New Craftsman Ratchets

[Mmfh]

Hey there,

I have a complaint about the New Craftsman Ratchets. They are garbage! I'm a big SO man and also fond of Mac and a few others, but over the years I've ended up with some Cman stuff as well.

I gave my wife a couple of older Cman Ratchets to take to Sears and exchange for new ones, they were stripped out in the head and wouldn't catch anymore.

Nice older Ratchets, both had the knurled wheel on the back side of the head. Loved that style!

Anyway, the ones they gave her have a plastic flipper lever for the direction and it feels loose as hell in the head as if its only good for one use. Garbage!
Almost feels like it could have a plastic gear inside?

What's going on at Sears, I thought tools and appliances were their money makers? Not tools anymore it seems. At least not from me.

Mm

 

[jjjrmx5]

They phased selling and repairing the knurled wheel ratchets many many years ago.

If you take them in for repair/exchange they will give you a raised panel (or polished pear head if you ***** enough and your old ratchet is polished) as the new replacement.

Q/R button is plastic any more and direction levers were metal until a decade ago.The slim line ratchets use a metal direction switch still. My pear heads and RP ratchets have worked fine for years and years using those parts.

It's pretty well known that if you want to keep you older Craftsman ratchets, you need to find a donor wrench to exchange guts or find a rebuild kit from a 2nd hand mfgr. If turned in to Sears, they take it and give you a new style in exchange.

 

[diesel research]

Wrong place to complain, gonna hurt a lotta peoples feelings.

 

[Boiler]

Wrong place to complain, gonna hurt a lotta peoples feelings.

Seriously? I thought everyone thought that raised panel craftsman ratchets were junk...?

 

[porphyre]

I gave my wife a couple of older Cman Ratchets to take to Sears and exchange for new ones, they were stripped out in the head and wouldn't catch anymore.

Nice older Ratchets, both had the knurled wheel on the back side of the head. Loved that style!

They haven't made that style ratchet for something like 10-15 years.

Just like your wife doesn't trust you to do the laundry, you shouldn't trust her to warranty tools.

The RHFT's were 45 tooth. Sounds like they gave her a crappy 36 tooth raised panel. I've heard of lots of guys getting the 60 tooth thin profile as a trade in for a RHFT.

 

[Mmfh]

Wrong place to complain, gonna hurt a lotta peoples feelings.

I intention was not to upset anyone, but its hard to deny that the tool line is going to hell.

I'm very curious, what is your avatar?? Can't make it out.

Mm

 

[BQuicksilver]

Today didn't have a lame Sears complaint yet. Thanks.

 

[Mmfh]

They haven't made that style ratchet for something like 10-15 years.

Just like your wife doesn't trust you to do the laundry, you shouldn't trust her to warranty tools.

The RHFT's were 45 tooth. Sounds like they gave her a crappy 36 tooth raised panel. I've heard of lots of guys getting the 60 tooth thin profile as a trade in for a RHFT.

Actually if I want my shirts to fit after their cleaned I clean them myself. I do all the cooking too.

I figured sending her to trade in a couple of tools, what could go wrong. They didn't give her a choice, as I'm sure they would have done the same to me. I feel like I would have rather kept my broken old ones than have these new plastic pieces of S$%!

I haven't exchanged any Cman stuff is obviously many years, and haven't bought anything new, so I had no idea what they were going to give her.

Mm

 

[bartels_metal_works]

I'm very curious, what is your avatar?? Can't make it out.

I believe that is the Ma Deuce!

 

[billymade]

Mmfh, next time see if they have a rebuild kit for it; IDK at this point if there are any rebuild kits left but you can get one from other brands that still sell that style of ratchet head.

 

[Mmfh]

Mmfh, next time see if they have a rebuild kit for it; IDK at this point if there are any rebuild kits left but you can get one from other brands that still sell that style of ratchet head.

I wished I would have known that, I doubt I could go back and they would still have my old ones?

Live and Learn.

 

[billymade]

The warranty is a "satisfaction" based warranty; go back and ask for a manager to remedy the situation. Tell them the old ones were much better (the plastic lever is a good argument) and you were given lesser as a exchange; hell, look at what they have new.... see if there is something you would like as a exchange; if not... ask for a credit with a sears card and get something else. Be firm, stand your ground and ask for management if you do not get anywhere and then call sears customer relations if they give you the run around... good luck!

 

[Davefr]

What's going on at Sears, I thought tools and appliances were their money makers? Not tools anymore it seems. At least not from me.

Mm

Sears is in a tough situation with the Craftsman warranty. Everyone buys old buckets of rusted tools at the garage sales and takes them in for a warranty exchange.

Sears has to replace them based on their lifetime satisfaction warranty.

Now they have to cheapen the new tools or go to China based on this huge warranty expense.

It's probably their strategy to try and limit the warranty exchanges.

 

[archirelic]

 

[kythri]

If it had a knurled wheel on the BACK side of the head, as the OP describes, then those sound like the Taiwanese-made (Stanley-contract?) Sears Canada-sold Craftsman ratchets, not RHFT, which are still made/sold.

RHFT have the knurled wheel on the front of the ratchet, integrated into the square drive.

They don't have repair kits for the Taiwanese/Canadian ratchets.

As far as quality, try using the ratchet before passing final judgement. Lots of people don't have an issue with them, and they're every bit as good as the craptacular old Canadian ratchets.

 

[diesel research]

I intention was not to upset anyone, but its hard to deny that the tool line is going to hell.

I'm very curious, what is your avatar?? Can't make it out.

Mm

I won't deny that, just saying a bunch of people get their ******* in a wad any time someone speaks ill of that brand. Especially if they mention liking truck brands in the same post.

My vote is get your money back OR possible partial trade for a premium or thin profile.

My avatar is my old M2.

 

[porphyre]

If it had a knurled wheel on the BACK side of the head, as the OP describes, then those sound like the Taiwanese-made (Stanley-contract?) Sears Canada-sold Craftsman ratchets, not RHFT, which are still made/sold.

RHFT have the knurled wheel on the front of the ratchet, integrated into the square drive.

They don't have repair kits for the Taiwanese/Canadian ratchets.

As far as quality, try using the ratchet before passing final judgement. Lots of people don't have an issue with them, and they're every bit as good as the craptacular old Canadian ratchets.

Well I'll be damned. I have a ratchet like you describe and assumed it was the famous RHFT because it's a round-head, it's got 45 teeth and has a thumbwheel.

Then I went and looked at it.... "Craftsman" on one side "243797" on the other. No USA anywhere.

Either way, this thing is waaaay better than my plastic pear-head raised panels.

Also, Sears phased out the roundhead ratchets last summer. I got one of the last ones. 45 tooth, no thumbwheel. 1/2" drive clearanced for like $6.50. I much prefer the thumbwheel style, even if it is Taiwan.

 

[Mike662]

They haven't made that style ratchet for something like 10-15 years..

Do you mean the RHFT?

I have a 3/8 RHFT flex head that I bought new from the Craftsman website about 2 years ago. I think you could still order that style from their website until fairly recently, but of course Sears didn't stock them in stores.

Kythri, you are saying they still make and sell the RHFT? I haven't been able to find anything on their website.

I wish I had bought a few more back when I got the flex head .

 

[thesilverone]

Pictures please to clear things up

 

[kythri]

Well I'll be damned. I have a ratchet like you describe and assumed it was the famous RHFT because it's a round-head, it's got 45 teeth and has a thumbwheel.

Then I went and looked at it.... "Craftsman" on one side "243797" on the other. No USA anywhere.

Either way, this thing is waaaay better than my plastic pear-head raised panels.

These:

http://www.sears.ca/product/craftsman-md-standard-locking-ratchet/609-000383596-42268

are the Canadian ones. Full polish, round (not raised-panel) handle, tri-wing selector, and knurled wheel on the back, around the selector.

These:

http://community.craftsman.com/Craf...-Release-Fine-Tooth-Roundhead-Ratchet-reviews

Are the RHFT. Picture doesn't show it well (though you can enlarge), but the knurled wheel is integral to the square drive piece. Raised-panel handle, "satin" finish rather than full-polish, and "bi-wing" selector with the quick-release in the middle.

Finally, there's these things:

http://www.searsoutlet.com/1-2-in-D...etails.jsp?md=ct_md&pid=12334&mode=buyNewOnly

Tri-wing, round head, but no knurled wheel, and no quick-release. They're not "full-polish", at least the ones I have and the ones on the shelf aren't - they're tooled/machined to have a "texture" to them (not cross-hatched) that's kinda interesting.

You'll typically find these in some of the socket kits, but they do sell them separately as well - they're decent enough, never had a problem with them.

Also, Sears phased out the roundhead ratchets last summer. I got one of the last ones. 45 tooth, no thumbwheel. 1/2" drive clearanced for like $6.50. I much prefer the thumbwheel style, even if it is Taiwan.

Doh - should have read closer. The product comes up on the sears.com site in a Google search, but it's unavailable for order.

There was a bunch of talk about them being discontinued, so I snapped up the models that I could, but given listings such as the ones I found a bit ago, didn't think they had actually discontinued them.

I had heard that you can get them from NAPA, but can't seem to find them in the catalog.

 

[jjjrmx5]

Thanks kythri.
I just assumed the OP had an older Taiwanese polished tri-wing based upon the knurling description.

I forgot about the RHFT.

Every knurled tri-wing I have traded in netted me a polished pear-head from Sears on teh ratchets I didn't care to fix or restore. Didn't bother me at all, but if prodded, they may give you a slim profile instead these days.

 

[porphyre]

Canada doesn't count.

I agree, the finish on the last generation round head is... different. The one I have is funny because the mill marking/laser effect, whatever you want to call it, stops about 1/2" from the end of the handle. The little ball end is a standard satin finish as is the flat face on the drive side. The selector side is milled just like the handle.

Older thread about Craftsman round-heads:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=44430

 

[kythri]

Grabbed some quick pics - not the greatest quality, but they should illustrate (these are all 1/2" drive):

From left to right:

Regular Raised Panel (QR)
Round Head "Full Polish" Tri-Wing (No QR)
Full Polish "Professional (QR) (same guts as the raised panel)
RHFT (QR)
Next Generation Thin Profile (QR)
Premium 84T (No QR)

A close-up of the RHFT knurled wheel:

I don't have a Taiwanese/Canadian anymore - I've had three different ones at one point or another, and they always ended up stripped/free-wheelin'.

 

[jjjrmx5]

Knurled polished tri-wing with Taiwan COO...

 

[kythri]

Thar she blows!

 

[NWphotog]

Sears is in a tough situation with the Craftsman warranty. Everyone buys old buckets of rusted tools at the garage sales and takes them in for a warranty exchange.

Sears has to replace them based on their lifetime satisfaction warranty.

Now they have to cheapen the new tools or go to China based on this huge warranty expense.

It's probably their strategy to try and limit the warranty exchanges.

Good points,doesn't make it easy to take though.

 

[kythri]

I still refuse to believe that Sears is losing money from their warranty policy, or that it has anything to do with off-shoring production.

If that were the case, then the hardline wouldn't still be made in the USA. The vast majority of stuff that is off-shored is significantly lower volume than the hardline.

The Craftsman Pro wrenches (as an example) were great, but I'd bet money that if we were ever to get our hands on sales figures, they never sold anywhere near the volume of them that raised panel stuff sells.

As far as "cheapening" the tools, when we're talking about stuff like the plastic selector lever in some ratchets, I'm sure someone figured that they can save tons of money because of sheer volume of ratchets sold by switching to plastic, but if those levers were really breaking on every single ratchet like some people try to claim, they'd switch back to metal to save replacement/repair expenses.

I'm one of those folks that don't seem to have any issues with the plastic selectors breaking on me...

 

[HandyManny]

Just my opinion having owned and used a selection of Cman tools over the last 50+ years. I think the overall quality of most of the Cman tool line has greatly diminished as of recent years, especially in most of the Danaher made stuff. Fit, finish, function, all gone out the window with many of their tools. I've voiced this before, and I'll say it again, but it truely is embarassing to see USA stamped onto such inferior tools. I had always thought that most USA manufacturers were better than that. Luckily there still are certain (non Danaher made) Craftsman tools that have retained their quality. But I think that's more attributed to certain particular contract manufacturers of those certain tools for Cman.

 

[kythri]

Dad's got a bunch of older Craftsman bought during the '70's and '80's, so 30-40 year old stuff. I like my newer production stuff far better.

The only CONSISTENT fit/finish issues are the chrome coloring issues, but that's more of an EPA regulation issue. I've had a few fit/finish issues with individual pieces, but that's one-off type of stuff that escapes from QC.

I find the ratchets to be every bit as good, and the newer designs that weren't available to Dad (like the thin profile or premium stuff) are phenomenally better.

I find the modern sockets and wrenches to be FAR superior, since they take advantage of the now-open patents of advances like "Flank Drive" or whatever non-trademarked name is being used. I love the laser-etching - as long a socket is still engraved, because the laser etch does seem to wear off over time - makes it super easy and super quick to identify.

Screwdrivers? They seem pretty much the same. I've moved to Craftsman Pro for that, and haven't had any issues.

Of course, that's just my opinion.

 

[jjjrmx5]

Good points,doesn't make it easy to take though.

To add to that, I've had to exchange a couple of polished pear heads over the last decade from being used hard (but never abused) and the teeth getting jammed or freewheelin'.

They were from my home box which is lightly used and the tools kept in immaculate shape. I took the first pear head in and they wanted to give me a replacement from the "returned and refurbed" rack where they fix the guts of returned ratchets and give them in exchange for what you bring in.

My pear head looked close to new and the several they had looked like someone used them for a hammer or pry bar as well and were pretty cosmetically damaged. I asked for a new one instead and was told no and the rebuilds were my only option. i then asked when the rebuild kid (it's always the 18 to 20 yo kids doing the guts swaps in my stores) was going to be in next and I'll bring it back in.

Did that both times and the practice still goes on with the "refurb" swap at the stores I've been in. I don't mind the re-build process but don't give me your ****** ratchet dregs in exchange for my minty tools Sears. Geesh.

 

[HandyManny]

Dad's got a bunch of older Craftsman bought during the '70's and '80's, so 30-40 year old stuff. I like my newer production stuff far better.

The only CONSISTENT fit/finish issues are the chrome coloring issues, but that's more of an EPA regulation issue. I've had a few fit/finish issues with individual pieces, but that's one-off type of stuff that escapes from QC.

I find the ratchets to be every bit as good, and the newer designs that weren't available to Dad (like the thin profile or premium stuff) are phenomenally better.

I find the modern sockets and wrenches to be FAR superior, since they take advantage of the now-open patents of advances like "Flank Drive" or whatever non-trademarked name is being used. I love the laser-etching - as long a socket is still engraved, because the laser etch does seem to wear off over time - makes it super easy and super quick to identify.

Screwdrivers? They seem pretty much the same. I've moved to Craftsman Pro for that, and haven't had any issues.

Of course, that's just my opinion.

I do agree, you are absolutley correct about the Chrome plating issues being more attributed to the EPA regs these days. It really is hard to find quality USA done chrome plating as of 2007.

As far as recent made wrenches goes, yes I will say that the Cman Professional high polished combo wrenches and Professional off-set box wrenches are excellent wrenches and are very nice to use. I own several, some are the earlier S-K made wrenches and some are the newer Danaher made ones. I use them a lot. The only issues I've seen is on the newer Danaher made chrome plating. I don't have this issue with any of the ones I own because mine were purchased at various times between 1995 and 2006, but have seen flaking occure on brand new wrenches still hanging right on the store shelf rack recently.

I also have a fondness for their current made Adjustable Wrenches as manufactured by Western Forge. Sure I prefere the older JH Williams made Cman adjustables, and own a couple, but the newer WF made wrenches are pretty good quality too. Never have had an issue with their screwdrivers either, as long as I use then as they were intended.

I think their current made ratchets **** big time. I also think their extentions should come with knurling or checkering on the shafts, makes for a more useful extention. Duralast does it.

 

[kythri]

I have zero issue with Sears refusing to replace the ratchet with a brand-new off-the-shelf ratchet if they're willing to rebuild yours while you wait.

That said, I do have issue with them trying to replace your ratchet with one in quite obviously worse condition, and if the counter goon doesn't understand, that's where you should invoke the "get the manager over here" procedure.

Quite honestly, if I'm taking a ratchet in, I'd rather have MY ratchet back (post-rebuild) than someone else's rebuild.

 

[porphyre]

I think their current made ratchets **** big time. I also think their extentions should come with knurling or checkering on the shafts, makes for a more useful extention. Duralast does it.

The newer 36-tooth cheap ratchets do **** bad. I personally don't like the handle shape on the 60-tooth ratchets, but everyone raves about them. I love everything about my 84-tooth rats. I think the fact that CMan is actually differentiating is good for business.

I agree on the knurling too. CMan's wobble extensions are knurled. I really want a knurled, locking, all metal, USA Made extension, but can't find one for less than the $30-$40 truck price. CMan are not knurled and I believe the lock mechanism is plastic.

 

[Mmfh]

Knurled polished tri-wing with Taiwan COO...

This one here is fairly close, only thing is I think Mine might have been even older, the Craftsman logo on mine looked older and the chrome looked thicker and heavier.

No doubt mine had been around for many years but I took good care of them.
The one I have now feels like if I pull on a tight bolt its going to strip out the head. The plastic lever doesn't even fit tight in the head, just feels like junk.

I might go to Sears today and ***** some and see what happens.

Thanks

 

[bighank57]

i have one on EBay for sale right now http://www.ebay.com/itm/270835892709?ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1555.l2649

 

[GoBlue]

Seriously? I thought everyone thought that raised panel craftsman ratchets were junk...?

I dont think they are junk. I dont like the plastic selector and QR button but ive never had one fail. In fact i have never broken one of these ratchets when a pipe wasnt involved. For the money...they are tough to beat IMHO

 

[jrodc455]

They're supposed to give you a thin profile ratchet if you exchange a fine tooth. I work there, it's right in our list of which ratchets to exchange for which.

 

[GirlnAgarage]

Have any of you guys compared any/all of your Cman items using the dates codes on them?

Out of all these Craftsman threads I see reference to "early" or "late" items but no years are ever referenced when giving an opinion of good or bad. Would it be possible to start using date codes and part numbers instead of just general descriptions? Maybe it's just me but specificity helps.


Here's the Craftsman date code thread:
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=84807&referrerid=72128

 

[kythri]

They're supposed to give you a thin profile ratchet if you exchange a fine tooth. I work there, it's right in our list of which ratchets to exchange for which.

Technically, though, those Canadian-sold Taiwanese ratchets aren't fine tooths, they are/were the equivalent of the raised panel ratchets sold in US Sears.

 

[jrodc455]

Oh ok it's one of those beasts. I don't know what the policy is for those. A lot of times they just need taken apart and cleaned out. I've saved a bunch of them from the scrap pile, not that they're worth saving lol.