Most compact 1/2” right angle drill?

[cycle61]

So we’re looking for a 1/2” chuck right angle drill. The application is to drill holes through stacks of copper with fairly tight clearances between adjacent components. Imagine dropping flat bars in between the vertical pieces shown here and then drilling holes in place, for instance. Because this is copper or aluminum, we need low RPM and big torque. Prefer corded or M18, brand isn’t important unless I have to buy batteries.

Top priority is the compactness of the head. These sections of bus are often less than 8” apart.


The Milwaukee super hole Hawg is looking tempting. https://www.acmetools.com/milwaukee...gle-drill-bare-tool-2809-20/045242540051.html

 

[sparky 1971]

I have both the Super Hawg and the Hole Hawg. The Super gets to be heavy sooner than later as well as it's a lot longer than the regular Hole Hawg. I'd go with the Hole Hawg.

Milwaukee M18 FUEL Hole Hawg 1/2 in. Right Angle Drill (Bare Tool)

Milwaukee M18 FUEL Hole Hawg 1/2 in. Right Angle Drill (Bare Tool) - 2807-20 from Milwaukee

www.acmetools.com

 

[LopezBart]

Machinery's Handbook recommends 60 sfm for drilling for deoxidized copper. A friend who worked on SLAC where they machined lots of copper mentioned it was not fun to work. You may need to cut down and re-machine a 5/8" stub drill to get clearance.

 

[RTM]

It seems like my Milwaukee RA drill has less @$$ than my hole Hawg.
Too tired to go look tonight, maybe tomorrow.

 

[cvairwerks]

Might be faster and more efficient to create a drill fixture to do this on the bench

 

[dutchgray]

Makita do a corded right angle drill that is angle grinder sized with a very low profile chuck, might be too high rpm though as it's not super low geared.

 

[Zewnten]

That looks like a nightmare. Why weren’t the holes pre-drilled before assembly?

 

[Muckin_Slusher]

What's the secret to drilling copper bus bars like that?

I've done it, but found the copper was gummy and somehow hard to drill, but I might have been drilling pure copper. Not sure if yours are a different alloy.

I was using twist drills and WD-40 I think.

 

[Jim greengo]

So we’re looking for a 1/2” chuck right angle drill. The application is to drill holes through stacks of copper with fairly tight clearances between adjacent components. Imagine dropping flat bars in between the vertical pieces shown here and then drilling holes in place, for instance. Because this is copper or aluminum, we need low RPM and big torque. Prefer corded or M18, brand isn’t important unless I have to buy batteries.

Top priority is the compactness of the head. These sections of bus are often less than 8” apart.


The Milwaukee super hole Hawg is looking tempting. https://www.acmetools.com/milwaukee...gle-drill-bare-tool-2809-20/045242540051.html

I've got a super hawg in my truck,holding that heavy ******* in production environment will be a young man's sport to say the least! Hahaha
Stupid auto correcting phone!

 

[finn]

Maybe I don’t understand, but wouldn’t a good designer / process development team have specified punching holes off line, and just installing the fasteners in the pre punched holes as part of the assembly process.

Seems rather labor intensive and inefficient to drill holes after the assembly is almost done.

 

[bwringer]

You might consider a tether and spring loaded reel system that supports the drill from above and lightens the load on the operator.

As far as drilling copper, I know there's a modification needed to the tips of "normal" HSS drill bits to make this a lot easier. Regrinding the rake angle makes things a lot less grabby. And of course use a compatible lube if at all possible.

No idea what you're building there, Dr. Frankenstein, or how big a concern contamination or cleaning off the lube might be.

 

[Pinemarten]

Maybe I don’t understand, but wouldn’t a good designer / process development team have specified punching holes off line, and just installing the fasteners in the pre punched holes as part of the assembly process.

Seems rather labor intensive and inefficient to drill holes after the assembly is almost done.

I agree with Finn. Punching the stacks of copper plate makes a lot of sense. Bwringer's concerns about FOD and contamination are valid as well.

I would add, the "Murphy's Law" factor. I've run a Milwaukee Hole Hawg before, they are torque-monsters! The potential for binding the drill bit and causing damage is great.

 

[Jswain]

I would try to make a mount for a low profile mag drill and use that. Drilling any hole of size on its side with no room to get behind it is going to be slow and painful.

Seems like it would be pretty easy to sandwich some heavy steel plate, bolt them together and stick the mag drill to that. The extra cost of the mag drill would go away with the time savings

 

[cycle61]

For those suggesting punching things in advance, or designing them properly at the factory…you’re absolutely right and whenever feasible that is the plan. But we aren’t the factory, and by the time we discover that the holes don’t exist or don’t line up, disassembling everything and starting over is often impossible. Much of our work is in-place retrofits, and although some remote design and prefab can be accomplished, field adjustments are nearly always necessary.

This particular contraption is the main 3000 amp feed into a historic high-rise building, and we installed modern breakers and controls into a system built in the late 1930’s.

Going to try and find a regular hole hawg as suggested, along with a couple sets of stub length drills.

The concept of bolting on a steel plate and using a mag drill is interesting. Used one for the steel parts on this project, it would be interesting to see if the time savings overcomes the setup time for copper.

The holes don’t have to be particularly precise once we reach the “almost assembled” stage, just good enough to get a bridge reamer and then a half inch bolt through the stack.

 

[dutchgray]

Definitely have the drill ground to a profile suitable for copper, 100° point, 12° rake, stone the cutting edge like you would for brass to reduce grabbing if you get grabbing.
Copper is horrible so good luck

 

[cgrutt]

Don't have much to add but just wanted to say that project looks so cool. I do have both of the corded Milwaukee drills pictured above and wouldn't necessarily call them "Compact". Note the hole-hawg has a high and low speed but is not variable. It delivers a ton of torque immediately so be careful if you go that route. I use mine mostly for mixing concrete or mortar and sometimes leaves a mess starting up.

 

[Sumboodie]

It seems like my Milwaukee RA drill has less @$$ than my hole Hawg.
Too tired to go look tonight, maybe tomorrow.

Those hole hawgs don't goof around! We had 2 on a road construction job to put in mailbox posts/beams. ($58/hr... I would have done lots worse jobs!)

The other guy figured it didn't need the 2nd handle, a 2ft long pipe. I tried telling him, but young and all knowing.

It about busted his face when it bucked out of his hands and kept spinning. The cord winding up unplugged thankfully.

 

[CoronadoBruin]

I vote for one of the three Milwaukee drills mentioned above (I have all three corded but have yet to try the cordless). The D-handle is the lightest, and all three will become pretty damn heavy pretty damn quickly. Makita also makes the same three (IIRC), just in light blue instead of red. Look at pneumatic right angle drills, they may work for you. Edit: Just looked at the Milwaukee M18s, and they seem to be smaller and significantly lighter than the Hole Hawgs.

Makita 40V max XGT Brushless Cordless 1/2 in. Right Angle Drill Kit (4.0Ah) GAD01M1 - The Home Depot

The 40V max XGT Brushless ½

www.homedepot.com

https://www.flexibleassembly.com/Ingersoll-Rand-Air-Drill-Angle-Head-14-in-28-Female-Thread-850-rpm-QA0854D?srsltid=AfmBOoq7HlReRYz6AslZULzu0aKmOuuM3U9cQ86psDERZxvuwY4XsMqIueU

 

[Zewnten]

For those suggesting punching things in advance, or designing them properly at the factory…you’re absolutely right and whenever feasible that is the plan. But we aren’t the factory, and by the time we discover that the holes don’t exist or don’t line up, disassembling everything and starting over is often impossible. Much of our work is in-place retrofits, and although some remote design and prefab can be accomplished, field adjustments are nearly always necessary.

This particular contraption is the main 3000 amp feed into a historic high-rise building, and we installed modern breakers and controls into a system built in the late 1930’s.

Going to try and find a regular hole hawg as suggested, along with a couple sets of stub length drills.

The concept of bolting on a steel plate and using a mag drill is interesting. Used one for the steel parts on this project, it would be interesting to see if the time savings overcomes the setup time for copper.

The holes don’t have to be particularly precise once we reach the “almost assembled” stage, just good enough to get a bridge reamer and then a half inch bolt through the stack.

I understand having to work with what you’ve got. Drilling copper is b@&ch even on a small scale. Milwaukee makes a special low profile angle drill for under flanges and we used a cutter rather than drill to avoid snagging and spinning. Don’t know if they make something like that cuter for copper.

 

[Zewnten]

Looking at Mascter-Mccarr they do have annular cutters for brass if that helps

 

[cycle61]

Definitely have the drill ground to a profile suitable for copper, 100° point, 12° rake, stone the cutting edge like you would for brass to reduce grabbing if you get grabbing.
Copper is horrible so good luck

This is very helpful. Spent lots of hours drilling copper but usually with hardware store twist drills. And yeah…it *****.

 

[cycle61]

Looking at Mascter-Mccarr they do have annular cutters for brass if that helps

I’ll take a look, thank you! If I understand correctly, using annular cutters handheld is a bad idea, yes?

 

[Jswain]

I’ll take a look, thank you! If I understand correctly, using annular cutters handheld is a bad idea, yes?

I think it would be an expensive, bad idea lol.

 

[torqueman2002]

SORRY - Just re-read your post. This is a great drill, but 3/8" chuck.
$149 - Amazon
BOSCH PS11-102 12V Max 3/8 In. Right Angle Drill/Driver Kit with 2.0Ah Lithium Ion Battery

 

[Zewnten]

I’ll take a look, thank you! If I understand correctly, using annular cutters handheld is a bad idea, yes?

Yeah you'd probably want to rig up some anti kick back but looking at your pictures that's going to be a major problem for a twist bit as you penetrate multiple plates with the gaps between them. But I've drilled steel with the short mag drill and annular cutters and as long as one wasn't being aggressive with feed pressure it never bound up like a twist drill either. I would think making a frame to support a mag drill would have long term pay off for you if this is a recurring problem. A broken wrist or smashed hand is usually pretty cheap compared to making a jig.

 

[cycle61]

Okay, picked up the M18 Hole Hawg 2807-20 this afternoon. I really like the overall size, it's just over 5" to the back of the head with the handle removed. Combined with some stubby bits this should be a great solution.

@slodat coming soon to a project near you.

 

[Zewnten]

Did you get the one with the clutch? Mine has one and it’s a life saver when they snag.

 

[cycle61]

Not sure if it has a clutch. Doesn't seem to. It's definitely variable speed, 0-1500 rpm.

 

[sparky 1971]

Not sure if it has a clutch. Doesn't seem to. It's definitely variable speed, 0-1500 rpm.

There is no clutch like the old high torque drills. The length of the drill makes it easy to fight back if it gets bound up. It does have a shut down feature if it gets too bad, if that happens you have to let off the trigger and start over. I think the super hawg has a clutch in low gear but it's never activated on me.

 

[slodat]

@cycle61 that Fein compact mag drill I had at 300 would be perfect for this. Clamp a 3” x 10” chunk of mild steel to the bus, and use an annular cutter and some lube. The set screws for the chuck get here Saturday. It’s definitely the fastest and least fuss. It can run a 2” doc annular cutter.

That whole hog (tm) also looks good.

 

[whateg01]

I would try to make a mount for a low profile mag drill and use that. Drilling any hole of size on its side with no room to get behind it is going to be slow and painful.

Seems like it would be pretty easy to sandwich some heavy steel plate, bolt them together and stick the mag drill to that. The extra cost of the mag drill would go away with the time savings

Mag drill isn't going to fit between the groups of copper.

 

[slodat]

Mag drill isn't going to fit between the groups of copper.

I have the Fein Compact Mag Drill. The project @cycle61 and I worked a couple weeks ago, in the photo above, we had about 8” between phases in the overhead bus. The compact Fein is 6.625” tall.



Won’t work everytime. We need as many options as we can manage. We punched close to, if not a thousand holes on that project.

One of the other parts of the project we had to drill the bus in position. I found a 1/4” pilot hole and a step drill made short work of it. But we wanted a better drill for it.

 

[cycle61]

I have the Fein Compact Mag Drill. The project @cycle61 and I worked a couple weeks ago, in the photo above, we had about 8” between phases in the overhead bus. The compact Fein is 6.625” tall.



Won’t work everytime. We need as many options as we can manage. We punched close to, if not a thousand holes on that project.

One of the other parts of the project we had to drill the bus in position. I found a 1/4” pilot hole and a step drill made short work of it. But we wanted a better drill for it.

We just need to get the magnet tuned for copper!

 

[slodat]

We just need to get the magnet tuned for copper!

Clamp a 3”x 10-12” x 3/8 chunk of mild steel to the copper…

 

[Jswain]

Clamp a 3”x 10-12” x 3/8 chunk of mild steel to the copper…

Yup that's the easy part. As long as you have enough space a mag drill would be damn nice

 

[whateg01]

I have the Fein Compact Mag Drill. The project @cycle61 and I worked a couple weeks ago, in the photo above, we had about 8” between phases in the overhead bus. The compact Fein is 6.625” tall.



Won’t work everytime. We need as many options as we can manage. We punched close to, if not a thousand holes on that project.

One of the other parts of the project we had to drill the bus in position. I found a 1/4” pilot hole and a step drill made short work of it. But we wanted a better drill for it.

Well that's damn impressive! I stand corrected

 

[Retired dozer fixer]

For those suggesting punching things in advance, or designing them properly at the factory…you’re absolutely right and whenever feasible that is the plan. But we aren’t the factory, and by the time we discover that the holes don’t exist or don’t line up, disassembling everything and starting over is often impossible. Much of our work is in-place retrofits, and although some remote design and prefab can be accomplished, field adjustments are nearly always necessary.

This particular contraption is the main 3000 amp feed into a historic high-rise building, and we installed modern breakers and controls into a system built in the late 1930’s.

Going to try and find a regular hole hawg as suggested, along with a couple sets of stub length drills.

The concept of bolting on a steel plate and using a mag drill is interesting. Used one for the steel parts on this project, it would be interesting to see if the time savings overcomes the setup time for copper.

The holes don’t have to be particularly precise once we reach the “almost assembled” stage, just good enough to get a bridge reamer and then a half inch bolt through the stack.

Seems like you should be more worried about drill shavings laying around someplace they could cause a fault

 

[cycle61]

Seems like you should be more worried about drill shavings laying around someplace they could cause a fault

There's definitely a cleaning and inspection process after this sort of work. Fortunately, these things are large enough that a shaving big enough to cause a problem is also big enough to see and remove.

 

[dutchgray]

Seems like you should be more worried about drill shavings laying around someplace they could cause a fault

We did have that once where an electrician was drilling into the main cabinet with an 3 x100A 3 phase supply which was live and the shavings shorted out all 3 phases and blew all 3 main fuses, the utility was not impressed with that one.

 

[Zewnten]

There is no clutch like the old high torque drills. The length of the drill makes it easy to fight back if it gets bound up. It does have a shut down feature if it gets too bad, if that happens you have to let off the trigger and start over. I think the super hawg has a clutch in low gear but it's never activated on me.

The M18 hole hawk like the OP posted offers a version with a clutch, which I have. It’s very nice on the body part’s being smashed when the bit catches.