Pliers; How Many Is Too Many?

[d42jeep]

Here are my Diamond DC pliers along with a conventionally marked pair.
-Don

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Potentially just more confusing, Don!

What would you say the finish on the K36 is? Natural steel? Supposed to be nickel-plated, satin finish. The K38 is also odd, because that model number is supposed to be the < DC > line. And is that chrome plated? Or possibly nickel-plated with a satin finish? Perhaps they re-used the same model number scheme later when they dropped the < DC > line in favor of what you're calling a "conventional" < DIAMOND > logo line. Just spitballin'. I have not looked at other catalogs yet.

Sticking with only the 1951 catalog, maybe it's just me, but in terms of marketing, I typically associate higher model numbers with higher quality lines. And that seems to be the case based on the finish. My pliers (Motor Spec K1x series) are natural steel finish (which I assume is the "hand-finished" reference in the catalog), whereas the Motor Spec K2x series are "Nickel plated", and the < DC > pliers (K3x) are "Nickel plated, satin finish". But the rest of the description seems counterintuitive to that scheme to me. The Motor Spec are lauded as being made "from special steel", and aiming them at "the most particular" customer doesn't smack of economy line to me. Whereas the < DC > K3x series were made of "high grade tool steel," which seems like an economy line reference to me.

There is no pricing, and no price list in the back, which would help.

 

[d42jeep]

I’ve always thought that the DC line was a response to Crescent’s less expensive Cee Tee line but I’ve never checked into it any further. I need to go through my Diamond tool box and see what else is in there.
-Don

 

[Mintgrun]

Here are three that I have for comparison. Two K36 and a Motor Spec. One of the K36 has horseshoes in the logo. I'm guessing the yellower top one is nickel, the middle one chrome and the bottom bare steel. Another difference can be seen on the handles, where it says FORGED IN U.S.A. , <U.S.A.> and MADE IN U.S.A. .



The nut's different on the middle pair as well.



Tom

 

[d42jeep]

I went through the Diamond box. Here are the DC pliers next to my Motor Spec.
Green handle Diamond pliers
Non green handle Diamond pliers
Most all of the pliers together.
Diamond but not pliers
-Don

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Another difference can be seen on the handles, where it says FORGED IN U.S.A. , <U.S.A.> and MADE IN U.S.A. .

Thanks, Tom, but I'm punting on that. I'm having enough trouble figuring out their model number/marketing scheme in the same production year, where all other markings except the branding (Motor Spec vs < DC >) is identical, let alone taking on those kinds of differences, which are probably production era related.

I’ve always thought that the DC line was a response to Crescent’s less expensive Cee Tee line but I’ve never checked into it any further.

I think your intuition, which confirms mine, is good.

The 1946 catalog supplement had no price scheme and seems to indicate the Motor Spec and < DC > pliers are both made from tool steel, with the Diamalloy brand getting the alloy steel, which differs from what they were doing in 1951. But they gave the Motor Spec the same finish as the Diamalloy (double nickel), whereas the < DC > was just plated.



Just so we don't have to toggle back and forth between pg 5 and 6, here is the 1951 cat excerpt again.



By 1969 they had dropped the Motor Spec branding, but note that they were still essentially making a three-tier model line with a three-tier model numbering scheme. The "special steel" with "Polished nickel chrome plating" = K1x series, the "special steel" with "satin nickel chrome plating" = K2x series, and "high grade tool steel" with "Nickel chrome plating with satin finish" = K3x series.



The 1969 catalog included a PL and the pricing scheme indicates that K1x was top of the line, K2x was mid, and K3x was clearly economy.



It's a little risky to apply that retroactively, but it would be kind of confusing for their customer base to suddenly invert the whole scheme after they had been using it for a couple decades.

 

[Outlawmws]

So the K36 DC are nickle plated per the 51 catalog

My K36 for posterity:

 

[Outlawmws]

And a couple recent pliers adds:






The Nippers jaws - Why buy junk tools? to make specialty tools. with some angle iron welded into the jaws (after some grinding) they make great sheet metal tongs, so I'll make a third set, with specialized jaws. my others are 2" and 4" wide.

Tongs like these:




And the "second gen" Plierench from VACO - in the teens and 20's Eifel made the original Plierench, VACO resurrected them and Knipex coped the base design concept. My second pair of VACO's with the extended jaw:

 

[jeffmoss26]

I’ve definitely stopped counting lol

 

[d42jeep]

When it comes to tools, I don’t have many sentimental favorites. These two pairs of pliers are exceptions. When my wife and I were in our 20s, we were walking through a local discount store and found some Diamond pliers at a very low price. We bought two pair that became our his and hers pliers. Mine received some aftermarket red plastic handles and have lived in my user toolbox for many years. Her pair have lived in the household tool bin. Here are pictures of both of them taken today.
-Don

 

[Mintgrun]

Thanks, Tom, but I'm punting on that. I'm having enough trouble figuring out their model number/marketing scheme in the same production year, where all other markings except the branding (Motor Spec vs < DC >) is identical, let alone taking on those kinds of differences, which are probably production era related.

Okay. When you get around to it, you can add Outlaw's FORGED U.S.A. marked pair to the variety list.

(they're different than my FORGED IN U.S.A. example).

On that same topic, it looks like the N is backwards on your red handled pair, Don. Or, am I seeing things? Does it say, MADE IИ U.S.A. ?

Details, details, everywhere!

 

[d42jeep]

Looks that way.
-Don

 

[Outlawmws]

All the N's I see look right?

 

[Mintgrun]

All the N's I see look right?

 

[Outlawmws]

Ah! missed that one!

 

[Provincial]

I'm not sure if this has been posted before. Excuse me if it has been.

 

[dchawk81]

"too many" is not a phrase to be used on El Journo de Garaje.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Antique pliers don't excite too many collectors, but these unusual Red Devils are probably in my Top 5 finds of the year so far. More photos (edit: and info) in the S&H thread here.

 

[Provincial]

Those look like a specialized variation on the Button pattern.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

For sure. More info linked.

 

[d42jeep]

I pulled this assortment of pliers out of the electrical work toolbox today for a picture or two.



-Don

 

[Skyman]

I'd be proud to own that nice T&B crimper.

 

[RTM]

I'd be proud to own that nice T&B crimper.

I have two, one owned since the late 70s, the other grabbed a year or two ago at a garage sale. Always able to find a pair when I need them now.

 

[Outlawmws]

Keeping in line with the "How many is too many" theme - I have a few - This is leaving out the stamped steel stripper/crimper/screw cutter types.





Closer view of the older 4 on top. 3 are factory one is not:




Pretty sure these were dykes in a former life, someone (Not me) needed a crimper badly, and got busy with a mini die grinder - these remind me of a super dull rounded over pair of dykes I once had that were so dull I used them for crimpers before getting the real deal: No name left on these:

 

[d42jeep]

I found some interesting pliers at yesterday’s tool sale. My second pair of Diamond DC pliers.
Unusual crimping pliers that may have been made by Moore Drop Forge


Parallel jaw pliers to add to my Bernard collection
Vacuum grip Snap-on pliers
Barcalo lineman’s pliers
Out of the evaporust.
-Don

 

[d42jeep]

A couple more I found stashed in a Kennedy cantilever today. I’ve never found any use for them since they are for specific jobs.
-Don

 

[MisterEd]

Klein 203-8N Long Nose Cutting Plier Heavy Duty Pattern Skinning Hole Insulated “Handform” Handle

 

[MisterEd]

Klein Bell System 6 Inch Notched Diagonal Cutter, LER

 

[MisterEd]

Klein 317-6PC Long Nose Pliers Knife at Point Yellow Plastisol Handle w/Coil Spring

 

[torontotools]

Wondering if the C.T CO as on these wire cutters is the same as Cee Tee as shown above. Crescent Tools? Also labelled: MADE USA 282-6

 

[RTM]

Wondering if the C.T CO as on these wire cutters is the same as Cee Tee as shown above. Crescent Tools? Also labelled: MADE USA 282-6

Carpenters pinchers, not wire cutters top left, yours is 6”

Crescent Tools : Catalog No. 19 : Crescent Tool Co. : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

38 p., illus., 26.6 cm, trade catalog

archive.org

Here is an older pair

Crescent Tools : Catalog No. 17 : Crescent Tool Co. : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

44 p., illus., 26.2 cm, trade catalog

archive.org

 

[four.cycle]

1926 Crescent Catalog pp 8

1939 Van Camp Hardware & Iron catalog pp 182 Crescent Smith & Hemenway advertisement

The 1942 Crescent catalog shows their end nippers as having a different part number as well as appearance. As near as I can tell, you found a pair of early "Smith & Hemenway" "Crescent" end nippers.

Hopefully one of the experts will be able to shine a bit more light on it.

 

[RTM]

Wondering if the C.T CO as on these wire cutters is the same as Cee Tee as shown above. Crescent Tools? Also labelled: MADE USA 282-6

Carpenters pinchers, not wire cutters top left, yours is 6”

The 1942 Crescent catalog shows their end nippers as having a different part number as well as appearance. As near as I can tell, you found a pair of early "Smith & Hemenway" "Crescent" end nippers.

My problem with our identification is the shape, but since the number is there, I’m thinking our age is wrong. All of the pix show a single or pair of bent handles, while the OP’s appear to be straight, no nail puller on the leg. And flipping thru the catalogs, I only recall seeing the CT Co moniker later, like 1942, which could be poor memory, or mean nothing, but would S&H use CT Co? I could see Crescent.

 

[d42jeep]

I have been informed on this site that my gapper was made by the Caterpillar Tractor Co.
-Don

 

[RTM]

I have been informed on this site that my gapper was made by the Caterpillar Tractor Co.

Cincinnati Tool Co (Hargrave) also did, but I think the number match might be pretty damning to Crescent

No Caterpillar catalogs, not seen in Cincinnati

 

[Private Lugnutz]

Wondering if the C.T CO as on these wire cutters is the same as Cee Tee as shown above. Crescent Tools? Also labelled: MADE USA 282-6

Yes. They used "C.T. Co." on some tools, even screwdrivers. Look in the 1961 catalog (35M) for your nippers. I believe there is a copy in the Internet Archive International Tool Catalog Library.

 

[four.cycle]

^ the 282-6 number matches that shown in the 1939 Van Camp Hardware catalog. That's what I searched for: "282-6". Only showed up in the Crescent folder in that old ad, and then I found it in the 1926 catalog.
it doesn't make sense that the Caterpillar Tractor Company would be manufacturing 6 inch carpenters nippers.

 

[Private Lugnutz]

His tool is in Crescent catalog No. 35M (1961).

 

[RTM]

His tool is in Crescent catalog No. 35M (1961).

Well hell, didn’t expect it to be newer, but I guess shrinkflation has been going on for a long time, removing features. Was guessing older, before the features were thought up.

 

[four.cycle]

^ yes. I posted the catalog page above.