Garage plans and City codes!

[Joe87MonteSS]

So my wife and I have had several deaths in our families, and as a result my wife inherited her moms house. It is paid for, and is in a decent neighborhood. The problem is that there is no garage. Whatever detached garage there was has been converted into a large den probably back in the 50's, and added on to the house. (Based on historical imagery)

So here is my dilemma. The house is on a corner lot. There is limited space on the driveway side. I have gone to city hall and talked with a planner, and gotten a general idea of what I can do. I would just like some input/opinions.

Here is the property. (Satellite image)



My plan is to build on the right side of the house (corner street side). However, City code says that if the garage is attached, it has to be 15 feet from the north property line. (The fence in the top of the photo.) Also 30 feet from the sidewalk on both sides. Using those setback limitations, I believe I can fit a 16x30 over there.



If I did this plan A, I would have to move a gas meter, move an AC unit, I would lose two bedroom windows, and then there are the roof leak issues that would arise with this sort of addition. The other main factor is cost. I would probably have to use wood frame, etc. The entrance would also be to the rear, which would be very tight for a long car or truck. My 87 Monte Carlo SS is about 17.5 feet long, and my 2004 Silverado is 19 ft. long. I also have a boat/trailer that I would like inside as well. This Plan A is my last option.

Plan B is my second choice. I can request a variance with the Board of Adjustment. The variance would be to build past the 30 foot setback on the East side of the property. (Right side in photo) However much I would need to fit.

This would be detached. The requirements for a detached garage are the same 30 foot setbacks, but will be 5 feet from the north line. Also it has to be 10 feet from the house.



Plan C would be my first choice, and the absolute maximum that I could fit on the property. This is roughly the same as Plan B, but with more garage space. The difference being the driveway space would just be garage space. I would be able to put my car, my boat, and hopefully a lift in there. It could be a 24x40 depending on what I get approved for with the variance.



Plans B and C will be for a steel building. The only problem is that it has to match the house. Which would mean that I either side the house to match the building, or side the building to match the house.

The house is, I think, cypress board and batten and brick.



To request a variance would cost 150 for the application fee. I would also have to have some plans drafted up, and the land surveyed. Also a bunch of other legal junk. The planner did say that there is a good chance that the variance would be approved based on the hardships of the property layout, and since the past garage was converted. Not to mention the setbacks in the plat were from 1952 when the place was built.

Actual location of doors/windows of the garage are TBD. The white is planned driveway additions.

The steel buildings are assembled on site, include slab, and insulation. Electrical, CAT5, etc will come at a later date.

Any questions or clarifications, just ask. She really doesn't want to sell the house as its sentimental. She said that I could do whatever I want for a garage as long as I stop whining about it. Lol.

Sorry for the long post. I really would like some opinions. I'm probably over thinking all of this. But it really is stressing me out.

Thanks for looking! Please excuse the paint drawings. It's the best I could do so I could actually see something laid out. Of course, things are not to scale.

 

[Kevin54]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

I'm assuming that the bedrooms on the house are on the side that you want to put the garage? If so, then it makes it odd if you want to come in the house from the attached garage. Can you go for a variance and add on to the family room/den? Or add on to the back of the den, add on to the front of the den, then relocate the den to the rear of what you add on, if that makes sense. Then you can always enter the den from the garage. Make the new roof line to match the existing house. The garage would go back past the ridgeline.

 

[Joe87MonteSS]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

The entrance to the garage would be from the outside. As I would be the only one using it.

Anything attached has to be 15 feet from the north property line. The den is finished on the inside with brick floor, and a large fireplace. And she really likes the den, so I couldn't do anything to it.

I need as much space as I can get. I build engines and heads on the side, and am currently working on my car. From time to time I work on friends hot rods as well.

 

[bczygan]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

How much available space do you have on the left side of the house, adjacent to the former garage?

My first thought would be to change the former garage back into a garage, and expand it as much as allowed. Much easier to match the existing house, even when building up. And if more living space is needed, add that to the house on the side street side and into the back yard.

 

[Homerr]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

I like what Kevin is showing. I'd even take it further and make that west end all garage. Optional den on the east side where you are considering a new garage.

Some jurisdictions get crazy with moving a driveway to a different street on corner lots. Sometimes the old one needs to be abandoned or the entire sidewalk needs to be 'improved'. Check all this out ahead of time.

 

[Joe87MonteSS]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

The left side is a patio as you see there. The end of the of the picture is where it stops. There is an easement on that side for utility lines. Also, it drops down about a foot or so.

Theres also a pond over there..

The planner says OK with the additional driveway. It just has to be a certain distance from the street corner.

 

[bczygan]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

The first thing I do, when planning something like this, is to sit down and draw out all the constraints.

Before I talk to anyone at the planning or building department. I research what I can do by finding out my zoning on the zoning map, and then I read the zoning regs at least a couple of times, and learn ALL the rules that apply to my zoning. I never want to ask a question of zoning or building that I do not already know the answer to.

Next, I find out all my easements. I look at my mortgage survey and read my property's legal description.

Then I take a copy of the mortgage survey and draw all the easements, setbacks and other restrictions on it. Those, along with the existing structures and conditions and any recent improvements will tell me what I can do, and what I can't.

What are your zoning requirements (All of them)?

What size are the easements?

And are you allowed 2 accessory buildings? That looks like a shed in the upper left corner, and many jurisdictions only allow one.

What is the maximum allowed height and where is it measured to?

What is the maximum allowed lot coverage and percent of rear yard coverage?

Bill

 

[Slednut]

Have you thought about looking for something better suited for you, and if you find something just sell the house?

 

[DeadSock]

Re: Garage plans ad City codes!

The first thing I do, when planning something like this, is to sit down and draw out all the constraints.

Before I talk to anyone at the planning or building department. I research what I can do by finding out my zoning on the zoning map, and then I read the zoning regs at least a couple of times, and learn ALL the rules that apply to my zoning. I never want to ask a question of zoning or building that I do not already know the answer to.

Next, I find out all my easements. I look at my mortgage survey and read my property's legal description.

Then I take a copy of the mortgage survey and draw all the easements, setbacks and other restrictions on it. Those, along with the existing structures and conditions and any recent improvements will tell me what I can do, and what I can't.

What are your zoning requirements (All of them)?

What size are the easements?

And are you allowed 2 accessory buildings? That looks like a shed in the upper left corner, and many jurisdictions only allow one.

What is the maximum allowed height and where is it measured to?

What is the maximum allowed lot coverage and percent of rear yard coverage?

Bill

I second this ... when planning/building, the only questions are what is allowed and what isn't.

I'll also offer, a bit of lipstick on that, and you can sell and build/buy nowadays. Get a better house and garage. (e.g. how many bedrooms do you need, where is better suited for you living needs, etc)

 

[FordTruckWench]

From what little I can see in the picture of the neighborhood, I'd say your neighbors would be up in arms if you build a steel building. On the corner.

The privacy fence in plan A likely won't be allowed. In my area, a fence in a "front" yard may only be 3 feet tall. On a corner lot, both frontages are considered "front" yards, thus the 3 foot limit applies to both.

If you build a detached structure, you'll still "lose" the windows in the bedrooms. They'll still be there, but will now be useless as they'll be looking at the back wall of the garage.

My suggestion is to build an attached garage similar to plan A, but face the garage doors toward the side street. You can probably build the garage proud of the corner of the house. I notice a covered porch on the front of the house. You could extend that the entire length of the house, and then build the garage out to the same line. At the same time, because of the straight in driveway, the garage can extend beyond the back of the house. Your 16x30 could become 16x40.

 

[jimindm]

What I would do is drive around a newer area of town, and see what most builders are building for garages. Check out the sizes and the shapes and maybe use the same imagery you have for approximate square footage.

It would be hard for the city to deny you a garage size, that they are allowing elsewhere. Ask for more and settle for less, and get what you want.

I would guess that you will be matching the house as far as materials go. How ever you need to make that happen.

Last, but not least make sure the wife is involved. It is her emotional status that has you living there. It will be the same emotions that will make it easier for you to build what you want. I can just about guarantee that somebody behind that counter and on that variance board will side with her in the situation that you are in. You will just look like any other guy wanting the biggest shop in town for all of his toys.

That may get you the size you want, but they likely have no control of giving you anything with materials or looks. Cities have standards that you will have to meet.

 

[kbs2244]

Assuming some sentimental reasons for not selling and getting another place, I would go with your plan "C."

But make it stick built so that it matches the neighborhood.

You never want t be the "sore thumb" of the neighborhood.
It kills any resale value.

And, just like you didn't expect to get this place, you may have to get out of it someday.

 

[Joe87MonteSS]

bczygan, I did what you suggested before talking with the planner, and making these images etc. There is little to be found researching. Most of what I came across is for more recent builds.

The only easement is on the left side of the picture. It is 5 feet from the property line. That would leave me with 15 feet width if attached to the house.



Max height is 40 feet. The total of the structure cannot exceed 75% of the sq.ft. of the house. The house is 1528 sq.ft.

FordTruckWench, on the outside it will look like the house.

The proposed fence in the picture is at least 20 feet from the sidewalk. I have seen 6 foot tall privacy fences in the area all the way up to and along the sidewalk. I don't want the fence that close to the sidewalk.

In a detached plan I understand that I will lose the bedroom window view, but I will still have light as the garage would be 10 feet from the house.

In plan A, 16 feet is the limit with the 30 foot setback. I thought about a 16x42, but then I found out about the 15 foot limit from the north line if it is attached.

I thought about a variance to go past the 16 foot width, which may be better looking to the board. The fee for an attached variance is 250. I would be fine with, say, a 24x30 attached. I really don't want to move the gas meter and AC unit though.

The front of the house is at the max 30 feet build line from the sidewalk. The porch extends beyond that, and I don't think it counts as part of the enclosed structure.

I will run the final plan by the wife, but she knows I will make it look good and add value to the house. I plan to pay for all of this anyway.

She knew that she was getting this house, as she is an only child.

Hope this clears some things up. Thanks for the input.

 

[JohnnieMo]

I'm having some similar issues. Trying to fix up the place we've got. What city are you in? My experience with the city is there are rules, then there are exceptions. You never know which rules they will bend. Give yourself a long time to get through that process.

Sent from my Passport

 

[bczygan]

I'm having some similar issues. Trying to fix up the place we've got. What city are you in? My experience with the city is there are rules, then there are exceptions. You never know which rules they will bend. Give yourself a long time to get through that process.

Sent from my Passport

This. Your ideas and desires may change or become modified over time.

 

[reader2580]

With plan A I think you'll have issues turning a vehicle into the garage. Your plan A garage is only wide enough for one vehicle so no issues trying to get two vehicles in the garage with the required turn.

My previous house had a two car attached garage with a turn at the end of 10 foot wide driveway. It was difficult to get one car in the garage. I never tried to get two vehicles in the garage. I don't think it could be done without backing in one or both vehicles. I doubt the new owners realized how hard it is to get vehicles into the garage before they bought the house.

 

[Joe87MonteSS]

With Plan A, I knew there would be that tight turn. Thats the idea that the planner came up with so that I wouldn't have to request a variance.

Believe me, this has been in the works for a couple years at least. We aren't moved in that house yet as I want to get some other repairs out of the way.


Also, this is in Memphis, TN.

 

[James-W]

Have you thought about looking for something better suited for you, and if you find something just sell the house?

I agree, it would be best to find something more to his liking. I am quite certain that with careful planning the opening poster could make the best of a "less than ideal" situation. But even after he spends a whole bunch of money to make the changes, he still won't have what he really wanted. He will have to settle for something less and in the long term I think he will wish he had done things a bit different.

 

[JohnnieMo]

You will burn $10k to $15k just buying and selling. That buys a lot of garage. We looked at these options too. There is value in staying where you already own.

I'm not opposed to this course, just pointing it out.

Sent from my Passport

 

[bczygan]

What is your resistance to putting the garage back on the left side and enlarging it?

 

[NUTTSGT]

You will burn $10k to $15k just buying and selling. That buys a lot of garage. We looked at these options too. There is value in staying where you already own.

I'm not opposed to this course, just pointing it out.

Sent from my Passport

It may buy a lot of garage but sometimes spending a little more to get what you want is worth it in the long run, especially, if this is going to be the last place you own.

I'd also take into effect what/where the OP currently lives now, rent/own ? If he owns, selling two homes to buy a final place could be in the cards if the interest rates are low and could include a nice big detached garage.


Needless to say, it'd be a wise decision for the the OP to edit his user profile to put a general location so he can get better advice.

 

[Joe87MonteSS]

What is your resistance to putting the garage back on the left side and enlarging it?

The wife. She likes the den the way it is, and wants it left alone. Thats the first thing I asked, was if I could turn it into a garage.

Selling is out of the question. This was her childhood home. We currently rent a house a mile away. The carport I use here is 16 feet wide by 20. Its useable, but I'm out growing it.

 

[NUTTSGT]

The wife. She likes the den the way it is, and wants it left alone. Thats the first thing I asked, was if I could turn it into a garage.

Selling is out of the question. This was her childhood home. We currently rent.

Well I guess that answers that question.

While I'm not sure how long you have known your wife or been married and no offense is meant. Watch out when women get an idea in their head because of what they feel in their heart. Sometimes it clouds better judgement and common sense. I've been there more than once in my 20 plus years of marriage and two adult daughters.

 

[bczygan]

The wife. She likes the den the way it is, and wants it left alone. Thats the first thing I asked, was if I could turn it into a garage.

Selling is out of the question. This was her childhood home. We currently rent a house a mile away. The carport I use here is 16 feet wide by 20. Its useable, but I'm out growing it.

When I do designs that modify existing houses, especially if the owners have lived there a while, and have an emotional investment with the house, it can be difficult to sell them on the modifications I propose.

I have to explain to them the design process, step by step, and the tradeoffs and decisions and comparisons I made, in getting to the final design.

I have to take them on the trip I made, from existing conditions, to optimum resulting solution.

Then they can get used to the change.

Just because the wife likes the den the way it is, wouldn't be a good enough reason to keep it, especially if abetter den space and overall plan, could result. When I design, nothing is sacrosanct. The only constraints are zoning and building regulations, existing conditions, budget and the needs and desires of the owners for the kinds of spaces uses they want to accommodate.

Bill

 

[Jim_No_Garage]

This reminds me a little of the Property Brother's show. Most people don't have the vision of what a house CAN BE - they can just see what IT IS.

Getting a proper rendering done of a new den and such could sway her - getting you back the original garage footprint (and then some).

Good luck and keep us appraised.

Cheers

Jim

 

[rubberrodder]

If you are nice to the city code people, SOMETIMES they can be very loose on codes. I was told 3 times I could go 18 ft. tall on my project. When the contractor went with the plans to pull permits, HE was told "sorry, can only allow 15 ft. tall". I went down to the code office and NICELY explained the situation and everything I was told previousely. The young lady said she would get "clarification" on height restrictions. Her supervisor comes out and I explain again whats going on. Without being beligerant or angry. "Well,You only have 6 foot ceilings in the loft and 8 foot ceilings in the main garage, You're under 15 feet, here's your permit." I left before they could change their minds!

 

[starquestMM]

If you could get the variance to the 20' current standard in front.... would that give you enough room to build in front of the old garage/den?

That way you wouldn't touch the den or have to mess with utilities.

 

[HoosierMark]

I kept looking but did not see anything about traffic flow. I did see you said you would be the only one using the garage. I also saw that you would be doing some business on the site. First traffic flow might be an issue when you are in the house, someone comes to your barn and is walking thru the back yard to get to you, possibly where the bedroom windows are. Also your business is on "display" and may get you in trouble with the neighbors as you are running a business. A garage for you to park in daily could be mighty nice. Also why not talk to a Realtor or appraiser about your plans and get their thoughts on it. Some day you may want to sell and making wise choices now could be worth money in the future.
Finally the concensus of the advice seems to be that making the garage in the area of the den and old garage was makes the most sense. I would bet your wife likes the memories of the den which she will always have, but now may be the time to create your own family space to make new memories and take pieces of the den and incorporate them into the new space. Have you considered converting another area into a den and adding a new master bedroom suite? Yes it may cost some $$ but it may also make the house really enjoyable to live in.

 

[Red05GT]

Does your wife still bring groceries home? I envision an awfully lot of steps from the garage to the kitchen. Just sayin! I agree with Kevin 54 and Homerr that a complete redo
on the left side will blend better and make it easier for guest arriving to your front door.
I imagine the converted garage/den is very nice and roomy adjacent to the kitchen no doubt. I would think a nice vaulted ceiling den off the back of the house with a nice patio
to the upper left. I think the thought process may be clouded with the perceived simplicity
of a metal building that you apparently want. Just my .02 .

 

[Adriel]

Joe, I can understand where your wife is coming from. Further, can understand all the work to tear up the floor and the rest, especially the fireplace. Be nice to have a picture of the front and side, if possible.

I am a Master's of Architecture student, so thus my bias. I am one that values and likes morning light in bedrooms. Not sure if you still get that with a wall 10' away. SketchUp can approximate the answer.

So what are the needs? I mean, why a full inclosed garage? Why wouldn't a workshop work? I do a lot of my projects on the workbench in the open patio. Just a thought. We as designers need to know the parameters to generate a program.

My thought is you mentioned set backs don't include spaces which are not inclosed. Have you considered a carport in front of the den? Aligned with the porch, looks like just barely fit based on the vehicle parked in the driveway.

Hope this helps...