interesting china cman issue?

[krdiesel03]

Was board today and thought I would stress test some 3/8 extensions. I have access to a torque wrench that will go to 5000FP. It will also tell you what torque a fastener failed at. I put in a 6 inch MUSA extension and it broke at 230, the china one went to 290. thought it was strange so I tried a snap on, it snapped at 195.

Now I need to go collecting some more extensions and see if it is repeatable.

 

[nine4gmc]

hit the pawn shop but take some pics this time

 

[krdiesel03]

Will have to save up some cash, I am not sure about pawn shop tools, you do not know the history. Snap on will not warranty anything used at the plant, Plus i do not feel right warrantying anything that I broke on purpose.

 

[rsanter]

You also have to look at the type of failure. Did they all suddenly snap? Did any of them yield then twist to failure?

Bob

 

[91bronc300]

Like GMC said, do you have post-test pictures of the samples?

 

[krdiesel03]

They twisted some then snapped. I will get photos next time, I tossed then in the recycle bin.

 

[scaron]

that all said, i suppose it could be argued that 200 ft-lbs is a fair bit of torque for 3/8" drive...

edit: though i _would_ be curious to see how other makes come out in the comparison, too.

 

[krdiesel03]

yea I am a big guy and there is no way i am going to get 200fp on a 3/8 ratchet.

My point was that the china tool was comparable to the MUSA. I am not hung up like some people about COO. I do not have to worry about my job being sent to china and if you look at ipads they can do quality

 

[retDAC]

Was board today and thought I would stress test some 3/8 extensions. I have access to a torque wrench that will go to 5000FP. It will also tell you what torque a fastener failed at. I put in a 6 inch MUSA extension and it broke at 230, the china one went to 290. thought it was strange so I tried a snap on, it snapped at 195.

Now I need to go collecting some more extensions and see if it is repeatable.

Not surprised at Craftsman, both US and Chinese, doing well but would have expected better from S-o.

 

[1950mercury]

cool post.....that would be cool if you could compare some sockets also

 

[LXCam]

That's very cool for you to do this and share the results. And I say this not to under play your results. But as was pointed out, knowing if it snapped verses yielded then snapped would make the difference for myself. I'd much rather know it maintained it's torsional rigidity. Reason being fastening of torque to yield hardware. Not long ago someone posted a article regarding ratchet failure tests, the results were interesting like your test. Hey if you feel like testing 3" extensions, for some reason I got a bunch of them from different manufacturers. You're more then welcome to break to your hearts content, I just need an address.

 

[General Geoff]

threads like this make me wonder why there isn't a consumer reports for hand and power tools.

 

[HighPlainsWrencher]

This means nothing at this point. You have the torque value that they failed at but we need to know what caused them to fail at that value. Really the only thing you proved with this is that you can break different manufactures socket extensions with enough torque applied. The more detailed pictures you can post the better.

 

[scw1991]

If this wrench can measure up to 5000 FP, what is the degree of precision at 200 FP in % deviation at any given point? Did you use a test-lab type torque wrench? What is the make/model?

 

[Hootbro]

Me thinks had the Chinese Craftsman extension came out on bottom in the test and Snap On on top, people would not be so critical and making a hullabaloo about the testing procedure.

 

[upndown]

Me thinks had the Chinese Craftsman extension came out on bottom in the test and Snap On on top, people would not be so critical and making a hullabaloo about the testing procedure.

......

 

[monomach]

Me thinks had the Chinese Craftsman extension came out on bottom in the test and Snap On on top, people would not be so critical and making a hullabaloo about the testing procedure.

Wouldn't matter if Snap-On themselves did the test and had the results came out like this. Some people absolutely will never accept that any asian country is capable of wiping its own ***, let alone producing even a moderately acceptable tool.

Then again, tool snobs have always hated Craftsman. I made a living with mine back when they were almost all US made and other guys in the shop were still talking **** about how my tools were trash and how Craftsman hadn't been any good since the 70s...anything to justify their decision to hand their firstborn child over to the Snap-On man.

For my part, I've still only ever broken one CMan tool. It's amazing how using the right tool for the job keeps your stuff in good shape.

 

[Hootbro]

Wouldn't matter if Snap-On themselves did the test and had the results came out like this. Some people absolutely will never accept that any asian country is capable of wiping its own ***, let alone producing even a moderately acceptable tool.

I am not really trying to start a debate that the Chinese Craftsman stuff is better, just that I think the OP did a fair test with no ax to grind and the results just put some peoples perceived bias off center.

The lack of pictures does not help for those that cannot grasp or conceptualize in their brain what he did and the results he conveyed by text. At a minimum, a picture of the broken extensions would alleviate some of that concern.

To put in context though, 195 ft lbs is still respectable for a 3/8" extension and never something I would remotely go to in that drive size and would bump to the 1/2" drive for those torque values.

 

[monomach]

I am not really trying to start a debate that the Chinese Craftsman stuff is better, just that I think the OP did a fair test with no ax to grind and the results just put some peoples perceived bias off center.

The lack of pictures does not help for those that cannot grasp or conceptualize in their brain what he did and the results he conveyed by text. At a minimum, a picture of the broken extensions would alleviate some of that concern.

To put in context though, 195 ft lbs is still respectable for a 3/8" extension and never something I would remotely go to in that drive size and would bump to the 1/2" drive for those torque values.

I don't think anyone's going to claim that the Chinese C-Man (or even the US) is better than Snap-On. Just that it's at least "ok" and not pot metal that folds in half every time you touch it the way a lot of people on GJ pretend it is.

 

[woody 73]

I am not surprised by the test, because back in the day before some of the GJ members were born you indeed had Chinese pot metal. Today things are different there are some very well made Chinese and Taiwan tools out there.

I realize that a pro wants a tool that will keep on going 24/7 and they stay away from overseas tools, while others buy what they can afford without going into debt for the rest of their life.

Funny thing but about two months ago at a garage sale I bought a small tool box with tools for $15.00 dollars and one of the tools was a K mart special 3/8 ratchet from Taiwan. That sucker is so nice to use; in the past I would have never given it a second look, but I thought what the heck try it out and now I like it very much.

So good work on the op's part

 

[Wakefield]

Was the extension that dissappointed older/more used than the other?
I think my old Craftsman stuff strong except for the ones obviously not made well like some wrenches broached offcenter but don't trust the newer ones as much.
Did the extensions bend like butter or like a spring before breaking? Would be easier to tell with a long extension. Butter-bends/twists and stays that way if you let off the torque before it goes bust-Spring-it twists itself back straignt when you let off

 

[krdiesel03]

I was not watching close when they broke, Standing back a few feet. I heard a SNAP and then the machine stopped. It was me just screwing around not a scientific test. Next time I will take photos.

 

[TheGrooveking]

In regards to an of these snapping and at what torque I am more concern in mnowing what the standards lost as required strength, from there is what would determine which brand is was meeting the specs. Another point of interest would be size and weight, if the Snap On had a smaller diameter cross section at its center length point thus it broke at a torque proportional to the Craftsman.

TheGrooveking

 

[nicksnothereman]

Was board today and thought I would stress test some 3/8 extensions. I have access to a torque wrench that will go to 5000FP. It will also tell you what torque a fastener failed at. I put in a 6 inch MUSA extension and it broke at 230, the china one went to 290. thought it was strange so I tried a snap on, it snapped at 195.

Now I need to go collecting some more extensions and see if it is repeatable.

Dude, you're going to get banned on here saying stuff like this.

 

[nicksnothereman]

I don't think anyone's going to claim that the Chinese C-Man (or even the US) is better than Snap-On. Just that it's at least "ok" and not pot metal that folds in half every time you touch it the way a lot of people on GJ pretend it is.

I will make that claim!

(I'm just joking, don't send the snap on truck after me)

Still...um...that's 95 foot pounds difference. That ain't minor bro. Less china is good more snap on needs to up their game. Flame shield on!

 

[cburnscrx]

I was not watching close when they broke, Standing back a few feet. I heard a SNAP and then the machine stopped. It was me just screwing around not a scientific test. Next time I will take photos.

I would just like to thank you for doing the test. I think it was interesting, and while I am not a fan of Craftsman moving to China, I am not surprised to hear they are decent tools.

 

[sberry]

It doesn't surprise me, as someone said, you don't know about pre existing stress and duty cycles though. China has some of the most modern steel mills, lots of older USA was built from old mills with marginal QC.

I know this, 40 pc 5$ socket sets were junk but there are a lot of extensions from those floating around still in service.

 

[Gert]

Thank you for testing and posting the results
Please keep us updated on further tests

 

[bobcatdan]

Extensions are one thing I never got too excited about. You are doing something wrong if you are applying over 100 ft lbs to a 3/8 extension. About the only issue I ever had was a 24" import extension that had noticeable torque loss. Bought an SO, problem solved.

 

[sberry]

I have a couple maybe 3 or 4 long cmans, one is great great and one bottlenecks to a spindly thing.

 

[TAMPAGT07]

Me thinks had the Chinese Craftsman extension came out on bottom in the test and Snap On on top, people would not be so critical and making a hullabaloo about the testing procedure.

I've never made a hullabaloo...How would I go about making one? Any special tools neeed? Just kidding (As usual.)

 

[Hiball]

It would be awesome if someone had the capabilities/experience/time to scribe a straight line on the extension, and then video the test. I would like to see how much twist is involved at the above torque levels. I suspect the tools breaking point (Especially at the levels given by the OP) isn't near as important as figuring out how much torque is Lost/Applied to the fastener because of the Twist.

Thanks for the Results OP, But we got to have some sort of Pictues.. Or? It didn't happen.. Ha.

 

[Steevo]

You really need video, preferably high-frame-rate, not photos, that way you can have it running, aimed closely at just the extension, and by slowing down the playback you can see where it flexed, twisted, fractured, etc.

 

[TAMPAGT07]

You really need video, preferably high-frame-rate, not photos, that way you can have it running, aimed closely at just the extension, and by slowing down the playback you can see where it flexed, twisted, fractured, etc.

Kinda like in a ***** flick.......