New garage - very dissapointed!!!

[Lassen Forge]

Fresh concrete keeps drying/losing water for a long time (supposedly the Hoover dam is still curing).

If you put epoxy on too soon the moisture will fail it.

Damn, I feel like a dummy now! Shoulda picked up on that... thanks.

 

[slickgt1]

What happened to that one?

Lots of back and forth. Got shafted on something smaller, and not what initially wanted, and I think he lost some money on the deal. I think the contractor was a friend of a friend or something. Complete retaining wall failure, and improper construction.

Tempest, you know I have to say it, PORCELAIN TILE that place like a boss.

 

[C96]

I'm in no hurry (I've already waited a year) so I might as well make sure it's cured.

Looking for suggestions. I've used Rust Oleum water based in my other garage and want something more durable.

Hi Tempest,

Sounds like the project is moving along swiftly now since your thinking about floor coatings.

Like Lassen Forge mentioned, definitely put in the grit, or some type of non-slip material.

My daughter has a beautiful epoxy floor that my son put down for her and her husband. The slab may have been a little on the fresh side for installing the epoxy since the house was brand new, but my son in law was anxious and in a hurry to get moved in. He got the most expensive epoxy from Lowe’s (4-5 hundred bucks IIRC) and my son volunteered to do the job. Son in law wanted a smooth finish, so that’s what he got.

Let me tell you, the floor looks outstanding; it still has a wet look to it and is smooth as glass, not to mention it’s hard as a rock. Gas/oil spills don’t seem to bother it and it’s very easy to clean.

Downside:
• Extremely slippery even when clean and dry. Don’t attempt walking on it with socks on; you’ll go down…Lol.
• Extremely hard surface, drop a large hammer, or similar it will chip like a stone, but then so would bare concrete.

The floor has been in place now going on 3 years and still looks new. No issues of lifting, pealing, or coming off (yet).

Sorry, don’t remember the name of the product, but Lowe’s sold it approximately 2-3 years ago.

So far seems to be a good product, worked well on a new slab and something you can do yourself.

Have fun with your new garage and Good Luck!

 

[Tempest 455]

New concrete was poured today and walls were finished. A few lose ends and repairs will be completed. Hate to keep everyone following this thread waiting. Should be done by weekend or next week at latest. I will post up all that's been done once I'm satisfied and can elaborate on this ordeal.

Getting to the point where I can now start thinking about finishing drywall and floor coatings. I should have been at this point a year ago!

More to follow.

 

[Tyberius]

Sounds good! Happy to hear progress is being made.

 

[volleyball]

I should have been at this point a year ago!

I say that a lot too but it's procrastination

 

[Rkbuell]

It's been month with no updates, what's happening?

 

[malibulvr]

 

[BBChevro]

I've just read through this thread Tempest, and I'm glad to hear that it's finally getting fixed.

With the repairs/rebuilding done, you'll finally be able to start fitting it out how you want it.
The garage appears to be in a great spot in relation to the house and driveway, it looks like it's meant to be there (great looking house btw).

 

[Eric DC5]

Just read all of this... Wow. Glad that this headache is almost done.

 

[BobRae]

I hope the OP didn't jump off a tall building over this. I don't know what the local conditions are in his area, but I'd have had the contractor jack the whole structure up, dig everything out, drive piles to refusal, pour a new footing, set the building down. Then, dig out the fill under the floor, put in the correct depth and composition of gravel fill, compact it and pour a new floor. I'm sure all of that is the last thing the contractor was thinking about though. Hope it all worked out.

 

[Xicaque]

Perhaps the OP is busy installing drywall?

Hope is going for the better. I wonder if the contractor will give him 12 months warranty????

 

[Denwood]

Not sure if already covered in this thread, but what provision was made for drainage at the base of the retaining wall? Water + freezing next to an exterior retaining wall = guaranteed failures.

 

[Rkbuell]

Man, I sure would like to know the end of this story! Or who is buried in the cement.

 

[BBChevro]

The OP is still active on GJ (just not on this thread), so I presume he still has to maintain silence about the situation while legal proceedings are taking place.

Or, a settlement may have already been reached - but with a nondisclosure clause.

In which case, I hope he starts a new build thread (making no mention of the problems encountered, of course).

 

[Xicaque]

^^^ x3

or he is too busy in his new garage after the mediocre contractor fixed it the right way

 

[Danver]

or maybe there really is someone buried in the cement.

 

[stage20]

probably too fuming mad to talk about it.

 

[boobag]

if that were my garage, i would haul in a bunch of dirt and put it around the sides and back of the garage, to counter the weight of the fill inside, and to help protect the footing from frost.

 

[packofqtips]

i just read this whole thing hoping to find out the end result. hopefully its posted when all done

 

[Danno1]

.



Don't buy any floor epoxy fr the big box stores. I know people usually have probs.

I went with Ben Moore M70 epoxy. Expensive but about as rugged as it comes. I think Sherwin Williams has some good stuff too.

I finished mine smooth. Yes, it can be slippery when wet, but I didn't want to be crawling around under a vehicle on a gritted surface. Smooth is also easier to clean.



.

 

[metalhead212121]

Tempest 455 Tempest 455 is offline
Member

Last Activity: Yesterday 10:20 PM
User Lists

At least he's still coming back to garage journal. Fingers crossed he decides to update his post.

 

[Platonic Solid]

After reading this whole saga, outside of the OP leaving this thread on a cliffhanger, I have to wonder if due diligence was done when choosing the builder.

• Get at least 3 quotes with references
• Actually check the references
• Check with the BBB
• Verify License
• Check with your local Dept. of Consumer Protection for registered complaints
• Check recent litigation history

The last 4 can all be done online.

 

[kd3pc]

After reading this whole saga, outside of the OP leaving this thread on a cliffhanger, I have to wonder if due diligence was done when choosing the builder.

• Get at least 3 quotes with references
• Actually check the references
• Check with the BBB
• Verify License
• Check with your local Dept. of Consumer Protection for registered complaints
• Check recent litigation history

The last 4 can all be done online.

doing all that proves nothing about the builder, when you get right down to it. Especially as regards design and structural knowledge or capability to do the job right. BBB is useless on every front. Similarly is license check in a lot of jurisdictions, the license does not prove knowledge of building or capability to do so.

OP did things right.

 

[Platonic Solid]

doing all that proves nothing about the builder, when you get right down to it. Especially as regards design and structural knowledge or capability to do the job right. BBB is useless on every front. Similarly is license check in a lot of jurisdictions, the license does not prove knowledge of building or capability to do so.

OP did things right.

Reputation and history proves everything about a builder. No single item listed proves everything. Put them all together and you have a fighting chance. I certainly could have missed it, and there's no way I'm digging through this whole novel again to search, but I don't recall the OP stating anything about his selection process. So you’re saying that the OP hired a licensed contractor with good validated references, a clean complaint and litigation history, who just, out of the blue, happened to build a total POS. I think not.

 

[metalhead212121]

Reputation and history proves everything about a builder. No single item listed proves everything. Put them all together and you have a fighting chance. I certainly could have missed it, and there's no way I'm digging through this whole novel again to search, but I don't recall the OP stating anything about his selection process. So you’re saying that the OP hired a licensed contractor with good validated references, a clean complaint and litigation history, who just, out of the blue, happened to build a total POS. I think not.

I REALLY would like to agree with you that reputation and history proves everything about a builder. I'd also REALLY like to agree with the last part of your sentence as well. In my case this royally blew up in my face. Long story short I needed work done. Hired a guy who a friend of my raved about. I PERSONALLY went to go see work that he did at other houses since it was a town or two away. My friend owns/rents out a couple houses near me. I liked it.. nothing amazing but solid. The work that was done on my house SUCKED. I called him out on it and he didn't want to hear anything. This is just one example of how your argument (for me) doesn't hold water. I don't have a ton of examples to REALLY fight it out with you. This one instance was enough for me not to believe "he did a good job on other peoples houses I'm sure he'll do a great job on mine." In the end the next guy I hired did a great job. He was a lot more professional, provided a ton of references but NONE of the people I called got back to me on whether his work was good or not. I took the gamble and hired him. I called a lot other people to quote the job out. I didn't feel good about ANY of them. In the end I went with the guy I felt most comfortable with. I had a feeling he was blowing smoke up *** saying that I needed to hire "old Italian Masons" to get the job done right. Big surprise.. the guys that showed up to do the job DEFINATLY were not Italian.... They were hard workers though.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Sounds like you need better friends metalhead. I was just kinda being an **** with the "everything" comment to contrast the equally arsey "nothing" comment by kd3. Personally, I get contractor references from other contractor trades, references from friends, the Town Hall (who isn't supposed to recommend anyone specific, but ... (wink wink nudge nudge), hardware store, lumber yard ...

Hiring a new contractor is always a risk, but the risk can diminished. Anyone who values their money would be wise to educate themselves on how a particular project is supposed to be done. A little research on foundations, retaining walls and the local building code would have enabled the OP to have an intelligent conversation with potential bidders.

I'm just trying to find out how this particular contractor was selected and maybe learn something from this. Was he the lowest bidder? Best snake-oil salesman? Bring his 20 yr old daughter with him?

 

[metalhead212121]

Platonic Solid- Again I'd like to agree with you but in my personal experiences this has NOT been true.

I know some of the guys in my Town Hall. Lets just say they aren't exactly on the up and up. I don't know how it works in other towns but in my town you can only talk about getting the paperwork for a work permit ONE day out of the week between the hours of 9AM and I believe Noon. What a joke. And then at the end of the day they get to give you a hard time. You never win. You decide to say "screw it" and do work without a permit trying to cheat the system and then the building inspector drives around.. catches you trying to work the system.. demands you stop work.. pay the fine etc. OR you try to do things the RIGHT way and still get **** on. In the end I had to "name drop" just to lighten the whole mood while trying to do things the right way. Somehow the price for a permit doubled from the time I asked about permits to the time I applied for it. (a total of 7 days) At that point I didn't care.. just wanted my permit so I could move forward LEGALLY.

Contractor references? The ONE contractor that did an amazing job for me I called later on A COUPLE times for suggestions for other work and questions about something else. His answers ranged from "I don't have time for this phone call" to "I'll call you back later I'm busy." Those where his exact words and no he never called me back since it didn't involve him making money. Sadly I plan on using him for some other work down the road. He does great work.. came to do an estimate EXACTLY when he said he would. Started and finished when he said he would. Just don't like his personality.

Asking questions before the work starts? That's a flip of the coin on here or any internet forum for the matter. You can see that if a thread starts out "positive" there's a good chance it will stay positive. This thread in particular is filled with great information. I can think of other threads here that turned into a **** show to where I'm sure the OP's were banging their head into the wall saying why did I even bother asking for help.

As far as me needing better friends?? I'll recap real quick what happened between me and my friend.

Me: Hey friend who would you recommend for "xyz"?
Friend: Without a doubt go with this guy. Go visit my properties that I rent out and so you can see his work first hand.
Me: Sounds good.
See his work first hand.. looks good.. hire him and the work is garbage.
Friend: Who the hell did that work?!?!!?
Me: THE GUY YOU RECOMMENDED.
Friend: Couldn't be.. it was DEFINATLY so and so???
Me: YES.
Friend: I don't know what happened but you need to talk to the owner Frank. I've dealt with him forever. He'll make it right.
Me: I DID DEAL WITH FRANK RIGHT FROM THE START. HE DOESN'T WANT TO HEAR ****.
Friend: I'm so sorry I recommended him to you.....

Fortunately between my friend and SOME members here were able to tell me what to say to get my money back from the first contractor. For that I'm forever grateful!

 

[Platonic Solid]

Interesting how our experiences with contractors are so different. I actually can’t think of even one time that I haven’t been satisfied with the work of the contractors I’ve hired. Sure there have been a few minor mistakes, but they were always immediately repaired when brought to their attention. I’ve also never hired anyone that I didn’t have a comfortable easy-to-talk-to rapport with.

I tend to do way too much research into whatever project I’m hiring for before talking to potential bidders. Everything I expect is always presented to the bidding contractor in a step by step outline and a drawing package if appropriate, presented on paper and emailed.

I do have some large construction projects planned for the future. My first step, after I’ve done my homework and documented what I want, will be to visit with an architect** to review my basic plan and have them make the necessary drawings for the town hall**. If money is not an issue, you can hire the architect to manage the whole project, but that will add 20% to your total cost.

After town approval I will go straight to the local cement suppliers** for foundation quotes. Not some subcontractor who’s going to tack on 20%.

**While I’m there (architect+town hall+cement suppliers) I will ask for builder recommendations. I should now have at least 6 builder recommendations. Those with the cleanest online history, with priority given to names that have been mentioned by more than one source, will be contacted for quotes. I’ll likely hire each trade independently which generally works out since the building inspector tends to hold up construction progress between stages anyway. They can’t exactly jump on command as they have a schedule of their own.

When the contractors are hired and arrive, the project site is always prepped (clean and as obstacle free as possible) and ready to go. The project outline and drawings are handed out again and briefly discussed before work begins (never underestimate the power of donuts and coffee to start a large project on a positive note). I always take the time off from work the first day. On multiple day projects, depending on my comfort level with the contractor(s)and complexity of the project, I may take more time off or go into work half a day or a whole day with a long lunch to stop home to check on things. There’s very little room left for misunderstanding or errors.

 

[Speedy2222]

interested to see what the outcome of this was

 

[Mike007]

The majority of contractors are horrible. That's my opinion as a contractor. I witness it daily. Part of the problem is most people are shopping for the cheapest price.

In regard to this thread, I wouldn't pass judgment on the contractor until all is said and done. Things happen. Mistakes happen. If the contractor jumps through hoops to make this right, it probably doesn't happen to him very often. The hacks who screw up every job generally run away fast and are never heard from again.

 

[Clik]

As a contractor who has dealt with many settlement issues, the first thing I see is a very green low area which indicates possibly soft ground.

The second thing I see is a downhill slope from a previous construction site which alerts me to the high probability that spoils from clearing for the house may have been pushed in that direction.

I would be concerned with compaction and thinking: heavy rebar monolithic slab.

The next thing I see is poured footers with lots of top soil in the center where the slab is to go. Why wasn't that scarped off prior to pouring the footers?

Then why is that puddle of concrete laying in the center of grass and garden soil?

I don't know what was done as far as rebar goes but all in all I see a SLOP JOB!

I doubt you'll get much help from the inspector because unless a soil compaction test was done he should have never passed the footers BEFORE pouring.

Where does this stand now.

I wish you the best.

 

[Tempest 455]

I'm back!

Sorry for the delay. The process was lengthy and I got busy afterwards. To the point I can post some pics. Need to upload them this weekend so I can post. I will have some time off so I promise I will post all updates this weekend sometime.

In short, I'm pleased it's been forward progression. Hopefully by Sun AM will have detailed update.

 

[carcajou]

Great to see you back. Looking forward to your update on Sunday too!

 

[BBChevro]

Welcome back Tempest, I look forward to hearing all about it.

 

[Notgrownup]

Glad it's progressing.

 

[volleyball]

It's a Christmas Miracle!

 

[Tempest 455]

I appreciate all the positive comments on this over the last year. It’s been extremely frustrating and I’ve done my best to remain calm (for the most part) regarding the matter. I did come unglued with the builder and his salesman at one point but it could have been worse.

I’m going to point out what was done and resolved. For those that say, “you should have done this or made them do this, etc., etc.”. I consulted with an attorney and engineers many times on this matter. They explained the best course of action was to be firm, educated about the situation and let the builder resolve the issue without legal action. They said that is the ideal course of action. He explained the cost of taking this to court would escalate quickly. In fact, depending on what a ******* match it might become, could approach the cost of the structure. So that would not really be an option.

So in the end, I got the engineers on my side, and got some 3rd party engineering/construction recommendations and continued to remind the builder of that fact. I’m absolutely positive he knew if it did go to court, he would lose so he did pretty much what the engineer recommended. So I’m going to point things out step by step. As I posted before, I’m trying to keep this positive. So if you have nothing positive to add, please don’t comment.

The head engineer was very knowledgeable and knew right away what the problems were. As some have posted in previous comments and as I found from 3rd parties, we all knew this, the wall was not constructed properly, fill was not done properly. He said even though the wall was an issue, the fill was the root of the problem. He said since it was not filled in lifts, it settled massively. When holes were drilled to check the settling, one side of the garage, there was 6” of air gap between the fill and concrete. He said the slab was sliding over to the side pushing the wall out.

He had the footings excavated to inspect and they looked fine.

He did soil compact test of the dirt around the footings and found it to be just fine.

His recommendations were the following:

*Excavate the entire perimeter and install new footings. Not sure why but these were at least twice and wide as the previous.

*Install a new wall around existing wall. This walled was core filled and laterally reinforced with rebar. Wall was capped.

*Most of garage floor was busted out. The front part was OK and was the footer for the front of the garage.

*Holes were drilled into existing slab and rebar crossed to opposing walls. New concrete poured in remainder. I have since painted the outside walls.

In the course of this, they had to move my electrical, cable line etc. With the cost of the new footers, walls, concrete, electrical cont., downspouts, this must have cost them significantly. He was not happy about it, I was not happy about it but it got done finally.

So I finally started some forward progression on my other projects. Got 50 sheets of drywall delivered and 2 guys came and hung all of it in 6 hours. Another two guys came the next day and did the mud. Had it done in a day and came back another day and finished. They were awesome, looks better than the drywall in my house. You can’t see a single seam!

I painted and got most of the trim done.

Hung some T8 lights (not sure how I’m wiring yet, so wiring is temp). Started to work on the window trim. Should be done this winter with all of that.

Building workbenches over X-mas vacation.

Bought my epoxy floor but too cold to apply. That’s the 1st project in the spring.

Having gone through this, my best recommendation would be to ask for references (many) and talk to them before choosing a builder. In my case, it was a very reputable home builder that does nice work. However, they attempted to start another sub company to construct garages and let some people run it that had no business running a construction business. The engineer (who was really open and honest with me) said they now have him approve everything before they construct a garage. So apparently they learned a very expensive lesion.

It’s finally nice to post some positive stuff after all of this. I have a thousand pics of what they actually did but posting the main things. I will add to the progression of this over the next few months.

 

[7th Kahuna]

So glad to see it come to some sort of resolution, and in time for the holidays no less. Good on you, good on them. Look forward to seeing what all you do with it now.

 

[jd_1138]

Beautiful garage, house and Mopar!