Plastic Oil Drain Nut Frozen Solid

[4Quarters]

I mentioned sometime ago I'd come into a Champion Porta Champ. When I went to change the oil, no matter what wrench I used, the plastic thread drain nut was/is frozen absolutely solid.

I turned on it so hard I was afraid of breaking it off, leaving just a threaded stub in the crankcase. It is NOT coming out.

I jacked up the Porta Champ at a ridiculous angle, unscrewed the nut just above the drain, which unthreaded easily and drained the old oil, and I filled the crankcase up to the indicated line, no sweat.


Good part is I got replacement half moon filters + half moon silencers from Pacific Air Compressors, and replacing the filters and oil smoothed out the compressor and it's not as loud. The old oil didn't look that bad.

Even though I can change the oil this way, it bugs the HELL out of me I can't get this drain nut loose.

I mean I can wait, but I still want to get it off, and replace it w/another nut, possible a metal one.

What can I do, or is the fix a job for a professional, it sure seems silly taking it to somebody else for 1 "itty bitty" plastic nut.

 

[RacerX]

Try heating it up with a hair dryer then trying to loosen it . see if the heat changes things

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

 

[ducksface]

Burn/drill it out and buy the $3 replacement plug
And
Have you tried tightening it?

 

[sberry]

If the old oil isn't bad and you now put new modern oil in call it a day. Likely good for the life of the unit. Is this something you gonna run every day?

 

[4Quarters]

It will not budge either way. I'll try the hair dryer 1st, and call Pacific Air Compressors and see if they've got a replacement part. Is there another outfit that would have this part?

No, won't be using everyday, but somebody died and gave it to me to take care of, so I'm going to try to fix it.

Worst case scenario, I keep putting it up on a box at a nice angle and change the oil, but I'm sure this oil change will last me 4 yrs.


Can't lose can I?


If it makes sense, it was passed on to me, and I'm becoming attached to it. It's just an old compressor, but I like messing w/ it.

 

[dogdog]

Vise grips... will break loose any nuts.

 

[metaldad]

any chance it's reverse threaded?

 

[4Quarters]

Could be, or whoever screwed this in screwed it in too tight. I used pliers, and the end I was using the pliers on, would give/twist while the other end/threads wouldn't move.

I've twisted almost a quarter turn and the threads don't move, I'm afraid to twist it any more which will just snap off the end of it leaving just the threads.

One gentleman says I can burn/drill it off, so I guess that won't be a problem.


The funny thing is the fill nuts are right above the drains on the crankcase. I guess that's to prevent anyone from overfilling the crankcase.

It took me about a quarter turn and the fill nut was loose, no sweat; unscrewed it by hand from there.

I don't think this thing was used a lot, I think it sat a lot, for yrs. and just got dirty. This thing is going to outlast me, and then I'll give it to my son.

 

[The Cobbler]

may have been cross threaded on install. try more heat , or really put some ooomf into it.
heat the area around it with a propane torch.

 

[Copymutt]

It will break with less force than you'd think. BTDT. Replaced 3 on a B&S pump motor B4 they broke.

 

[4Quarters]

Yeah, well it just broke off. I drained the oil back out of it, and will figure out a way to get the remaining plastic out of the threads w/o getting pieces of plastic in the crankcase.

I don't know how this was originally screwed on, but the plastic is cemented to the female threads of the crankcase. I don't think the oil was ever changed, and this is the way the compressor came w/this this thing already stuck.

I'll have to get this plastic off the threads and replace it now.

 

[tym]

I'll have to get this plastic off the threads and replace it now.

I wonder if some solvent (acetone?) could dissolve the plastic. Or, failing that, some heat to melt it out.

 

[RTM]

Thread restoring file of the right pitch, and Run it in little circles? Work with the shop vac nearby, or blowing in from the top to create positive pressure. If tons left in the hole drill up to almost the largest diameter of the thread? Small utility knife?

 

[brianh]

Run it until its hot then try to take it off.

 

[4Quarters]

Can a propane torch soften the plastic w/o messing up the cast iron/threading to where the plastic can easily be pulled out.

If that could work, how hot/how long to soften the plastic. This is the type of plastic they made 35-40 yrs. ago.

I'm assuming the cast iron of the compressor will be ok, and the plastic will go first.


Just remembered I've got a small heat gun (1000-1100 watts) that should soften the plastic to where I can pull it out w/needle nose pliers.


When does plastic go limp/malleable before melting from heat?


I guarantee you if I ever get this goop out, I'll buy a metal plug.

 

[matt_i]

Most thermoplastics don't conduct heat very well, so once you get started they have a reduced ability to conduct it away.

I think the suggestion of an electric heat gun or hairdryer is excellent. You'll know whether the plastic is going to soften in a few minutes,

Past that, oring picks, pocket knives, chisels could all be used to thin out the plastic to a shell which hopefully would come out in a twisted piece.

Or not where you'd use a pilot drill and hand tap to clean the threads back. Takes some sensitivity to get the tap into pitch with the existing thread and not "split the lead" -- meaning carving out good threads.

If I had to guess without seeing any pics, it would be 1/4 NPT.

 

[4Quarters]

Here's the damn thing, stuck to the threads.

I've got dental pics, needle nose pliers, I'll try heating it up and picking it out trying not to get anything bits in the crankcase.

 

[ducksface]

Now that I've seen a picture:
Pound a wooden plug in that and call it a day.
Unless you just need a project.
Or
Tap the plastic and just leave it there.

 

[Mikeybc]

Just “cut” it out with a soldering iron. Make a couple groves with a hot iron to the threads then turn or pry it out with a small screwdriver. Did this with a oil drain plug on a Can-Am ATV

 

[Mr_B]

stick a junior hacksaw blade through the hole and cut down until touch threads,
then use a old screwdriver or small chisel to tap the plug out of threads ,
If that not possible, heat a old flat blade screwdriver and use that gouge it out .
looks like you can clean debris easy through the top bung which useful .

 

[4Quarters]

Just “cut” it out with a soldering iron. Make a couple groves with a hot iron to the threads then turn or pry it out with a small screwdriver. Did this with a oil drain plug on a Can-Am ATV

Since you've already done this, I'm going down to Harbor Freight which has a small soldering iron for the price of a burger, and between that and the heat gun I believe this plastic is gonna give it up.

This isn't gonna be much money between a small soldering iron and a drain plug or else I'd go the "Ducksface" treatment which would be quick and painless.

I'm going down and getting this small soldering iron and see if I can work this out.

I like this forum, you folks have class; I've been on other forums, where you mention a problem you're having and you get 5 negative responses starting w/ "you stupid jerk, what did you do that for".

Thanks for the help.

 

[Mikeybc]

Since you've already done this, I'm going down to Harbor Freight which has a small soldering iron for the price of a burger, and between that and the heat gun I believe this plastic is gonna give it up.

This isn't gonna be much money between a small soldering iron and a drain plug or else I'd go the "Ducksface" treatment which would be quick and painless.

I'm going down and getting this small soldering iron and see if I can work this out.

I like this forum, you folks have class; I've been on other forums, where you mention a problem you're having and you get 5 negative responses starting w/ "you stupid jerk, what did you do that for".

Thanks for the help.

Same principal as the hack saw idea, i just used a soldering iron so I wouldn't risk hurtIng the aluminum threads on the ATV.

 

[4Quarters]

Yes, I see the wisdom of that.

Thanks

 

[Mikeybc]

Actually do you have a old small screwdriver or something else small you could just get really hot with a propane torch ? That would work too if you don't want to buy an iron.

 

[4Quarters]

I was going to buy something like a soldering iron some time later, I guess this just hurried things along, and between that and the heat gun, I'm sure this'll come off.

What's strange is the plastic you see in the pic is hard as a rock, the other end which I twisted off was soft enough to twist off. Does heat do that?

Also, the fill plug just above has clean threads/looks like it was put on yesterday.

In any event a metal plug is replacing this.

 

[ZRX61]

Try hitting it with your purse


Can't believe we got to 25 replies without that being suggested...

 

[sberry]

You fixed it so you gotta fix it better now. Out of all the ideas I like heating the screwdriver the best.

 

[4Quarters]

Yeah well, after all this, I'm going to have to get it out.

 

[visionguru]

Here's the damn thing, stuck to the threads.

I've got dental pics, needle nose pliers, I'll try heating it up and picking it out trying not to get anything bits in the crankcase.

Looks not that hard: drill a pilot hole. then move on to bigger sized bits, until there is only 1mm thickness left. Gently knock around the bolt. You should be able to free the bolt from the threads and turn it out. Basically the same procedure as dealing with a metal bolt.

Heat won't work, just makes a mess. Plastics don't transfer heat well. The outside is burning, but the inside is still stone cold. The metal has to be heated to red hot to affect the bolt inside. Once you deformed plastics that extends inside the metal case, you will have no chance of fishing it out.

Can you access the stuck bolt if removing the big bolt above? Drill, not burn.

 

[sberry]

There is still time to leave it alone if it's not leaking.

 

[RTM]

I do like that soldering gun idea. I have knife like blades for mine, great for cutting webbing straps, etc. (Top Right most in the first pic here)

https://www.flitetest.com/articles/soldering-gun-hot-knife-quick-tip

 

[4Quarters]

Ok, this is done.

I won't be doing this again if I can help it; if I buy something that has oil to drain, I'll be sure and check the plugs.

If it gets frozen after I buy it, and I can get the oil out another way, I'll quit while I'm ahead.


The dental pics didn't work, the file didn't work, the little soldering pen didn't get hot enough, and just heating up the plastic didn't work. I was pulling out bits that were too small and nothing was coming off the threads.


Tried the heat gun, setting it on 1000, holding the screwdriver directly in front of the plastic, and heated the crankcase around the plastic, the plastic, and the screwdriver, put the heat gun down quickly and started scooping and twisting the screwdriver like a little shovel and got out a big chunk off the threads, so doing this worked.


95% of what you saw in the original pic came off in about 8 or 9 chunks heating everything up and working this w/the screwdriver quickly.


Heating everything until I could see the plastic getting dribbly and twisting and scooping until a big chunk came out. Everything would cool in a few seconds, and the good thing about that is that most of the chunk would stick together leaving no residue on the threads.


Go figure.


I took a pic of the chunks here, sitting on the box of the heat gun, this is 95% of what you see in the original pic of the plastic frozen on the threads. Burned up w/what looked like sowing thread all through it.





Here's a pic of everything I tried on this.







Here's a pic of this finished, and the threads. I think I scuffed a bit of the 1st thread and the rest of the threads look ok.






Actually, Ducksface advice was good advice, and this is what I had to go through because I didn't follow it, so my career doing heart surgery on frozen drain plugs is over.

 

[Mr_B]

good job lol
wish all the frozen drain plugs I dealt with were made of plastic rather the steel in alloy or iron housings.
I done a few plastic pipe fitting in past where broken off thread or solvent pipe end needed removing & I used hacksaw blade and hot screwdriver with good results hence suggesting it .
sort a nice plug for that and take pride every time you check or drain the oil lol
Go treat yourself to some new tools ready for your next adventure

 

[4Quarters]

Don't get me wrong I appreciate your advice very much, in fact everybody's advice.

You folks steered me in the general direction and that put me in the ballpark for fixing this.

I've already started sipping on a cold one, and glad I got lucky on this.

Thank you all very much!!!


Well Mr. B, I'm witness to it's worth every penny you charge for fixing these things.

 

[4Quarters]

Got one more question. I can get a simple plug replacement, but I've also ck'd out this where once you screw it in, you can push the lever up and over to drain the oil.

The reason I mention this is it seemed to me even if the plug ended up frozen, you'd still have a way to drain the oil.

Is it good/no good/worth it/not worth it/too much money/something better/don't need it/better than slice bread?


https://www.ebay.com/itm/EZ-OIL-DRAIN-VALVE-EZ-102-Thread-size-PF-3-8-/264305553238

 

[tym]

I took a pic of the chunks here, sitting on the box of the heat gun, this is 95% of what you see in the original pic of the plastic frozen on the threads. Burned up w/what looked like sowing thread all through it.

Hmm...if there was some reinforcing "thread" material inside, I wonder if the plug was made out of a phenolic and not plastic--might explain why it was so tenacious.

 

[sberry]

****** and a cap, a common valve. I opt for nip and cap,,, you dont need to change oil on this like a nascar. An oil change should be good for the life of the unit. Put some synthetic in it, forget it.

 

[lilredex]

Just get a regular CI plug. If you are concerned about getting caught again somehow, later, screw in a street elbow first.

 

[seber]

Hmm...if there was some reinforcing "thread" material inside, I wonder if the plug was made out of a phenolic and not plastic--might explain why it was so tenacious.

The plug would have been nylon.
I would stay away from the flip to drain plugs. You can find a lot of horror stories of those used on vehicles that failed on the highway. Losing all your oil without warning is a bummer.

 

[4Quarters]

There's a steel street elbow from Zoro for 3 bucks, and a magnetic drain plug for 5 bucks.

You've convinced me. I'll get those and as Ducksface would say, I'll call it a day.