Generator connection to home

[zendriver]

I have a 3500 working watt gen 120/240V, for emergency use.

Right now, even to keep the fridge going, I'd have to raise the stabilizer legs and roll it away from the wall just to plug in.

I'll have my electrician wire stuff in, but could I start with something like this, put in a cross-over switch and then just switch circuits on/off using the existing 200A circuit breaker?

25 ft. 30 Amp 125-Volt Generator Extension Cord and Power Inlet Box Kit STW 10 AWG RV Generator Cord with Twist Lock

I Oil furnace, well pump , water heater, central A/C (probably just use 1 windows a/c unit or portable heaters) Mainly want refrigeration and water.

Better ideas? Thanks.

 

[Firebrick43]

I have a 3500 working watt gen 120/240V, for emergency use.

Right now, even to keep the fridge going, I'd have to raise the stabilizer legs and roll it away from the wall just to plug in.

I'll have my electrician wire stuff in, but could I start with something like this, put in a cross-over switch and then just switch circuits on/off using the existing 200A circuit breaker?

25 ft. 30 Amp 125-Volt Generator Extension Cord and Power Inlet Box Kit STW 10 AWG RV Generator Cord with Twist Lock

I Oil furnace, well pump , water heater, central A/C (probably just use 1 windows a/c unit or portable heaters) Mainly want refrigeration and water.

Better ideas? Thanks.

Is your well 120v? That is all the cord is good for. And if you did use a 120v cord you would only have half the breakers on the panel function.

There is a lot more to it.

 

[ToolsRCool]

It would work, but possibly not compliant with code.

 

[fitter30]

This is my generator panel have a outdoor generator plug uses a 6' premade cord to a 7k gen converted to lp. Being rural lp doesn't go bad and since having a 500 gallon tank been without power for 9 days and comfortable. Lp stove for heat, cook stove. Gen, some lights, refrigerator, tv, internet water heater, well pump, microwave, 5k btu window unit ( keep in closest) for summer. Not all at the same time.

Google Search

 

[Firebrick43]

It's basically all I do. Dump the main and then back-feed a 240v welder outlet in my garage. Maybe against code, but I think there are exceptions during emergency times.

No there isn't

You are putting lineman's lives at risk. Why would you do that? Would you be upset if someone killed your spouse, kids, or parent because of pure laziness?

 

[yatg]

Is your well 120v? That is all the cord is good for. And if you did use a 120v cord you would only have half the breakers on the panel function.

There is a lot more to it.

L14-30 is 125/250 locking.
And it does have 4 prongs.

 

[ToolsRCool]

No there isn't

You are putting lineman's lives at risk. Why would you do that? Would you be upset if someone killed your spouse, kids, or parent because of pure laziness?

Of course, I'd never do that.

 

[Firebrick43]

L14-30 is 125/250 locking.
And it does have 4 prongs.

Its cheap Chinese ****. Which one is right? They cant even get their advertising right, do you think they will get the important details correct?

 

[ToolsRCool]

L14-30 is 125/250 locking.
And it does have 4 prongs.

I saw that as well, but the HD title says 120V. Wonder if that is just their lack of 240v info, or if the Chinese cord really only does have 120v rated insulation.

 

[Firebrick43]

Of course, I'd never do that.

Then why do you back feed via a welding outlet and not have at minimum a generator outlet and lockout plate for when its connected?

Because you absolutely are putting their lives at risk when you do it the way you are.

 

[manwithtools]

Its cheap Chinese ****. Which one is right? They cant even get their advertising right, do you think they will get the important details correct?

It's clearly a 250 volt cord and outlet. Description errors are common with Chinese translations. Look at the other images in the listing.

 

[yatg]

Its cheap Chinese ****. Which one is right? They cant even get their advertising right, do you think they will get the important details correct?

The actual Vevor description doesn't mention volts.
The HD copy paste monkeys shortened and incorrectly embellished the description.

 

[manwithtools]

The HD copy paste monkeys shortened and incorrectly embellished the description.

They frequently do this. It's an HD screw-up, not Vevor.

 

[zendriver]

Is your well 120v? That is all the cord is good for. And if you did use a 120v cord you would only have half the breakers on the panel function.

There is a lot more to it.

I didn't notice the cord was only 120v which my well pump does need 240v.

Thanks for the heads up.

 

[ToolsRCool]

I didn't notice the cord was only 120v which my well pump does need 240v.

Thanks for the heads up.

It is a 240v cord as well.

 

[manwithtools]

I didn't notice the cord was only 120v which my well pump does need 240v.

That is incorrect, it's a 240 volt cord and connectors.

 

[micromind]

No matter how you rig it, it needs to be physically impossible to have the gen backfeed the utility. Remembering to turn off the main breaker isn't good enough.

 

[mm08822]

That is incorrect, it's a 240 volt cord and connectors.

The cord will support 120v loads, 240v loads and 120/240v loads since it has L14-30 cap ends = 4 wire caps and cord.

Get a 30a power inlet box and add a 2pole 30a cb interlocked with the panel main cb.

This way you can manually select any load in the panel to operate under 30a total.

 

[manwithtools]

The cord will support 120v loads, 240v loads and 120/240v loads

Isn't that what I typed? Zen said it was 120 only, I corrected that its 240, which by inference with the included neutral it will support both 240 and 120 volts. BTW, the referenced Item comes with a 30 amp inlet box. See post #1

 

[mm08822]

No. If you stated "also 240v," then no inference is needed. A person could understand you to mean only for 240v, and that is not the case.

 

[manwithtools]

Sure, that's the way it could be interpreted if one chose to do do that. With all the back and forth in this thread, anything is possible. I'll let you guys wrap this up. I would hate to mislead...

 

[JSutter]

You need a transfer switch. That vevor kit is just the stuff for outside.

 

[aandpdan]

You could use an interlock. It will allow you to choose ANY or ALL of the circuit in your house to run. Of course you're limited by the generator output.

It beats a transfer panel and is usually very easy to install.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

but could I start with something like this, put in a cross-over switch and then just switch circuits on/off using the existing 200A circuit breaker?

gonna have to be more specific here. by crossover switch did you mean transfer switch? what type? make/model?

and the 200a breaker is the main? that should be off if you have a generator feeding the panel.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

That is incorrect, it's a 240 volt cord and connectors.

technically its 120/240v grounded. its 4-prong

 

[zendriver]

gonna have to be more specific here. by crossover switch did you mean transfer switch? what type? make/model?

and the 200a breaker is the main? that should be off if you have a generator feeding the panel.

Then that would be a transfer switch. as far as which one, guess I'll ask here.

It is a 200A main breaker in the main (only) circuit breaker box.

 

[PCustoms]

Then that would be a transfer switch. as far as which one, guess I'll ask here.

It is a 200A main breaker in the main (only) circuit breaker box.

Can you snap a pic of your main breaker/main panel?

 

[zendriver]

Can you snap a pic of your main breaker/main panel?

 

[PCustoms]

Looks like a square D homeline.

Top right breaker needs to be moved, you have plenty of space. 30A or 50A goes in it's place. The homeline interlock kit will include a template, drills bits and bolts. It only allows the main OR the generator indeed breaker to be "on".

Square D Homeline 150-225 Amp Indoor Load Center Generator Interlock Kit HOMCGK2C - The Home Depot

Visit the Home Depot to buy Square D by Schneider Electric Homeline Cover Generator and QOM2 Frame Size Main Breaker Interlock Kit 94050

www.homedepot.com

Then get a generator inlet sized to the breaker you added:

Midwest Electric Products 30 Amp Temporary Power Inlet U030N - The Home Depot

GE - 30 AMP Power Inlet - For use with a generator panel, load center with interlock kit, or manual transfer switch for stand-by power. Single enclosure made of galvanized steel protects against damage

www.homedepot.com

Connect the two with the appropriate 4 wires (individual wires need conduit, or watch the ratings on NM-B/UF-B).

Now in an outage flip the main "off", slide the interconnect, generator breaker "on", shut off large loads (as needed) and go fire up the generator.

This is very abbreviated

 

[M.Brane]

Just had our main panel replaced with an interlock, and inlet installed. Roll genny out of shed, fire it up, connect cord, turn main off, slide interlock, engage genny breaker. Easy peasey, and nobody gets fried.

 

[dave*99]

Then that would be a transfer switch. as far as which one, guess I'll ask here.

It is a 200A main breaker in the main (only) circuit breaker box.

Sounds like you are headed toward an interlock and generator inlet as described in post #29 and #30. And that is a good plan.


A transfer switch is often a double throw device ahead of the main breaker. When that is the case, it becomes the first disconnect and you have to isolate ground and neutral in the panel. The old "main" panel becomes a subpanel. An automatic transfer switch is another case. A manual transfer switch might look like this:

 

[Codyboy]

Of course, I'd never do that.

No there isn't

You are putting lineman's lives at risk. Why would you do that? Would you be upset if someone killed your spouse, kids, or parent because of pure laziness?

Has that ever really happened?
I cannot think of one instance that it did .
I know its precautionary and as a lineman of 39 years I've never seen it.
As soon as I put my grounds on it will trip the generator breaker or choke the engine out.
But I or no one I know has seen it in action.

 

[PCustoms]

Has that ever really happened?
I cannot think of one instance that it did .
I know its precautionary and as a lineman of 39 years I've never seen it.
As soon as I put my grounds on it will trip the generator breaker or choke the engine out.
But I or no one I know has seen it in action.

Why chance it?

 

[wyliesdiesels]

Has that ever really happened?
I cannot think of one instance that it did .
I know its precautionary and as a lineman of 39 years I've never seen it.
As soon as I put my grounds on it will trip the generator breaker or choke the engine out.
But I or no one I know has seen it in action.

Yes it has happened.

I have read several articles about it over the years.

 

[WildBill]

Has that ever really happened?
I cannot think of one instance that it did .
I know its precautionary and as a lineman of 39 years I've never seen it.
As soon as I put my grounds on it will trip the generator breaker or choke the engine out.
But I or no one I know has seen it in action.

It happened in my neighborhood when I was young. During hurricane Alicia in Houston a guy hooked up a generator by using a two male ended 240v cable and killed a fireman when they were helping the power company clean up downed lines. They were both from our neighborhood and we went to school with the fireman's kids, so it was a big deal.

 

[Eric Brown]

I had a problem where my main overhead feed was draped over the gutter. I also have a lot of trees. So I decided to have the main buried and relocated to the end of the house. Then I had a whole house generator put in. It had to be located at least five feet from any windows or doors. Automatic transfer switch will kick the natural gas generator on after five seconds of a power outage. When power restored the generator shuts off. Talking with the electrical inspector he said a lot of new housing developers in the area are installing generators on the new houses as a selling point. So while more expensive than using your generator and some switching device, it adds to your property value and can run on natural gas. The generator is rated 22KW which can run my whole house. I will also offer to run some 20 amp extensions for my neighbors if needed. While I was at it, I also had a surge protector put in for the main panel. For me it was a good investment.

Bottom line: Safety first.

 

[Firebrick43]

Has that ever really happened?
I cannot think of one instance that it did .
I know its precautionary and as a lineman of 39 years I've never seen it.
As soon as I put my grounds on it will trip the generator breaker or choke the engine out.
But I or no one I know has seen it in action.

"July 13, 2005
South Carolina Lineman Killed by Generator Back Feed
Victim Helping Restore Power in Alabama

Sumter Electric Cooperative (SECO) officials report that a South Carolina lineman helping to restore power in Alabama after the damage caused by Hurricane Dennis was killed late Tuesday, reportedly by an improperly installed customer generator.

According to SECO Director of Public Affairs Barry Bowman, the lineman was helping to restore power lost during Hurricane Dennis to customers in Alabama. The report Bowman received indicated the lineman was working on a power line that was supposed to be dead. It was not.

?Tragically, the line this technician was working on was not dead,? said Bowman, ?The line he was trying to repair had been re-energized by a customer who had improperly hooked up a generator and created a back feed of electricity from the generator into the supposedly dead line. The death of a lineman who was there to help the victims of Hurricane Dennis was the horrible result.?

Bowman noted that the lineman?s name was not immediately released, but he was from South Carolina and worked for Pike Electric, Inc. in North Carolina.

Alabama authorities are looking for the person responsible and indicate that charges are pending."

 

[micromind]

As soon as I put my grounds on it will trip the generator breaker or choke the engine out.

This is the key..........if it ain't grounded it ain't dead.......it's as simple as that.

 

[mm08822]

This is the key..........if it ain't grounded it ain't dead.......it's as simple as that.

You are either working it in one of two states, hot or dead, really no in between. Hot means every procedure executed is with that in mind, full PPE, isolation, etc.

Dead means you have grounds provided on both sides of the work area AND you still have some level of PPE. There is capacitive coupling that also occurs from close proximity lines as well as unintentional connections made by tree limbs, car bodies, crossed lines, etc.

With all of the possible sources that could (intentionally or unintentionally )energize a line, it's impossible to have a full lockout under that person's control, so you work it as considered hot. I can't believe any company EHS group or Union Rep would allow anything less.