Well , I have saved up enough to make my next big purchase. A welder. I've researched for the last 3 months and was certain I was going to go with Hobart 210 DVI unit.. that is until I got the Harbor Freight sale ad in the mail the other night....I can get the Hobart 210 for under $700 (on sale right now) My question is, has anyone used or own A Vulcan or a Titanium welder? I know there are many factors involved in answering this question. I'm not looking for a debate just if anyone out there has used either the Vulcan or Titanium and what they like and dis-like. I'm about 90% sure I'm going to go with the Hobart 210, as my neighbor has the same machine and I have experience using it. Any input is appreciated.
Hobart vs Vulcan vs Titanium...
- Thread starter toyoguy81
- Start date
koditten
Well-known member
I freely admit that I'm a Miller man. With that said, I shop at HF often. I've looked the Vulcan units over very closely. I am impressed with the set ups. The drive quality is very high. I can't see how a home owner could go wrong with one of these welders.
I did some searching for reviews and everything I found was very positive.
I watched one vid where a person was trying to trip the duty cycle on his Vulcan welder. He couldn't get the thing to trip. He had to stop because his hand was getting too hot.
The HF warranty is pretty good too. Plus if you need consumables, you can buy them after work or on the weekends.
I did some searching for reviews and everything I found was very positive.
I watched one vid where a person was trying to trip the duty cycle on his Vulcan welder. He couldn't get the thing to trip. He had to stop because his hand was getting too hot.
The HF warranty is pretty good too. Plus if you need consumables, you can buy them after work or on the weekends.
plinker
Well-known member
I would say the Hobart would have better long term support over the others. It would seem that inverter technology is making welders a throwaway item, seemingly anyway.
anythingyoucanimagine
Well-known member
Home/Hobbyist chiming in:
I have a German car up on a rotisserie in my garage so maybe we will be polar opposites
Are you going to be doing car-related stuff? What are you going to be welding? What gauge?
First thing you want to spend money on is PPE: Buy a GOOD helmet (WITH GRIND MODE), a good respirator, gloves, leathers, etc. Sorry, I know it's corny but you get what you pay for. We own two HF auto-darkening helmets (backups, loaners, etc.) but wife and I both have (expensive 3M brand) stuff --it's night and day... and worth every penny.
I have a bunch of welders (gmaw, fcaw, gtaw, etc.) One blue, three red and one (actually also blue) very old (made in Italy) HF/Chicago Electric fcaw.
Miller recently bought Hobart. Rumor is they wanted to sell blue wire like how red sells red wire. I believe that Miller is keeping the Hobart name and the blue boxes will be the higher end machines while the Hobart (white/orange/whatever) boxes will be focused much more at retail/homeowners/hobbyists. It's sort of like Lincoln Electric --if you see a red Weld-Pak 1xx with a NASCAR stocker on it, that welder was sold at HD/Lowes (some big-box retail store). If you find a red weld-pak box without nascar stickers on it, that person probably purchased it from a welding supply house (or direct from lincoln, or some other non-retail channel). They may have same "weld-pak 100" written on them but they are two different machines. (or they were... no idea what they are today)
If I could suggest one more thing (first is GET A GOOD HELMET!!): Look for a machine that doesn't just have numbers/letters on the knobs. It will help you a lot in the long run if you know/understand wire feed rate, amps, etc. ABCD/12345 doesn't do you any favors. You will be able to switch over much easier process-to-process (even fcaw to gmaw) if you understand that "letter B means n feet-per minute/second. Letter B tells you nothing. Understanding the numbers behind balancing amps (heat) and wire speed (glue/filler material) will advance your welding skills a lot. Even if you end up buying used, get something that has dials/buttons that translate back to actual meaningful numbers --not abcd or 12345.
Also, if you think you are going to fcaw sheet metal/body panels/thin stuff --it ain't gonna happen... Think of fcaw as baby stick (dirty, working out in field/remote, etc.) and think of gmaw as baby gtaw (clean, precision, control, etc.) fcaw and stick are more similar (flux inside vs. flux outside) whereas tig vs. mig there is the whole electrode/filler medium difference...
My Chicago Electric Easy Mig 100 is horrible. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I haven't given it away or sold it because it's so bad that I don't want to give it to anyone (in fear of them wanting to come back and murder me).
My red weld-pak 100 (with gas) is OK... ABCD/12345 settings. It's small, cheap, I can loan it out, etc.
My red weld-pak 140 is where things start to get decent. It's 240V, gas, aftermarket gun, etc. I teach people on that machine. Pretty much that's my normal go-to box. I still have the gas hookups on the weld-pak 100 but it's setup for fcaw as my "loaner". The red 240V weld-pak 140 is a really great little machine.
Then I have a red Precision 225 gtaw (and stick). That thing is awesome --but it wasn't cheap. Absolutely amazing machine. I probably can't even weld to 50% of it's capabilities. For my purposes --it's awesome and I love it.
I also have a blue MM 350P. It is also an amazing machine... Except I'm meh about it. I had a little blue MM 211... Then I upgraded to a blue MM 252?? (or whatever was just above the 211)... Eventually I landed an amazing deal on the blue 350P (long story but basically new/open box). I have 3-phase 208Y power at my home. gmaw with 3ph and a good machine is unbelievable. It's also night & day --welding aluminum with the 350P can be pretty close to gtaw. It's a VERY solid machine except I still find the little welding cart with the Lincoln 14o gmaw on it to be less hassle.
Look for real wire speed/amp numbers and don't be afraid of a 240V welder.
Hope that helps.
I have a German car up on a rotisserie in my garage so maybe we will be polar opposites
Are you going to be doing car-related stuff? What are you going to be welding? What gauge? First thing you want to spend money on is PPE: Buy a GOOD helmet (WITH GRIND MODE), a good respirator, gloves, leathers, etc. Sorry, I know it's corny but you get what you pay for. We own two HF auto-darkening helmets (backups, loaners, etc.) but wife and I both have (expensive 3M brand) stuff --it's night and day... and worth every penny.
I have a bunch of welders (gmaw, fcaw, gtaw, etc.) One blue, three red and one (actually also blue) very old (made in Italy) HF/Chicago Electric fcaw.
Miller recently bought Hobart. Rumor is they wanted to sell blue wire like how red sells red wire. I believe that Miller is keeping the Hobart name and the blue boxes will be the higher end machines while the Hobart (white/orange/whatever) boxes will be focused much more at retail/homeowners/hobbyists. It's sort of like Lincoln Electric --if you see a red Weld-Pak 1xx with a NASCAR stocker on it, that welder was sold at HD/Lowes (some big-box retail store). If you find a red weld-pak box without nascar stickers on it, that person probably purchased it from a welding supply house (or direct from lincoln, or some other non-retail channel). They may have same "weld-pak 100" written on them but they are two different machines. (or they were... no idea what they are today)
If I could suggest one more thing (first is GET A GOOD HELMET!!): Look for a machine that doesn't just have numbers/letters on the knobs. It will help you a lot in the long run if you know/understand wire feed rate, amps, etc. ABCD/12345 doesn't do you any favors. You will be able to switch over much easier process-to-process (even fcaw to gmaw) if you understand that "letter B means n feet-per minute/second. Letter B tells you nothing. Understanding the numbers behind balancing amps (heat) and wire speed (glue/filler material) will advance your welding skills a lot. Even if you end up buying used, get something that has dials/buttons that translate back to actual meaningful numbers --not abcd or 12345.
Also, if you think you are going to fcaw sheet metal/body panels/thin stuff --it ain't gonna happen... Think of fcaw as baby stick (dirty, working out in field/remote, etc.) and think of gmaw as baby gtaw (clean, precision, control, etc.) fcaw and stick are more similar (flux inside vs. flux outside) whereas tig vs. mig there is the whole electrode/filler medium difference...
My Chicago Electric Easy Mig 100 is horrible. I wouldn't wish it on my worst enemy. I haven't given it away or sold it because it's so bad that I don't want to give it to anyone (in fear of them wanting to come back and murder me).
My red weld-pak 100 (with gas) is OK... ABCD/12345 settings. It's small, cheap, I can loan it out, etc.
My red weld-pak 140 is where things start to get decent. It's 240V, gas, aftermarket gun, etc. I teach people on that machine. Pretty much that's my normal go-to box. I still have the gas hookups on the weld-pak 100 but it's setup for fcaw as my "loaner". The red 240V weld-pak 140 is a really great little machine.
Then I have a red Precision 225 gtaw (and stick). That thing is awesome --but it wasn't cheap. Absolutely amazing machine. I probably can't even weld to 50% of it's capabilities. For my purposes --it's awesome and I love it.
I also have a blue MM 350P. It is also an amazing machine... Except I'm meh about it. I had a little blue MM 211... Then I upgraded to a blue MM 252?? (or whatever was just above the 211)... Eventually I landed an amazing deal on the blue 350P (long story but basically new/open box). I have 3-phase 208Y power at my home. gmaw with 3ph and a good machine is unbelievable. It's also night & day --welding aluminum with the 350P can be pretty close to gtaw. It's a VERY solid machine except I still find the little welding cart with the Lincoln 14o gmaw on it to be less hassle.
Look for real wire speed/amp numbers and don't be afraid of a 240V welder.
Hope that helps.
sberry
Banned
I havnt used the HF machines but I wonder how a guy can get the Hobart 210 at that price? It's a good welding machine.
RumRiver5.0
Well-known member
I am certainly no expert but I have a Miller 211 with the autoset deal. Great welder for the money. I have welded 1/4" steel and down to 1/16" with it am I am not that great at welding.
I bought a HF MIG about 18 years ago, and could not get a decent weld out of it. Since I had NO MIG training, I didn't know if it was me or the welder. An aquintence who is an excellent welder, recently tested the HF Mig, for me. He said it was junk and he could not get a decent weld, either.
After that, I took 2 course's and learned to MIG/STICK/GAS WELD, but not w/ my crapy HF welder. NO more HF welders for me.
After that, I took 2 course's and learned to MIG/STICK/GAS WELD, but not w/ my crapy HF welder. NO more HF welders for me.
hefnerconstructionlc
Well-known member
I have the Vulcan Migmax 215 I did a review on it a while back I posted about it. If you search make max 215 on the form you’ll probably find what I posted about it. I actually used it last night the thing is downright phenomenal. How long will it last nobody knows. But it doesn’t cost much so I’m rolling the dice. compared to others I have a a small Lincoln my brother has him a Miller 252 I like this one the best.
hefnerconstructionlc
Well-known member
I screwed up...the Hobart 190 is $649 @ Blaine's Farm...
The 210 is $819 ...$860 shipped @ Blaines...
Im still leaning towards Hobart 210...
nadogail
Well-known member
I have been told by a Miller Factory Rep that the difference between my Hobart Stickmate and a Miller Thunderbolt is that the grey machines are sold at a lower price point through "big box" stores and the blue machines are sold at a higher price point through professional welding supply outlets.
welderjosh
Member
- Joined
- Mar 10, 2008
- Messages
- 18
Buy once, cry once. Get this and do everything. MIG, STICK, AC/DC TIG
Multimatic® 220 AC/DC
Multimatic® 220 AC/DC
Steveodle
Well-known member
I taught welding 14 years in high school.
Welded over 30 years in industrial maintenance.
Bought 8-10 Miller's, 4-6 Lincoln's and 1 Hobart.
The Miller's are great, they taught 100's of kids to gmaw weld, no trouble.
Big red got to the short end of the electrode for stick welding.
But since the early 80's I've used my Hobart Beta for all my home shop projects
And it served me well. I never bought/replaced any part except contact tips
cable liners, nozzles until 2018.
New 15ft mig gun.
HOBART given those choices.
If you do nothing right,you'll do nothing wrong!
Welded over 30 years in industrial maintenance.
Bought 8-10 Miller's, 4-6 Lincoln's and 1 Hobart.
The Miller's are great, they taught 100's of kids to gmaw weld, no trouble.
Big red got to the short end of the electrode for stick welding.
But since the early 80's I've used my Hobart Beta for all my home shop projects
And it served me well. I never bought/replaced any part except contact tips
cable liners, nozzles until 2018.
New 15ft mig gun.
HOBART given those choices.
If you do nothing right,you'll do nothing wrong!
fourbyford
Well-known member
...dont know if you're a you tube'r... a guy on there goes by AvE... buys brand new stuff and does "DESTRUCTIVE" testing on it. I watched one of his vids where he opened up a Vulcan machine... bottom line is that he was pretty impressed with the quality... and that's not all that common for him. You can check the vid for yourself...
I already have an awesome mig machine (have had for nearly 20 years) so I'm not in the market but am seriously considering the Vulcan TIG in the near future
...D
I already have an awesome mig machine (have had for nearly 20 years) so I'm not in the market but am seriously considering the Vulcan TIG in the near future
...D
I've never used a Vulcan or Titanium but own a Hobart and Lincoln tombstone. I used a Chicago Electric years ago.
I'll stick with my Hobart but I'll stick weld with my Lincoln. I've got no issue with a blue welder. Tan, blue or red.
I'll stick with my Hobart but I'll stick weld with my Lincoln. I've got no issue with a blue welder. Tan, blue or red.
Diesel Dan
Well-known member
Have a Hobart 190 for home.
No complaints.
No complaints.
Scout Driver
Well-known member
Looking at how often Harbor Freight changes up their welder line, I'd stay away just because of unknown product and parts support over time.
As far as Hobart, I've got a Hobart 140 that has worked great for me!
Scott
As far as Hobart, I've got a Hobart 140 that has worked great for me!
Scott
Greeny
Well-known member
I have a Vulcan omnipro 220. It's awesome.
But my previous experience was an HF 90 amp fluxcore.
But my previous experience was an HF 90 amp fluxcore.
cspcrx
Well-known member
I had a HF when I started learning to weld and trying to make things. I then got a Hobart 210MVP and love it. Gives me a lot of flexibility and does anything I need to. I use it with 75/25 and get great welds.
When I was looking I found a great video on welding tips and tricks where he used the 210 and how it performs. Helped sell me
When I was looking I found a great video on welding tips and tricks where he used the 210 and how it performs. Helped sell me
Lucky13driver
Well-known member
I had a Hobart 140 and now have a 210 MVP. They are owned by Miller and a great machine. I've never used the HF welders however, HF has really upped there game for sure.
86turbodsl
Well-known member
I know some of the newer chinese welders work ok, but freely admit i'm a Miller *****. The inverter boxes can't be easily fixed when they break. The older Miller's just keep working. And you can fix em fairly cheap when they break. Lincolns are ok too, but i haven't had one lately. If you're just playing around, buy cheap and don't worry about it. I know i want a bulletproof box, so i buy Miller.
I've spent no more than $300 on any Miller welder in the last 20 years. 330A/BP, syncrowave 300, Dialarc, CP200 and CP300. I have 6 welders. I can do all processes.
I've spent no more than $300 on any Miller welder in the last 20 years. 330A/BP, syncrowave 300, Dialarc, CP200 and CP300. I have 6 welders. I can do all processes.
emeraldcoupe
Well-known member
I have a Vulcan 215 and like it so far. I still have my Lincoln weld pak 100, just wanted more capability .
Novice here but got a Hobart 190 "refurbished" on sale for around 500 last year and love it. Looks brand new and never had any non user inflected issues with it (gun not fully seated). Would be nice to have "infinite adjustment" but for a hobbyists i feel like its more than enough. If it were me i would check out their refurb selection, i had to wait a month to find what i wanted but it was worth it.
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk
evintho
Well-known member
My vote is for the Hobart. I've owned mine for the last 8 years and I use it a lot! It's a quality piece that I can weld up to 1/2" steel with. I paid $700 for it but it was a demo model at a welding supply store.
JamesW84
Well-known member
Same thing I did a few years ago. Although I don't weld much, and was a complete beginner, it has worked well for me.
Also, someone above said you ain't gonna weld body panels with flux core, but I did just that. Not sure how easy or how much faster MIG would have been, but I was outside and don't have any gas, so I used flux core. It was on a F250, so the metal was probably like 22 gauge.
Also, look into the 3m Speedglass helmets. I had a harbor freight and couldn't see what I was doing. I got so irritated that I researched and spent $300 on a Speedglass. Much better. It's nice to be able to see what you're trying to weld.
emeraldcoupe
Well-known member
My vote is for the Hobart. I've owned mine for the last 8 years and I use it a lot! It's a quality piece that I can weld up to 1/2" steel with. I paid $700 for it but it was a demo model at a welding supply store.
nice turbo coupe. I've had a few of them, the 83-86 tbirds were one of the best looking cars from the 80's
cj7jeep81
Well-known member
They've been owned by the same company for a really long time. I have 2 Hobart welders at home, and 2 older industrial Miller's. I've been really happy with the Hobart, and what's nice is parts are very readily available, and can get them from a variety of sources. Does the Harbor Freight ones use standard consumables, or are they specific to them? If you are not in a hurry, I'd keep an eye on Craigslist for a used unit. I see them all the time with very little use, for a couple hundred bucks off new price. The mutli-voltage would be nice, but not a deal breaker for me. I'd personally save the money and get a 190, but if you have a need for dual voltage, that would change things.
One thing I wished I would have done years ago was buy a gas bottle. With my Hobart 140, I always used flux cored, because I didn't want to spend the money on a bottle. So instead, I paid way to much for many roles of expensive flux core (cost savings would have paid for a bottle). Also, figure out what size wire you want to run, and buy the biggest spool your welder will hold. Bigger rolls are significantly cheaper per pound.
My Old Tools
Well-known member
Miller bought Hobart in 1996.
sberry
Banned
Yes, that 210 is an old model and discontinued some time ago as it was replaced by a compact. I have used it, its ok, you got a deal and its outstanding feature is it will hold a full size roll of wire. The new model which replaced it in the lineup as it replaced the 250 also is the 230 and it might be on my shortlist in smaller full sized machines. Its really got the stones of the 250 but it sold in a little different market than the Miller. Doesn't have a bunch of features and extra power where not needed, its a one wire one gas machine/shop maintenance kind of deal. It will handle a size larger wire and 2x the output of a 210.
Wire cost less on big spools too. 2x as much out with the same time and gas cost. Especially an issue if we got one guy waiting on another to weld something out. I was right there and set up, I weld out a foot with a smaller machine the other day, a 1 off maintenance item didn't pay to get a machine with lower operating cost, similar to most hobby guys, a rool of 10# in a 210 lasts a long time. It goes fast on big projects but minor work makes hundreds of welds.
Wire cost less on big spools too. 2x as much out with the same time and gas cost. Especially an issue if we got one guy waiting on another to weld something out. I was right there and set up, I weld out a foot with a smaller machine the other day, a 1 off maintenance item didn't pay to get a machine with lower operating cost, similar to most hobby guys, a rool of 10# in a 210 lasts a long time. It goes fast on big projects but minor work makes hundreds of welds.
anythingyoucanimagine
Well-known member
No idea. I think they use standard tips? I was given a (really old) Chicago Electric Easy Mig 100 way back when. It's so old it doesn't have wire feed speed and only has a 3-way switch, off, on #1 or on #2. I never use it so no clue about the consumables. No clue about the newer ones either, once I went red/blue I didn't look back.
Yes this. Welding with gas is so much better (unless you are truly portable/out in field --then stick not fcaw). I didn't notice a huge difference in cost savings but I don't weld that often. Probably if I welded more often I'd have better control and use less gas so gmaw/gtaw would end up being cheaper
Sorry. I guess that was a brain fart. I could swear I recently read something within the last year or so (or maybe someone at welding supply store mentioned it) that said Miller was making changes, going to start selling blue wire (and discontinue Hobart brand wire) and that they were going to consolidate the lines with Hobart being more retail/homeowner/hobbyist focused and Miller being more pro/industry focused...
I didn't realize Miller bought Hobart back in 1996. I'm not old enough to classify that as "recently"
I wasn't trying to knock Hobart at all. It is a very good brand/name and in my opinion very under-rated --I made my comment thinking that if Miller was going to be making changes, just be careful not to buy a Hobart rig that's going to go away in a year or three. Guess I was way off base though. Sorry again.hefnerconstructionlc
Well-known member
Vulcan uses the generic tips you can buy them at the welding supply shop,Harbor freigh, or Depot, or Lowe’s nothing special. You can also use big spools of wire in the Vulcan or small if you have it. The nice thing is is quick to change wire because you have a cold feed.
sberry
Banned
ITW bought Hobart, they own Miller too and is a conglomerate of more than 700 companies that are symbiotic. They share a lot of parts and material. Rubber, hose, copper, steel, plants, equipment. Wire, paint.
They have done well in the stock market and were a Buffet pick for well run companies. The welding machine companies are lean with executives and layers.
They have done well in the stock market and were a Buffet pick for well run companies. The welding machine companies are lean with executives and layers.
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Fueler
Well-known member
I am an automotive guy that welds whatever is needed.
At one time I had all high end Miller MIG, TIG and stick.
Many years ago I looked around and realized I had not used the MIG on any car stuff for a long time.
Sold it.
These days I have progressed up to a Dynasty 350. Not that just anyone needs that but the power allows me to weld some pretty thick stuff as well as pop cans if I want. Anything super thick or ugly I break out the stick attachment and weld outdoors.
I recommend that any car guy go straight to TIG unless you are building OFF road thick wall chassis in hurry up mode. You can do so much more with nicer results.
Not hard to learn and in the era of Youtube help is a click away.
The other reason is pretty simple.
MIG throws a lot of sparks around. I worry about that in a home garage. Heck, it worried me in a shop environment that is not solely setup for welding.
Oh, and I vote for the helmet that Miller sells that has the big viewport.
At one time I had all high end Miller MIG, TIG and stick.
Many years ago I looked around and realized I had not used the MIG on any car stuff for a long time.
Sold it.
These days I have progressed up to a Dynasty 350. Not that just anyone needs that but the power allows me to weld some pretty thick stuff as well as pop cans if I want. Anything super thick or ugly I break out the stick attachment and weld outdoors.
I recommend that any car guy go straight to TIG unless you are building OFF road thick wall chassis in hurry up mode. You can do so much more with nicer results.
Not hard to learn and in the era of Youtube help is a click away.
The other reason is pretty simple.
MIG throws a lot of sparks around. I worry about that in a home garage. Heck, it worried me in a shop environment that is not solely setup for welding.
Oh, and I vote for the helmet that Miller sells that has the big viewport.
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sberry
Banned
I fix about anything that moves, havnt used a gig in decades. I would be lost without a feeder, am done before most even get started.
no, miller doesnt own hobart, the parent company own miller and hobart but they are two separate companies
Own a titanium 170 and the Vulcan protig 200 currently. Have owned a Hobart handler 140 and 190, older Lincoln buzz box and a weldpak 140. Never had an issue with any of them.
The titanium uses standard tips. The tank pressure gauge leaked internally on the regulator out of the box, replaced it with the regulator from the Vulcan since I used a flow meter instead. Have around 15lbs through it without issue.
I would go for the Hobart if you have any concerns about longevity/parts etc
The titanium uses standard tips. The tank pressure gauge leaked internally on the regulator out of the box, replaced it with the regulator from the Vulcan since I used a flow meter instead. Have around 15lbs through it without issue.
I would go for the Hobart if you have any concerns about longevity/parts etc