Making the plunge, m12 vs m18

[jrlp]

Well, my Dewalt 20v setup has disappeared. It served me well. I had the non-brushless hammer drill and 1/4 hex impact.

I used the impact the most, by far. I would use square drive arbors on it, and it had enough oomph to remove lug nuts on most cars. I had developed a system to pretty much use it instead of an air ratchet. Almost all the work I do on cars, I would use the impact for.

Everything from valve cover gaskets, suspension work, lugnuts, pulling transmissions, differential work (where it flat-out excels), and interior work.

Ever since I made a nice set of jigs to plasma cut small circular holes, I haven't drilled very much since then. I do use uni-bits a bunch though.

Anyhow, I've always been a Milwaukee guy, and have had M12 before, when they first came out with their first m12 tools, getting the 3/8" drill and screwdriver set. I loved it. I still have their little m12 radio I run off an a/c adapter. It is a flat-out amazing little radio.

So, I'm at the place where I get to choose what system to go with. With the new brushless systems in tools, I'm pretty excited. I've done brushless motors in r/c cars since quite literally the very beginning. Paying way too much money for ModelTech brushless systems that were just rebadged Hacker junk lol.

Anyhow, the DeWalt 20v impact I had did 1400 in/lb of torque (117 ft/lb). The m12 brushless impact does a little less, at 1200 in/lb of torque (100 ft/lb), and probably weighs at least 1/2 pound less.

Don't get me wrong, I have air powered impacts covered, but lugging around a big impact and air hose on the inside of a nice car is not going to happen.

I've been rambling here for a while.. Guess I just want to hear stories of people who's chosen one or the other, and if they have regrets.

I want to go m12, it's lighter, cheaper, and has tons of power. But, the m18 has much more power but is heavier. I won't be drilling 1/2" or thicker steel or anything like that, I have a big 3/4" hole hawg and a big Milwaukee Mag drill as well, and a plasma, so.. I may be able to get away with the m12 drill.

 

[joedodge]

I use the m12 line in the shop daily and love it m18 is to big to me

 

[firebox40dash5]

The M12 Fuel impact is pretty damn good, but I definitely noticed the 20 ft/lb or so loss over my old 18V impact, and I suspect you would too. But, the weight and compact size (although it is a touch long) make up for it IMO. I ended up also getting the M18 Fuel impact in 3/8 square for heavier work, so the M12 pretty much gets used with a 1/4" adapter or screwdriver bits, and both impacts give me nothing to complain about. I regularly throw a 1/2" adapter on the M18 to loosen and tighten lug nuts, and I've managed to replace struts with no other tools besides a breaker bar to break the lower mount nuts loose and a wrench to hold the bolts... even used it to run the spring compressors.

Oh, and the M12 Fuel 1/2" drill hasn't failed me yet either. I bought the non-hammer variety figuring I'd want an 18V drill for times I need more power or to drill masonry. Long story short, for my uses, I kinda wish I'd bought the hammer drill, because I have yet to buy that 18V drill and I don't think I will be anytime soon.

 

[eeprete]

I have the M12 kit, I like the compactness of it. M18 is a bit beefier. Some people are known to have both. If you do a lot and also will get an array of the tools powered by the batteries I'd suggest going with the M18.

 

[eeprete]

Rereading your post... M18 all the way.

 

[jrlp]

Hmm. Well, the M12 Fuel system has a 3/8" impact that does 1,400 in/lb (117 ft/lb). Just saw that.

My main 'gripe' around the m18 is that they try to replace corded tools, so the tools are larger and heavier. I know, I had the Dewalt 20v regular impact with the largest batteries, and it was heavy. I loved it, but it was big. I have tons of 'big' equipment from my metalworking business.. including probably the heaviest MagDrill around and heaviest 3/4" and 1/2" drills.

But having big power on cordless is real nice as well. I've posted this video a few months ago, but it's the Dewalt 20v hammer drill in 1st gear pulling a 33" tire on a steel rim in 4 seconds.

I tend to use them often for that, although not nearly as fast, last thing I want to do is strip a customer's tire winch. I usually do it around 10 seconds at low throttle slowly ramping up rpm.. Beats the hell out of doing it by hand.

 

[Ign]

I want to go m12, it's lighter, cheaper, and has tons of power. But, the m18 has much more power but is heavier. I won't be drilling 1/2" or thicker steel or anything like that, I have a big 3/4" hole hawg and a big Milwaukee Mag drill as well, and a plasma, so.. I may be able to get away with the m12 drill.

You nailed it here. M18 bigger, more powerful and more expensive. Or M12 cheaper but not as powerful.

I love my M12 stuff. I really want the Fuel 2404 drill which is a hammer drill with a 1/2" chuck. First 12V drill I'm aware of that comes with a 1/2" chuck, and I have to believe Milwaukee wouldn't put it on there unless it could handle it. Plus I do need a cordless hammer drill for occasionally sinking concrete anchors. I use my M28 right now but it's HUGE.

If you ever want test/measurement equipment that's mostly in the M12 line, like temp guns, inspection cameras etc. Or the infrared if you've got $2500.

You'll love either choice and deal with the drawbacks of each. Honestly if I had to choose one I'd get rid of my M28 and M12 and go M18 for everything. It mostly falls into that "just right" category. But damn I do love the compact size and light weight of most of the M12 tools....

 

[mattdwelder]

If you go from a 20v dewalt to a 12v you will hate it. You better get the 18v.

 

[firebox40dash5]

You'll love either choice and deal with the drawbacks of each. Honestly if I had to choose one I'd get rid of my M28 and M12 and go M18 for everything. It mostly falls into that "just right" category. But damn I do love the compact size and light weight of most of the M12 tools....

I was afraid of that when I started buying M12 stuff, but the low price (even for the Fuel line, relatively) tempted me too much and I had to try it. Admittedly I did buy the 18V square impact, and I'm a mechanic and not a contractor so I'm not using the drill nearly as hard, but I've been finding that my M12 stuff does 95% of what I need to do well enough that I don't mind breaking out corded stuff (or the 18V impact) for those times they won't cut it. Though I must say, things like the M12 bandsaw and rotary hammer make me a bit, but I suppose there's people who need them.

I'm stoked to see the Fuel angle grinder and Sawzall too. Both tools left a lot to be desired when I had my Makita gear.

 

[Rezeppa]

I agree with the 18v. The 12 volt is the difference between a 1/2" fastener and a 5/16 fastener. If your doing lug nuts no chance a 12 volt will handle that. I know the length difference is much smaller than most expect as far as clearance is concerned. If your doing mainly interior work and small engine it is amazing but for all around work your much better of going with the 18. I agree you won't be happy going smaller.

 

[shiftdrift]

Ir7150 20v or their 5130 3/8

 

[mryyc]

I have both the M12 Fuel Impact and the Dewalt 20V impact, it's pretty rare I pick up the Dewalt now. Brushless is the way to go - if you have lots of big iron anyhow for bigger jobs I would go for the M12 Fuel.

 

[jrlp]

If you go from a 20v dewalt to a 12v you will hate it. You better get the 18v.

Well, regular motor 20v dewalt vs brushless m12

I've been finding that my M12 stuff does 95% of what I need to do well enough that I don't mind breaking out corded stuff (or the 18V impact) for those times they won't cut it.

That's the stuff I like to hear. Thanks!

I agree with the 18v. The 12 volt is the difference between a 1/2" fastener and a 5/16 fastener. If your doing lug nuts no chance a 12 volt will handle that. I know the length difference is much smaller than most expect as far as clearance is concerned. If your doing mainly interior work and small engine it is amazing but for all around work your much better of going with the 18. I agree you won't be happy going smaller.

Well, no. The m12 3/8" impact does ~120ft/lb. I have plenty of corded and air tools for the big stuff, it's just hard to beat using a small impact on small stuff. Zipping a valve cover off an import (and all associated ****) in less than 3 minutes is flat-out awesome. I haven't decided what exactly the initial purchase would be. I'm thinking..

M12 fuel:
the 1/2" brushless hammer drill
1/4" hex brushless impact
-MAYBE- 3/8" brushless impact
M12 power port
----VS---
M18 fuel:
1/2" brushless hammer drill
1/4" hex brushless impact
M18 Power Port

Or maybe get a mix, get the M18 impact + dual charger and m12 1/2" hammer drill. I have the M12 radio and love it to DEATH. It is the life force behind my shop Too bad the original battery died and has been running off an a/c adapter forever.

Ir7150 20v or their 5130 3/8

Well, I have the IR 2115qtimax 3/8" air impact, mg725 1/2" air impact, and a NitroCat 1600th 3/4"air impact.

But it's hard to beat the portability, size, weight, and cordless appeal of ~100ft/lb brushless m12 impacts.

I have both the M12 Fuel Impact and the Dewalt 20V impact, it's pretty rare I pick up the Dewalt now. Brushless is the way to go - if you have lots of big iron anyhow for bigger jobs I would go for the M12 Fuel.

This is exactly what I was looking for. The m12 fuel impact you have, is it the 1/4" hex or the 3/8" square drive vversion?

 

[walrus]

I love my M12 stuff but just bought M18 fuel 1/4 impact for driving screws. Love it as it has more power but you know what I like m12 as I've found as I've gotten older, the lighter the better. If I need more power out comes the 18v, I say buy both

 

[FiendFX]

m12 fuel because it's compact and light.

 

[jfcasey]

I love my m18 and wouldn't have it any other way. Its really not that big at all compared to the competitions impacts in the same power range, and its pretty easy to control the power on for smaller fasteners.

I have held the m12 and the m18 impacts side by side and they are damn near the same size from the tip of the nosecone to the back of the gun. Theres no real space saving there.

You sound a lot like my self, I use it for everything I can... from suspension and brake work all the way to interior bolts and engine work. I can bust lugs on most imports with a full battery... its really helpful for customer cars with aftermarket wheels that you don't want to use a air impact on so you dont have to worry about the speed of the gun messing up a wheel.

 

[Ign]

I originally got into M12 'cause I wanted a 1/4" hex impact driver for wood screws and sheetmetal/roofing screws. $99 for the kit, common sale price.

Then, because, it's so inexpensive I wound up with a couple more tools. Then a couple more. And so on.

I'm amazed at how much I use the M12 line in basic wrenching/mechanic'ing, fabrication and even machining. I keep the M12 3/8" drill chucked up on a 5/8" 6 flute countersink and deburr most holes that way. The 3/8" square drive impact is awesome for valve covers and under-dash work - - also WAY awesome for taking the jaws off my 3 jaw and 4 jaw lathe chucks. The ratchet is useful for all things that require a ratchet, including removing the jaws on my Kurt vise on my mill. The LED worklight is helpful for everything. I run my BIG jobsite radio on the M12 batteries, but it'll take any of the 3 voltages. I use the inspection camera to see under upper intakes, in front of the firewall, etc. The 1/4" hex impact is great for wood screws, self-drilling sheetmetal screws, or with nut drivers.

Now with the M12 LED stick light I think that fills a real need for a cordless "trouble light" (ala Bayco, etc) that doesn't have a built-in, non-serviceable, proprietary battery pack. (Nextec makes a fluorescent but only 1.5 hours run time per charge). Problem is at retail of $80 it doesn't hold to the M12-is-cheaper model.

I also agree that M12 would do 95% of what I need, and I don't mind dragging out a cord for the other 5%. I think M18 would probably do 99%, but at cost greater than an additional 4%

 

[Bustawrench]

18 volt all the way.

 

[shiftdrift]

The ir7150 has 780ft lb and is cordless.

 

[cheechi]

All the replies, all the criteria you've listed, I keep coming back to how I use my 18v & M12 tools. I have Bosch 18v but the principle is rougly the same with M18; there's going to be some situations where the 18v is overkill, or where its not enough. Find the balance.

I originally thought all these 10.8v tools were just gimmicks for homeowners or guys who didn't know. Then I got a few 12v tools that there wasn't an 18v equivalent, and expanded from there; I use my M12 drill more often probably than any of my several 18v so far this year. With the impact, it's close. Flashlights it's about even. I use my 18v sawzall & M12 Hackzall side by side (with a helper) so there's no true comparison there. You will find that it fits, or the reduced fatigue, or the greater power, will swing you one way or another but if it's going to be used 'at work' then I would get both. Kind of like sockets & wrenches, you need both for different things.

There are still things the 18v isn't enough for me and I go corded or air, but fewer seemingly than there used to be. The M12 stuff has also helped in reducing the need for hand tools as often.

 

[jrlp]

Went with the brushless m12 fuel. Bought the 1/2 hammer drill fuel m12 and fuel 1/4 hex impact. Haven't used it yet but have a giant project this weekend so I'll put it through it's pace's. i picked up the power port and the little jigsaw as well. The power port seems cool. Should be nice to have a fully charged phone without running to the truck constantly.

They feel exceptionally well made. Makes the older DeWalt 20 v stuff feel cheap.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[BBC71Nova]

I went back and forth about this as well. I ended up going with the new M18 Fuel combo even though a buddy swears by his 20v Dewalt (non brushless) setup. I haven't gotten to use it yet but upon initial inspection it is a very nice setup. My previous driver was a Dewalt 14.4v. I never really wanted the weight of the larger voltage setups since I mainly just use it around the house, working on cars, etc. This Fuel setup doesn't seem much heavier - if at all - than the 14.4v nicad setup I had.

It was somewhat of a tough call to go Milwaukee over Dewalt since there is a price difference when you compare the combo kits (driver and impact). I have loved my Milwaukee compact portaband though. Another thing that swayed me was the impact in the Dewalt combo isn't their top model with the multi-speed, battery indicator and flush chuck. Instead it is slightly less featured model presumably to keep the price down.

One thing I actually overlooked about the M18 Fuel setup prior to purchasing it was that the charger actually handles both M12 and M18 batteries. That means if I wanted to I could go purchase a "tool only" M12 tool and a matching battery and just use the charger I have. That is a nice potential benefit but it is worth mentioning that I haven't actually priced the M12 tools to know if a sans charger setup is less expensive.

Though it expired on 7/4, Home Depot, CPO Milwaukee and maybe few others were running a special with which you received an additional M18 battery with a purchase. So that also helped justify the higher price.

 

[Ign]

Went with the brushless m12 fuel. Bought the 1/2 hammer drill fuel m12 and fuel 1/4 hex impact. Haven't used it yet but have a giant project this weekend so I'll put it through it's pace's. i picked up the power port and the little jigsaw as well. The power port seems cool. Should be nice to have a fully charged phone without running to the truck constantly.

They feel exceptionally well made. Makes the older DeWalt 20 v stuff feel cheap.

Yeah, please let us know what you think of the 1/2" hammer drill. I'm sure you've seen this a million times, but performance really is more with the XC battery so that's what I'd use on that drill, esp if using twist bits in excess of 3/8".

I'd like to have the jigsaw but have never ordered it.

After a prolonged power outage last night (it's lightning season) I was reminded how freakin' awesome the LED worklight is. With just a single LED the beam is so bright & well distributed, I just pointed it at the ceiling in any room and had enough light to see relatively well. It's noticeably better than the Craftsman Nextec worklight which has 24 LEDs. Milwaukee really took the time to design a light around an LED rather than just cram multiple LEDs behind some clear plastic and call it good.

I'd also be curious if the power port charges your phone successfully, and if so, what phone(s) you charged. Amazon reviews mention lots of problems charging Iphones, and near zero possibility of more than one charge per battery.

Welcome to the M12 world

 

[jrlp]

I went ahead and through the combo's got 1 xc battery, and 2 of the 2.0AH batteries.

As far as the power port sucking and not charging properly, I've come across that before on several devices. I have a rooted/modded android phone. Most custom ROMs and kernels allow something called Fast-Charge (fcharge). It overrides the software checks that are performed to see how much current a charger can provide. So it'll **** as much power as possible, the only limiting factor being battery temperature (which is all that matters). I can pull almost 3A charging my phone, and go from 0 to 60% in 20 minutes.

Most android / IPhone chargers set the charging current several ways. One is the cable itself. IPhone and IPad cables do this. They set up a series of resistors on pins, and the phone can read this resistance. The resistance tells the I-product exactly how much current the cable or charger can provide.

If there's no resistors present, it will default to 500mA which is USB standard current capacity. Android based phones do something similar but different, with the same net result. If you run a normal USB cable, there will be no resistors to set charge current. The plug itself, what ever it may be (cigarette lighter, AC adapter, computer, lipo backup system, etc), will set the current that way.

From what I've read so far, I just bought a power converter from amazon. I'll drop in a voltage regulator (switching, not linear) that will do 5v @ 3A, and be done for under 5 bucks. Installation should be a breeze.

As far as chargers go, since I got 2 m12 chargers, I may put them one or both on EBay and buy the m18/m12 charger. It charges m12 batteries faster as well.

Just picked up a bunch of jigsaw blades and unibits (3 bit combo). I have a HUGE project. Need to install RV windows in to a Ford cargo van, fabricate and install an overhead trapeze like device, build a new gearbox for a wheel chair lift, rewire the entire wheel chair lift electronics with upgraded 160A reversing solenoids (over their wasteful and trouble-shooting nightmare H-bridge made with RELAYS it has now. I've never seen 'industrial' electronics done so poorly. TONS of work.

The little impact will be put through it's paces doing most of the work. Bought bunches of accessories for it too.

They are coming out with a new M12 light. It's a magnetic light bar that puts out 220 lumens! I screwed up, I should have bought it from cpomilwaukee with the rest of my order but thought I could pick it up locally later. I'm going to order it now and just eat the shipping.

 

[Ign]

They are coming out with a new M12 light. It's a magnetic light bar that puts out 220 lumens! I screwed up, I should have bought it from cpomilwaukee with the rest of my order but thought I could pick it up locally later. I'm going to order it now and just eat the shipping.

From post 17:

Now with the M12 LED stick light I think that fills a real need for a cordless "trouble light" (ala Bayco, etc) that doesn't have a built-in, non-serviceable, proprietary battery pack. (Nextec makes a fluorescent but only 1.5 hours run time per charge). Problem is at retail of $80 it doesn't hold to the M12-is-cheaper model.

Thanks for the info on the chargers altho I'd be lying if I said I understood much of it. Apparently an electronics ***** like me would be best to buy some sort of cable with resistors already in place. I think.