Is there really any difference in engine oils?

[kelpaso1]

In comparing between say Canadian Tires house brand 10W30 (14.99/gal) and say Castrol GTX 10/30 (25.99/gal). I personally don't think so and have no proof to back that up but was just wondering.

 

[JJThrasher]

You need to look at the oil service rating along with the weight. You're engine manufacturer will also have an oil spec you can look up and verify your oil of choice meets their spec.

In short it doesn't really matter..

Long story though there is a difference. Additive packages, oil bases, and composition are all different brand to brand.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Huge difference between best oils and the worst, ...

I disagree. Viscosity is viscosity and is tested by them same method throughout the North American market.

In the US, most oil is also tested to the American Petroleum Institution (API) standards. One set of standardized test for spark ignited engines, another set for compression (diesel) ignited engine.

If 2 different oils pass the same tests, they are fairly similar.

 

[Ole Slewfoot]

The primary reason engines are lasting 250,000 miles today instead of 100,000 is the availability and use of better oils.

Id give closed loop engine management more cred than oils....

 

[jd_1138]

If it meets the API grade/weight that the owner's manual says to use, it should be fine as long as you don't try to go too long between changes. These 10k intervals are nuts. I go 5k tops between changes and use semi synthetic. Sure with synthetic you can go longer, but I still wouldn't wait until 10k unless it was easy highway miles.

I'd avoid the dollar store branded oil and **** like that. I usually get Amsoil, Castrol GTX, Napa premium.

 

[csp]

API standards are like building code. You can meet minimum code or exceed it. Exceeding it costs money.

 

[exmaxima1]

If it meets the API grade/weight that the owner's manual says to use, it should be fine as long as you don't try to go too long between changes. These 10k intervals are nuts. I go 5k tops between changes and use semi synthetic. Sure with synthetic you can go longer, but I still wouldn't wait until 10k unless it was easy highway miles.

The manual on my Toyota Venza says you can double the recommended interval if you use synthetic. That tells me that synthetic lasts much longer than conventional dinosaur juice, and has twice the additive package. Nothing nutty about that, it's better oil.

 

[Farmall450]

Depends on the house brand. ie Farm & Fleet's is Citgo...same as their branded stuff. I'm not sure what a MSDS would tell you but I don't think you can justify the price when likely the performance/lasting life isn't there. I do feel it's worth OEM or better yet Napa Gold (wix) filters, more so than the flavor of oil you put in.

 

[sberry]

Oil got super good after about 2000 or so and now is way better than when any older engines were designed. I have 2 or 3 older cars on the 25K plan with house brand dino and a silver filter. The engines made before 2000 and worn out when I got them and still put 50K on, still runs the same as when I got it. I actually felt sorry for one and gave it new juice.

 

[sberry]

My wifes van has near 100 on it and about 3 oil changes, couple sets of brake pads and rotors since last oil. Bought it with 100 on it and put a belt tensioner on and a belt in 100 more, never looked at a plug.

 

[sberry]

I hate changing oil, I hate tune up work to my own stuff. Taking maint demands out of cars and equipment is the best thing ever happen to it. We did some samples on old engines and with a little make up oil dam near never got to change it, I got 3 diesels I have been meaning to change for a year.
1 I use all weather, 2 I use dino 15/40 and just scored 20 gallons for 8 a gallon. The all weather is really only occasionally but 5/40 really helps starting.

 

[bobcatdan]

As long as oil meets the current API rating, it's fine. After that you are paying for the name. Keep the oil level correct and change regularly, you will never have oil caused failures. As for synthetic oil, I only use it when called for. If factory fill is dino oil, that's what I'm putting in.

 

[bczygan]

Cheapest oil I can find.

How about the re-refined stuff?

 

[gungatim]

yes there is a difference. it is the additive pkg. there was a pretty big study done by a couple pretty credible sources documenting the amounts of zinc and detergents on hundreds of different brands, from cheap house brands to expensive brands with a cult following.

do some reading on bobistheoilguy website and search for 540 Rat's testing data...

 

[ovrrdrive]

Id give closed loop engine management more cred than oils....

That and tighter machine tolerances and better designs. I wouldn't give the oil brand much credit at all these days.

Look at it this way, Canadian Tire isn't making their own oil anymore than Walmart or Pep Boys is. Who do you think is making the stuff? (To the OP)

 

[SALIV8]

There is a difference.

I would never run house brand oil in my race car, nor would my engine builder recommend it. and i have personally seen differences between oils and engine wear during my time.

Daily drivers, if they spec to the oil standard that the manufacturer recommends, then thats all i care about.

good oil filters also are important, and they are different too.

 

[elba]

I have used Castrol Oil in my 2006 Corolla and it has 360,000 on it . It doesn't use any oil between 5000 mile oil changes . By the way , the only parts I have changed on the engine are the plugs and serpentine belt .

 

[Showkey]

Another oil thread.....aq

If you have diesel witha DPF low ash oil might be required to avoid fouling the DPF. Not all diesel oils are DPF rated. A DPF can cost $1000-$3000 if it becomes fouled.

So........yes not all oils are the same ........

 

[kelpaso1]

Look at it this way, Canadian Tire isn't making their own oil anymore than Walmart or Pep Boys is. Who do you think is making the stuff? (To the OP)

That's what I was wondering.

 

[doubleot]

Absolutely no difference. I've been told by multiple engine builders the only thing they recommend is a normal interval of oil changes. New filter and oil every 3k miles for conventional oil 5k miles for full synthetics. Use whatever weight your manufacturer specified and keep up on maintence. I've been following this for years and never had an issue with a motor. Do as you will. In my race car that sits more often than not, I change it every 3 months regardless of mileage, which is usually less than 2k miles.

 

[zak77]

My suggestion is to check out Blackstone Labs website for info on oils. I've been getting their newsletters for years and it's been an eye opener. These guys test oils for their business and i'm pretty sure they know what they're talking about. Do your own research and make your decisions based on reliable, accurate information.

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

 

[Smoker]

Depends what engine its going in. High revving or turbocharged it needs a better quality synthetic oil that performs in those environments - if its going in Uncle Joe's 78 Ford... cheapest oil on the shelf.... Castrol and the like don't spend $$$ on R&D just because they feel like it.

 

[SALIV8]

Absolutely no difference. I've been told by multiple engine builders the only thing they recommend is a normal interval of oil changes. New filter and oil every 3k miles for conventional oil 5k miles for full synthetics. Use whatever weight your manufacturer specified and keep up on maintence. I've been following this for years and never had an issue with a motor. Do as you will. In my race car that sits more often than not, I change it every 3 months regardless of mileage, which is usually less than 2k miles.

you have a race car that you only change the oil every 2k miles?

I think our definitions of race cars and high performance engines are vastly different.
I dont even have an odometer in my race car but i change the oil after a day at the track, even if it only sees 4 or 5 passes..

 

[doubleot]

you have a race car that you only change the oil every 2k miles?

I think our definitions of race cars and high performance engines are vastly different.
I dont even have an odometer in my race car but i change the oil after a day at the track, even if it only sees 4 or 5 passes..

Its more of a weekend warrior race car not a track queen.

 

[SALIV8]

Its more of a weekend warrior race car not a track queen.

is it a high performance engine? have you seen the bearings on a rebuild?

 

[doubleot]

is it a high performance engine? have you seen the bearings on a rebuild?

4cyl turbo, I rebuilt the motor less than 1000 miles ago, everything looks like new still, I followed a pretty good break in oil schedule.

 

[Outlander]

Canadian Tire gets products from supplier du jour, whoever they strike up a suitable long term contract with. Right or wrong, I feel better with name brands even if they are the same. Probably no reason other than fear.

I did some research on Can-Am products via ATV forums and they were able to track down some suppliers via data sheets. Expensive ($18/tube) BRP grease was made by a local Canadian company. Not sure if they sold exactly that elsewhere but in my mind a huge place like Can Tire needs a multi-year contract with reasonable quality oils as that is probably what they use in the shops as well as off the shelf.

 

[Kevin54]

It used to be that back in the day, they always said that if you use one brand of oil, stick with that particular brand to prevent buildup of deposits, or sludge in your engine. IIRC, and this was back in the 70's, there were your paraffin based oils, and your mineral based, or crude based oils. Mixing the mineral based oils, and the paraffin based oils would create the waxy, sludgy buildup. Again, IIRC, Pennzoil, Quaker State, and I think Havoline were supposedly paraffin based. Texaco, Sunoco, Valvoline, were supposedly mineral based oils. Again, I'm trying to remember what was explained to me 45 years ago.

Today, I don't think there is that worry as refinement of oils have changed quite a bit. But you still want to stay brand specific as there will be some differences in the oils unless you know who makes what oils. A ot of people used to swear by Pennzoil, then all of a sudden Pennzoil became the junk oil. Why I have no idea. But if you are one that likes Pennzoil, then stay with Pennzoil in the rating that the car manufacturers want the engine to be ran in. I think most today is either 5W-30 or 10W-30.

And if you run synthetic oil, then stick with synthetic oil, and don't switch between, or mix the two types of oil....meaning your standard oil and your synthetic based oil.

 

[SALIV8]

4cyl turbo, I rebuilt the motor less than 1000 miles ago, everything looks like new still, I followed a pretty good break in oil schedule.

does it have much hp? 4 cyl turbos can be nasty, but I would assume yours is more milder than what im thinking. how much psi do you spool? is it a stock bottom end?

im surprised you dont like to use a quality top of the line oil that at least has the additives needed to help with wear.

edit- also with a turbo that is oil fed i would think there would be a significant advantage to using high quality oils with additive packages. the last thing you need is to have a turbo contaminating the oil the engine sees.

 

[kelpaso1]

My suggestion is to check out Blackstone Labs website for info on oils. I've been getting their newsletters for years and it's been an eye opener. These guys test oils for their business and i'm pretty sure they know what they're talking about. Do your own research and make your decisions based on reliable, accurate information.

http://www.blackstone-labs.com/

Interesting reading on that site. Here is a snippet from that site on "Which oil should I use"

"Managers and analysts at Blackstone Laboratories often do presentations regarding the fascinating world of oil analysis. Regardless of the immediate topic, the most common question we hear is, "What type of oil should I use in my car?"

Because we're an independent laboratory, we don't recommend any specific oil brands. We always recommend using an oil grade recommended for your engine by the manufacturer and a brand that fits your budget.

You can go into any mass retailer (Wal-Mart, K-Mart, Meijer, etc.) that sells engine oil and buy a 5W/30 (or any other preferred grade) that will perform well in your engine. One of the best-kept secrets of the oil industry is that these store brands are actually the same, quality oils that are produced by the major oil companies. The only difference between these products and the major company brands is the name on the container and about 50¢ a quart."

Guess that answers my question.

 

[doubleot]

does it have much hp? 4 cyl turbos can be nasty, but I would assume yours is more milder than what im thinking. how much psi do you spool? is it a stock bottom end?

im surprised you dont like to use a quality top of the line oil that at least has the additives needed to help with wear.

edit- also with a turbo that is oil fed i would think there would be a significant advantage to using high quality oils with additive packages. the last thing you need is to have a turbo contaminating the oil the engine sees.

I use a full synthetic in it, Valvoline to be specific, for the conventional I was meaning more towards daily drivers and normal cars, I'm setting up speed density and getting setup throw in my larger walbro and injectors in then I'll turn the boost up around 22psi reliably. I wanted to build this one to enjoy on the weekends and drive it at the track one in a while. My current setup should be good for around 350whp, future setup I'm wanting a 6262 top mount and am going to shoot for 550whp reliably on pump gas. I could have jumped the gun when I said race car, that wasn't what I wanted with this car from the beginning just something to put around in and break some hearts

 

[Trey T]

...

Today, I don't think there is that worry as refinement of oils have changed quite a bit. But you still want to stay brand specific as there will be some differences in the oils unless you know who makes what oils. A ot of people used to swear by Pennzoil, then all of a sudden Pennzoil became the junk oil. Why I have no idea. But if you are one that likes Pennzoil, then stay with Pennzoil in the rating that the car manufacturers want the engine to be ran in. I think most today is either 5W-30 or 10W-30.

And if you run synthetic oil, then stick with synthetic oil, and don't switch between, or mix the two types of oil....meaning your standard oil and your synthetic based oil.

It could be said about Mobil 1 in the early 90s, but opposite. My uncle, a mechanic, told me stick with Pennzoil or Castrol bc they're better.

20yrs later, Mobil 1 is the cream of the crop. Why? I have no idea ... I stopped trying to figure out ....

I usually find what's cheapest synthetic, Pennzoil, Castrol, or Mobil 1. There have been more deals lately w/ Mobil 1 so I have been using those.

 

[SALIV8]

I use a full synthetic in it, Valvoline to be specific, for the conventional I was meaning more towards daily drivers and normal cars, I'm setting up speed density and getting setup throw in my larger walbro and injectors in then I'll turn the boost up around 22psi reliably. I wanted to build this one to enjoy on the weekends and drive it at the track one in a while. My current setup should be good for around 350whp, future setup I'm wanting a 6262 top mount and am going to shoot for 550whp reliably on pump gas. I could have jumped the gun when I said race car, that wasn't what I wanted with this car from the beginning just something to put around in and break some hearts

sounds nice to me that will get going around town. I have a dedicated high hp all motor race engine and I only use brad penn with the extra zinc additives or zdpp- not sure what the formula is now. I have used mobil 1 on a milder setup that i was happy with, with another foxbody. If it works for you, then thumbs up. I would assume using a quality synthetic with a quality filteris helping your program, as opposed to some lower brand dinoasaur oil, though.

 

[claymont]

Having been a line mechanic in a lubes manufacturing facility, the only difference in motor oils of same weight, is the labeling on the bottles. The $.39/qt going to a drug store or supermarket compared to the $2.50/qt STP or CAM2 all came out of the same tank. The only engine oil that had different a additive package was Harley Davidson. This facility bottled for dozens and dozens of brands even other refineries.

 

[Brick_Smart]

There ARE significant differences between engine oils and those differences do matter. As others have mentioned above there are two basics components in every engine oil; the base stock, and the additive package. The base stock is the what differentiates conventional oils from the synthetics, while the additive package tweaks the characteristics of the base stock.

Conventional oils are refined from petroleum and can be refined to several tiers (Group I-III+), in general the higher tiers are more refined and offer superior characteristics. Synthetic base stocks are not derived from petroleum, hence their name. In general there are two types of synthetic oils PAO (Polyalphaolefin) and ester based. The ester base stocks have some compatibility issues with the additive packages used for PAO and conventional oil, so most synthetics are PAO based due to the cost of developing separate additive packages.

What really matters to the end-user is performance. The Group III+ conventional oils are generally very good and far better than engine oils of the past; however, the synthetic oils are even better. Significantly higher viscosity indexes (VI) mean that the viscosity stays within a smaller window between cold and hot operation (one of the reasons 0w-20 oils are now feasible). The synthetics are more stable resulting in less sludge buildup with extended operation. The synthetics can also be produced to have a greater pH buffer, increasing the operational time before the oil becomes acidic due to combustion blow-by and other sources. (Acidity is a major cause of wear in bearings).

TL;DR
There are major differences
Modern Group III+ conventional oils are far better than predecessors
Group IV (PAO) and V (Ester) offer additional benefits
Change your oil with something other than beer (drink the beer instead!) at a frequency close to the OEM recommendations and you'll be fine

 

[zendriver]

Lol There's a huge difference – $11 a gallon.

Engines and last longer today not because of the oil, but because their machined to much tighter tolerances, The materials are lighter and better. Oil where is the engine when it gets dirty which is caused primarily by engine blowback that is reduced because of today's technologies.

The oil change frequency of my 2015 Volvo work truck s determined by or oil analysis now 50,000 miles. My old Volvo at 900,000 miles and didn't use a drop of oil

dS 96 Ranger four banger is probably have your oil changed three times in the last hundred thousand miles. It started right up after sitting for six months is never used to drop of oil.

If racing team swear by a certain brand of oil maybe that's because they're writing them a nice big fat check, no doubt some of it that $11 a gallon


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[zendriver]

Back in the day, when Quaker State was a nickel a quart more than Kmart, saying "what the hey, I only want the best" was pretty easy.

Now the difference is real money, and looking around at how many vehicles we have, power equipment etc, obsessing over expensive oil changes, just seems like a fruitless waste of time and money.

Has a truck driver, I see thousands of vehicles every day, and rarely ever see dreaded "blue smoke". I if I do so to sum it might be from overheating.

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[stang2007]

For Regular Conventional oil. the only Difference would be the additive package, Weather or not that is worth the extra $$ is another Ford vs Chevy, 1911 VS Glock ETC....

 

[zendriver]

I find it very interesting, that when crude oil prices skyrocketed so did the price of motor and interestingly enough synthetic motor oil.

Now that crude oil prices are in the dumper motor oil prices of stayed right up there with the top,maybe even higher.


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[nh_yota]

Oh boy here we go again....the never-ending argument over engine oil is just like the never-ending arguments over Ford vs. Chevy, Pepsi vs. Coke, and Ketchup vs. Catsup.

Unless you're running high performance engines designed for specific formulations of oil and running at high temperatures, you're fine with any name brand or store brand oil as long as it meets the specification in your owner's manual. As long as you get an oil that meets the proper specification - and you change it REGULARLY - you will be fine.

Editor's Note: There have been stories in the news about dollar stores selling no-name oils labeled as 10W30 etc. that do not meet any modern specifications for engine oil. That's why you should always look on the back of the bottle to verify that an oil meets the specification your car requires, even if it's the same viscosity.