Inverter generator decision

[finn]

One thing many people do not know is that many (most ? all?) inverter generators can run "paralleled", so two 2000W generators make 4000W. Why ? some of us old farts can't hoist a 3000W or 4000W generator into the back of a pickup ! Also, even though inverter generators throttle down, if you only have a 1000W load, only run ONE !

Exactly why I bought two 2000 w Champion inverters.

I can wrestle them into the front compartment of the fifth wheel alone, and only use one if there is no need for air conditioning. A single, larger inverter would be relegated to living in the truck bed for the duration of a camping trip.

Downside is that I cannot run my 240v well pump in a power outage.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Downside is that I cannot run my 240v well pump in a power outage.

Buy a used 3-4kVA 240V/120V and just wire it backward !

 

[Falcon67]

It’s a logarithmic scale.

62 is a LOT quieter than 68.

58 is pretty impressive too, though, but so is the cost premium.

The other thing the EU has done is cut our fuel consumption by no less than half. When you're talking about being on the genny for 80~100 hours straight at a 3 day race, that's a big deal.

 

[finn]

I bought an open frame 3750 /4100 watt generator from Menards for $187 last year on black Friday. It has a 240 v plug and runs the well just fine during power outages.

Only had one. Three hour outage since I wired in the transfer panel, so I guess it was a good investment.....

Buy a used 3-4kVA 240V/120V and just wire it backward !

 

[Perrorojo]

You'll need at least 3k watts to start an RV A/C. Dometic, Suburban, Atwood etc all are going to draw 15a AC when warm and will need 22-40 to start when hot. You can get a Magnum Hybrid inverter that will load assist and pair it with a 2k generator but then you have no room for other loads. Most RV's use a 4k or 5.5k Onan and they are rated for 33 and 44 amps respectively.

The Honda/Yamaha units are fantastic. Most of the others are made by Generac in china and they don't have the surge capacity you want.

Unless you go big you'll want a soft start kit (capacitor)

 

[Falcon67]

Our 2017 15K Dometic pulls 13 A when running on full tilt in 90F+ weather. Pretty good. The old Coleman 13.5K on the old 24' trailer pulled 20A in same weather.

 

[theoldwizard1]

You'll need at least 3k watts to start an RV A/C.
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.
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Unless you go big you'll want a soft start kit (capacitor)

There are a lot of people out there who would disagree with you, ESPECIALLY if you have a GOOD Soft Start kit !

 

[Perrorojo]

There are a lot of people out there who would disagree with you, ESPECIALLY if you have a GOOD Soft Start kit !

As a guy with 18yrs in the RV industry servicing/selling/teaching energy management systems, solar, lithium hybrid systems and inverters from 400w modified sine to 3k hybrid pure sine inverters and 6.2 - 40kw Lithium systems to the OEM's, I'll argue against air conditioners on marginal inverters all day.

If you don't have a soft start, you'll burn anything under 2800w fairly quick. I routinely see 3500-4000w of surge when an A/C starts. It may be for a few milliseconds but a 2500w high frequency inverter will not have the surge capacity to sustain repeated 20+ amp starts.

None of it matters without a decent battery bank. Newmar ran (16) group 31 batteries and dual 2800w inverters just to be able to run a single 15k penguin air for 4 hours. One inverter for the A/C and the other for microwave, fridge, kitchen GFCI and TV.

As a retail, the OP can do whatever he wants. I'm stating my opinion based on my experience.





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[checkthisout]

As a guy with 18yrs in the RV industry servicing/selling/teaching energy management systems, solar, lithium hybrid systems and inverters from 400w modified sine to 3k hybrid pure sine inverters and 6.2 - 40kw Lithium systems to the OEM's, I'll argue against air conditioners on marginal inverters all day.

If you don't have a soft start, you'll burn anything under 2800w fairly quick. I routinely see 3500-4000w of surge when an A/C starts. It may be for a few milliseconds but a 2500w high frequency inverter will not have the surge capacity to sustain repeated 20+ amp starts.

None of it matters without a decent battery bank. Newmar ran (16) group 31 batteries and dual 2800w inverters just to be able to run a single 15k penguin air for 4 hours. One inverter for the A/C and the other for microwave, fridge, kitchen GFCI and TV.

As a retail, the OP can do whatever he wants. I'm stating my opinion based on my experience.





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Thread is about inverter GENERATORS not inverters hooked to battery banks.

 

[Bretny]

As a guy with 18yrs in the RV industry servicing/selling/teaching energy management systems, solar, lithium hybrid systems and inverters from 400w modified sine to 3k hybrid pure sine inverters and 6.2 - 40kw Lithium systems to the OEM's, I'll argue against air conditioners on marginal inverters all day.

If you don't have a soft start, you'll burn anything under 2800w fairly quick. I routinely see 3500-4000w of surge when an A/C starts. It may be for a few milliseconds but a 2500w high frequency inverter will not have the surge capacity to sustain repeated 20+ amp starts.

None of it matters without a decent battery bank. Newmar ran (16) group 31 batteries and dual 2800w inverters just to be able to run a single 15k penguin air for 4 hours. One inverter for the A/C and the other for microwave, fridge, kitchen GFCI and TV.

As a retail, the OP can do whatever he wants. I'm stating my opinion based on my experience.





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That sounds like a really really expensive way to "save" a few bucks by buying to small of a generator.

 

[Perrorojo]

Thread is about inverter GENERATORS not inverters hooked to battery banks.

I understand. But, watts are watts and less than 3k is going to struggle without a soft start. The generator (combustion engine) can lose rpm during surge (A/C start). As rpm drops, so does voltage. The voltage sag increases amps.

Let's say you have an RV with a 13.5 A/C and an Onan microlite 2.8 generator. When you flip the A/C on the fan will start and draw about 2 amps, 15 seconds later the compressor will start and you'll hear the generator bog and rev. That bog causes a sag in voltage. Most modern generators have some sort of AC overload protection and if the load needs too many amps it will trip. If it fights through that surge it should keep the air conditioner running. As that A/C gets warm that initial surge will be to much to overcome and the air conditioner will short cycle until the generator gives up.

That's why they won't sign off on the above setup without load assist or soft start and why they don't allow two air conditioners on a 30 amp generator without energy management.

Batteries and fuel are both a form of energy storage.

Sorry, I'll stop highjacking.

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[Perrorojo]

That sounds like a really really expensive way to "save" a few bucks by buying to small of a generator.

I'd say it's cheaper to buy a big generator than to buy a small one twice.

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[Falcon67]

Our 2017 15K Dometic pulls 13 A when running on full tilt in 90F+ weather. Pretty good. The old Coleman 13.5K on the old 24' trailer pulled 20A in same weather.

I'll add that our old 3500/4000 non-inverter Champion had no issue starting the old 13.5K AC unit. That was a nice little generator, worked it's *** off.

 

[Showkey]

^^^^^^^^^^^[
When they put the “WEN” and “Westinghouse” ( and other clone names) at the top of any list you know it’s click bait or paid ad/reviews.

The work “trusted“ in the link name is also tell tale...........all the price checks lead back to Amazon....what a surprise!!!!!!

 

[mike93lx]

^^^^^^^^^^^[
When they put the “WEN” and “Westinghouse” ( and other clone names) at the top of any list you know it’s click bait or paid ad/reviews.

The work “trusted“ in the link name is also tell tale...........all the price checks lead back to Amazon....what a surprise!!!!!!

Just report spam and ignore it. That's what I did this morning and the post is already gone

 

[dcg9381]

My main use is RV too. I replaced my non-inverter champion 3500 with an open framed inverter champion, 3659/4500. Largely to get the dual fuel and cleaner inverter power. They're about $500. Another advantage is you can link 2 of them together, so I replaced a larger generator with two.

What I didn't know is that they are not 240V capable when linked... They can do near 50A of 120V.

They can idle down at low power use settings, but are about as loud as the regular open framed generators of the same size under normal load.


I add the wheel kits to mine and they are fine... A larger generator - they get really loud fast and are really hard to transport.

 

[mx500]

I bought the 2000 watt honda inverter specifically for camper A/C. $1000. holy cow is it quiet and it starts first pull. One of those purchases that your not too excited about until you have it.

 

[theoldwizard1]

My main use is RV too. I replaced my non-inverter champion 3500 with an open framed inverter champion, 3659/4500. Largely to get the dual fuel and cleaner inverter power. They're about $500. Another advantage is you can link 2 of them together, so I replaced a larger generator with two.

What I didn't know is that they are not 240V capable when linked... They can do near 50A of 120V.

With careful load management, the average US household can get by with 3000W (peak) @ 120V generator. The big problem usually is a 240V well pump. Hard to live without water.

 

[Denwood]

So I just finished some testing with a new Champion 2000/1600 Inverter, vs a larger 3000/4000 generator. The 2000/1600 (120V only) powered up everything we would run in a power outage in the house, including:

1. A newer high efficiency furnace with ECM motor (running in heat mode)
2. My office workstation with 32" monitors x 2.
3. Our main entertainment unit with 65" LCD panel, satellite etc.
4. Most house lights (all LED)
5. All the automation hubs (x3) wifi access points, router etc.
6. One small fridge.

Obviously no 220V, but we have an inductive hot plate (120v) that would be used if power outages went longer.

The smaller inverter ran at about 75% with all of the above running during my test, showing a 7 1/2 hour runtime with 1 gallon of fuel. It's also about half the running noise volume of the 4000/3000 Champion generator.

The larger generator causes issues with UPS units constantly cycling (until drained), and would not run the newer Lennox furnace either. Conversely, no UPS cycling with the Inverter/generator.