Garage Not Air Sealed..

[krn1188]

Hi! I moved into an apartment last Fall and noticed some strange musty odors coming in through a kitchen cabinet that shares the wall with the attached garage and a similar problem in the master closet that is also attached to that same wall. It was a brand new construction and I was busy moving in, so I didn't think much of it. I assumed maybe it was the building materials off gassing. Then it got worse and everything in my closet was ruined - my entire wardrobe had to be tossed because the odor was so disgusting. I started wondering if it was just my items because they had been packed for about 3 months prior to moving in - threw just about everything out and completely cleaned. The smell is still just as bad and I can feel warm air coming under the baseboard that shares the garage wall.

The odor in the cabinets on the lower wall in the kitchen and the closet and now a lot of the house absolutely reeks since it's been humid. Also, our central AC just will not keep the humidity under control at all - over 70%. Upon investigating I can see where the drywall in the garage meets the cement, there's no sealing. Then along the wall by the kitchen outside in the garage there's a baseboard - but under it you can see straight through to insulation and framing. So it looks like concrete floor, some concrete going up - the concrete stops - there's a baseboard and under that gap between the concrete and the baseboard, there's wood beams and a grey insulation. On the side walls, it's the same but I can't see the actual boards - I see drywall with a rough cut that meets the concrete walls and the insulation kind of hanging out underneath.

Our air intake for our apartment is over the garage door and it's sucking in air from the garage and blowing it all around our living space which is just truly disgusting. I contacted the apartment complex and someone says they're coming to seal it hopefully this week - but I'm just a little worried that maybe there's a bigger issue or mold or something inside the walls? Luckily we have never parked our car in the garage - but honestly once in a while I smell gas fumes and each of these apartments has an attached garage so the neighbors garage is up against my other kitchen wall.

Do any of you guys have experience with finishing garages? This totally isn't normal right?

 

[jbtvt]

What you're describing sounds pretty standard. If you're seeing insulation, then it's sealed. Maybe it's missing a vapor barrier, if unfaced batt and no plastic but you'd likely need to cut into the wall to figure that out.

They make mold test kits but I've never tried one

 

[Bretny]

When hot humid air hits a cold surface it makes condensation..so yes I would be looking for mold.

What's the smell? Like a musty smell?

 

[BillK]

I just cant imagine what kind of smell from a small attached garage would be bad enough to ruin clothes ???? Especially if you have never parked your car in it.

 

[wssix99]

None of this is standard and it sounds like a very bad situation. Aside from the smell, the garage should be sealed for fireproofing considerations.

Building code requires a firewall between a garage and living spaces. There should be at least two layers of 5/8" drywall in the garage and everything sealed. If you don't have this level of protection, I suggest you reach out to your local building department. (It sounds like you are able to see how they have it layered on the wall.)

Whatever your landlord has planned to "make this right" is probably not going to get you to code. (If your municipality is subject to the IBC - International Building Code.) Your building department can confirm this and I would ask them this question, also.


BTW - My wife and I built our house like this. Bedroom over the garage. We have a proper firewall and fireproofing and the only gasses we smell come from my body.

 

[jbtvt]

It's more likely than not that OP's apartment falls under IRC, rather than IBC, in which case this is both standard, and up to code. Certainly it's standard in that every non-high rise apartment I've ever seen features this type of construction. Fiberglass is an approved fireblock under IRC, as is the dimensional lumber, and code only requires a single layer of 1/2 drywall, whereas he already has 2 layers. I'd be willing to wager that most he'll get out of this is some fireblock foam sprayed into the gaps.

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Probably the best solution, after foaming the gaps, would be for OP to apply a couple coats of gloss paint over the affected drywall, which will slow vapor and block most odor, at least for a while. Zinsser shellac if he really wants to go wild, but that's more difficult to work with.

edit spelling

 

[firebirdparts]

I'm confused about the air intake comment. Sealing the ingress under the wall will take $5 and 5 minutes, but wherever that air intake is, that is not going away. My wife ******* about humidity and also opens the windows. Not much I can do except go to work and earn unlimited money so that she can run heat, a/c, humidier, dehumidifier all at the same time with the windows open.

 

[krn1188]

What you're describing sounds pretty standard. If you're seeing insulation, then it's sealed. Maybe it's missing a vapor barrier, if unfaced batt and no plastic but you'd likely need to cut into the wall to figure that out.

They make mold test kits but I've never tried one

Thanks - yeah I wasn't sure because I'm having tons of weird odors leaching into my kitchen cupboards and closet and then getting sucked all through the apartment. It just seems kind of unsafe considering fumes, etc could all make it inside. I think they are going to use some kind of foam/sealant to seal the gaps and seams - but I won't know until they come out. Hopefully if they do that it'll keep whatever odor is in the garage... in there and not all over everything in my apartment :/.

When hot humid air hits a cold surface it makes condensation..so yes I would be looking for mold.

What's the smell? Like a musty smell?

It’s a musty smell mixed with a really sharp smell like ammonia/urine. We didn’t use the garage at all over the winter besides to walk out to the car in the driveway. And to be honest, during the pandemic - we haven't gone anywhere so maybe 1-2 times a week walking out quickly to go get in the car and pickup groceries.

We had some boxes stored on one side for a few months while we were moving in. That’s pretty much it. While those were out there, I could smell a little bit of a cardboard/musty smell so I tossed them. They didn't look wet or anything - no stains or mildew/mold. Never stored any chemicals etc or anything in there and really just didn’t go out there at all. We have our bikes in there - a metal shelf with a toolbox on it and a stroller. I sprayed everything with vinegar and scrubbed everything down and it did absolutely nothing. We take our trash out daily - so it's not that.

 

[krn1188]

I just cant imagine what kind of smell from a small attached garage would be bad enough to ruin clothes ???? Especially if you have never parked your car in it.

It smells like straight up ammonia/pee with musty air mixed in. So in that lower cabinet - it’s hot air blowing around and it smells terrible. If you open it or open the drawer above it, it will almost knock you over. I had two pans and a mixer stored in there and I did have our utensils in the upper drawer until I realized where this smell was coming from. I’ve cleaned, scrubbed, sanitized. It’s only the two lower cabinets coming from that lower corner wall.

 

[krn1188]

None of this is standard and it sounds like a very bad situation. Aside from the smell, the garage should be sealed for fireproofing considerations.

Building code requires a firewall between a garage and living spaces. There should be at least two layers of 5/8" drywall in the garage and everything sealed. If you don't have this level of protection, I suggest you reach out to your local building department. (It sounds like you are able to see how they have it layered on the wall.)

Whatever your landlord has planned to "make this right" is probably not going to get you to code. (If your municipality is subject to the IBC - International Building Code.) Your building department can confirm this and I would ask them this question, also.


BTW - My wife and I built our house like this. Bedroom over the garage. We have a proper firewall and fireproofing and the only gasses we smell come from my body.

Initially they said they’d use a camera and test for mold. Now they talked to the builder again and he said the barrier is on the inside behind the insulation. That the gap in the concrete and no sealant around the drywall is correct to allow for air circulation and that there would be visible mold on the outside wall (drywall) if there was a problem. I call BS on this because I know for a fact mold can grow inside just about any space with moisture and humidity.
The inside of my apartment won’t go below 70 even running the central air and using a dehumidifier. They came and looked at the exterior of the apartment today and said it was properly sealed and they suspect the garage is also. They just want to come in and take a look but they can also only see what I can so not sure how that’s effective without some type of tool to search for thermal differences or a camera to see openings? Also the apartment my exact layout on the other end had spray foam all around the outside this winter so I know there’s no way this is just me and totally isolated.

 

[krn1188]

I'm confused about the air intake comment. Sealing the ingress under the wall will take $5 and 5 minutes, but wherever that air intake is, that is not going away. My wife ******* about humidity and also opens the windows. Not much I can do except go to work and earn unlimited money so that she can run heat, a/c, humidier, dehumidifier all at the same time with the windows open.

It’s the grill for the intake is right above the garage door in the kitchen so when it turns on, the air is getting pulled (from the garage, I think) into the unit then distributed throughout. My exhaust fans in the bathroom run 24/7 Bc they’re on auto and the humidity is so high. When it kicks on I can smell this god awful ammonia/moldy smell and it just pumps all throughout the entire apartment. The apartment keeps telling me no one else has complained of humidity issues or odor issues. Idk how I got so lucky with this but it’s awful. I’ve checked for rodents or animals out of desperation and can’t see any evidence of that.

 

[jbtvt]

It’s the grill for the intake is right above the garage door in the kitchen so when it turns on, the air is getting pulled (from the garage, I think) into the unit then distributed throughout. My exhaust fans in the bathroom run 24/7 Bc they’re on auto and the humidity is so high. When it kicks on I can smell this god awful ammonia/moldy smell and it just pumps all throughout the entire apartment. The apartment keeps telling me no one else has complained of humidity issues or odor issues. Idk how I got so lucky with this but it’s awful. I’ve checked for rodents or animals out of desperation and can’t see any evidence of that.

First thing you should do is turn off your bathroom fans (multiple?), you're pulling humid, outside air inside, probably at the rate of hundreds of CFMs. No wonder your AC can't keep up. Hopefully you also close the windows, not like wife above.

If you're also getting a smell from the ducts they may need to be cleaned and have the filters changed. Gotta be videos online of how to DIY this, as a landlord prob isn't going to want to pay for it.

 

[SALIV8]

What happens if u accidently left ur car running in the garage? I thought all garages had to have some serious air sealing measures taken no matter what area of the US it is in? Seems like a serious problem to me.

 

[krn1188]

First thing you should do is turn off your bathroom fans (multiple?), you're pulling humid, outside air inside, probably at the rate of hundreds of CFMs. No wonder your AC can't keep up. Hopefully you also close the windows, not like wife above.

If you're also getting a smell from the ducts they may need to be cleaned and have the filters changed. Gotta be videos online of how to DIY this, as a landlord prob isn't going to want to pay for it.

Our windows are always shut Bc my son has allergies. I asked the hvac person they had call us and maintenance Bc I read that the fans running like that would be pulling in constant humid air and they said “they’re doing what they’re supposed to”. My bathrooms are like a swamp and no one has showered in them. The fans are on those automatic sensors that I can’t turn off.

 

[BillK]

Is this a new building ? Where are you located ?? If I had my thermostat set at 70 degrees I would be freezing to death.

I am still not sure exactly what the "air intake" is that you keep mentioning ? HVAC systems that I know of do not take in any air from outside the building. They simply circulate the indoor air and either heat it or cool it. How about some pictures of this stuff, might make it easier to figure out what you are dealing with.

 

[Pontiac787]

I don’t think your issue is the garage. Sounds like there is a water/mold/critter issue going on.

 

[krn1188]

What happens if u accidently left ur car running in the garage? I thought all garages had to have some serious air sealing measures taken no matter what area of the US it is in? Seems like a serious problem to me.

Yeah and I told them I can occasionally smell exhaust even when my car has never been parked in there - so I wondered if it was coming from the garage next to my kitchen wall that is my neighbors and they haven’t looked into it or acknowledged it at all.

When we first moved in my husband was in the driveway and started the car with the garage door open and he was backed in but the inside door was shut and I remember calling him and asking why I smelt exhaust in the dining room. Makes sense now. I’m just not sure how weeks and months can go by where they don’t do anything about this.

 

[krn1188]

Is this a new building ? Where are you located ?? If I had my thermostat set at 70 degrees I would be freezing to death.

I am still not sure exactly what the "air intake" is that you keep mentioning ? HVAC systems that I know of do not take in any air from outside the building. They simply circulate the indoor air and either heat it or cool it. How about some pictures of this stuff, might make it easier to figure out what you are dealing with.

it’s a brand new building. It was ready to move in this last fall. I’m in New England. I’d be fine keeping it at a higher temp, but it’s a loft with super high ceilings so the upstairs doesn’t cool off well. Also, I noticed if I keep the temp higher - the humidity is worse. Also my sons room - his closet is above the garage and it’s HOT in there and now running a dehumidifier on full blast in here - it’s even hotter. Right now the dehumidifier is on high and it won’t even get to 50. The Dyson purifier is also in here and it’s saying the RH is 58% right now.

I can take photos if it will help. I think I said the wrong thing. It’s the return vent for the hvac not the intake. So the return is over the kitchen door that goes out into the garage and there’s like a little box of drywall in the garage ceiling that hides the ductwork and then upstairs there’s another return I think where the actual hvac unit is located and all our vents are on the ceiling.

 

[krn1188]

I don’t think your issue is the garage. Sounds like there is a water/mold/critter issue going on.

I wondered that too. I haven’t seen any signs of anything and I’ve been looking. I also asked if they thought it could be that and they said I’d smell more than a urine smell if it were some type of rodent/animal.

 

[krn1188]

Also - just wanted to say thank you to those willing to offer any opinions/advice. This has been so stressful and I feel like I am getting the major run around with my apartment. Initially I felt hopeful for a solution because the builder they had us speak with said the garage didn't look right based on our picture - so I was like, great - they can fix it and we can move on. But then fast forward a few days later and the builder that they had us speak with who actually built these apartments said - it's correct, nothing wrong, everything is good.

They send someone out to look at the exterior of the apartment today and also said it looks fine. Correct me if I'm wrong, but to determine leaks - is that a purely visual thing or isn't there supposed to be some equipment utilized? We had ice cold air blowing under all our baseboards and from every outlet all winter to the point we had to put backing rod under the gaps in the baseboards because we were freezing and there was still airflow. They told us no one else had an issue - but we saw the same house in the same section as ours and the same layout with tons of spray foam sprayed all around the exterior where we were also having our issue.

Now, same thing with the humidity/odor/hot air blowing into our cabinets - they keep saying "no one else has had this issue" and it makes me second guess myself but I know something is not right. I've already replaced like everything I own and I'm really not interested in doing that again. I have zero idea what the odor IN the garage actually is caused by - but it's a super sickening smell. I thought with being the first people to live here, I would have no issues - but it appears that's not the case.

The only thing I see in the garage when I was cleaning is a white substance on the ground in the corner. I looked it up and it seems like it's salt deposits on the concrete (efflorescence)? It's all along the garage floor on the other side of the kitchen.

I can get an air quality test and I've been on the fence of doing it for the past few months because it's around 1100 to test for everything - chemicals, mold ect and I'm worried even if I get a positive result, there won't be a change anyhow because I don't know if it's something they'd have to address. They said they'd do mold testing and then backed out of it a few days later saying it wasn't possible for there to be any mold inside the walls in the garage.

 

[SALIV8]

If your landlord is draggin their feet i would escalate this issue to the authority having jurisdiction. Your city building dept will be very interested in this complaint since it is a potentially hazardous situation. I would be very clear that I can smell exhaust fumes in the kitchen and whole apt when hubby pulls the car into the garage. And it is nauseating.
My city has a simple online portal to submit complaints.
They will send someone out and then youll have your answer.

 

[krn1188]

If your landlord is draggin their feet i would escalate this issue to the authority having jurisdiction. Your city building dept will be very interested in this complaint since it is a potentially hazardous situation. I would be very clear that I can smell exhaust fumes in the kitchen and whole apt when hubby pulls the car into the garage. And it is nauseating.
My city has a simple online portal to submit complaints.
They will send someone out and then youll have your answer.

Thank you, I'll look into that. I just opened the door to the garage and with the heat, it's the most horrid smell. I have no idea where it's coming from but it literally takes your breath away. It smells like salt/urine/mildew all mixed together and it's not a whiff of a smell it's just so thick in the air it's disgusting. I'm actually worried about staying here. It's definitely coming all around the door, under the door and under and through the lower cabinets.

 

[wssix99]

That the gap in the concrete and no sealant around the drywall is correct to allow for air circulation and that there would be visible mold on the outside wall (drywall) if there was a problem. I call BS on this because I know for a fact mold can grow inside just about any space with moisture and humidity.

I agree. Regardless of the code you are subject to, this wall needs to be continuously sealed for fire protection. Plastic or synthetic vapor barriers (behind the drywall) control moisture and mold.

Our windows are always shut Bc my son has allergies. I asked the hvac person they had call us and maintenance Bc I read that the fans running like that would be pulling in constant humid air and they said “they’re doing what they’re supposed to”. My bathrooms are like a swamp and no one has showered in them. The fans are on those automatic sensors that I can’t turn off.

Are the fans really on automatic sensors, or do they come on with the lights? (You can check easily by holding a tissue up to the vent.)

You could also be having a negative pressure problem. This occurs sometimes when houses are sealed too well and/or the HVAC doesn't take the situation into account. (My house has this issue and it's a pain to deal with.) https://yellowbluetech.com/2019/04/10/clearing-home-negative-air-pressure/

In a negative pressure air condition, things like your bath fan will "****" air (and down the road... water when it rains) in from wherever it can get it. (Because there is not enough fresh air supply to make up what is being exhausted out of the building.) The air will come in through the path of least resistance.

One thing you might try is cracking a window in one part of the house. (For the allergy concerns, you can put a high quality furnace filter in front of the opening. If you do have a negative pressure problem, the air should come in from that window/filter vs. the other areas that smell.

^ You may also find that this helps your bath fans work more efficiently. (If they are trying to blow air out of the apartment and no fresh air can come in behind it, they aren't going to do their job very well.)

I just opened the door to the garage and with the heat, it's the most horrid smell. I have no idea where it's coming from but it literally takes your breath away. It smells like salt/urine/mildew all mixed together and it's not a whiff of a smell it's just so thick in the air it's disgusting.

Nothing smells like pee except for... pee. I would look for the pee.

I lived in a condo a few years ago and we had a neighbor who was walking around the hallways and garage urinating on everything. So, that was not a good situation, but a few web cams recordings, a call to the police, and some lawyers took care of that for us.

Hopefully the source of your smell is not a neighbor. More likely, I would expect it would be a rodent. (They go to the bathroom in the same location and concentrate the goodness, so it smells worse but usually easier to detect.) If a rodent is responsible, they could have burrowed into a wall, which would put the smell close to you and also create a weakness in the sealing system that would allow air to come in.

You may also make sure the garage is secure. We also have homeless people come into our garages, exterior stairwells, and elevators to urinate because it gives them privacy.

 

[krn1188]

I agree. Regardless of the code you are subject to, this wall needs to be continuously sealed for fire protection. Plastic or synthetic vapor barriers (behind the drywall) control moisture and mold.




Are the fans really on automatic sensors, or do they come on with the lights? (You can check easily by holding a tissue up to the vent.)

You could also be having a negative pressure problem. This occurs sometimes when houses are sealed too well and/or the HVAC doesn't take the situation into account. (My house has this issue and it's a pain to deal with.) https://yellowbluetech.com/2019/04/10/clearing-home-negative-air-pressure/

In a negative pressure air condition, things like your bath fan will "****" air (and down the road... water when it rains) in from wherever it can get it. (Because there is not enough fresh air supply to make up what is being exhausted out of the building.) The air will come in through the path of least resistance.

One thing you might try is cracking a window in one part of the house. (For the allergy concerns, you can put a high quality furnace filter in front of the opening. If you do have a negative pressure problem, the air should come in from that window/filter vs. the other areas that smell.

^ You may also find that this helps your bath fans work more efficiently. (If they are trying to blow air out of the apartment and no fresh air can come in behind it, they aren't going to do their job very well.)



Nothing smells like pee except for... pee. I would look for the pee.

I lived in a condo a few years ago and we had a neighbor who was walking around the hallways and garage urinating on everything. So, that was not a good situation, but a few web cams recordings, a call to the police, and some lawyers took care of that for us.

Hopefully the source of your smell is not a neighbor. More likely, I would expect it would be a rodent. (They go to the bathroom in the same location and concentrate the goodness, so it smells worse but usually easier to detect.) If a rodent is responsible, they could have burrowed into a wall, which would put the smell close to you and also create a weakness in the sealing system that would allow air to come in.

You may also make sure the garage is secure. We also have homeless people come into our garages, exterior stairwells, and elevators to urinate because it gives them privacy.

Thank you! I will try your suggestion with the window. They’re definitely automatic and turn on when they sense humidity. There is a switch to turn them on and off, but if they are activated by the humidity in the room - it won’t allow me to turn it off. All three are going non stop right now. The only one I can actually turn off is the one over the stove. Even now the humidity has dropped outside and inside pretty drastically and those fans are still going strong. I asked the contractor if I could somehow have them turned off Bc I also read it’s a fire hazard for them to run 24/7 and he sort of laughed it off.
The odor is really bad - unsure what it is - but it has definitely totally permeated through the master closet wall. It’s like absorbed into the drywall at this point. I wondered if it was something we stored initially because we had some boxes outside for about 4 months of decorations ect and some plastic outdoor toys while we were sorting through things - but that seems unlikely. It only really started when it got warm and humid - but the musty smell was there the whole time.
We live in a quiet area and always keep the garage door shut, so I’d be surprised if it was a neighbor. Our next door neighbor moved in a few months ago and she does have a dog but I can’t imagine we would smell anything in our garage from that. But then again, I’m smelling tide in my upper kitchen cupboards and I don’t even use that detergent so who knows what is happening here.
I wish I knew how to find where the air was coming into that lower cabinet myself. It smells exactly like the garage. It’s as hot as if I open the door and step outside - but I can’t see behind the wall so I can’t figure it out and it seems like they aren’t going to investigate it.
I will check again for anything that looks rodent like. There is that big opening in the wall they claim is sealed on the inside but who knows. Maybe something got inside of there. We scrubbed all the walls down with straight vinegar to no improvement in odor and I did look for any signs of mice, etc but I didn’t see anything visible (droppings or chewed up things).

 

[firebirdparts]

It’s the grill for the intake is right above the garage door in the kitchen so when it turns on, the air is getting pulled (from the garage, I think) into the unit then distributed throughout. My exhaust fans in the bathroom run 24/7 Bc they’re on auto and the humidity is so high. When it kicks on I can smell this god awful ammonia/moldy smell and it just pumps all throughout the entire apartment. The apartment keeps telling me no one else has complained of humidity issues or odor issues. Idk how I got so lucky with this but it’s awful. I’ve checked for rodents or animals out of desperation and can’t see any evidence of that.

Thanks. Your use of the phrase "garage door" is confusing. I guess you're talking about a people door that leads into the garage, and the air intake is near this in conditioned space, and you were just trying to make it clear that it was near the part of the apartment that is close to the garage.

i guess this is obvious, but if you are successfully exhausting air all the time, then air has to be coming in from outside all the time, through whatever leak is best available.

That's an interesting comparison with my wife's behavior I mentioned above. My wife is on a big mold kick right now. that is to say, she is telling me that I "should do something" about her fear of mold. She eats 100% alive raw food that's never been sprayed with chemicals and opens the windows, and she has a dog that runs in and out all day. She cranks up a whole house humidifier to high levels all winter. She's the biggest mold lover I know.

 

[BillK]

It’s the grill for the intake is right above the garage door in the kitchen so when it turns on, the air is getting pulled (from the garage, I think) into the unit then distributed throughout.

Just to be certain . . . this grill is actually in your kitchen ?? If so that really should not be happening. If it is the return air duct for the HVAC then it should be a sealed duct back to the furnace and should not in any way be pulling air from the garage. Unless they are using the "joist bays" as a return rather than having an actual duct. If you take the grill off the return can you see a metal duct in there ?

If it was me I would find another HVAC business and ask them to come and look at it and give their opinion without getting the landlord or builder involved.

Sounds to me like there are two actual problems.
1. The odor itself ? You need to find out where that is coming from. Almost sounds like a dead animal.
2. Why the odor in the garage is getting into the HVAC system in the apartment. That should definitely not be happening.

 

[Nthill93]

Maybe I missed this but did you have the building manager come in and smell it? If it’s as bad as you describe it doesn’t seem like they can blow it off. Mold isn’t going to smell like ammonia. You probably have dead rodents in the walls. How long have you been there? They most like baited before you moved in and now you’re smelling it. Is there batt insulation in the walls or is it foam? Foam insulation done wrong can off gas pretty bad

 

[Bretny]

Our windows are always shut Bc my son has allergies. I asked the hvac person they had call us and maintenance Bc I read that the fans running like that would be pulling in constant humid air and they said “they’re doing what they’re supposed to”. My bathrooms are like a swamp and no one has showered in them. The fans are on those automatic sensors that I can’t turn off.

Def find a way to turn those fans off. Theres no reason to run a exhaust fan 24/7 with air conditioning.

 

[krn1188]

Just to be certain . . . this grill is actually in your kitchen ?? If so that really should not be happening. If it is the return air duct for the HVAC then it should be a sealed duct back to the furnace and should not in any way be pulling air from the garage. Unless they are using the "joist bays" as a return rather than having an actual duct. If you take the grill off the return can you see a metal duct in there ?

If it was me I would find another HVAC business and ask them to come and look at it and give their opinion without getting the landlord or builder involved.

Sounds to me like there are two actual problems.
1. The odor itself ? You need to find out where that is coming from. Almost sounds like a dead animal.
2. Why the odor in the garage is getting into the HVAC system in the apartment. That should definitely not be happening.

This is what I’m talking about. Excuse the dust. That’s from one week of it vacuuming even though I vacuum daily. The smell is coming all around and under the door 24/7 and when the air turns on it ***** it right into and up into that vent then directly to the system upstairs and through the vents. So even when I’m standing all the way across the room I can smell a putrid garage/damp/urine ammonia smell coasting in all the time. Then it is getting sucked up and distributed. If we open the garage door it is strong enough to knock you over so it’s definitely coming from out there.

 

[krn1188]

Maybe I missed this but did you have the building manager come in and smell it? If it’s as bad as you describe it doesn’t seem like they can blow it off. Mold isn’t going to smell like ammonia. You probably have dead rodents in the walls. How long have you been there? They most like baited before you moved in and now you’re smelling it. Is there batt insulation in the walls or is it foam? Foam insulation done wrong can off gas pretty bad

All I can see is a fuzzy grey material - so I’m not sure what type that is. They said they’d send someone over, but they don’t have any idea what to do even though I’ve described it as thoroughly as possible so I sort of figured what is the point? They can’t see anything I can’t see and without some idea of what they’re going to check it seems like a total waste.

 

[krn1188]

Just to be certain . . . this grill is actually in your kitchen ?? If so that really should not be happening. If it is the return air duct for the HVAC then it should be a sealed duct back to the furnace and should not in any way be pulling air from the garage. Unless they are using the "joist bays" as a return rather than having an actual duct. If you take the grill off the return can you see a metal duct in there ?

If it was me I would find another HVAC business and ask them to come and look at it and give their opinion without getting the landlord or builder involved.

Sounds to me like there are two actual problems.
1. The odor itself ? You need to find out where that is coming from. Almost sounds like a dead animal.
2. Why the odor in the garage is getting into the HVAC system in the apartment. That should definitely not be happening.

I can see a metal tube - but that’s it Bc the rest is in drywall in the garage ceiling outside of the door.

 

[krn1188]

Thanks. Your use of the phrase "garage door" is confusing. I guess you're talking about a people door that leads into the garage, and the air intake is near this in conditioned space, and you were just trying to make it clear that it was near the part of the apartment that is close to the garage.

i guess this is obvious, but if you are successfully exhausting air all the time, then air has to be coming in from outside all the time, through whatever leak is best available.

That's an interesting comparison with my wife's behavior I mentioned above. My wife is on a big mold kick right now. that is to say, she is telling me that I "should do something" about her fear of mold. She eats 100% alive raw food that's never been sprayed with chemicals and opens the windows, and she has a dog that runs in and out all day. She cranks up a whole house humidifier to high levels all winter. She's the biggest mold lover I know.

Yes it’s the door that you walk out to the inside of the garage from the kitchen.

 

[krn1188]

This is the cabinet attached to the garage wall that is the other place the odor is coming in. Only that one cabinet drawer and into the one next to it. Inside that is what the cabinet looks like and there’s also a “hole” on the bottom under where you open the door in the corner where the boards all come together.

 

[wssix99]

Def find a way to turn those fans off. Theres no reason to run a exhaust fan 24/7 with air conditioning.

+1 I've never heard of fans running off a humidity sensor before. If anything, these running will pull humid air in from outside the house (as it exhausts the good air inside the house). So, this could be part of why you are fighting the humidity battle.

 

[krn1188]

+1 I've never heard of fans running off a humidity sensor before. If anything, these running will pull humid air in from outside the house (as it exhausts the good air inside the house). So, this could be part of why you are fighting the humidity battle.

I think so too and when I asked them if there’s a way they could be unwired or turned off until this gets figured out, they said no and they’re working as they should. Meanwhile my floor is sticky Snd wet and everything in my apartment is damp. Ugh. The property manager finally after two weeks admitted that the construction who built these apartments are just not responding to complaints and issues that people are having so I guess that’s what all the stalling has been about in having someone come out. Now I’m just not sure personally what to do about it.

 

[65ranchero]

You have seemed to have done all the right things so far
I would advise to take a lot of notes, video ( if possible ) pictures,document every person you have spoken to and time and their answer, it goes a long way if it needs to go further .
Have you asked the building owner what he is going to do about it?

Did you contact the building department in your town ?
There may be a renter advocate that you can turn to

OK , it may be time to seek legal help. Need all the residences to be on the same side.
I know it will cost but the burden is lessened the more people are on board.

 

[krn1188]

You have seemed to have done all the right things so far
I would advise to take a lot of notes, video ( if possible ) pictures,document every person you have spoken to and time and their answer, it goes a long way if it needs to go further .
Have you asked the building owner what he is going to do about it?

Did you contact the building department in your town ?
There may be a renter advocate that you can turn to

OK , it may be time to seek legal help. Need all the residences to be on the same side.
I know it will cost but the burden is lessened the more people are on board.

I called the building inspector office this morning and they were off for the holiday weekend so I will call again on Tuesday. I did let the property manager know I’ll be seeking help from them in getting this resolved and she just said it’s not necessary - but it obviously is.

After that, I guess I will need to research where to go for help legally to get this handled appropriately if nothing comes off it. The property manager just said that the builders/contractors are not responding in a timely manner to problems with the apartments and she doesn’t want to have someone come over and “patch” the issue. So she’s passing it onto the maintenance supervisor and construction I guess who are supposed to have a call on Monday to formulate a plan to get this investigated. But this has sort of been the cycle the past two weeks without any outcome.

Also, back in February we went through this same thing and just ultimately gave up and tried to figure it out on our own because it was just daily calls saying that she was waiting to hear from them. I’m going to try to call around to an hvac person that’s not associated with the apartment to start, but I also have a feeling that they’re going to throw it back to being a structure problem which is where we have been stuck.

 

[crazy wheel]

A blower door on the apartment and a duct blaster test on the HVAC ducting, along with a qualified person doing the testing. This will reveal where air is coming into the apartment. Also the amount of air leakage.

 

[krn1188]

A blower door on the apartment and a duct blaster test on the HVAC ducting, along with a qualified person doing the testing. This will reveal where air is coming into the apartment. Also the amount of air leakage.

Thank you! I asked them if it passed the testing they did for the blower door test and she said that it got a score of 3. I haven't had the ductwork tested, so I will add that to my list of things of things to get in touch with someone about.

 

[Gerald O]

You just moved in recently so you may have items in cardboard boxes still? Get rid of any stored cardboard boxes. In humid places the chemicals in cardboard can produce bad musty 'horsebarn' like smells just like you described.