Grunge Garage

[98TJ]

Hey, I've got bikes too......about a dozen. Mountain bikes, carbon graphite, Old Raleigh Pro road bike, Guerciotti I picked up for $20. Not riding any of them. Should sell most of em.

Keep a couple of them for you and the wife to ride. Get a couple of rides in before the weather turns cold up there.

 

[Modern Jess]

And like I stated before, this thread has made many member step back and take a look at their own personal life.

It really has, in my case. This thread came along as I was finishing the remodel of a new house, and it made me look at the conditions I was living in at the old house in a whole new light. There was far too much clutter, the house was dirty all the time, and we were loathe to have any guests visit us.

After following this thread, I have a new appreciation for what's important and what's not, and am extremely wary of falling into the trap of holding on to things because of some perceived value of the object. At this point, as I start moving in to the new house, I am taking a hard line approach: if it doesn't have a place, it needs to go away.

As I move, I am in the process of touching -- and making a decision about -- every single object I have in my possession. It's a sobering experience, but also a liberating one. Already, a huge weight has been lifted from my shoulders as I get rid of lots of stuff I've been holding on to.

I think I can sum it up like this: "Things" don't make you rich. The more things you have in your possession, the more weight you carry around, and the poorer you are for it. Getting rid of 50% of what you have will make you feel 500% better about yourself and your life.

I promise.

 

[JC23]

Wonder how things are going up there?

 

[ValuePack]

First post, here. I'd heard of GJ on the GRM board, but hadn't visited until now...

I've recently become very interested in Detroit and it's decline since the 50s, as well as becoming active in the community outreach programs and citywide restoration. Wish I weren't so far away, I'd love to help in this project. Certainly has reminded me of how much needless excess I surround myself with.

Everyone here is pulling for you, Bill. Please continue in your endeavor.

 

[bczygan]

Wonder how things are going up there?

We took the weekend off and went up to Ludington to camp overnight. Alone time without even the dogs. Time for her and I ro reacquaint. Went by Gladwin to pick up the Dumore sensitive Drill Press. Hope to stop by warmpancakes place in Brighton on the way home and pick up the air hose reel.

Bill

 

[markviii]

"Alone-together" time is great! Helps to re-energize and motivate. That fresh air can't hurt either! Now, on to the next step...

Chris

 

[Bull]

Uh-oh. Another drill press, Bill?

 

[bczygan]

Uh-oh. Another drill press, Bill?

It's a little Dumore 20,000RPM one I bought a while back and just now picked up.

 

[jeffmoss26]

Bull, my thoughts exactly...

 

[Red Leader]

It's a little Dumore 20,000RPM one I bought a while back and just now picked up.

I might be with Bull on this one. While it sounds like you may be getting some help from some forum members (which is awesome) and making some good progress, is the root issue being addressed?

When us 'vintage tool connoisseurs' buy a tool and while it is still in its unused, unrestored state find another of the same type of tool (i.e. drill press), we call it 'addiction' and in this case it may present a real problem. Let me ask just a few questions:

1. Have you used your Buffalo drill press? How much? Does it currently work?
2. What have you found inadequate in the Buffalo to make the other purchase necessary for your work?
3. What was the purchase of either drill press for?
4. Do any of these purchases help you with your goal of cleaning out your garage and house?

Trust me, I know all about redundancy with tools that were good deals (I have 2 table saws and 2 jointers at the current moment), but I also have plans to sell 1 of each.

The fact remains: You are accumulating things right now that you don't need while you are trying to get rid of stuff and don't have running water or heat...which is something very hard to comprehend.

I think you may want to take a good hard look at yourself in the mirror and ask yourself, "Am I going to make the choice to change?" This has everything to do with what you choose.

I will say that it is a little hard reading a lot of the great advice and encouragement that other members have posted and to have you agree and make a lot of important and great self-discoveries, then see you make a lot of incredible progress...just to see you turn around to buy more stuff. It makes me question has anything really changed?

It is a little hard to feel any excitement about these new purchase posts, watching you bring home just another thing that will sit around and push you further from your goals. And it is all because you are making these choices. It is hard watching this addiction/condition unfold. We are all rooting for you so hard and that is what makes it painful to watch.

Bill. I sincerely hope that you follow through with getting the right help you need. While all of us forum members are your comrades in arms and are with you through this fight, we are NOT enough. You might need to make some hard decisions on your own, because at this rate, I could see you completely transform your garage into the ideal shop...just to see it destroyed with junk and clutter within a years time, like your first set of pictures, which is a very sad thought.

I'm still waiting for that 1 picture, just that one, single picture, that shows your shop completely cleared out. I know I may be waiting a while, but I'm waiting...

 

[Nighttrain]

You didnt mention what your wife bought this weekend. Something tells me you both went on a shopping spree. Come on Bill get into this fight and get some help for both of you.

 

[tinbender 66]

. Well said.

 

[Bull]

It's a little Dumore 20,000RPM one I bought a while back and just now picked up.

Ok, I am lowering my horns then, if this is an older, pre-self-help purchase

 

[PDR John]

One more newbie brought to you by Bill.

Was linked over from another board (not the first), but had to sign up this time.


Only to say: Good luck and stay strong Bill.



John

 

[Xenocide]

Lets have some pictures of the new drill press then. It's the only way to appease this lot!

 

[Kevin54]

We took the weekend off and went up to Ludington to camp overnight. Alone time without even the dogs. Time for her and I ro reacquaint. Went by Gladwin to pick up the Dumore sensitive Drill Press. Hope to stop by warmpancakes place in Brighton on the way home and pick up the air hose reel.

Bill

It's a little Dumore 20,000RPM one I bought a while back and just now picked up.

So in essence, you are getting two things. I take it you don't already have a hose reel?

On a very serious note Bill, are you wanting to beat this beast or not? While you say one thing, you do another. You tell us you aren't going to do it, then on another thread you are talking about the purchase that you made (DuMore) then it comes to light in this thread. There has been many many members trying to give you suggestions as to what to do and how to do it the most effecient way that there is, but you insist on still doing things your way. It looks to me like your way hasn't worked very well for years. When rooms become a fire hazard, when your bedroom is so packed up with clothes, boxes, and whatever else that you have to crawl over things to get into bed, when your stairsteps are a trip hazard, and when th ewife especially wants to buy a house next door to start filling it, then you have real deeprooted issues. Whether it be depression or some traumatic life altering experience, you have a deeprooted problem that only a trained professional can help with. Bill....IT'S NOT A NORMAL LIFESTYLE!!!!! You have items that you can't use, items that you didn't realize you had, and items that you do't even know about because they have been buried for years. I said it before but have you thought about your neighbor that you borrow water from? What does he think in his mind? Have you give it a thought as to what neighbors think because you just keep moving stuff around? You are tacking too many emotional attachments to things. Inanimate objects that are now worthless because you chose to ruin them by not being able to do upkeep on your house.

What really was the motive for going away for the weekend? I really think that you like camping, but the ulterior motive was to go pick up your drillpress, plain and simple. And in all honesty, answer me this, does a damn little DuMore drillpress take precedence over busted waterpipes and a ******* that doesn't work? Your plumbing is shot, you haven't got it fixed in a year but you are more worried about cleaning out a spot in the garage for a drillpress and going away camping God knows how many times since your plumbing went bad.

But remember Bill, you have rats, and you have mice. for every one you see, there are hundreds that you don't see. At least in the case of the mice. It is a very unsanitary, unhealthy condition to live in. That doesn't take in consideration the years of dust and other bugs that have accumulated and made a home there.

Is there a reason that you don't want to talk to a professional to help you and your wife? The problem won't fix itself and will continue to grow and fester until the city finally comes in and condemns your place. What then? If you don't know who to call for professional help, then I will step up to the plate and call some for you if you give me some info.

So bottom line Bill, if you are really, really serious, it's time to **** or get off the pot. Make a move to get some serious professional help.

And as I always said all along, every member here is pulling for ya and would like to see you really pull this off Don't let us down

 

[orange02ss]

I feel I better go throw something away! Good luck Bill, you are making progress!

 

[Holedgr]

I had a busy weekend trying to take advantage of the weather before it breaks...

I'll be on Bill's *** before the end the day...I might stop by....

In retrospect, I guess it's a good thing I didn't plan anything...Bill wasn't even home.


-T

 

[bczygan]

Just got home. Wife extended the vacation weekend one day because the weather was so beautiful. Yes, I picked up the DP (Bought a while back, and the hose reel (Bigger than I thought). Didn't get to meet Warmpancakes (He wasn't home).
I avoided the extra pop up trailer and still ended up with a very happy wife. Ludington restores her soul (And mine). Photos of DP, reel and Ludington to follow. Tomorrow the work starts anew. I am refreshed, re-energized and renewed.
One of the changes we need to make is to treasure and care for our belongings better. We embarked on that path by patching our tent while camping and carefully folding it for storage. Have what you value and value what you have. Another thing is we went tent camping for the first time in years. It proved we don't need a pile of stuff to enjoy a trip. We ate out at cheap local places and enjoyed walks in the woods and watching sunsets on the beach. We also had time to enjoy each others company like we haven't in years. Without the dogs and cats and birds we had time to walk hand in hand. Our relationship is on the way to being renewed as well. And we made it back in time for the Lions game and her favorite show (Sorry to anyone we ran off the road). Sorry to Holedgr. We will connect. Things will begin to happen in the morning.

 

[Omphaloskeptic]

"Things will begin to happen in the morning."

Sorry Bill, that's not good enough. We want to see a prioritized list posted and see that you are sticking to that list. The first three items on that list should be: Water, Sewage, and Heat. Nothing else beyond those items, no diversions, no side trips, NO MORE PURCHASES, and no more bull-shitting yourself.

 

[bczygan]

"Things will begin to happen in the morning."

Sorry Bill, that's not good enough. We want to see a prioritized list posted and see that you are sticking to that list. The first three items on that list should be: Water, Sewage, and Heat. Nothing else beyond those items, no diversions, no side trips, NO MORE PURCHASES, and no more bull-shitting yourself.

OK,
List for today:
(Get access to basement for removals)

1. Put dresser (That is on front walk) on CL.
2. Put Mesa (That blocks drive approach) pop up on CL.
3. Clear path to basement stairway.
4. Clear back walk.

 

[MadMechMaster]

Now, finish the coffee and get started!

 

[70Chevy]

Bill,

While listing your items on CL, resist looking / calling / buying other stuff.

That doesn't sound like the weekend you had planned when we spoke Friday. Where you joshing me?

Maybe not only a priority list - but a list with deadlines. These 4 items will be complete today? That would be great!

 

[bczygan]

Bill,

While listing your items on CL, resist looking / calling / buying other stuff.

That doesn't sound like the weekend you had planned when we spoke Friday. Where you joshing me?

Maybe not only a priority list - but a list with deadlines. These 4 items will be complete today? That would be great!

Not today. List is too ambitious. I've got the trots. Don't know what I ate on the trip. Lets narrow it to clean path to stairs and maybe CL ads. Due today.

 

[Nighttrain]

Get at least two garbage bins full today Bill, we know you can do it. I have an old international 234 tractor I have been letting sit since we bought our 4-wheel mule. I told myself I would get the tires replaced and sell it. (due to this thread) guess what? I bought the tires today and am replaceing them, although they are giving me a tough time getting the old ones off. I will race you to a craigslist add to sell your camper. Eating lunch and heading back to the shop. good luck.

 

[JSBriggs]

Like Nighttrain, this thread helps motivate me as well. Im in the process of prepping to paint the interior of the house we are building (see sig). It is taking forever, and I just ran through my second case (12 tubes per case) of caulk. Im grabbing lunch, then headed back out.

Keep fighting the fight Bill.

-Jeff

 

[markviii]

Garbage day tomorrow, right? Clear that back walk ASAP (while the weather is good) so helpers can actually help this next weekend. That would be great! Thursday/Friday rain is imminent, so you can get lots of indoor work completed on that list (like finally clearing off the basement stairs, again so that helpers can actually help with the truly important jobs which NEED to be started/completed soon). Just keep hydrated to keep from other negative health issues cropping up. Hope you got all that stuff is on CL while you were sitting around before filling those garbage bins!

I reorganized my mom's storage shelves in her garage last Friday when I visited dad in hospice care at home. It made the time go faster. My niece was visiting from Portland and we had LOTS of fun looking at our childhood pictures. She's 36 and I never had contact with her until 2 years ago, so we never saw pictures of each other growing up (she was born the year I got married). I ran into some boxes filled with MY stuff that has been packed away since I left for college in '71 and through 2 moves that my parents made in that time. I didn't even open them - I just loaded them in my trunk and threw them in the dumpster when I came home Saturday. It wasn't hard because I didn't give into temptation and peek at the contents. If I haven't missed it in 40 years, it just wasn't worth anything.

Chris

 

[BlueSuedeShoe]

Bill,

I admire you for giving all these calm answers even though pretty much everybody here is putting so much pressure on you.
That is not what I am used to with my husband. When I pressure him to do something he would shut down completely.

Which makes me ask you:
What would be the ideal help for you?
Do you need that pressure? Do you need someone to make plans for you? Do you want someone to just do what you ask him/her to do? For example carry stuff around for you, drive trash away, fix broken whatevers...
How much advice do you need?

 

[Woffski]

A horder you are!!!!

 

[bczygan]

Bill,

I admire you for giving all these calm answers even though pretty much everybody here is putting so much pressure on you.
That is not what I am used to with my husband. When I pressure him to do something he would shut down completely.

Which makes me ask you:
What would be the ideal help for you?
Do you need that pressure? Do you need someone to make plans for you? Do you want someone to just do what you ask him/her to do? For example carry stuff around for you, drive trash away, fix broken whatevers...
How much advice do you need?

Pretty much the variety of help, support and critical reviews that I am getting here are exactly what I need. Things go in cycles of supportive comments and critical comments, as my progress waxes and wanes. I'm getting criticism right now as I should because of lack of progress during a critical time period. I have also revealed a lot and made contacts and people expect me to produce. There is still a lot more people don't know about what I need to do about car repair and financial issues. And I haven't laid out my medical problems that, along with the psychological difficulties, make for additional slowness. But I asked for all this and still welcome it. I need more than anything to do most of the actual work myself (Along with Julie). I need to do that so I am making the decisions to let go of things. It will be slower than the group likes. At this point, even if the group turned on me and decided I was a lost cause, I couldn't go back. The thing I need most right now is every kind of support, critical and otherwise. I would really like to hook up with Holedgr whenever he has a minute (And his time is very valuable), so I can give him the tour so he can report to you all the real lay of the land. Nothing beats eyes on the problem. I trust him to mirror back to me what reality really is. The best I can do for now is trudge on, step by step toward many small goals, one at a time, that build into large goals.

 

[sams]

so long as you keep trying we won't give up on you, even if progress slows down- I promise

 

[markviii]

It took a lot of strength/courage on your part to reveal as much as you have about your family's challenges. Financial and health problems compound these other issues and also need to be addressed. You're rebuilding your lives and that takes a lot of hard work. I'm with you all the way.

We know there's more going on "behind the scenes" than you've shared so far (frankly, it's mind-boggling to me!). I know what can be hidden from the world by all those trees on such a prominent corner in a town because we've cleaned up such a place over the past 5 years on our Restored 1930s Auto Shop property. We didn't have to live in it, though. It's another deal entirely when you're living in it. We did, however, get the water and heat taken care of ASAP in order to move along the cleanup more efficiently.

Keep strong (and accept assistance when offered)!

Chris

 

[ibedayank]

a LARGE thing makes you want to say screw it and ignore it... small thing is easy to get done and something you will see results after you do it...so you do

 

[Omphaloskeptic]

Bill, you appear to me to be very astute and keenly aware of your own mental processes in dealing with the world around you. I ask you if you have ever been evaluated by a professional to determine how you could compensate for whatever drives you or holds you back from actions that are considered the norm. I do not ask this to embarrass you, but to find out if you have been made aware of techniques to work around your current mode of decision making. A crude comparison might be how a person dealing with dyslexia can train their brain to counter the limitations imposed by the dyslexic condition, or perhaps, how a left-handed individual adjusts to a right-handed world. What you are trying to accomplish is worthwhile and admirable, but what concerns me more is the 'how' of your efforts. I do hope you seek help from those professionals who may be able to teach you techniques to reach your goals of self-improvement with much less angst, depression, and reversals.

 

[rubberrodder]

Bil,
Just checking in to give you some more encouragement. It is fantastic news that you accepted help from holedgr and 70chevy. Us A.A's call that a fifth step. "admitted to god, to ourselves,AND TO ANOTHER HUMAN BEING to excact nature of our wrongs." You actually are letting ANOTHER HUMAN BEING into your situation. I know how scary this can be. But, trust me on this, only good can come from this.

 

[bczygan]

Bill, you appear to me to be very astute and keenly aware of your own mental processes in dealing with the world around you. I ask you if you have ever been evaluated by a professional to determine how you could compensate for whatever drives you or holds you back from actions that are considered the norm. I do not ask this to embarrass you, but to find out if you have been made aware of techniques to work around your current mode of decision making. A crude comparison might be how a person dealing with dyslexia can train their brain to counter the limitations imposed by the dyslexic condition, or perhaps, how a left-handed individual adjusts to a right-handed world. What you are trying to accomplish is worthwhile and admirable, but what concerns me more is the 'how' of your efforts. I do hope you seek help from those professionals who may be able to teach you techniques to reach your goals of self-improvement with much less angst, depression, and reversals.

Your post above is VERY important. You have a lot of insight into the problems to which the human mind is susceptible. You must have some knowledge in this area. Maybe some professional training. Yes, I have had treatment and counseling, and it is a BIG help, especially when you reach an impasse in your life. It is the reason I am able to be somewhat self aware. You learn to become self analyzing. One difficulty is that you can fool yourself so easily, especially initially. Everyone needs to take a good long look at themselves from time to time and really try to see how they are living their life. And when you have constructed a blind spot like I have in this case, it helps to have a professional to guide you out from the darkness. But there are no shortcuts. You have to have the determination and you have to do all the work. And by work, I mean the hard work of retraining yourself to live in a different reality and respond in different ways. I liken it to a drug addiction, something I had experience with as a youth. While in the midst of the addiction the world is a very comfortable, soft and warm and wonderful place. When all the circumstances of the addiction cause your world to fall apart and you have to face the real world, it is a very hard edged and stark and unpleasant place. But you learn to live in it and enjoy its challenges and triumphs and find satisfactions in doing so. Yes, it would be easier to have the help of counseling right now. Don't have health coverage right now, so I'll work my way through with your help for a while. The very good news is that I've learned that it IS possible to change. And change IS good. And the resultant reality you get to live in IS better. It is more fun to live as a more completely whole and functioning person. It takes a lot of mental energy to live in a mish-mash and crooked world of your own creation. When you get your thinking clear and the cobwebs are gone you get to enjoy a more energetic and satisfying life.

 

[Kevin54]

Bill, I'll again say it, you need to get the help of a professional. You talk about health problems but make no headway on your own to remedy the situation, you talk about finance problems, but continue to buy. See the problem there? If your wife works, she has health insurance. Take advantage of it to get the health problems looked at. If a mental problem would be part of your or your wifes as far as the hoarding, health insurance will or should cover talking to a professional.

But as an overall look at the complete picture and where you are at in it, you really haven't done squat as far as attacking the problem. All you are doing is rearranging what you have and then boast that you have made progress. And throwing away a couple of trashcans of worthless **** a week doesn't even scratch the surface of the real problem. For Chris' sakes man, you still don't have running water. WTF!!!! yet you make another purchase, go camping, purchase something else, so on and so forth. And in all of this, what has your wife bought, brought into the house and throwed down on one of the many piles of items that you already have.

I propose a little picture competition. You post up a picture of the rooms in your house and I'll post up pictures of rooms in our house for comparison. Although I'm a single story ranch with no basement and you are two story with, but I'll still compare rooms. If you do, I will, and I hope others will. Maybe everyone showing their cards will prompt a fire under your ****.

Game on?????

 

[bczygan]

Bill, I'll again say it, you need to get the help of a professional. You talk about health problems but make no headway on your own to remedy the situation, you talk about finance problems, but continue to buy. See the problem there? If your wife works, she has health insurance. Take advantage of it to get the health problems looked at. If a mental problem would be part of your or your wifes as far as the hoarding, health insurance will or should cover talking to a professional.

But as an overall look at the complete picture and where you are at in it, you really haven't done squat as far as attacking the problem. All you are doing is rearranging what you have and then boast that you have made progress. And throwing away a couple of trashcans of worthless **** a week doesn't even scratch the surface of the real problem. For Chris' sakes man, you still don't have running water. WTF!!!! yet you make another purchase, go camping, purchase something else, so on and so forth. And in all of this, what has your wife bought, brought into the house and throwed down on one of the many piles of items that you already have.

I propose a little picture competition. You post up a picture of the rooms in your house and I'll post up pictures of rooms in our house for comparison. Although I'm a single story ranch with no basement and you are two story with, but I'll still compare rooms. If you do, I will, and I hope others will. Maybe everyone showing their cards will prompt a fire under your ****.

Game on?????

OK Kevin,
Since I'm up here doing the Aztec two step, here are a few photos of our master bedroom. Basically the room we live in. It has been cleaned up from what it was. Before we only had a 2'x2' space by one side of the bed to dress in. Now there is a larger space. I removed 15 bins full of clothes from in here. We still need to climb over the bed to get from my side out. I have cleaned out a couple of drawers of one dresser for my clothes so I don't have them in a pile. But there is a lot still to do. Can't get to or use the closet. Can't get to the windows to look out.

A couple of notes. My wife's health insurance excludes me. She doesn't even use her insurance at all, despite medical and dental problems. A waste of money (And lots of it), if she won't go to the doctor....
You are right on in your comments about minor removals and moving things around. The more I think of it, the more I agree.
An example is the "Office". It's a spare bedroom with 2 computer desks and countless computer equipment from as far back as 386 and dot matrix. We can't even get into the room. It needs to have EVERYTHING removed and disposed of. Then 1 desk and 1 desktop computer need to be put in there, nothing else. We have 5 laptops that can also be put in there for other computer use. An additional chair would allow 2 people to use computers there at the same time. I can see in my mind how neat and clear and minimalist and usable that would be. But then I think of all the equipment we bought at great cost, and used very little before buying the next generation. This stuff has no market value or further uses except maybe for home automation or security or maybe a kitchen or shop computer. Even then, the laptops will do a better job. So it comes down to my ability to part with things.......

By the way, I am getting flak from my wife now on the pop up we didn't get. She is finding out that I ignored phone calls from the seller and will blame me for not getting it on purpose.
And she is missing some of her clothes I put in bins and took to the back yard. I need to provide her an organized dressing room where all her clothes are readily available and organized. But she will have to be an active participant for that. She can't just throw her clothes down in a pile in the evening. Having the organized room won't help if she doesn't use it.

 

[70Chevy]

Bill,

It sounds like your wife is not completely on board here.

Is Julie aware of this thread that you have started (as a garage clean-out thread) ?

If not, perhaps you could let her read through it and maybe it will help her understand what you are trying to accomplish.

I'll be calling again this week.

Brian

 

[bczygan]

Bill,

It sounds like your wife is not completely on board here.

Is Julie aware of this thread that you have started (as a garage clean-out thread) ?

If not, perhaps you could let her read through it and maybe it will help her understand what you are trying to accomplish.

I'll be calling again this week.

Brian

Thank you Brian,
She is aware and I have read her some of the thread. Mostly to make her aware of our need to respond to our problems, not just ignore them. She considers the entire house and yard my problem and there is a good reason for that. I'm not working. She is our sole support. My job is the house, yard, animals and cooking etc. So she can just ignore things and not take ownership for anything.
Her buy in has to have a benefit that means something to her. A couple weeks ago she thought she would be transferred to a building where she would have to dress up all the time. Her wardrobe became important to her and the idea of creating a walk in closet out of the spare bedroom became a motive force. That allowed me to remove a lot of stuff from that room and the master bedroom in prep for that. She has since been told the move is postponed or canceled. Still, she would like clothes organized. So I will be able to go forward with the cleanup here. These are the spaces she uses so that is important to have the ability to change them. But she won't do much to facilitate the work. When she comes home it's mindless TV to decompress from work. I would like to find her more fun things to do and involve her in the project, but until she sees exciting progress it will be hard to get her actively into it. It will be good for her, as it is for me, to learn to live differently. I want that freedom from the burden of too much stuff for her. I want her to have the space and time to devote to more satisfying pursuits than TV. I will guide her and give her the opportunities. She is part of my master plan. She just doesn't know it yet.