Lam-Beam Removal Y/N?

[rslaback]

Here is a quick Autocad sketch of what you have. The X denotes end grain. The red is your beam, the green is a 2x2 ledger and the white is your floor joists. There is no way to move this beam up as it is already flush with the upstairs floor. At most you could look into a built up beam (site built glued beam of 2x and plywood) or you may find a steel to fit.

However, I doubt you are going to be able to find a beam that will span your distance and carry the upstairs load that is any shorter than what you already have. A built up usually requires a post about every 10 feet and a steel about every 14. Finding a beam that will clear span your garage that will be shorter than what you have doesn't look likely.

 

[dlenkewich]

Perhaps the easiest thing to do would be to find an good chair with castors so you can sit under the car comfortably rather then stand, like a computer chair , that can lean back.

 

[The Boss]

He's just bluntly stating you can't cut into it because you'd be compromising it - answering a question no one asked.

I was just anticipating the next question....


Get one of these.

 

[scratchedup]

I really appreciate the input and help here.

Yes sadly I have these.

 

[scratchedup]

Here is a quick Autocad sketch of what you have. The X denotes end grain. The red is your beam, the green is a 2x2 ledger and the white is your floor joists. There is no way to move this beam up as it is already flush with the upstairs floor. At most you could look into a built up beam (site built glued beam of 2x and plywood) or you may find a steel to fit.

However, I doubt you are going to be able to find a beam that will span your distance and carry the upstairs load that is any shorter than what you already have. A built up usually requires a post about every 10 feet and a steel about every 14. Finding a beam that will clear span your garage that will be shorter than what you have doesn't look likely.

I'm still dreamin....

What dimension of steel could be used to replace this? Stuff on Crgslist pops up all the time in my area.

 

[bczygan]

OK,
Let's look at this. The limiting factors are the top of the beam, which is the bottom of the floor above, and the ceiling, which is the bottom of the joists plus drywall below them.

You want to reduce the depth of the existing beam so it doesn't hang below the ceiling.

There are two approaches to this.
One is to reinforce and rework the beam so that even with the bottom portion removed, it is adequate to support the loads.
The second method would be to replace the beam with a shallower depth beam that will support the loads. You would have to do some calculations to see what beam would do this. It might end up engineered wood or it might have to be steel. Or it might be a combination.

A third option would be to cut the span of the joists that are supported by the beam, thus reducing the load on the beam and allowing you to reduce it's depth. You do this by installing 2 new beams parallel to the existing beam, but at the midpoints of the span of the joists on either side of the existing beam. These can probably be engineered wood the depth of the available space. Again calculations need to be done for the existing as well as new beams.

Understand what I am saying?

 

[scratchedup]

OK,
Let's look at this. The limiting factors are the top of the beam, which is the bottom of the floor above, and the ceiling, which is the bottom of the joists plus drywall below them.

You want to reduce the depth of the existing beam so it doesn't hang below the ceiling.

There are two approaches to this.
One is to reinforce and rework the beam so that even with the bottom portion removed, it is adequate to support the loads.
The second method would be to replace the beam with a shallower depth beam that will support the loads. You would have to do some calculations to see what beam would do this. It might end up engineered wood or it might have to be steel. Or it might be a combination.

A third option would be to cut the span of the joists that are supported by the beam, thus reducing the load on the beam and allowing you to reduce it's depth. You do this by installing 2 new beams parallel to the existing beam, but at the midpoints of the span of the joists on either side of the existing beam. These can probably be engineered wood the depth of the available space. Again calculations need to be done for the existing as well as new beams.

Understand what I am saying?

yes ...keep talking....

 

[bczygan]

yes ...keep talking....

Well, that's about it. We haven't talked much about any point loads from bearing walls above or if the new beams have places in the walls for support. Where are your door openings? But the person doing the calculations for you can check all that. You may need stronger headers if beams fall above them.

The choice is made by getting someone to size (Engineer) the different options and price the materials and compare how much work each would be.

Redoing or replacing the existing beam will involve opening up one part of the ceiling and supporting the floor above on each side with temporary walls. Adding two additional beams will involve doing that in three places but you can do them one at a time and reuse locations of the support walls. In other words, do the existing beam first, with temporary walls on each side, then move one temporary wall to the other side to do the new beam on that side, then move them both to the other side to do the third one.

Decide if you will do the work or contract it. Then the decision makes itself based on money and trouble.

Just a footnote. If you just cut off the bottom few inches of that existing laminated beam it probably wouldn't fail, or even deflect (Sag) a whole lot more. You do know that all beams deflect, right? Even steel. But the additional deflection might cause cracks in the drywall, especially over time, and if any live load (People and stuff) was put in that room above. Residential structures are overbuilt to the point that flexing and cracks in drywall won't happen as easily. Deflections are kept to a lesser amount for framing that is covered in drywall. And you can do calculations to see of a shallower beam will support a particular load with different deflection amounts. Typical are 1/180 or 1/240 or 1/360th of span. 1 360th of a 10 foot span would be 1/3 of an inch. Beams are built with a camber built in to compensate for part of these deflections.

But these things are covered by standards so everyone knows what to expect. You can expect floors to be designed for 50#/SF LL. If you remove part of the beam and cover it up, the next guy won't know and may overload it and suffer at least a lot of cracking and a flex in the floor that doesn't feel right. So the right thing is to do it right. In fact, you are required to pull a permit to do anything structural.

My choice, and probably the least cost and trouble, if it can be done in the desired space and support the original design load, would to to rework the existing beam. Probably some combination or choice of a flitch plate beam by adding steel plates or C channels on one or both sides, or the use of additional wood beams like LVL's. Again, the calculations tell you which alternative is cheaper and easier.

Do whatever solves the problem the cheapest and easiest way.

Bill