PEX air lines?

[Falcon67]

Not to mention those who might run a line through an attic.

Exactly why I skipped it and will continue with my 1/2" black iron. Once the temp starts up, the pressure rating falls way off.

Also, IIRC from another thread on this, meeses like to munch on Pex, so keep that in mind.

 

[financer83rs]

i used pex. Have run it 150' from my basement out to my two garages. All run either in the walls, attic or under ground. No problems. Easy to work with and not expensive. Its been five years with no issues.

 

[HoosierBuddy]

Just because PEX has not been "Rated" or "Tested" doesn't mean it won't work, it just means that nobody has tested it thoroughly enough to get a rating.

This is the problem I run into ALL THE TIME with people who run their own natural as piping. When will the insanity end?

If it's not rated for it by the manufacturer and not allowed by code...THEN YOU SHOULDN'T DO IT.

I too have some pex water line in my house. I too was very impressed with it for water (hydronic heating system). I would never use it for air because it wasn't designed for that.

What I like about my shop air lines (black iron) is that I can not use them for weeks and the compressor never has to kick on. It tooks some time and effort to get to that point. If my air lines were PEX buried in a wall and the compressor was cycling, how would I even begin to start finding and fixing the leaks?

Phil

 

[Zick]

This is the problem I run into ALL THE TIME with people who run their own natural as piping. When will the insanity end?

If it's not rated for it by the manufacturer and not allowed by code...THEN YOU SHOULDN'T DO IT.

I too have some pex water line in my house. I too was very impressed with it for water (hydronic heating system). I would never use it for air because it wasn't designed for that.

What I like about my shop air lines (black iron) is that I can not use them for weeks and the compressor never has to kick on. It tooks some time and effort to get to that point. If my air lines were PEX buried in a wall and the compressor was cycling, how would I even begin to start finding and fixing the leaks?

Phil

Insanity huh
As long as your smart about it and do it correctly, what's the difference?

I guess you don't like to think outside the box.

Edit: So are your black pipe buried in the walls? PEX doesn't have to be inside the walls.

 

[Gary S]

Our shop uses a lot of 1/2" nylon tubing:

http://www.camozzi-usa.com/documents/fittings/tubing/nylon-11-tubing.pdf

with push lock fittings:

http://www.camozzi-usa.com/documents/fittings/fittings/nickel-plated-brass-push-in-fittings.pdf

for industrial pneumatic equipment.

It's way easier to work with than iron or copper pipe.

I've seen the same thing on air powered undustrial equipment. The equipment manufacturers used nylon lines with brass push in fittings. This equipment operates at 150psi, and the machines are 20-30 years old and running strong with no nylon line failures.

 

[jack stand]

Insanity huh
As long as your smart about it and do it correctly, what's the difference?

I guess you don't like to think outside the box.

He must have missed the "home run" idea. The stuff is only about .25 cents per foot and just like black pipe, it's only going to leak at a fitting. You could do a couple of 3/4" home runs to the comp. to "branch" manifolds on opposing shop walls then branch out from there if you have a large shop. If it 's smaller just home run every outlet.

 

[79mudbugg]

IMHO rapid air *****. No offense to anyone who has used it. I have 3/4 steel pipe in my set up. the only other option i remotely thought about was this Maxline set up. ITs big enough to carry volume where you need it and has great reviews.

bout the rapid air statement<<<<< is this from experince or do you know some1 with the system?

i have personally seen pvc blow the pieces and sounds like a bomb goning off.cant say i would use it, but to each its own

 

[Kev442]

I don't think it has been stressed enough that both pex and carmozzi have ratings that drop below 100 psi if the tubing temperature hits 150 degrees. Whether this happens in the attic or from high air temperature from the compressor air itself.
This is why pex will never get an air rating, it will not pass.

I'll also mention like others have, mousers and chipmonkers love to chew on pex.

 

[jjpp]

I still don't understand why everyone insists on leaving their compressors turned on. I turn mine off and close the ball valve at the compressor every night. It's not that hard and even if it leaked from the drain my compressor would live to see another day.
Not to say I haven't forgotten a few times after a few pops

 

[ptschram]

I still don't understand why everyone insists on leaving their compressors turned on. I turn mine off and close the ball valve at the compressor every night. It's not that hard and even if it leaked from the drain my compressor would live to see another day.
Not to say I haven't forgotten a few times after a few pops

X2, it was easy for me to find a DPST switch with a 20 amp rating for my compressor. The switch is right next to the main light circuit switch, last thing I turn off at the end of the day.

 

[eboy]

Do not use pex or pvc. Google osha regarding that. Just did my new shop with Kaesr Smart pipe. Relatively new aluminum pipe with all twist lock fittings:
http://us.kaeser.com/Products_and_Solutions/piping/pipe.asp

only other choice I would ever consider is copper.

 

[Gregory M]

I have been using PEX water line for my air line in my garage for over 2 years now with no problems. Easy to use and install my system is an older 5 hp running at 120 psi.

 

[Gary S]

I have been using PEX water line for my air line in my garage for over 2 years now with no problems. Easy to use and install my system is an older 5 hp running at 120 psi.

Two years isn't what I would consider a thorough test. It is barely a start. I know of one large shop in my area that has PVC lines for the past 20+ years on a 200psi system with no failures. That doesn't mean that PVC is rated for this use. It simply means that it hasn't failed yet.

 

[ptschram]

Do not use pex or pvc. Google osha regarding that. Just did my new shop with Kaesr Smart pipe. Relatively new aluminum pipe with all twist lock fittings:
http://us.kaeser.com/Products_and_Solutions/piping/pipe.asp

only other choice I would ever consider is copper.

I've never seen any OSHA restrictions on PEX.

Cite???

 

[Zick]

Do not use pex or pvc. Google osha regarding that. Just did my new shop with Kaesr Smart pipe. Relatively new aluminum pipe with all twist lock fittings:
http://us.kaeser.com/Products_and_Solutions/piping/pipe.asp

only other choice I would ever consider is copper.

Where? I didn't find anything regarding OSHA and PEX.

Interesting that I find that Duratec quotes itself as passing OSHA standards.

http://www.ipexinc.com/Content/Prod...rketId=9&MarketSegmentId=1&LanguageCode=en-CA

 

[indymx6]

bout the rapid air statement<<<<< is this from experince or do you know some1 with the system?

i have personally seen pvc blow the pieces and sounds like a bomb goning off.cant say i would use it, but to each its own

I have a few friends that had the 1/2" rapid air that they were always chasing leaks. the maxline kit seems to not have those problems. I would never ever use PVC anyone on this forum knows that to even mention it is heresy. I personally used 3/4 inch iron and am more than happy and it cost less money so win win.

 

[Gonsenheimer]

I have a twin compressor supplying 600 liter/minute 10 bar ( 146PSI ) and I use the white PEX/AL/PEX 1/2" pipe for feeding in my workshop. It is the regular installation stuff you use for hot water or central heating. It is specified for 70°C / 158°F at 10 bar /146PSI for drinking water or 100°C / 10 bar /146PSI for heating application.
A plumber once tested the burst pressure and did not succed with a pressure of 70 bar / 1015 PSI ! I was told that the inner flow resistance is much lower with PEX than metal and that your pressure drop on long pipes - especially for water - is much lower.

I have it in use for about 1 year and yesterday I finished my feeding pipes for Argon ( TIG and MIG / MAG welding ) from which I can now easily connect via plugs my welders.

UV stability inhouse - even behind windows - should not be an issue as regular window glass will block UV-B ( ... you will not tan in your car when windows are up ) and let pass UV-A at a rate of approx 10%.
Try to get certified pipes, - on our local market ( Germany ) it COSTS AROUND 0.80€/ Meter ( 1.10$ / 40 inches ) which I find reasonable cheap compared to copper or steel.

I would neither reccomend Nylon nor PVC for pressure pipes, Nylon might be the better choice of both but has a tremendous water pick-up, is too rigid and there is a problem with chemical resistance against sulphur acid. PVC contains plasticiser which will disappers making it very brittle then. Polyethylene is very good against chemical exposure, contains no additives which dissapear over time and has a good hydrolytic stability.

So use it, but take care that you protect it against heat ( welding / grinding / flames / sparks )

 

[Gonsenheimer]

I have a twin compressor supplying 600 liter/minute 10 bar ( 146PSI ) and I use the white PEX/AL/PEX 1/2" pipe for feeding in my workshop. It is the regular installation stuff you use for hot water or central heating. It is specified for 70°C / 158°F at 10 bar /146PSI for drinking water or 100°C / 10 bar /146PSI for heating application.
A plumber once tested the burst pressure and did not succed with a pressure of 70 bar / 1015 PSI ! I was told that the inner flow resistance is much lower with PEX than metal and that your pressure drop on long pipes - especially for water - is much lower.

I have it in use for about 1 year and yesterday I finished my feeding pipes for Argon ( TIG and MIG / MAG welding ) from which I can now easily connect via plugs my welders.

UV stability inhouse - even behind windows - should not be an issue as regular window glass will block UV-B ( ... you will not tan in your car when windows are up ) and let pass UV-A at a rate of approx 10%.
Try to get certified pipes, - on our local market ( Germany ) it COSTS AROUND 0.80€/ Meter ( 1.10$ / 40 inches ) which I find reasonable cheap compared to copper or steel.

I would neither reccomend Nylon nor PVC for pressure pipes, Nylon might be the better choice of both but has a tremendous water pick-up, is too rigid and there is a problem with chemical resistance against sulphur acid. PVC contains plasticiser which will disappers making it very brittle then. Polyethylene is very good against chemical exposure, contains no additives which dissapear over time and has a good hydrolytic stability.

So use it, but take care that you protect it against heat ( welding / grinding / flames / sparks )

 

[Justin C]

I ordered the Maxline 3/4 in mater kit last night from Grizzly. It was the chepest i have seen it at $200.00 for the kit. I thought i would give it a try and see what happens.

 

[tonycastec]

I have a twin compressor supplying 600 liter/minute 10 bar ( 146PSI ) and I use the white PEX/AL/PEX 1/2" pipe for feeding in my workshop. It is the regular installation stuff you use for hot water or central heating. It is specified for 70°C / 158°F at 10 bar /146PSI for drinking water or 100°C / 10 bar /146PSI for heating application.
A plumber once tested the burst pressure and did not succed with a pressure of 70 bar / 1015 PSI ! I was told that the inner flow resistance is much lower with PEX than metal and that your pressure drop on long pipes - especially for water - is much lower.

* Gonsenheimer- Great - a poster who quotes facts ,is logical,has experience and doesn't confuse pex with Pex-Al-Pex or pvc.
Thanks for your welcome contribution to the(.... err) discussion..

 

[tonycastec]

Good call ! Grizzly shipping is half what Northern Tool want on EBay.

 

[79mudbugg]

Do not use pex or pvc. Google osha regarding that. Just did my new shop with Kaesr Smart pipe. Relatively new aluminum pipe with all twist lock fittings:
http://us.kaeser.com/Products_and_Solutions/piping/pipe.asp

only other choice I would ever consider is copper.

hey eboy, can u tell me more bout this system? how big is your shop? what type of compressor you have? have you had any leaks yet? how long have you used it? and what is the cost?

 

[indymx6]

i almost went with the smart pipe type setup myself. it has great reviews. when i set mine up cost was my main concern. let us know how it turns out justin!

 

[Cobra6]

I think the tubing that is used by Rapidair and other setups is actually PUVEX, not PEX, even though a similar variation of nylon tubing.

The ratings are different.

 

[Full Throttle]

I have delt alot with pex pipe, I have seen it freeze and be frozen for day's with no rupture, copper woulda split in 2. I am getting ready to run air lines in my shop and I'll use pex, I would use 3/4'' not 1/2'' though for volume

 

[sberry]

Next time I have to plumb a house I am going to get all the pex stuff and will skip a lot of fittings, as was said, 1/2 home runs to fixtures. wouldn't scare me to run it in the walls especially no fittings. Ina small shop 1/2 will be plenty, the runs are so short and additional hoses and fittings will add way more line friction than a few feet of 1/2.

 

[Big-Foot]

Other than the additional expense over black pipe, is there any problem with using galvanized pipe? Very little to any corrosion problems even with damp air I would think..

I am about to plumb my new shop and am looking at doing it all in 3/4" or maybe 1" galvanized.

Edit...
Sorry for the thread drift... Moderator please delete if inapproriate..

 

[eboy]

I'm still setting up the shop, though all air lines are done. It is 9600 sq. ft. and I have two Kaeser screw compressors. 1@5hp & 1@10 hp. I need to be running 8 hrs. a day! If one is being serviced, I will switch over. I will post some pics soon. Also, I manufacture cabinetry. My move to this shop should happen third week of april. I plan on testing my system for air leaks soon as I have to do the wiring switch over on the compressor to 480volts.

 

[Justin C]

I started to put in my Maxline kit today. It isnt too bad to work with. It cuts very good with the cutters in the kit. It bend fairly good but getting it perfectly strait wont happen. I didnt get all done as i forgot some other parts i needed to hook up my air hose so i will have to finish another day.

 

[Full Throttle]

Other than the additional expense over black pipe, is there any problem with using galvanized pipe? Very little to any corrosion problems even with damp air I would think..

I am about to plumb my new shop and am looking at doing it all in 3/4" or maybe 1" galvanized.

Edit...
Sorry for the thread drift... Moderator please delete if inapproriate..

I don't like galv pipe for anything. contrary to popular belief you have about 10yrs before you start haveing leaks at the fittings from corrosion

 

[cj7365]

I started to put in my Maxline kit today. It isnt too bad to work with. It cuts very good with the cutters in the kit. It bend fairly good but getting it perfectly strait wont happen. I didnt get all done as i forgot some other parts i needed to hook up my air hose so i will have to finish another day.

Looking at the kit you bought, its now $180 bucks, not to happy with "cant get it perfectly straight, can you take some pics of your install, like mounting to the walls etc..

 

[Big-Foot]

I don't like galv pipe for anything. contrary to popular belief you have about 10yrs before you start haveing leaks at the fittings from corrosion

Sorry FT, not buying that...

According to the local gas company (Centerpoint Energy)The steel in Black Pipe is the same grade of steel in galvanized pipe. Galvanized pipe fitting threads are cut "after" the galvanizing process. Hence the threads / joints are of the same quality as the black pipe.
If the Gas company is good with Galv pipe (and they are), and the pipe's max pressure is within tolerance of need - then it should be just fine for use in air lines.

 

[Gonsenheimer]

I don't like galv pipe for anything. contrary to popular belief you have about 10yrs before you start haveing leaks at the fittings from corrosion

The sealing you normally use at the fittings avoids corrosion.
Even with 10 bar (145PSI) water in galvanized pipe you will not run in leakage problems for at least 20 years if you did a proper job avoiding galvanic corrosion ( material mix with copper etc. or contact to concrete / brickstone ).
Internal corrosion of the pipe will happen, if galvanized or not, particles will be picked up by air. This due to humidity of the air compressed and dew in cold pipes. Plastic pipe remains warm therefore less dew and has no internal corrosion. It is even cheaper.

Steelpipe would only be an option for me if I would consider to feed high pressure hot steam. ( unfortunately I have not yet found anything to run with hot steam..)

 

[tonycastec]

Sorry FT, not buying that...

According to the local gas company (Centerpoint Energy)The steel in Black Pipe is the same grade of steel in galvanized pipe. Galvanized pipe fitting threads are cut "after" the galvanizing process. Hence the threads / joints are of the same quality as the black pipe.
If the Gas company is good with Galv pipe (and they are), and the pipe's max pressure is within tolerance of need - then it should be just fine for use in air lines.

Sometimes the responses are a little of line.
1. Gas line pressure is insignificant compared to that from a mdern 2 stage compressor
2. Most gas line is PLASTIC ! Specifically the yellow pipe is HDPE a close relative of PEX !

 

[darkk]

I like all these guys with their it will freeze or explode. Pex tubing is a lot stronger than you would think. I pressure tested mine to 135 psi (in the winter at near 0 deg) for a month for plumbing inspection. No problems. I'm using pex in my garage for air...3/4" main and 1/2" drops. Easy to assemble, Easy to repair if necessary, won't explode with shrapnel if it fails (unlikely) it will just split... I used regular water line red and blue colors. Black oxygen barrier (heating) is good also. I'm not running 175 at the pex, I set my compressor output regulator at 125psi...and I'm a professional body man. I have trouble seeing why anyone would have 175psi at their drops. In almost 50 years I have never used that kind of pressure, and the pressure doesn't drop enough over a 100-150 ft to warrant it.

 

[96snma]

I'v been reading up on things for awhile now and thought this was a good place to make my first post.

This is the stuff you need. Its the line that someone said they use on semi trucks in an earlier post. Its rated to 600psi and I used it on my truck at 200 everyday. works well. The only thing is it comes pre rolled and retains that shape so you have to stretch it out and let it sit for a day in the sun. I use PTC fitting and they make the world of difference for ease of use.

http://thorbros.com/air-line-dot/1/2-air-line/12-dot-reinforced-air-line

fittings
http://thorbros.com/catalog/fittings

 

[Falcon67]

Other than the additional expense over black pipe, is there any problem with using galvanized pipe? Very little to any corrosion problems even with damp air I would think..

I am about to plumb my new shop and am looking at doing it all in 3/4" or maybe 1" galvanized.

I use both because the stores are usually out of some fitting or other in black or gal. So I just get. I tore down my 3 year old system for out move, didn't notice anything special about the black iron or any gal pieces. I have a portable regulator and reg/filter that moves around the shop so if there is debris that should catch it. Black is cheaper than gal, so I use black. Otherwise it's whatever IMHO.

 

[tonycastec]

"This is the stuff you need"
Guys we need to be a bit more specific.
There is a huge diffference in specs between :
HDPE
PEX
PEX-AL-PEX
PVC of any sch and size
Sch 80 CPVC 3/4"
ABS
If you don't specify which you are talking about ,it is meaningless.

 

[Gonsenheimer]

"This is the stuff you need"
Guys we need to be a bit more specific.
There is a huge diffference in specs between :
HDPE
PEX
PEX-AL-PEX
PVC of any sch and size
Sch 80 CPVC 3/4"
ABS
If you don't specify which you are talking about ,it is meaningless.

HDPE ---> you will only find PEX ( PEX is crosslinked HDPE )
PEX ---> see above
PEX-AL-PEX ---> best choice, multilayer PEX / Aluminium core / PEX
PVC of any sch and size ---> loses plastifier and gets brittle, dangerous !!
Sch 80 CPVC 3/4" ( never heared... )
ABS ---> most dangerous, no UV stability, no chemical resistance, bad mechanical properties.

 

[tonycastec]

Exactly ! And if all the poster says is "plastic" it is meaningless. Even worse they say pvc and mean abs and have no clue about the difference between sch 80 cpvc and regular sprinkler pipe (the lowest grade of sch 40 pvc).
The confusion is a great source of risk because people who have used 1/2" sch 80 cpvc on a 1hp single stage Cman compressor declare it "works great" ,so someone fits sch 40 1" pvc to a 2-stage 175psi compressor !
So please be specific about:
1. the chemical
2.the wall thickness
3. u.v exposure
4. oil exposure
5. pressure used.
Sayin "well truck air brakes use plastic/nylon/poly/? pipe really doesn't help advance the discussion.