Need electrical help

[Kybound]

I recently wired my new pole building, and am having an issue. I ran 2224 aluminum mobile home feeder 125 feet from my home to the building, 100 amps, drove in 2 ground rods and everything seemed fine. I ran 3 120 circuits with 4 outlets each with the first one being a gfci plug. And then I ran several 240 circuits for woodworking equipment I have. I’m still not move in working on metal ceiling and walls. I plugged my table saw into a 20 amp 240 circuit and it’s tripping my 120 gfci’s. Sometimes 1 and sometimes all 3. Never kicks off a breaker. What have I done wrong. Thanks Danny

 

[Terry D]

Do you have your neutrals isolated from the grounds in the panel

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[Terry D]

Post a picture of your panel with the cover off

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[Kybound]

Yes have a separate neutral bar. Will post a pic tomorrow.

 

[Terry D]

You might not be able to post pictures yet with only 3 posts. Are all these circuits homeruns to the panel. Are the 240 volt circuits anyway connected to the 120 volt ones

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[Kybound]

All the 240 are homeruns. One circuit to one plug. I have three separate 20 amp 240 plugs and it does this on every one.

 

[nadogail]

You may have a problem in your saw.

 

[wyliesdiesels]

You may have a problem in your saw.

A problem on a separate circuit would not cause GFCIs to trip

Something else at play here

 

[Jim greengo]

A problem on a separate circuit would not cause GFCIs to trip

Something else at play here

What he said.

 

[alfredeneuman]

I ran 2224 aluminum mobile home feeder 125 feet from my home to the building, 100 amps,

#2 Aluminum is only rated for 90 Amps.

 

[Kybound]

But that wouldn’t cause this problem would it?

 

[Kybound]

And I have a 90 amp breaker in my house, just couldn’t find a 90 amp box for the garage so I got 100 amp square d homeline.

 

[mike93lx]

And I have a 90 amp breaker in my house, just couldn’t find a 90 amp box for the garage so I got 100 amp square d homeline.

Then that part is good. You have a 90a feed. The breaker rating in the barn doesn't matter all as it is just a disconnect

 

[Jim greengo]

And I have a 90 amp breaker in my house, just couldn’t find a 90 amp box for the garage so I got 100 amp square d homeline.

The breaker in garage panel is just a disconnect.

 

[Kybound]

Here are some pictures I think I did this right.

 

[mike93lx]

Does anything besides the table saw trip the GFCIs?


Also, in case there is a next time, you could have flipped the panel to have the main at the bottom and used a little less wire for the feeder

 

[Kybound]

I haven’t had any other tools out there yet. I’ll take my 220 dust collector out there and see if it trips it.

 

[mike93lx]

how fast do they trip? immediately at start up?

https://www.fluke.com/en-us/learn/blog/grounding/chasing-ghost-trips-in-gfci-protected-circuits

are the outlets all brand new? purchased at the same time? They could be bad.

 

[Terry D]

I see 6 single pole breakers and 6 neutrals on the neutral bar, so that looks right. The 2-pole breaker on right second from bottom, it has a 3-wire ran to it, where is the neutral and what is the breaker feeding

 

[Kybound]

That feeds a welder, no neutral just 2 hots and a ground.

 

[Kybound]

And they trip right away. Sometimes none, sometimes 1 or all three. And yes bought at the same time.

 

[mike93lx]

Maybe swap in a gfci from your house to see if that resolves it

 

[Terry D]

Let us know what another 240 volt load, besides the saw, plugged in does. Are the grounds for all these circuits tied together in any way, other than back at the ground bar.

 

[Kybound]

Will do. And only at the ground bar.

 

[Kybound]

I plugged in the dust collector and so far it's not kicking them out. I'll keep messing with it.

 

[Kybound]

So would that mean my table saw has a bad ground?

 

[Terry D]

Okay, Im going to ask you to do something here, if you don't feel comfortable please don't do it, but if you did all the other wiring, you should be ok with it. What ever circuit the saw is plugged into, remove that ground from the bar in the panel. make sure the removed ground does not touch anything in the panel, even other grounds. With the breaker off and the saw plugged in and switched on, turn power on with the breaker and see if the other GFCIs hold. Don't touch the saw in any way in cause you may have a motor starting to go to ground. If the GFCIs do not trip, the saw is putting some current on the ground. Make sure you turn the breaker off before hooking the ground back up. I really don't have a idea if this would trip the GFCIs, Im trying to isolate the problem

 

[Kybound]

Terry do I need to run 3 wire a neutral to the welder?

 

[Terry D]

There was a similar problem like this on another thread here in the past with a welder tripping a GFCI on another circuit, I believe he exchanged the welder and the problem went away. I might be wrong on this

 

[Terry D]

Terry do I need to run 3 wire a neutral to the welder?

No, 2 hots and a ground, if you ran a 3-wire just don't hook up the white and cap off both ends

 

[Kybound]

Ok I did what you said and with the ground off it did not trip. When I was loosing the ground terminal I had the drill on forward and it tightened down some more. Would a loose ground have caused this problem?

 

[mike93lx]

Ok I did what you said and with the ground off it did not trip. When I was loosing the ground terminal I had the drill on forward and it tightened down some more. Would a loose ground have caused this problem?

I think it is unlikely, but test it out.

Sounds like a problem with the motor on the table saw.

 

[Kybound]

Hell now the table saw with it hooked back up is not tripping it.

 

[Terry D]

Ok I did what you said and with the ground off it did not trip. When I was loosing the ground terminal I had the drill on forward and it tightened down some more. Would a loose ground have caused this problem?

I don't think a loose ground would cause this. But it sounds like the problem might have been isolated. I have never had to troubleshoot a problem like this before, so im guessing at stuff like you are. If the problem has defiantly went away with the ground disconnected, and no other machines are tripping the GFCIs when plugged in ant 240 volt outlet, then the problem possibly is in that saw. Is this saw new to you, or had it hooked up before

 

[Kybound]

Also one time yesterday I have the radio plugged in to the gfci itself and a game on on regular outlet right next to it, it kicked off the fan but the radio was still on. Reset and the fan came on.

 

[Terry D]

Hell now the table saw with it hooked back up is not tripping it.

That is a strange one

 

[Kybound]

It was hooked up in my other garage and never tripped a breaker, but there were no gfci's.

 

[Kybound]

Yeah I'm getting to the point of taking g out the gfci's. Even though I want ot right. I have the plug in circuit tester for gfci and says everything working right.

 

[Terry D]

Also one time yesterday I have the radio plugged in to the gfci itself and a game on on regular outlet right next to it, it kicked off the fan but the radio was still on. Reset and the fan came on.

Make sure all your line and load hots and neutrals are on the right screws. But my understanding is if they are swapped, the GFCI wont even reset.

 

[Terry D]

Also one time yesterday I have the radio plugged in to the gfci itself and a game on on regular outlet right next to it, it kicked off the fan but the radio was still on. Reset and the fan came on.

You mean the GFCI tripped, not the breaker, right.

This doesn't make sense, I cant see how that is possible. Are these 2 receptacles on the same circuit