing in high wind. In that event, having a strong, non-rotted beam to support the uplift becomes important.
I'm hoping that the PT beams will look good after removing the green tint (with oxalic acid) and adding a couple coats of good stain (ReadySeal "pecan"). The engineer that I was required to hire (for the city) specified PT lumber for the beams - I suppose because they are exposed. The big concern was the 5-foot overhang - which becomes a wing in high wind. In that event, having a strong, non-rotted beam to support the uplift becomes important.
Update:
Ready for wall sheathing!
First, I hoisted the beams into place and screwed each outer beam to the middle beam. This definitely would have been a lot easier (and safer) with a helper since I'm not a very strong guy. I then drilled a row of three clearance holes, every four feet, through each outer beam then fastened it to the middle beam with GRK #10 x 3" structural screws. This means there are 18 screws holding each outer beam to the middle. I think this is an adequate number of fasteners for the beams that are supported by the wall framing, but the beams on the very front and very back completely hang over the wall framing (for a "reveal" as per the plans). I wonder if this is enough screws for these beams?
Next I reinforced the framing by using FastenMaster Timberlok 4" structural screws to secure the beams to the top plates on the outer walls. My engineer called for the use of Simpson twist straps here, but they actually don't fit because of the "reveal" mentioned above. I called the engineer and confirmed that I could just use the Timberloks instead. I used one in every stud bay, and three at each end for good measure. According to the spec sheet, this will give more uplift strength compared to the twist straps that were originally specified.
Since the middle beam does not have wall framing along its length, I used two twist straps as well as a Timberlok at each end. I also installed a couple of twist straps on the triple stud pack at the transition between the first top plate. Finally, I bolted down the triple stud pack to the concrete with a Simpson hold-down (LTT19).
So close to getting the roof on!
Questions:
1) What is the best method of holding/steadying the sheathing in place (by myself) so that I can nail it into the studs? I've read that one way is to partially hammer in a 16D nail below the sill plate and then resting the sheathing on the nails. This would line up the sheathing with the nails, but relies on your slab being level - and mine is not, so this method won't work for me. Any ideas?
2) Related to the non-level slab: if I want the bottom of the wall sheathing to be level on all 4 sides of the building, I will need to install it beginning at the lowest point of the non-level slab. The photo below shows that the lowest point is the NE corner, which is about 1.75" lower than the highest point (the door). In other words, I would have up to 1.75" of the side of the slab covered with the wall sheathing. Does the back of the wall sheathing in contact with the slab cause any problems?
3) I've learned that the minimum pitch recommended for asphalt shingles (which I already have) is 2/12. My pitch is 2.5/12. The MFR recommends on pitches below 4/12 to install a full water/ice barrier on the roof deck. I'm thinking about the "original" water/ice barrier by Grace. Any other recommendations for a specific water/ice barrier?
Ready for wall sheathing!
First, I hoisted the beams into place and screwed each outer beam to the middle beam. This definitely would have been a lot easier (and safer) with a helper since I'm not a very strong guy. I then drilled a row of three clearance holes, every four feet, through each outer beam then fastened it to the middle beam with GRK #10 x 3" structural screws. This means there are 18 screws holding each outer beam to the middle. I think this is an adequate number of fasteners for the beams that are supported by the wall framing, but the beams on the very front and very back completely hang over the wall framing (for a "reveal" as per the plans). I wonder if this is enough screws for these beams?
Next I reinforced the framing by using FastenMaster Timberlok 4" structural screws to secure the beams to the top plates on the outer walls. My engineer called for the use of Simpson twist straps here, but they actually don't fit because of the "reveal" mentioned above. I called the engineer and confirmed that I could just use the Timberloks instead. I used one in every stud bay, and three at each end for good measure. According to the spec sheet, this will give more uplift strength compared to the twist straps that were originally specified.
Since the middle beam does not have wall framing along its length, I used two twist straps as well as a Timberlok at each end. I also installed a couple of twist straps on the triple stud pack at the transition between the first top plate. Finally, I bolted down the triple stud pack to the concrete with a Simpson hold-down (LTT19).
So close to getting the roof on!
Questions:
1) What is the best method of holding/steadying the sheathing in place (by myself) so that I can nail it into the studs? I've read that one way is to partially hammer in a 16D nail below the sill plate and then resting the sheathing on the nails. This would line up the sheathing with the nails, but relies on your slab being level - and mine is not, so this method won't work for me. Any ideas?
2) Related to the non-level slab: if I want the bottom of the wall sheathing to be level on all 4 sides of the building, I will need to install it beginning at the lowest point of the non-level slab. The photo below shows that the lowest point is the NE corner, which is about 1.75" lower than the highest point (the door). In other words, I would have up to 1.75" of the side of the slab covered with the wall sheathing. Does the back of the wall sheathing in contact with the slab cause any problems?
3) I've learned that the minimum pitch recommended for asphalt shingles (which I already have) is 2/12. My pitch is 2.5/12. The MFR recommends on pitches below 4/12 to install a full water/ice barrier on the roof deck. I'm thinking about the "original" water/ice barrier by Grace. Any other recommendations for a specific water/ice barrier?
wasfast
Well-known member
1) I'd run the sheets horizontally (8' direction left to right). Snap a line at the desired height (upper edge of the sheet) for the first sheet, taking in to account the lowest point as you noted. I'd then put either a couple nails right above the line and jack the sheet into place against them using the toe of your boot to lever it up from the ground. Essentially the reverse as you were told because you can't get to the bottom plate in your case. Finish the first course on all 4 sides and then work your way up. Make sure you do #2 (see below) before nailing on the first sheets.
2) I'd put a layer of 30 lbs roofing felt along the bottom 12"-18" such that it extends well below the bottom edge of the sheathing. Nail the sheathing and then trim the paper flush with a utility knife afterwards. It at least prevents direct contact of the concrete and the sheathing.
3) 2/12 minimum is the general recommendation for asphalt shingles. If you live in a northern climate (with snow and freezing) AND plan to fully heat the space, perhaps the ice/water barrier is worth it. Otherwise, I'd likely just run a double overlapping course of 30 lbs roofing felt and call it good.
2) I'd put a layer of 30 lbs roofing felt along the bottom 12"-18" such that it extends well below the bottom edge of the sheathing. Nail the sheathing and then trim the paper flush with a utility knife afterwards. It at least prevents direct contact of the concrete and the sheathing.
3) 2/12 minimum is the general recommendation for asphalt shingles. If you live in a northern climate (with snow and freezing) AND plan to fully heat the space, perhaps the ice/water barrier is worth it. Otherwise, I'd likely just run a double overlapping course of 30 lbs roofing felt and call it good.
Vintage Veloce
Well-known member
Looks good! I'd be tempted to consider some other roofing materials, with insulation. Not sure what... depends on where you are located.
jfauto
Member
Love the design. Looks great.
I've had the walls sheathed for a couple of weeks now but I had to wait for good weather and a crew of friends to all get together to help put the roof panels on. The roof panels are currently just open stud bays. The next step is roof sheathing, then I can get it inspected I think.
As you can see, I used ZIP sheathing on the walls and will do the same for the roof. I haven't sealed the seams yet because I think the inspector might want to see the nail heads first. Fortunately it looks like I'll have some clear weather through the weekend so I won't have to worry about rain.
Building the roof panels first and installing/painting the ceiling on the ground at the beginning of the project worked out well. Having the ceiling already in place and painted is definitely nice. It was kind of inconvenient to have to wait around until I could heard together enough people to help put the roof panels on, and I felt pretty sheepish about asking friends to help out with the unpleasant job of lifting them into place in the middle of summer.
Finally looking like a building!
As you can see, I used ZIP sheathing on the walls and will do the same for the roof. I haven't sealed the seams yet because I think the inspector might want to see the nail heads first. Fortunately it looks like I'll have some clear weather through the weekend so I won't have to worry about rain.
Building the roof panels first and installing/painting the ceiling on the ground at the beginning of the project worked out well. Having the ceiling already in place and painted is definitely nice. It was kind of inconvenient to have to wait around until I could heard together enough people to help put the roof panels on, and I felt pretty sheepish about asking friends to help out with the unpleasant job of lifting them into place in the middle of summer.
Finally looking like a building!
Boosted1
Well-known member
Just saw your thread.
Nice work even if it isn't your first build.
Your design has lots of character.
Nice work even if it isn't your first build.
Your design has lots of character.
Vintage Veloce
Well-known member
Looking good!
Millcreekmadman
Well-known member
Really creative design. Im excited to see how this one turns out.
T-handle
Well-known member
Great work and very nice desing
I had a very busy fall and did not make much progress. The pressure to finish the building was relieved somewhat by getting it "dried in" with the roof and door.
Here is my overdue progress report:
I fastened the roof panels to the triple 2x12 beams with FastenMaster 6-inch structural screws. These went through the tops of the rafters and into each of the triple 2x12 beams. I installed one screw through every rafter at each beam location. This gives the roof a lot more uplift strength than the original plan called for and hardly required any more cost or effort. I believe the traditional way of this connection is to use Simpson connectors, but doing it this way would not have allowed me to have the finished ceiling and would have resulted in exposed connectors which would have been ugly.
I then filled the rafter bays with rockwool insulation. This stuff was easy to work with and provided a tight friction-fit in the stud bays. It was easy to justify the higher cost compared to fiberglass due to the ease of *proper* installation IMO. The rockwool got a slight shower on it and highlighted the fact that it does not absorb water and get ruined (compacted) like fiberglass does. The photo below shows some raindrops that kind of sat on top without absorbing into the rest of the insulation.
.jpeg)
I then installed the roof sheathing. I again used zip panels. I taped the ceiling seams with zip tape.
.jpeg)
Next step was to install the door. This was my first time doing this job so I read up quite a bit on how to do it properly so that the door is strong and seals out air, water, and bugs and does not rot out the door or frame.
The first step was to flash the door opening with zip tape. I also used zip liquid flash in the corners as per the manufacturer's instructions. Since my slab was not level, I used a PVC board and shims to level out the bottom of the door opening. I then used more liquid flash to seal this at the slab.
Next, I installed a sill pan. I think this step is frequently omitted by many amateur builders and even many so-called pros. I actually called several pros about installing my door for me and every one of them stated they never install sill pans. This slap-happy approach by the pros pushed me to do the job myself and it was easy and inexpensive. I purchased a Jamsill plastic sill pan and OSI quad max to do the job. I then installed plywood shims on one side and used composite shims on the other to shim the door. There is a real art to this process that I read up on at Gary Katz's website and youtube (links below). My installation turned out great and my door closes very tightly with zero visible light inside.
I chose an inexpensive fiberglass door with no panels or windows in it for a modern look to match the building. Instead of panels, the door has a "shadow line" routed into the panel to give it some visual interest. I think this will look great once painted (it is currently in white primer). I wanted to hang the door first and paint it later for the sake of getting the building dried in so that I could start storing stuff inside. The brickmold that came with the door is too detailed for the modern style of the door so i will be removing this and replacing with a simpler PVC brickmold.
Finally, I installed a good quality lock and handleset by Schlage. The home stores only sell light duty locks, so I ordered a nicer quality "grade 2" deadbolt online. I also ordered a nicer quality handle online.
Here are some videos that I used to help me through this door installation process:
Zip system - entry door flashing
Zip system - T-joint flashing
Sill Pan installation with OSI Quad Max
Exterior Door installation by Lowes
How to shim a pre-hung door the right way by Gary Katz
How to shim a pre-hung door by Gary Katz - text link
Here is my overdue progress report:
I fastened the roof panels to the triple 2x12 beams with FastenMaster 6-inch structural screws. These went through the tops of the rafters and into each of the triple 2x12 beams. I installed one screw through every rafter at each beam location. This gives the roof a lot more uplift strength than the original plan called for and hardly required any more cost or effort. I believe the traditional way of this connection is to use Simpson connectors, but doing it this way would not have allowed me to have the finished ceiling and would have resulted in exposed connectors which would have been ugly.
I then filled the rafter bays with rockwool insulation. This stuff was easy to work with and provided a tight friction-fit in the stud bays. It was easy to justify the higher cost compared to fiberglass due to the ease of *proper* installation IMO. The rockwool got a slight shower on it and highlighted the fact that it does not absorb water and get ruined (compacted) like fiberglass does. The photo below shows some raindrops that kind of sat on top without absorbing into the rest of the insulation.
I then installed the roof sheathing. I again used zip panels. I taped the ceiling seams with zip tape.
Next step was to install the door. This was my first time doing this job so I read up quite a bit on how to do it properly so that the door is strong and seals out air, water, and bugs and does not rot out the door or frame.
The first step was to flash the door opening with zip tape. I also used zip liquid flash in the corners as per the manufacturer's instructions. Since my slab was not level, I used a PVC board and shims to level out the bottom of the door opening. I then used more liquid flash to seal this at the slab.
Next, I installed a sill pan. I think this step is frequently omitted by many amateur builders and even many so-called pros. I actually called several pros about installing my door for me and every one of them stated they never install sill pans. This slap-happy approach by the pros pushed me to do the job myself and it was easy and inexpensive. I purchased a Jamsill plastic sill pan and OSI quad max to do the job. I then installed plywood shims on one side and used composite shims on the other to shim the door. There is a real art to this process that I read up on at Gary Katz's website and youtube (links below). My installation turned out great and my door closes very tightly with zero visible light inside.
I chose an inexpensive fiberglass door with no panels or windows in it for a modern look to match the building. Instead of panels, the door has a "shadow line" routed into the panel to give it some visual interest. I think this will look great once painted (it is currently in white primer). I wanted to hang the door first and paint it later for the sake of getting the building dried in so that I could start storing stuff inside. The brickmold that came with the door is too detailed for the modern style of the door so i will be removing this and replacing with a simpler PVC brickmold.
Finally, I installed a good quality lock and handleset by Schlage. The home stores only sell light duty locks, so I ordered a nicer quality "grade 2" deadbolt online. I also ordered a nicer quality handle online.
Here are some videos that I used to help me through this door installation process:
Zip system - entry door flashing
Zip system - T-joint flashing
Sill Pan installation with OSI Quad Max
Exterior Door installation by Lowes
How to shim a pre-hung door the right way by Gary Katz
How to shim a pre-hung door by Gary Katz - text link
charmin35
Well-known member
Nice work over there. If I had to do my garage again I'd have paid a little more and used the zip panels as well. Nice job following the liquid applied water barrier details. I used an entire 10oz tube of OSI quad max to seal the backside of the door, but also every nook and cranny on the front after I realized some water was somehow sliding its way in somewhere near the bottom.
How has it held up in the rain so far? No issues?
My inspector had me attach a pressure treated 2x4 under the door threshold, with tapcons into the concrete, to support foot traffic under it right at the edge. Which I needed to do anyway. Do you notice that aluminum part flexes a lot of you step on the edge of it?
How has it held up in the rain so far? No issues?
My inspector had me attach a pressure treated 2x4 under the door threshold, with tapcons into the concrete, to support foot traffic under it right at the edge. Which I needed to do anyway. Do you notice that aluminum part flexes a lot of you step on the edge of it?
I did the above roof and door work at the very end of summer and then made slow progress over the last few months. First up was to waterproof the roof. I wanted to be absolutely sure that I was doing this part right and I think I accomplished this - I may have even gone overkill here.
I first applied a full layer of Grace Ice & Water shield. According to the shingle manufacturers, this step is necessary because my roof pitch is only 2.5/12.
Next step was to install the fascia board to the roof panels. I used 16-ft pieces of LP Smartside trim board for this. I chose to paint both sides of the fascia boards before putting them up and then painted a second coat once up.
I then installed drip edge over top of the underlayment. I chose to install a furring strip behind the drip edge in order to move it further away from the fascia board. As the preceding link details, this is good practice in order for the drip edge to do its job of actually moving water away from the wooden structure. I only mention this in my progress report because it appears that this is often a neglected step even by professional builders. I painted my 1x2 furring strip on one side so that it blends in with the fascia board when looking up at it.
I learned a few other things about best practices for drip edge installation that are not obvious to a first-timer like myself. To prevent damage from high winds, it is important to observe the following:
- use 12-gauge roofing nails (preferably hot dipped galvanized and ring-shanked) that penetrate into the 2x4 edge of the roof panel, not the fascia board
- drip edge must extend a minimum of 2" onto the roof
- use a "W" nailing pattern with 4" on-center spacing (see photo below)
- overlap adjacent drip edge sections by at least 3"
- install shingles flush to edges of drip edge (or no more than 1/4" of overhang)
After the drip edge was installed, I laid down a layer of Grace Vycor roof flashing on top of the drip edge. This will seal the nail penetrations into the drip edge.
.jpeg)
.jpeg)
.jpeg)
Finally, I moved onto the shingles. I started off by using a proper "starter shingle" by GAF. This comes in a roll and is peel-and-stick:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/GAF-QuickStart-33-lin-ft-Black-Starter-Roof-Shingles/1000405121
I then used a light-colored, energy efficient, architectural shingle by Owens Corning:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Owens-Corn...Laminated-Architectural-Roof-Shingles/3320122
.jpeg)
.jpeg)
I first applied a full layer of Grace Ice & Water shield. According to the shingle manufacturers, this step is necessary because my roof pitch is only 2.5/12.
Next step was to install the fascia board to the roof panels. I used 16-ft pieces of LP Smartside trim board for this. I chose to paint both sides of the fascia boards before putting them up and then painted a second coat once up.
I then installed drip edge over top of the underlayment. I chose to install a furring strip behind the drip edge in order to move it further away from the fascia board. As the preceding link details, this is good practice in order for the drip edge to do its job of actually moving water away from the wooden structure. I only mention this in my progress report because it appears that this is often a neglected step even by professional builders. I painted my 1x2 furring strip on one side so that it blends in with the fascia board when looking up at it.
I learned a few other things about best practices for drip edge installation that are not obvious to a first-timer like myself. To prevent damage from high winds, it is important to observe the following:
- use 12-gauge roofing nails (preferably hot dipped galvanized and ring-shanked) that penetrate into the 2x4 edge of the roof panel, not the fascia board
- drip edge must extend a minimum of 2" onto the roof
- use a "W" nailing pattern with 4" on-center spacing (see photo below)
- overlap adjacent drip edge sections by at least 3"
- install shingles flush to edges of drip edge (or no more than 1/4" of overhang)
After the drip edge was installed, I laid down a layer of Grace Vycor roof flashing on top of the drip edge. This will seal the nail penetrations into the drip edge.
Finally, I moved onto the shingles. I started off by using a proper "starter shingle" by GAF. This comes in a roll and is peel-and-stick:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/GAF-QuickStart-33-lin-ft-Black-Starter-Roof-Shingles/1000405121
I then used a light-colored, energy efficient, architectural shingle by Owens Corning:
https://www.lowes.com/pd/Owens-Corn...Laminated-Architectural-Roof-Shingles/3320122
Last edited:
And that brings this thread up to date.
My next step is to look into some custom-sized windows under the roofline on the side with the door. I initially decided against windows here, but after some thought, I would like to have them if I can do it inexpensively enough.
After I make that decision, I will move onto pouring a concrete skirt under the overhang and around the back side. I will update again as soon as I get to this point!
My next step is to look into some custom-sized windows under the roofline on the side with the door. I initially decided against windows here, but after some thought, I would like to have them if I can do it inexpensively enough.
After I make that decision, I will move onto pouring a concrete skirt under the overhang and around the back side. I will update again as soon as I get to this point!
Last edited:
I really like the zip panels. They have allowed me to delay installing siding panels for months. I will soon apply liquid flash at the seams and nail heads to finish off the job.
So far I have not detected any water intrusion at the door (or anywhere else), and I have had quite a bit of rain to test that. Fingers crossed!
I installed a piece of PVC board under the door threshold to support foot traffic. I secured this board with Loctite Fastgrab 8x adhesive and tapcons to the concrete pad. The threshold seems rock solid with this support.
Minor update:
I was a bit confused about the best way to finish off the last course of shingles on the single-sloped / shed roof: when you lay down the last course of shingles near the top edge of the roof, how do you finish this off to prevent water from going underneath the shingles? In other words, the roof peak is one-sided, so you can't lay down a ridge cap as you would on a normal peaked roof.
After some reading online, I decided that this was best accomplished with metal flashing. I found out that I could use a local metal roofing fabricator to make me a custom piece of flashing for this purpose. This was better than buying an off-the-shelf flashing at the hardware store because I was able to specify the color (white), the pitch of my roof (so the flashing is not just a 90-degree bend), and the width of the horizontal and vertical portions so that it properly covered my top course of shingles as well as the roof's fascia board. The custom flashing is also 26ga so it is nice and sturdy. It was not very expensive IMO. In hindsight, I would have ordered my drip edge the same way but I didn't know I could do this.
You might notice that I ended up with TWO pieces of metal flashing on the high side of my roof because I first installed drip edge here and then installed the flashing over top. I could have omitted the drip edge but I don't think the way I did it will cause any problems.
I was then a bit confused on how to attach the metal flashing. I decided the best way was with metal roofing screws with EDPM washers. There are quite a variety of these screws and none of the big box stores carried the right combination of thread (wood, not metal), color (white), and length (2.0") so I again placed a special order with a local metal roofing supplier.
Here's a photo showing the top edge with the metal roofing screws:
.jpeg)
Finished roof:
.jpeg)
I was a bit confused about the best way to finish off the last course of shingles on the single-sloped / shed roof: when you lay down the last course of shingles near the top edge of the roof, how do you finish this off to prevent water from going underneath the shingles? In other words, the roof peak is one-sided, so you can't lay down a ridge cap as you would on a normal peaked roof.
After some reading online, I decided that this was best accomplished with metal flashing. I found out that I could use a local metal roofing fabricator to make me a custom piece of flashing for this purpose. This was better than buying an off-the-shelf flashing at the hardware store because I was able to specify the color (white), the pitch of my roof (so the flashing is not just a 90-degree bend), and the width of the horizontal and vertical portions so that it properly covered my top course of shingles as well as the roof's fascia board. The custom flashing is also 26ga so it is nice and sturdy. It was not very expensive IMO. In hindsight, I would have ordered my drip edge the same way but I didn't know I could do this.
You might notice that I ended up with TWO pieces of metal flashing on the high side of my roof because I first installed drip edge here and then installed the flashing over top. I could have omitted the drip edge but I don't think the way I did it will cause any problems.
I was then a bit confused on how to attach the metal flashing. I decided the best way was with metal roofing screws with EDPM washers. There are quite a variety of these screws and none of the big box stores carried the right combination of thread (wood, not metal), color (white), and length (2.0") so I again placed a special order with a local metal roofing supplier.
Here's a photo showing the top edge with the metal roofing screws:
Finished roof:
I'm treating this thread a bit like a journal now to remind me of what I've done, so forgive me if some of my posts are not very interesting at this point.
By chance, I came across this recent video by "Essential Craftsman" on youtube where he discusses the issues of rafters sitting on a beam without a birdsmouth. My workshed design has this issue because the roof panels sit on only the corner of the roof beams, and since the ceiling is finished beforehand, cutting a birdsmouth is impossible. I was not really happy with this aspect of the design but when I asked the engineer about it they said it was fine. The Essential Craftsman video shows how he ripped some boards to the correct angle and then glued and nailed these to the top of his beams.
If I were to build this design again, I would add the angled pieces on top of the roof beams so that the roof panels sit flat against the beams. Better yet, I would use an engineered beam and just specify that the tops of these beams are cut to the correct angle at the factory.
By chance, I came across this recent video by "Essential Craftsman" on youtube where he discusses the issues of rafters sitting on a beam without a birdsmouth. My workshed design has this issue because the roof panels sit on only the corner of the roof beams, and since the ceiling is finished beforehand, cutting a birdsmouth is impossible. I was not really happy with this aspect of the design but when I asked the engineer about it they said it was fine. The Essential Craftsman video shows how he ripped some boards to the correct angle and then glued and nailed these to the top of his beams.
If I were to build this design again, I would add the angled pieces on top of the roof beams so that the roof panels sit flat against the beams. Better yet, I would use an engineered beam and just specify that the tops of these beams are cut to the correct angle at the factory.