Good high end MIG?

[Fender1325]

Ive owned my Hobart Handler 140 for about 7 months now and I feel I'm wanting to step up into a 220v machine. The hobart has been a great machine, no real complaints for what it is.

What I'm looking to do is buy "the last MIG I'll ever need" type machine (I have a feeling I'll eat those words regardless of what I choose).

I'm interested in the Millermatic 252. Seems to get good reviews and is strong enough to handle pretty much anything I'll throw at it. (auto restoration, and fabrication like tables, chairs, etc.) I prefer to buy a little more machine than I need so I'm rarely pushing it to the limit. I see the 252 does up to 1/2" steel which I cant imagine encountering.

I'm also open to suggestions like ESAB, Lincoln.

Thoughts?

 

[Buckgnarly]

You answered it already, 252 is a nice machine!

 

[rice rocket]

Not sure if this changes your decision, but Miller is throwing out some pretty lucrative rebates right now. If you go all in on the deal, you could have the 211 for $400 off. The rebate on the 252 is not as good.

http://www.millerwelds.com/landing/build-with-blue/

 

[Fender1325]

That is enticing but this time around I dont want to pinch pennies as much. Of course I dont have an endless budget and cant go crazy, but I really want a machine that will serve me for the long haul. Be done with it so to speak

 

[trackwelder]

The 252 is a sweet machine. A good choice if you go that way!!!

 

[Fender1325]

Also just noticed the Lincoln power mig 256. Has more power than the 252 (output is up to 300A - can do up to 3/4" steel) and it also has a $200 rebate making it roughly 2200.

 

[Bob Warner]

I have the 210 and I build some heavy stuff. This is enough machine for me. I just built a bracket for mounting a front end loader to a tractor. It was 1/2" plate and I welded it in one pass. The loader can lift and carry a full bucket of concrete (wet). The 210 will do what you want and more, the 252 even better.

 

[sberry]

The hi outputs are for larger wires and other gasses. Most home brew outfits are one gas one wire. The 252 has all the punch it needs for this type of work and then some. If there is any time/money factor the 252 is 2 x as fast as a 211 with short circuit, maybe more depending on app. I have a 250 mig, use the smaller one 9 to 1 but there are times the power is needed and the cost of consumables, wire is about half due to larger spools and about same gas for 2x the weld.
035 solid and the Miller is a better machine than the one did this weld.

 

[zkling]

You would probably be well suited with a mm211 or equivalent. You would gain top end power while maintaining the portability of the 110v units. If you have the room and plan on keeping your current HH140, a full size machine such as the 212, 252, or greater you would gain top end power and duty cycle over the entire range. I seldom turn my mm210 past ~160amps, but when I need it, I NEED it, and it is there.

 

[RedneckWelder]

The MM252 is a sweet unit.

The Hobart Ironman 230 is also worthy of consideration too.

 

[CGT80]

Miller 252

I have a Miller 135 but borrowed my brother's 252 for some bigger work which needed wire that only came in 0.035" and bigger and I needed the stitch mode. I am much more into welding than my brother, but he wanted something that he would not outgrow. I started with a small budget and needed something portable. My big machine is a 460 amp Miller TIG welder.

I think the 252 is actually rated at 300 amps max output as well. 1/4" wall steel pipe with nasty fit up was no issue for the 252. The galvanized coating, on the other hand, was another story. My brother likes the spoolgun, but it just pissed me off. I didn't spend much time learning it and he wasn't around to demonstrate. I prefer my TIG for aluminum compared to attempting to use the spool gun.

The fan on demand was my favorite part of the 252. It is an awesome machine, but the weld charts and tip compartment on the front just plain ****. If I used only one wire, I would probably memorize the settings. I used a few wires and sizes. The gun is heavy and awkward compared to the little machines. It has to be big to handle the duty and amperage. For thin work, I actually prefer my small machine with the 0.023" wire and lighter gun. The problem is that I am often pushing the small machine to it's limit. I would love to have both.

The 252, at least my brothers, does not have pulse welding. I don't think it is an option until you get to a 350 model, which is big bucks. Pulse welding would have been nice for the project I was doing. It required full welds, but only needed a few small stitches for strength. Warping was a major concern. I was welding a 3/16" corten steel plate to a frame/border of 1"x1/8" wall corten steel square tubing. Continuous welding put too much heat into the part. The stitch feature looked good and reduced the heat. I could skip around the plate and it all looked like it was TIG'd rather than having a bunch of short beads. Stitch welding is not really meant for what I was doing, but it got the job done and beat using TIG (too much heat).

The 252 takes two strong people to load into a truck. I can load the 135 by myself. The 252 takes bigger wire and will run 33 pound spools. The wire is cheaper and in my case, the wire I needed only came in 33 and larger spools. The ground cable on the 252 is too short, at 10 feet with a 15 foot mig gun. You can't always get the welder right up to your work.

I drink the blue Miller koolaid!

 

[kazlx]

Buy the 252.

 

[ATC]

I have a MM180. Absolutely LOVE it! I do a lot of 1/4" stuff, and this welder handles it easy. If I were you, the 211 or 252 would be excellent choices.

 

[wilb1976]

Another vote for the MM 252. I have used it quite a bit a at my friends fab an love the ease of switching processes/guns when doing a project. I haven't looked into any other brand but the MM 252 is on my wish list for next welding machine. But I'm kind of partial to Team Blue!

 

[Stooge]

my Miller 211 has handled everything I've thrown at it over the past few years, from thin sheet metal work and chassis/ suspension fabrication, to repairing plow equipment and skidsteers. the big plus for me, other than the price, was the multi voltage plug so I could go to whatever corner of the garage I wanted to for light work, (only a few 230 outlets) as well as take it out and about to someone else house/ garage if need be.
I did get to use a 252 once and I liked it a lot, but unless I was in a production/ full time fabrication shop, it would be a little harder to justify the extra $1300 after having used the 211 and knowing how capable of a machine it is and what a bargain it really is. if I all of the sudden didn't have it tomorrow, I wouldn't hesitate to buy another one and I do not see myself outgrowing it anytime soon.

 

[Fender1325]

Thanks for the responses.

Not to throw this thread off, but just another possibility.....what do you think about going with a TIG machine instead?

The way I see it, the welds are beautiful - but if I remember correctly most of the Tig welder machines in similar price range max at a thickness of about 1/8". Then you also need two hands. A lot of times I need a free hand to help hold something when I tack it in. But those welds are beautiful.....

 

[motofool33]

step up to an inverter machine if you want the machine to help you weld better.

same with Tig inverter is king but they are not the cheaper machines.

 

[bigguns69]

The Miller 252 is a great choice for that, last a life time welder. I have the previous version, 251 that I bought 10 years ago and it is a great machine. Weld everything from 20 ga to 1/2" with .035 wire, no problems. I also have a Tig welder and very rarely ever use it, on occasion for aluminum or light gage steel. Mig is the all purpose machine, go with that.

 

[dr_clyde]

Thanks for the responses.

Not to throw this thread off, but just another possibility.....what do you think about going with a TIG machine instead?

The way I see it, the welds are beautiful - but if I remember correctly most of the Tig welder machines in similar price range max at a thickness of about 1/8". Then you also need two hands. A lot of times I need a free hand to help hold something when I tack it in. But those welds are beautiful.....

There are a couple ways to look at this. If you want to get a good MIG welder that will last and perform at higher amperages, the MM 252 is the best strictly wire welder available in its class. I have pushed the 211 to its limits and would have a 252 over it any day. The only 2 benefits to the 211 are cost and physical size.

If you were looking to have TIG capability, there are multiprocess machines that are excellent MIG welder, and have DC TIG capability. These cost more and have more parts, but are ususally pro grade equipment and have the grunt to match.

I have a MM211 and a Lincoln Invertec V300 pro with an LN-7 feeder. The little miller MIG isn't even in the same ballpark. With the Lincoln I can MIG, TIG and Stick with one box. And I bought it used for $800.

If I was in your shoes, I'd get a rockstar multiprocess machine like the Lincoln PowerMIG 350 MP or a Miller Shopmate. OR, I'd get a 252 and look for a used Syncrowave. You can get a good used 250 amp TIG and a watercooler in my area for like $1500

 

[trackwelder]

Thanks for the responses.

Not to throw this thread off, but just another possibility.....what do you think about going with a TIG machine instead?

The way I see it, the welds are beautiful - but if I remember correctly most of the Tig welder machines in similar price range max at a thickness of about 1/8". Then you also need two hands. A lot of times I need a free hand to help hold something when I tack it in. But those welds are beautiful.....

Mig welds are just as nice as tig on steel. A spool gun in the right hands produces nice sound welds also. Tig has its purpose but I hardly ever use mine. I reach for the Mig gun every chance I can.

 

[03protege]

I have the MM140. My next unit will be the MM212, MM252, or Hobart Ironman 230.

 

[great white tj]

The MM 252 will take care of any job you use it for...with .024 - .045 wire to alum. it is a very good welder. Here's the deal most welders or people who like to melt metal are going to tell ya that just one welder will not get the job done.... just do a smaller job.. But this will happen........smaller just gets Bigger. So one needs more welders...MM 211,MM252, Hobart 140,PM30. and a hobart 250ci.

 

[doojus]

Get the PowerMIG 256...

 

[Fender1325]

Nice clean shop there great white tj

 

[zkling]

Thanks for the responses.

Not to throw this thread off, but just another possibility.....what do you think about going with a TIG machine instead?

The way I see it, the welds are beautiful - but if I remember correctly most of the Tig welder machines in similar price range max at a thickness of about 1/8". Then you also need two hands. A lot of times I need a free hand to help hold something when I tack it in. But those welds are beautiful.....

I personally think a tig machine is the best choice for a home user. Why? The average home DIY user will run across all different types of materials from your common mild steel to stainless, cast iron and especially aluminum. Realize that the mig process was designed for a production environment where speed and easier operator training was available over the old stand by tig stick or even gas welding processes. Downside to the mig process is while it is a very versatile process, it is not well suited for constant changes of material type. To properly weld mild steel, aluminum, stainless and even cast iron you are going to need 4 spools of wire, which are difficult to switch, and 3 different gas bottles. Where as with a tig machine you will keep the same gas bottle throughout, just easily switching the filler material as required for the base material to be welded.

Some people just don't need that versatility though. A guy building a mild steel tube chassis, a sheet metal patch job on a project car to making lawn art and shop furnishings would very well be covered with a small to med sized mig machine.

Like any tool selection it boils down to what you specifically need it to do for you.

 

[Rated ///M]

Love my 212! Mine was never to leave the shop and I wanted the ability to have a larger spool. Whats crazy is that I've only had the fan turn on once during a larger project. Other than that the 212 is completely silent!

 

[great white tj]

zkling has a very good point. A nice AC/DC tig like the Miller 180. Very thin metal up to 3/16 and may be push out some 1/4 steel if need be. Great unit for the weekend welder.. If you had a MM211 and a Miller AC/DC Tig and a Buss box AC/DC stick...(Red or Blue or a Hobart) I would think you should be good to go...

 

[trackwelder]

I personally think a tig machine is the best choice for a home user. Why? The average home DIY user will run across all different types of materials from your common mild steel to stainless, cast iron and especially aluminum. Realize that the mig process was designed for a production environment where speed and easier operator training was available over the old stand by tig stick or even gas welding processes. Downside to the mig process is while it is a very versatile process, it is not well suited for constant changes of material type. To properly weld mild steel, aluminum, stainless and even cast iron you are going to need 4 spools of wire, which are difficult to switch, and 3 different gas bottles. Where as with a tig machine you will keep the same gas bottle throughout, just easily switching the filler material as required for the base material to be welded.

Some people just don't need that versatility though. A guy building a mild steel tube chassis, a sheet metal patch job on a project car to making lawn art and shop furnishings would very well be covered with a small to med sized mig machine.

Like any tool selection it boils down to what you specifically need it to do for you.

Not looking to argue but if a guy has difficulty swapping a spool of wire maybe he should grab an apron and try baking instead of welding. I. Could repair almost anything with say a miller 211, spool gun, a few bottles, and a torch set. You could buy everything you need for under two grand.

 

[kazlx]

It's not difficult to switch setups on a mig, it's just a pain in the ***.

 

[Fender1325]

Ya know.....I was just reading the specs on a Lincoln stick welder at lowes.com which is only $280 right now - and it can weld up to 1" thick mild steel. Thats crazy! But I guess the lesson is to not get hung up on capability for mild steel because I could pick up one of these and really have the extra capability Id want.

I had a welding friend once tell me stick welders were really best for structural welding in comparison to mig. Makes me wonder if the tables and chairs that I make would be stronger in comparison to doing it with my hobart 110v mig

 

[kazlx]

Makes me wonder if the tables and chairs that I make would be stronger in comparison to doing it with my hobart 110v mig

Nope.

 

[zkling]

It's not difficult to switch setups on a mig, it's just a pain in the ***.

Exactly, especially full size spools. Lord help you if you let go of tension on the wire and the spool unwinds. BTDT


Say a guy had to weld up a mild steel trailer bracket, repair a stainless BBQ lid or work on his home brewing setup and then build a custom aluminum widget for his boat. All common home welder tasks. The guy with the tig would most likely be enjoying a sandwich and nap while the guy with a basic mig setup would probably still be making a wire and gas switch.

If I could do it over again I would have gone with the large AC/DC tig first. It is by far a more versatile machine. A mig is just convenient. Again just depends what exactly the specific user wants to do and how it will fit their needs.

 

[zmotorsports]

I don't think you would go wrong with either the Miller MM252 or the Lincoln PowerMig 256. Both are great machines. I have the MM251 which is the same as the newer MM252 other than the packaging.

Some have mentioned getting a multi-process machine but I have a different take on that. I have owned a couple of multi-process machines and personally, I will never have another one. One did MIG OK but not so well on TIG, the other did TIG OK, but not so hot on MIG. They don't do all processes well.

Process specific machines do what they were designed to do, period.

Again, just my opinion.

Mike.

 

[padronanniversary]

Miller 350P. Love this machine, and I weld some thick to thin as well as AL.

 

[kazlx]

I agree. Tig excels for most home type projects. I find I want a second, smaller mig for 0.023 wire, so I don't have to change over my 180, but I usually just end up using the Syncrowave anyway...

 

[Fender1325]

Yeah Ive learned in life things that are supposed to cover multiple processes never excell at all and you end up sacraficing. Id rather take my time and buy several machines that are great at what they do.

 

[Fender1325]

Latest project was a grill table for the father in law.

 

[Fender1325]

Another pic

 

[Crusarius]

My only complaint I have with my 252 is the cost of the spool gun. other than that I do not regret it for one second. Most of my work is custom jeeps including bumpers rock protection and custom suspensions. The materials I use range from 1/8" to 1/2" primarily 1/4".

 

[Fender1325]

Yeah on my hobart 140 the largest Ive used is 1/8" which the machine has to be at 80% of its power. Im getting penetration because its discolored on the other side but I dont think I could ever even burn through by accident