Need help pulling out concrete anchors

[brihvac]

When I installed my lift I screwed up and should have drilled my holes deeper. I did not realize the bolts would pull up so far when they tightened. After I had my truck on it, I noticed the post were loose. I tightened them again but Im sure they will loosen more and to be honest with you, I dont feel safe under it. The directions that came with the lift are horrible. After searching the net, I found that most manufactors suggest you drill all the way through the foundation. Reason being if you ever need to move the lift,etc, you can just pound it clear through. The existing anchors are 5 1/2" wedge. I want to get them out and drill deeper then use 7" anchors. I was thinking of taking the nut off, then using a piece of pipe, make a spacer and screw the nut back on and tighten the hell out of it. Hopefully it will keep pulling up out of the concrete. If I had to guess I would say there is only about 3" or so in the concrete. In a way Im glad they are pulled up as far as they are because maybe they will be easier to get out.
Any other ideas?

Also I was going to take advantage of the Zoro tool sale and buy anchors.
Here are the 2 different ones I was looking at.

http://www.zorotools.com/g/Carbon Steel Wedge Anchors/00096058/

http://www.zorotools.com/g/Wedge Anchors Zinc Plated Steel/00113932/

Both are 3/4 dia. and 7" long. However one is zinc plated and the other is not. Does it make a differance? The price is double for the zinc plated. Greg Smith Equipment sells the 7" anchors for $7.00 each. They are local so there would be no shipping. However I would save money ordering them from Zoro.


Any advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[cj7365]

WOW, anchors are not made to come up, I would think you would destroy your concrete, it will take a lot of force to bring them up, why not just cut those studs flush and move your lift a few inches forward or backward and start over??

 

[shampoop]

Sounds like the anchors didn't seat correctly. Like the holes are a little bit too big for them to properly work. Sometimes happens when you don't drill straight.

 

[brihvac]

WOW, anchors are not made to come up, I would think you would destroy your concrete, it will take a lot of force to bring them up, why not just cut those studs flush and move your lift a few inches forward or backward and start over??

Yea, That might be the best idea. They have to be pulling up though. After I took my truck off, the nuts were loose enough to where I turned them by hand. I dont see any cracked concrete.

Its gonna be a pain disassembling the lift and moving it, but that may be what I have to do.

 

[brihvac]

Sounds like the anchors didn't seat correctly. Like the holes are a little bit too big for them to properly work. Sometimes happens when you don't drill straight.

I could see being crooked on a few, but not all of them. I used the bit they recommended (19mm) Maybe it should have been smaller?

 

[frankush]

Try loosening up the nut so it's flush with the top of the bolt. Take a hammer and try and tap them back down. Many times this will allow the expanding sleeve to lose it's grip on the concrete. Try and wiggle them out. You may have to do it a few times, but they should pull out. If they were real tough driving in, they'll be tough coming out. If they don't you might also think about using an epoxy. I'd call them if you don't have any luck. Drilled depth will be critical. Warning...............this stuff is not cheap.


http://www.us.hilti.com/holus/page/module/product/prca_rangedetail.jsf?lang=en&nodeId=-244640

 

[brihvac]

6" It was poured in the beginning of summer

 

[blk00ss]

Tighten up. Raise and lower your truck a few times. Give it a few shakes while up in the air. Tighten again. And as long as they tighten up you'll be fine. Don't sweat it.

 

[readhead]

They are not made to come out. If you do relocate the posts most wedge anchors are specified to not be closer than 3" apart. It is important to use a bit in good condition. A worn bit can bore a larger hole which may cause the anchor to not grip properly. We buy wedge anchors by the hundreds and fasten steel to concrete almost every day. Properly installed they work very well. Epoxy works well too but that is another story.

 

[brihvac]

I used a new bit. Greg Smith Equipment sells extra brackets also. Was wondering if I should go that route? $199
Not worried about spending the $199 as long as it makes it right and safe. I would also rather spend the money then go through the hassle of moving the lift. But.. I dont want to do it half *** and have it loosen. I will tell you one thing... You can be damn sure (if I go this route) that those anchors will be deep enough

 

[readhead]

Looks like a good fix.

 

[Drew_flux]

Most of the two post hoists at work have a habit of pulling the studs. we wack them back down every 3 months or so and check the nuts once a week.

 

[Sureshot]

Did you use a hammer drill?
I never had any luck using anchors with a plain rotary drill.

 

[RKA]

If you decide to use a hilti chemical anchor, I have an MD2500 dispenser you could borrow. It works with the HIT 330 and 500ml epoxy tubes. Looking at Hilti's website, I think you want the RE500 epoxy. The fast drying stuff mentioned above will likely cost more, but more importantly, unless you are in a hurry, it decreases your ability to fix a screw up.

 

[Aussie damo]

I use epoxy chemset every day. I use powers brand not sure if you have it over there but it has a 4 ton pull out. Much stronger than most concrete.
If you go down that road make sure all the concreted dust is out of your hole.
On that note if you were able to get mabe 1 out of each post is it an option to drill a mother hole or 2 in your base plate and use chemical anchored threaded rod? Just a thought.
Good luck.
http://www.powers.com/
Damo.

 

[readhead]

If you go with epoxy oversize the hole per the instructions and clean, clean, clean.

 

[brihvac]

If you go with epoxy oversize the hole per the instructions and clean, clean, clean.

Sent you PM Readhead

 

[readhead]

Home depot sells Redhead.

 

[jhelrey]

Did you drill all of the way through the concrete before you set your anchors? Not 100% clearly stated so I want to ask.

 

[shoot summ]

So the anchors are pulling up already, I would get a heavy sleeve larger than the OD of the anchors, a plate with a hole on top, a heavy nut, and pull them out the same way they are coming already, you could even use the lift to help them along to a certain point. I would then drill the holes deeper, use epoxy, and continue to check then regularly.

 

[brihvac]

I did not drill all the way through. I screwed up by not drilling deep enough. Im gonna buy the plates in the above post. I think Im gonna try and get one out to see how it goes. If I get them out Im gonna get longer anchors and drill all the way through, then reinstall.

 

[HAP]

How are you going to get the actual anchors out without moving the columns?

 

[brihvac]

How are you going to get the actual anchors out without moving the columns?

They pull through the hole. Same way as install

 

[Ironhorse]

been there done that...if your are using a Hilti or Bosch drill there is a set tool on the handle ( the metal rod ) use this in the future. For now pull the bolts as far up as you can, cut them off with a cutting wheel flush with the concret..then tap the bolt back down in the hole...take the hammer drill and lightly drill down..you are going to hit the metal sleve for your anchor bolt..when it spins take the drill out then get some needle nose pliers and pull it out you will need to crush it a bit..but it is light metal...then take a magnet tool and stick it down the hole for the bolt...and you get to start all over again...this time drill it deeper with the set tool on the drill..or just tape your drill bit...make sure your using the proper sized bit for the anchors...it will tell you on the box. If you drilled a hole that is to big you will need to get anchors that fit that hole...good luck on it.

 

[Vicious_Cycle]

If you try to pull the anchors out, you may get lucky with one or two of them, but I believe most likely you WILL mess up your concrete surface before you get them all out.

Learn from my mistakes! You don't want to pull them all back out.

 

[rbgearz]

Drive them back in and use epoxy. Let it set up, then retighten. We use this at work alot. Works great.

 

[AMCguy]

I read somewhere (either on my lift or wedge anchor instructions) that you should not drill all of the way through the slab. As I recall, the wedge anchor needs to bottom in the hole, then it is struck from above to open the sleeve, then tightened to wedge it firmly on place. If you drill all the way through the slab you aren't able to do this.

 

[zuk123]

As I recall, the wedge anchor needs to bottom in the hole, then it is struck from above to open the sleeve, then tightened to wedge it firmly on place. If you drill all the way through the slab you aren't able to do this.

This is the case with some styles of expansion bolt. There are many that look similar that do not need a bottom on the hole.

It is very important to read the directions for the actual anchor bolts you will be using and follow them completely. This is a life safety issue! YOUR LIFE!!

There are also rules for bolt spacing in the concrete, concrete strengths, torque, and minimum embedment. There is a lot of engineering and testing done to make these safe and secure, but you have to follow the rules to get the rated strength.


(^^^ posted this for the future reader, not necessarily the OP ^^^.)

Unfortunately, it's very easy to oversize the hole, especially the bottom (ie, a flaring hole.) If you do this, it will be loose, but is really unlikely that it's loose enough to get it back out. Hitting rebar, hard aggregate, or not staying perfectly plumb while pushing down will all tend to oversize the hole.

WRT depth, on my personal Bosch drill, the depth guide rod has a tendency to move... I take a piece of plastic pipe (pvc, electrical conduit, whatever is laying around) and cut it to the length I need to get proper depth hole. Slip it over the drill bit and drill until it stops you. Be sure to clean the hole well. I have a turkey baster with a piece of hose (well the jacket from some romex) that I stick down into the hole to blow it out. A vacuum doesn't really get all the dust out, even if you use a broom straw, piece of wire, etc to poke the hole while sucking...

Good luck, but the simplest thing is probably to drive them back in and cut them off flush, and then move the lift some and redrill.

zuk

 

[rasit]

If the anchors are tight now, I would fill the gap that is under those bearing plates with non-shrink grout, steel shims, or inject some kind of self leveling epoxy into the void that has been created due to your sloped floor and then add the Greg Smith brackets for insurance sake. The large gap you have is putting unnecessary pull strain on the anchors.

 

[wedge40]

What about cutting out the cement and re-pour. You could reinforce with rebar.
Just my thoughts.

Wedge

 

[brihvac]

Gonna just move the lift forward a few inches and drill all the way through the foundation (as recommended by Greg Smith Equipment) Im also gonna go with longer anchors 6 1/4"

 

[buzz4041]

As stated you better check to see if that type of anchor requires a bottom or not before I believed Greg Smith Equipment. I have installed many an anchor in my time and many different types and have never installed one that told me to drill all the way through the concrete. This sounds like a wives tale from hack lift installers that don't know what they are doing. If all else fails read the directions.

 

[brihvac]

Moved the lift forward 3". Used 7" Red Head Trubolts which looked and set a ton better than the bolts that came with the lift. I feel better now.

 

[blk00ss]

You didn't waste any time haha.

 

[brihvac]

You didn't waste any time haha.

I'm one of those guys that can not relax until its done. I will go to sleep at night and lie awake for hours thinking about it.

 

[Chucktown]

I'm one of those guys that can not relax until its done. I will go to sleep at night and lie awake for hours thinking about it.

I'm the same way. Literally I can't function at my day job because I've got that one thing lingering at home that's driving me crazy.

 

[Strouty]

Glad to see you got it resolved, you should still check torque often.

I am getting ready to install so anchors for my lift and they a Wej-it anchors. The anchor manufacturer seems to want a bottom, but mohawk states clearly to use these anchors and drill all the way through. I guess I am going by mohawk, they said this is the anchor we did all or specs and testing with.

This is the case with some styles of expansion bolt. There are many that look similar that do not need a bottom on the hole.

It is very important to read the directions for the actual anchor bolts you will be using and follow them completely. This is a life safety issue! YOUR LIFE!!

There are also rules for bolt spacing in the concrete, concrete strengths, torque, and minimum embedment. There is a lot of engineering and testing done to make these safe and secure, but you have to follow the rules to get the rated strength.

 

[brihvac]

I drilled all the way through. The Red Heads do not need a bottom and I checked with a few people that have lifts

 

[cj7365]

WOW, anchors are not made to come up, I would think you would destroy your concrete, it will take a lot of force to bring them up, why not just cut those studs flush and move your lift a few inches forward or backward and start over??

Gonna just move the lift forward a few inches and drill all the way through the foundation (as recommended by Greg Smith Equipment) Im also gonna go with longer anchors 6 1/4"

Glad you got it all worked out

 

[rburke65]

Well all this isn't making me feel real comfortable with my future Mohawk (used) installation. How can we have Mohawk telling us to drill through the concrete and then we have Wej-it anchor mfg. saying they need a "bottom". Sounds to me if, down the road, the user had an "issue" these two mfg. are covering their asses. If you have drilled through the concrete, then Wej-it says ' we told you our product needs a bottom. If you don't drill through and you have an issue, then you have Mohawk saying 'we told you to drill all the way through the concrete'. Either way, YOU are wrong.