natural gas moving into the area... Need input.

[DCarr2]

So the local natural gas suppliers left me a thing in my mail box, their info is misleading as the competeing heat fuels are in galons, but the their measurement is in cubic feet. of couse they make it look like NG is super cheap, but I know better.

they want to run a line down my road, and are offering the first 100' free, prob is my house is 280' from the road

i should email the contact, wonder if I can get the line ran the first 100' and then cap it

its $7 a foot over 100' and I dont have that money right now

plus my furnace is oil, not propane, so my conversion costs are in the range of $5,000+

but if i can get them to drop the line, cap the line, so its there, for the future that could work, but I dont want to pay a $15 a month meter rental fee...

the other thing is their price comparison charts are very misleading.

so far this winter, Oil heat has been cheaper than natural gas. my old house was 1400 sq ft. this house is closer to 3K sq ft (the home listing lied)

but the oil heat has been cheaper, than natural gas... I was on natural gas in my old house it *****, u get a bill each month and freeze ur *** off. but it seems to me that with oil i can buy it locally on the rez, and fill my tank as needed. alot cheaper... I dunno I feel like their comparisons are flawed, and very misleading.

 

[DCarr2]

When I say cheaper, natural gas heat and water tank from October to December is $600.

new house, electric hot water tank $150 a month for electric, $200 for oil

 

[ADSR]

I would talk with them and see if they would wave the 100 foot rule in order to get your business. They might just run it all the way up to your house. I'm not sure why you don't like natural gas. I love it.

 

[DCarr2]

For me, being able to heat my house on my budget is more appealing, my monthly income flucuates alot durinmg the winter, NG is a gaurranteed bill each month...

and regardless what they say on the radio, its not your best energy value, for instance, to keep my old shop at 60F all winter costs 2500-3500/a year, yet to keep that same shop at 65-75 with a wood stove, cost $1000 a year...

 

[M-technik-3]

I have a house that was out primary place of living two years ago that was HG for everything . Tankless h20 home furnace forced hot air hated it, dryer, garage heater kept at 40 all winter unless working in builing 26x24 and stove.

In winter our gas bill did not exceed 90 a month, but I had just rebuilt the place over the span of 5 years. I now have oil hate it and cost more for insurance, plus I have a wood furnace in the basement for more insurance complaints.

Love peace and quiet so cost difference keeps me here, if they said here is street natural gas I'm all over it. I have propane for my dryer and tankless h20 and stove. We cook at home so cooking with an electric stove BITES big time.

 

[jchetty]

If you ever plan on selling- that could be a game changer. Once you grow accustomed to natural gas- hard to live without it. Plus other possibilities open up- garage heat, standby generator, gas dryer.

They might even let you split up the payments. If they did, I would split the payment and just shut off the meter. Than upgrade the house as money frees up.

I agree with the others and push them to run it to the house. Street crews have the equipment to knock it job very quickly and $7 a foot is a bargain. My concern would be that if you don't jump on this offer now, it will be much more expensive later.

 

[M-technik-3]

My town put the line into my garage for 150 and included a shut off system and fixed the lawn. They were cool and next about it. I just called the Municipal center and they did up plans and permit and took care of it in a week. But it's a town of 65K people, the have town electricity and gas and water and now fiber optic.

Yet they can't pave a road to save them......selling it come spring we think.

 

[DCarr2]

i grew up with NG heat.

 

[DCarr2]

I agree with the others and push them to run it to the house. Street crews have the equipment to knock it job very quickly and $7 a foot is a bargain. My concern would be that if you don't jump on this offer now, it will be much more expensive later.

i plan to die in this house...

but agree the conversion will be more expensive later, but the money just isnt here right now to convert over

 

[Showkey]

Use the right numbers in this:

http://www.efficiencymaine.com/at-home/home-energy-savings-program/heating-cost-comparison/

https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=987&t=7

 

[ltusler]

When I say cheaper, natural gas heat and water tank from October to December is $600.

new house, electric hot water tank $150 a month for electric, $200 for oil

So your saying NG is 600 a month and the other two are 300?

 

[Bronson]

I am located in a NG hotspot.
I have lived with NG all my life and love it.
My 1200 sq ft steel shop, spray foam insy, costs about $40 a MONTH to heat to 70, as I am out there 16+ hours a day.
My 1100 square ft stucco on pier house runs around $40-50 a month to heat to 70F.
My water heater is also NG, dryer is electric.
I understand your monetary limitations, but I think You would be very happy with NG, if You ever do convert.

 

[Brian_WK]

Oil might be cheap now but that could change at any time. Plus oil equipment efficancy will not be able to be on par as gas equipment once it comes time to replace.

Brian

 

[Adk Mike]

I'd get it ran to the house and install a 40 gallon TTW Bradford White water heater.
With it in the house you have options. Then you can change the furnace years from now if that's the plan.
Long term it's the way to go. No delivery trucks in the yard. No fuel inventory.
Well worth the trouble. Just do it over time.

 

[csp]

For me, being able to heat my house on my budget is more appealing, my monthly income flucuates alot durinmg the winter, NG is a gaurranteed bill each month...

Say what? Your NG bill would be based on your usage.

 

[bczygan]

Try it, you'll like it!

 

[DCarr2]

Say what? Your NG bill would be based on your usage.

a min bill from national fuel is $20 a month wether you use gas or not....

after 5 months of dealing with that, I told them they either take the meter or I am cutting it off my building with my sawzall.

they were here 3hrs later... weird. since I called them 5x prior to come take thier meter... (2008)

Natural gas is great because it doesnt stop, power failures, ect it just goes, as long as the distribution center has power, you have fuel.

I grew up with NG. this is the first time I have had to deel with fuel, to heat my house in winter, my shop is going unheated, a first for me in 35 years.

I dont mind handling the fuel to heat my house...

After my old house (house I grew up in) I do not look forward to a NG bill. if you use gas or not, its still $20 a month. not much, but enough to irk you.

i think ill have them run te line, if its free cap it, and in the future if the budget allows, run it further, but i cant convert my oil furnace to NG so thats a whole new furnace. there is no way i can make that happen.

 

[marinusdees]

Say what? Your NG bill would be based on your usage.

Yes, of course, but the gas company will prorate it into equal monthly payments. A real convenience.

 

[Showkey]

Yup.........there is meter charge goes along with a distribution charge and gas usage charge.........just like electric company charges for use ( KWH) and distribution ( wire and meter) . So cut the electric meter off the house too........ go off the grid so to speak.

 

[Jazz1]

Will they finance the extra run of line and the furnace? Gas company here offers all sorts of deals to secure new clients. My furnace, hot water tank and stove all run on natural gas. Average cost $1400 CDN a year. Oil is going up,,no doubt about that. I invested in oil the day Trump got elected.

 

[Zeke]

DCarr, I think you answered your own ? by post #4 if not #2.

 

[TangoFoxTrot]

Most people that have natural gas love it. Long term, I don't see heating oil being cheaper than natural gas. Even so, there's a lot more appliances that can run on gas where there are cost savings.

I personally think it's a no brainer even if it costs $1000 or so out of pocket to get natural gas hooked up. I would easily say it saves me that much per year in utility bills, plus it just works better.

But I would do all the homework and get other bids and not just take the first flyer that shows up.

 

[theoldwizard1]

... Oil heat has been cheaper than natural gas.

Something is not right in your compariosn.. The fuel costs for natural gas is always cheaper than any other fuel, except maybe wood.

 

[Randy in Maine]

Something is not right in your compariosn.. The fuel costs for natural gas is always cheaper than any other fuel, except maybe wood.

And then only if you get the wood for free.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

For me, being able to heat my house on my budget is more appealing, my monthly income flucuates alot durinmg the winter, NG is a gaurranteed bill each month...

and regardless what they say on the radio, its not your best energy value, for instance, to keep my old shop at 60F all winter costs 2500-3500/a year, yet to keep that same shop at 65-75 with a wood stove, cost $1000 a year...

WTF, are you buying wood? I usually get my wood for free or when the neighbors have a tree come down I get paid to get it up for them...I just change them what I have to pay someone helping me, plus the gas/fuel cost.

 

[Bottlecapdigger]

Just for comparison here in Ontario oil heating cost WAY more than NG. We went from 500$ to about 90$ a month in Jan,Feb .We switched about 3 yrs ago and up graded furnace, water heater and AC . At that rate it won't be long paying for itself. NG is the preferred heat source here. BCD.

 

[mygarageone]

I can not figure out how burning wood is cheaper than gas period . Any time you spend your time getting it , cutting it , cleaning up , etc ,ect can . It's way more.
Your time messing with this is something. , if you took all the time you spent doing what ever for the wood and use it for a second job or work extra for your company or business , your way ahead of the game.
I watch people around here work wk ends all summer gathering wood , splitting it , stacking it, feeding the stove , removing and cleaning the stove and stove pipe .
So let's figure it out.
Gathering the wood 2 days a wk for 4 months =. 32 days @ what at least 8 hrs a day =
256 hrs X the minimum wage of $ 10.00 an hr = $ 2560.00

That's , not your fuel , truck , clean up , repairs , chain saw , etc ,etc.

So how is wood cheaper ?

 

[finn]

Replacing your old oil fired furnace or boiler, which probably has an efficiency of less than 80%, with a 95% ng fired unit, coupled with the lower cost per btu of gas compared to oil makes this almost a no brainer.

The investment will pay off in a few years, and it's all gravy after that.

Plus, you can convert other appliances as they wear out, for additional future savings.

 

[finn]

I can not figure out how burning wood is cheaper than gas period . Any time you spend your time getting it , cutting it , cleaning up , etc ,ect can . It's way more.
Your time messing with this is something. , if you took all the time you spent doing what ever for the wood and use it for a second job or work extra for your company or business , your way ahead of the game.
I watch people around here work wk ends all summer gathering wood , splitting it , stacking it, feeding the stove , removing and cleaning the stove and stove pipe .
So let's figure it out.
Gathering the wood 2 days a wk for 4 months =. 32 days @ what at least 8 hrs a day =
256 hrs X the minimum wage of $ 10.00 an hr = $ 2560.00

That's , not your fuel , truck , clean up , repairs , chain saw , etc ,etc.

So how is wood cheaper ?

You forgot the splitter cost.

 

[Jack D]

Also check with the NG supplier they may have special conversions for new customers where they will also swap out your furnace as part of the deal. My son converted that way. The furnace they offered was not a premium name/model but it got him converted.

Home heating oil here in the northeast has very volatile pricing.

 

[Movover]

If you want to Compare apples to apples you have to break out the costs equally, Gas is billed in therms here (100,000) Btu and oil is 138,690 Btu per gallon so you multiply the oil cost by .71 and that gives you how much oil would cost for the same amount. My bill is at 1.41 Per therm after all taxes and monthly charges (total monthly bill divided by total therms) and our oil is 1.979 Gal so X .71 and thats 1.405 a therm, so exactly the same at this point.

I just did a burner upgrade and not a system upgrade into a 95% because my boiler was only 4 years old and the 12% savings a year was not worth it yet.

Positives are no oil delivery, always on, I went direct vent instead of a chimney liner, and so far after 2 years No cleanings the unit looks spotless

 

[southalabama]

I'm 3 miles from the Florida line.

No heating oil around here. Three options natural gas/propane/electric. If natural gas lines are available most opt for it for heat. If a remote location then propare. Electricity is the last and worse option.

No way I'd spend that kind of money but I would see how far they'd run the gas line without incurring a monthly charge. Even if you paid a nominal fee. They have some flexibility but they are not gonna spend a bunch of effort and money and not get the business.

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I can not figure out how burning wood is cheaper than gas period . Any time you spend your time getting it , cutting it , cleaning up , etc ,ect can . It's way more.
Your time messing with this is something. , if you took all the time you spent doing what ever for the wood and use it for a second job or work extra for your company or business , your way ahead of the game.
I watch people around here work wk ends all summer gathering wood , splitting it , stacking it, feeding the stove , removing and cleaning the stove and stove pipe .
So let's figure it out.
Gathering the wood 2 days a wk for 4 months =. 32 days @ what at least 8 hrs a day =
256 hrs X the minimum wage of $ 10.00 an hr = $ 2560.00

That's , not your fuel , truck , clean up , repairs , chain saw , etc ,etc.

So how is wood cheaper ?

I guess you forgot the entertainment cost. I enjoy the work myself.

A lot of the time I get guys that usually buy their firewood to cut and bust my wood and let them take a cut of it,(pun intended).

At the end of the year, the actual out of pocket money spent is less and some years actually a plus for me. Yes, it's some work, but it's like anything, you can figure the cost a lot of ways. It's about satisfaction most of the time for me. It takes me about two weekends of cutting and splitting to make it through the winter, 40 hours. It takes me about 10 minutes a day to check and fill the heater. On the days it's not going to be real cold for awhile, I just let it burn out and not worry about it. I live in North Carolina so I do not have to "feed the beast' as much as someone up north would have to do. If you're not doing anything else, cutting/splitting wood is a noble way to spend some time.

 

[Farmall450]

If you hate NG so much why are you even considering it?
I doubt they'd just run it for free, that's pretty pointless for them with no guarantee you'll ever finish the project.

 

[rburke65]

I would be curious if they would run a 100' and then cap it, 180' away from your house, and just leave it. Somehow I'd be surprised if they agreed to that. No idea....I could be wrong....but I'd be surprised.

 

[ratdoggy]

I freaking love NG...I had oil heat at my old house and propane to cook and for the drier
Tank of oil every other month was $500-$600 plus the propane which I had to use a certain amount or I paid for it anyway...My heat,stove drier and gas fireplace on this house is cheap compared to the old house

In fact it was mandatory that the new house had to have NG.
BTW I ran the numbers on GeoThermal and it didn't pay to add it

 

[chrispyny]

I have never in my life heard that oil heat is cheaper than NG. For that matter, like others said, unless you get your wood for free, NOTHING is cheaper to heat your home than natural gas.
Now, that comment goes STRICTLY for northeastern NY and surrounding areas such as Western MA.
I'm sorry man, but you aren't doing your math right if you even for a moment think oil and wood(purchased wood) are cheaper than natural gas.

When my girlfriend paid $2,000+ every winter to heat her older 1,300 sq ft home with oil, and i'm paying $110 a month for gas and electric for a 1400 sq ft home? Yeah, Ng is cheaper.

In addition, NG furnaces/boilers are more efficient than oil burners.

Forget about the stink of fuel oil, swinging diesel prices, hoping you don't forget to order oil if not on a delivery plan, having to run out to get 20 gal of diesel to keep the house warm if you did forget to order oil, haggling with competing delivery companies for the best prices etc etc.. been there and done that in the past MANY times.
My home hydronic boiler, 40 gal water heater, and kitchen stove are all fed from NG. I mistakenly didn't think to change my dryer to NG when i bought it along with my washer a couple years ago. I dunno WHY i didn't think to convert. The Ng pipe is RIGHT on the other side of the wall in the garage. It would have cost me $50 tops to run a line through some drywall and install a shut off valve. So now my dryer is still electric.

I just blew in r70 worth of fiberglass insulation last month into the attic and got a new roof with ridge vent for the first time in the houses life. My electric and Ng bill were $88 dollars this month. Yup, in a 45 year old raised ranch in southern saratoga county. EIGHTY EIGHT dollars.

Do everything you can to get that line to your house now while you can. Trust us, your friendly GJ neighbors.

Good luck.

 

[Showkey]

+10. ^^^^^^^

 

[mygarageone]

I guess you forgot the entertainment cost. I enjoy the work myself.

A lot of the time I get guys that usually buy their firewood to cut and bust my wood and let them take a cut of it,(pun intended).

At the end of the year, the actual out of pocket money spent is less and some years actually a plus for me. Yes, it's some work, but it's like anything, you can figure the cost a lot of ways. It's about satisfaction most of the time for me. It takes me about two weekends of cutting and splitting to make it through the winter, 40 hours. It takes me about 10 minutes a day to check and fill the heater. On the days it's not going to be real cold for awhile, I just let it burn out and not worry about it. I live in North Carolina so I do not have to "feed the beast' as much as someone up north would have to do. If you're not doing anything else, cutting/splitting wood is a noble way to spend some time.

I won't deny it is a great work out for a person and some enjoy it but when I hear about the so called money they save , give me a break. Not gonna happen .

 

[TheEquineFencer]

I won't deny it is a great work out for a person and some enjoy it but when I hear about the so called money they save , give me a break. Not gonna happen .

LOL, not trying to start a ******* match...but I was out of work a long time with zero income and stayed warm....try that with Oil/Gas/Electric.