I think I found my winter project

[grannyknot]

I have wanted one of the old Canadian Buffalo 18" drill presses for many yrs now and I finally just bought one today.
This thing is a monster, gotta be 400lbs at least, maybe more.
I think this unit must have spent a couple of decades in a High School metal shop, check out the "Arc of Shame" .
Looks like the little buggers deliberately tried to cut the table in half.
I'll have to bone up on my cast iron welding technique so I can fill in that trench on the work table. In fact this drill press is so heavy duty I may even be able throw a milling bit in the chuck and work the bulge of the welding repair job back down to flat.

The old guy that was selling it was closing down his shop to retire, he threw in a beautiful big vice that he couldn't find a home for, it will find a good home in my shop!

 

[grannyknot]

The vise,

 

[grannyknot]

Well this DP project might not last until the winter, I can't leave it alone.
I've taken the 1/2 hp motor apart and after cleaning and painting it's running well, very quiet.
Cleaned out all the muck out and sand blasted the arc of shame and it's even worse than I thought, I talked to a professional welder today who has lots of experience welding cast iron and he was not too eager to take the job on.
He suggested I fill it with braze instead, much less chance of cracking.

 

[jabberwoki]

Yikes ... thats a hell of an arch.

Looking forward to seeing progress.

 

[slowtwitch73]

You can always 'punt' on the arc and cover it with 1/2 Al plate drilled and tapped for hold downs etc. More useful imo.

 

[txvwnut]

My Walker Turner has a thick piece of phenolic attached to it. I decided one day to pull it off and see what was underneath. I couldn't get it reattached quick enough. My table looks about like the OP's. If you want to fix the arc of shame the best option would be to braze it as brazing doesn't impart too much heat into the table.

 

[ChargerRT]

Man with an arc of shame as bad as this one what if you milled it out and put a piece of hardwood in there that matched the arc? this drill press restored and looking pretty would look pretty sweet with a sweeping arc of walnut

 

[Davefr]

Well this DP project might not last until the winter, I can't leave it alone.
I've taken the 1/2 hp motor apart and after cleaning and painting it's running well, very quiet.
Cleaned out all the muck out and sand blasted the arc of shame and it's even worse than I thought, I talked to a professional welder today who has lots of experience welding cast iron and he was not too eager to take the job on.
He suggested I fill it with braze instead, much less chance of cracking.

It looks horrible but I think it's structurally OK and won't crack in two. I'd buy a case of JB Weld and fill it up then hit it with a DA. Nothing you can do will make it an invisible repair. JB Weld isn't too far off color wise and will be easy to sand smooth/flush.

I just don't understand these arcs of shame. Back in the day these machines were expensive. Was every machinist a lazy hack?

 

[grannyknot]

It looks horrible but I think it's structurally OK and won't crack in two. I'd buy a case of JB Weld and fill it up then hit it with a DA. Nothing you can do will make it an invisible repair. JB Weld isn't too far off color wise and will be easy to sand smooth/flush.

I have thought about JB weld or 3M epoxy panel bond, both would work but I'll try the braze first. I also like the idea of attaching a plate on top. You're right, structurally it's fine and I don't mind the repair showing, scars add character.

I just don't understand these arcs of shame. Back in the day these machines were expensive. Was every machinist a lazy hack?

I'm pretty sure this machine spent years in a high school shop, I know my HS shop teacher would roll over in his grave if he saw this damage. Every tool in his shop had to be back in its spot and pristine clean before anyone could leave.

I had a go at the chuck today, looks like it hasn't been serviced in a while, if ever. It is pretty banged up, might have to replace it.

 

[grannyknot]

I think I'm going to choose to go the "do no harm" route and cover the whole table with 1/2" plate steel.
I've been doing a lot more reading and although the brazing route could work there is still the risk during the heating and slow cooling period of splitting the table. The different expansion and contraction rates of the cast iron and bronze worries me, could be completely wrong about this but I'm thinking because there will be so much braze fill the bronze might act like a wedge as the cast iron contacts around it.

I don't have enough experience in this area and if I do take it to a pro and the table splits, he's just going to say "sorry buddy".
Maybe I'll post this on the fabrication forum before I make a final decision.

 

[Davefr]

I think I'm going to choose to go the "do no harm" route and cover the whole table with 1/2" plate steel.
I've been doing a lot more reading and although the brazing route could work there is still the risk during the heating and slow cooling period of splitting the table. The different expansion and contraction rates of the cast iron and bronze worries me, could be completely wrong about this but I'm thinking because there will be so much braze fill the bronze might act like a wedge as the cast iron contacts around it.

I don't have enough experience in this area and if I do take it to a pro and the table splits, he's just going to say "sorry buddy".
Maybe I'll post this on the fabrication forum before I make a final decision.

I'd still start with the JB Weld route. It's pretty inexpensive and easy to do and would also add a tad bit of strength to that area without any risk. Then if you want, add a plate to the top. 1/2" plate steel that size will be expensive, hard to shape and very heavy. I'd go with 1/8"-1/4" plate aluminum drilled and tapped into the old table with countersunk stove bolts in all four corners. It can be cut with a jigsaw.

 

[grannyknot]

Done, I didn't have any 1/2" on hand but I think this 1/4" plate will do the job just fine, the cheap and easy solution.

 

[captain14]

Did you add any fill to the “arc of shame”?

I’m going to follow along with your progress.

 

[PSCo1867]

Not knowing the actual composition of the drill-press components, I have to ask the question: Is there a chance that the "arc of shame" table is actually cast steel, instead of cast iron? I've been pleasantly surprised before with different repair dilemmas, and things become instantly repairable.

I'm guessing it's iron, but I thought I'd ask. In that case, I'd go for the braze repair.

 

[grannyknot]

Did you add any fill to the “arc of shame”?

I’m going to follow along with your progress.

No I didn't, the table it self is plenty strong without any filler so I just screwed the plate down from underneath.

Not knowing the actual composition of the drill-press components, I have to ask the question: Is there a chance that the "arc of shame" table is actually cast steel, instead of cast iron? I've been pleasantly surprised before with different repair dilemmas, and things become instantly repairable.

I'm guessing it's iron, but I thought I'd ask. In that case, I'd go for the braze repair.

Steel would have been a breeze to repair, no, it's cast iron. Would have liked to repair it with braze too, then I watched this funny video.

 

[grannyknot]

So what is waiting for me behind this cap, a razor sharp spring ready to jump out?
I loosened off the Allen screw and the whole cap spun counter clockwise a couple of revolutions.
Open to advice on how to proceed on removing the spindle and pinion.

Manged to get the tag off without damaging it and started cleaning up the pinion handles, I have some long end knobs coming from McMaster-Carr to help with leverage.

 

[grannyknot]

Some success today, I got the head disassembled. Every video I've watched showed the spindle just falling out after the pinion was removed, not mine. I finally had to mount it on the press to make any headway, apparently someone in the past tried to disassemble by whacking the top of the splined shaft, that mushroomed out the top of the splines, that's why it wouldn't budge. I never would have have got it all apart without a press.
All 4 bearings need replacing.

The spring I was so freaked out about was very simple, no danger at all, cleaned out all the old grease with solvent, blew it dry and soaked it in a bath of 30wt oil over night.

 

[crguy]

The vise,

Chinese import.

 

[grannyknot]

Chinese import.

What makes you say that? This thing is old and made out of quality steel.

 

[grannyknot]

I stripped 3-4 layers of paint off everything and then painted a couple of coats of the closest grey I could find to the original, the new bearings came in today also.
Still have to strip the base and work on refinishing the main column, it's pretty rough, what I really need is to spin this column up on a lathe with 6ft bed.

 

[yhprum]

That’s a nice piece of kit, I like how you added the plate. Subscribed!

 

[Jgaz]

Can you spin the column with a rubber pressure test plug seater in one end?
Maybe a plug used for large pipe coupled to an electric drill?
Use a threaded coupling nut on the end of the plug’s expansion bolt with a cut off bolt gripped in the drill chuck.

Support the ends of the column with a couple of casters on the bottom of each end.
Kind of like 2/3s of a steady rest.

 

[grannyknot]

Can you spin the column with a rubber pressure test plug seater in one end?
Maybe a plug used for large pipe coupled to an electric drill?
Use a threaded coupling nut on the end of the plug’s expansion bolt with a cut off bolt gripped in the drill chuck.

Support the ends of the column with a couple of casters on the bottom of each end.
Kind of like 2/3s of a steady rest.

I like the way you think!
I have all of that stuff kicking around here, I'll have to see what I can hobble together.

 

[RTM]

What makes you say that? This thing is old and made out of quality steel.

Cuz the good Chinese imports say something like this.



The cheap ones say nothing.

The wing nut underneath locks the rotating bits



The cheap ones use the main screw to lock both.

Look at the size of the cylindrical bit the main handle goes thru. There are some skinny ones out there, and probably a skinny screw too.


The US made ones have the brand cast in in raised letters maybe?

Mine is from the early 80s, you can see the mass of bondo and primer to make it prettier.

 

[grannyknot]

Interesting, there's no wingnut/bolt on mine and the nut on the end of the main screw is castellated with a cotter pin so not sure atm what is locking the rotating assembly.
I'll probably reassemble it this weekend and will report back.

I guess "cheap Chinese" is a relative term these days, the difference between the build quality of this vise and the stuff being sold currently at Harbor Freight is night and day.
102 lbs for a 5"

 

[RTM]

guess "cheap Chinese" is a relative term these days, the difference between the build quality of this vise and the stuff being sold currently at Harbor Freight is night and day.
102 lbs for a 5"

Mine is only 76# at 4.75”

They aren't bad vises. But I don't think they will have the durability or build quality of my Parker, my Reeds, the good old American iron

 

[grannyknot]

Got it all back together and you're right RTM, the vise can rotate until it is clamped down on the work piece, then its locked.

 

[grannyknot]

I got the column and base finished this weekend, the flat machined surface on the base will never be used for what it is designed for while I own it so I'm wondering if I shouldn't just put a couple of coats of paint on it and keep it nice for the next guy.

 

[SMOKEYBEAR]

I knew I'd never use the base as intended on some I've brought back to life as well. I just taped the base off and sprayed the machined surface with a gray/ charcoal color so it had the "look" while in my shop without worrying about the rust returning.

 

[grannyknot]

I have been fooling around with diy nickel plating hardware and fasteners, I've done zinc plating before which can be quite involved but nickel plating is much easier and I'm sure will last a long time.
It has a warmth to the look that you don't get with chrome.
In the 3rd pic the unplated steel piece is to the far right.

 

[grannyknot]

There was a wooden spacer in the front of the head, could not get it out with out it breaking it, had some old very dense Mahogany on hand so made a replacement. The manufacturer painted over top of it but I thought it would add some "bling" to the machine.

I got most the drill assembled yesterday, it's a good thing I wasn't a day older, just about didn't get the head in place by myself.
The VFD is suppose to come in the next couple of days.
So far the runout seems to be about 11/1000th" which is a damned site more accurate than the outgoing drill press, once I get power to it and run in the new bearings at high speed I'm hoping things will settle out and might get a better number, or possibly not.

 

[slowtwitch73]

Nice.

Fall solstice today.... You better find a new winter project lol.

 

[grannyknot]

VFD arrived, Automationdirect DURApulse GS21-22PO, will easily handle the old 1hp 3ph I have.
Good company to deal with, good communication and techs who actually know what they are talking about.

 

[Davefr]

There was a wooden spacer in the front of the head, could not get it out with out it breaking it, had some old very dense Mahogany on hand so made a replacement. The manufacturer painted over top of it but I thought it would add some "bling" to the machine.

I got most the drill assembled yesterday, it's a good thing I wasn't a day older, just about didn't get the head in place by myself.
The VFD is suppose to come in the next couple of days.
So far the runout seems to be about 11/1000th" which is a damned site more accurate than the outgoing drill press, once I get power to it and run in the new bearings at high speed I'm hoping things will settle out and might get a better number, or possibly not.

Looks great!! Measure runout at the spindle.

 

[SweetD]

Just seeing this thread now, great project! Thanks for sharing!

 

[grannyknot]

So she's up and running, I haven't managed to get the stop/start button working yet as it seems you either use the key pad to start/stop and vary the speed or you have to go completely to external controls so I would have to get a potentiometer as well.

The run out was 11 thou so I gave the spindle a sharp rap on the high side that bought it down to 7 thou and as soon as the drill press was running I took it up to full speed for about 10min and did lots of random little taps with a hammer on the spindle, it is down to 5 thou run out now and I'm pretty happy with that, maybe it will continue to improve as the new bearings wear in.
This machine is much quieter than the old one, I don't even need hearing protection anymore.

 

[Davefr]

So she's up and running, I haven't managed to get the stop/start button working yet as it seems you either use the key pad to start/stop and vary the speed or you have to go completely to external controls so I would have to get a potentiometer as well.

The run out was 11 thou so I gave the spindle a sharp rap on the high side that bought it down to 7 thou and as soon as the drill press was running I took it up to full speed for about 10min and did lots of random little taps with a hammer on the spindle, it is down to 5 thou run out now and I'm pretty happy with that, maybe it will continue to improve as the new bearings wear in.
This machine is much quieter than the old one, I don't even need hearing protection anymore.

When it comes to runout, there's runout from the spindle and runout from the chuck. If each component's runout is aligned in one direction it will be worst case. There's a trick called "indexing the chuck". You install the chuck so that it's max. runout point is opposite of the spindle so they tend to cancel each other out. (example: if the chuck is .005" and the spindle is .005" in the same direction total runout can be .010" but if you orient them 180 degrees from each other, runout could drop to .000".) It might be worth experimenting.

I hope that made sense. In any event .005" is perfectly fine for a DP. Nice job on the restoration. It looks like you need to line up another "winter" project.

 

[grannyknot]

When it comes to runout, there's runout from the spindle and runout from the chuck. If each component's runout is aligned in one direction it will be worst case. There's a trick called "indexing the chuck". You install the chuck so that it's max. runout point is opposite of the spindle so they tend to cancel each other out. (example: if the chuck is .005" and the spindle is .005" in the same direction total runout can be .010" but if you orient them 180 degrees from each other, runout could drop to .000".) It might be worth experimenting.

I hope that made sense. In any event .005" is perfectly fine for a DP. Nice job on the restoration. It looks like you need to line up another "winter" project.

Thanks, I picked up a couple of projects today, a Logan 10.5"x24" model 200 lathe and a 15" production model Buffalo bench DP.
Both have been sitting in a barn for 20yrs so lots of work ahead.

 

[grannyknot]

The table on the drill press is 65lbs and more with the vise on top, my shoulders aren't what they were so I worked out how to motorizes it.
It's not much to look at but it does work well, I tie wrapped the original crank to the back in case the next owner wants to go back, if I hadn't then it would be guaranteed to get misplaced.
I used this motor from ebay, https://www.ebay.ca/itm/14620972161...IBwcEfllq1nl4VwTHAcutjAzbg==|tkp:BFBM2o7NoIxl