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Plomb tool picture thread - show your stuff!

Private Lugnutz

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I have a feeling PLVMB sent the dealers stickers to put over the PLVMB logo as opposed to just issuing new boards...
Well-documented. I discussed this in the 'Lawsuits' thread and posted excerpts from tinmedic's Proto flyer. Not only did they send out new stickers, decals, and placards, they sent out little self-addressed postage paid return cards that their dealers were supposed to checkmark and send back confirming that they were covering up their old signage.
 
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Smokeshow69

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Well-documented. I discussed this in the 'Lawsuits' thread and posted excerpts from tinmedic's Proto flyer. Not only did they send out new stickers, decals, and placards, they sent out little self-addressed postage paid return cards that their dealers were supposed to checkmark and send back confirming that they were covering up their old signage.
I need to go back and read that thread again.... I am aware of PRVTV LA stickers being seen on plomb tool boards but I am not aware of any Transitional stickered tool boards in the collecting world. That would be really cool to find and certainly quite uncommon. I remember MontanaFordMan having some tool boards that have the PRVTV LA stickers covering the PLOMB logo and you can seen the newer PRVTV sticker peeling away to reveal the old logo.
 

c1504

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I am pretty sure r_olson_06 has a dual marked version of my proto la 1/2 drive board
 

Private Lugnutz

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Smoke

I'm confused. I don't know MontanaFordMan but my impression is that there are several tool boards out there with PRVTV stickers covering Plomb decals. Several members here have them. I thought you did, too, although there are so many I tend to forget who has them. They're all "transitional." Maybe I have a broader definition of that term than you. I think of everything going on between just Plomb to just Proto, so, mid- to late-1948 and all of 1949 to March 1950, as transitional, including the PRVTV TM applications and dual-marked advertising and signage to the dual-marked tools and finally to the campaign to eradicate Plomb completely from tools and from everything else, even catalogs and ads, when not accompanied by the words "Tool Company". I do not distinguish between PRVTV BY PLVMB stickers and PRVTV stickers, because even the 1949 PRVTV stickers are "transitional" in the sense that they were a temporary fix and all the tools on the boards with those stickers were still dual-marked.

So, yeah, in the discussion on the "Lawsuit" thread I was talking about new signage (stickers etc) in 1949. But it stands to reason by deduction (much more than a feeling...) that if they were sending PRVTV stickers out as PLVMB coverups in 1949 that they were sending PRVTV BY PLMVB stickers out in late 1948.
 

Smokeshow69

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I need one of those Dachshund shaped DOEs! :lol_hitti
Oh man, that is one wrench with an annoying bark and an bit of a standoffish attitude :)

I am pretty sure r_olson_06 has a dual marked version of my proto la 1/2 drive board
I would love to see a picture if so!

Smoke

I'm confused. I don't know MontanaFordMan but my impression is that there are several tool boards out there with PRVTV stickers covering Plomb decals. Several members here have them. I thought you did, too, although there are so many I tend to forget who has them. They're all "transitional." Maybe I have a broader definition of that term than you. I think of everything going on between just Plomb to just Proto, so, mid- to late-1948 and all of 1949 to March 1950, as transitional, including the PRVTV TM applications and dual-marked advertising and signage to the dual-marked tools and finally to the campaign to eradicate Plomb completely from tools and from everything else, even catalogs and ads, when not accompanied by the words "Tool Company". I do not distinguish between PRVTV BY PLVMB stickers and PRVTV stickers, because even the 1949 PRVTV stickers are "transitional" in the sense that they were a temporary fix and all the tools on the boards with those stickers were still dual-marked.

So, yeah, in the discussion on the "Lawsuit" thread I was talking about new signage (stickers etc) in 1949. But it stands to reason by deduction (much more than a feeling...) that if they were sending PRVTV stickers out as PLVMB coverups in 1949 that they were sending PRVTV BY PLMVB stickers out in late 1948.
You are correct, I was using "transitional" in a broader sense...what I should have said was - I would like to see a dual marked tool board picture. I do agree with your statement of the different logos being all "transitional" during that time period of copious band aid fixes to the gushing wound that everyone could see :). I did make some tool boards to hold my dual marked wrenches and I did post them in the "lawsuit" thread so maybe that is what you were thinking of....however, I am now realizing that if they hold dual marked tools, they should have the dual marked logo. Now you have my ocd all wound up :) Thanks alot:beer::eyecrazy:. Now I need someone to post a good dual mark photo so I can make stickers ?!!
 
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Smokeshow69

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Just to save everyone from searching for that post, here is a picture of the mentioned "dual mark" tool board...per Lugz comments/research above, this is one of the first of many logos plomb issued in an attempt to get themselves out of hot water with the feds.. This is not my board, this is Roy's and I am simply reposting his picture. This really is a nice rare board! Most of them got covered up but someone went outlaw on this and didn't cover it :) Looks like I have more stickers to make now :) And I don't know if this makes me nuts or a nerd but I will leave the current logos on my dual marked boards and will cover over them to show this logo , just like the originals :dunno::headscrat:lol:
 

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Smokeshow69

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Looping back to my comment about MontanaFordMan's tool boards he has that were covered up, this is a picture of a plomb tool board that was in his family for years... As I understand it, the hardware store that had these boards in it burnt down. The tool boards had this Proto LA logo on them but the sticker was so fragile and coming off.... so he removed this logo to reveal the Plomb logo underneath. This is prior to him removing the logo...you can see the green peeking out under the Proto logo. I just bumped the thread he posted these in -"scored some plomb tool boards"... plomb proto tool board cover up.jpg
 

Smokeshow69

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**Next question- If I was to make some dual mark stickers, in the correct green color, would anyone be interested in them ? I know some folks like them and some don't....I am just trying to gauge interest so I can figure out the quantity needed to print. If no one is interested, totally fine but I have to purchase minimum quantities of 10 when I get these printed so I will either be buying 10 of them or 20 ? **
 

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RagTopTA

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**Next question- If I was to make some dual mark stickers, in the correct green color, would anyone be interested in them ? I know some folks like them and some don't....I am just trying to gauge interest so I can figure out the quantity needed to print. If no one is interested, totally fine but I have to purchase minimum quantities of 10 when I get these printed so I will either be buying 10 of them or 20 ? **
Count me in for 2 sir!
 
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RagTopTA

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Snagged these waterpump pliers and a pair of WF ignition wrenches at the flea this morning.
Nice finds Lugz! I see many pairs of pliers every weekend at the flea and sales, but Plomb pliers are very rare in Northcentral Texas for some reason, There was a Plomb factory in Dallas (1 1/2 hours away) according to some of the catalogs and ads I have seen.
 

Private Lugnutz

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Pretty rare up here, too, Rags! I think it's only the third I've ever found in the wild. The other two, found in 2017 and 2019, were both No. 227 duckbills. Both gunmetal. One had smooth handles, the other was Name-Nurl. None before those, so three in about ten or so years. Plenty of wrenches and other tools, but pliers are scarce, I agree.
 

Provincial

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I was going through a bucket of large sockets that I got from a retired mechanic a few years ago because I needed a 2-9/16 (65 mm) for three large bolts that hold the counterweight on a 100,000 pound excavator. I turned up this Plomb 2-5/8 1" drive monster. It was far from the largest socket in the bucket. The rest were Williams and Proto.

It looks like I will need to buy larger pencils!

Plomb 1.jpg
Plomb 3.jpg
 

Smokeshow69

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I was going through a bucket of large sockets that I got from a retired mechanic a few years ago because I needed a 2-9/16 (65 mm) for three large bolts that hold the counterweight on a 100,000 pound excavator. I turned up this Plomb 2-5/8 1" drive monster. It was far from the largest socket in the bucket. The rest were Williams and Proto.

It looks like I will need to buy larger pencils!

Plomb 1.jpg
Plomb 3.jpg
oh man! I did the same thing at work with a 2" socket i want to say ? Haven't seen it in over a year but should be going back within a few months...
 

Provincial

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MLG RETRACT GEAR BOX means Main Landing Gear Retracting Gear Box. Some Plomb ratchets were used in landing gear retracting systems. the F-20001 would be the aircraft manufacturer's part number. I can't be sure, but I don't believe that the extension was bought to be a tool. It was bought to be part of the aircraft landing gear system. If it had a through hole where the ball would normally go, that would be a tell.

You had better go back and get it!
 

MR.X

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MR.X

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Far as I know F was Boeing, K was for Douglas. The crowfoot tool in the pic above was used on B-17's.
 

MR.X

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I was going through a bucket of large sockets that I got from a retired mechanic a few years ago because I needed a 2-9/16 (65 mm) for three large bolts that hold the counterweight on a 100,000 pound excavator. I turned up this Plomb 2-5/8 1" drive monster. It was far from the largest socket in the bucket. The rest were Williams and Proto.

It looks like I will need to buy larger pencils!

Plomb 1.jpg
Plomb 3.jpg
Did you ever find the 2 9/16?
 

Provincial

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No. Or a 65 MM. I used a 12-point 2-5/8 China socket with a 6-foot cheater pipe. I bent the sliding T-bar from the China set, but got them loose!

When you get up in those sizes, a 1/16" mismatch doesn't mean as much! :evil:
 

Leviton

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I picked this up on eBay just because of the date code - "MC". In all regards it appears to be a perfect exemplar of a wartime Plomb 5449 1/2" drive ratchet. Did 1943 have an extra month? Is it possible that "I" or "J" was skipped as a prefix letter to avoid confusion? Anybody else seen any Plomb tools stamped "MC"? Inquiring minds want to know!

Bill

If the A.C. tools were for the Air Corps, perhaps the M.C. were Marine Corps.? :dunno:

Certainly makes sense. I'd love to dig up the contracts to see if they specified markings. That'd solve a lot of mysteries I believe.


That doesn't work for me, Jason. But I'll explain why and you can draw your own conclusions.

First of all, the "AC" tools I think you're talking about were made by Wright, not Plomb. I was the one who first postulated that the "AC" on the Wright tools stood for "Air Corps," but it's important to recognize that it wasn’t as simple as an unsubstantiated guess (i.e., A for Air and C for Corps). I made the postulation based on the fact that Wright had contracts with the US Army Air Forces that coincided with the dates codes we were seeing on the tools, and - this is the key, that those contract numbers, encoded with the contracting agency, all started with "AC".

The "AC" was used as the code for all US Army Air Forces contracts because many contracts in the book (which start in June 1940) pre-date the existence of the US Army Air Forces, which was established - due to a squabble about who had control of strategic bombers, in June 1941. Prior to the USAAF, there was only the US Army Air Corps. In other words, when those early contracts were awarded, they were truly awarded by the Air Corps. When the USAAF was established, and the Air Corps was subsumed underneath the USAAF, the contract numbers did not change. And when the book was published, in late 1945, by the Civilian Production Administration (new, post-war name for the War Production Board), the index accurately indicates that "AC" was the code for USAAF contracts.

Secondly, unlike the Wright "AC", identifying the customer, accompanied by an explicit numerical date code (e.g., "43"), identifying the date of production, the "MC" on Bill's Plomb ratchet (and the “”UC” and “VC” on oldmantaylor’s Plomb tools) most closely resembles the two-digit alphanumeric system that Plomb used as a date code to indicate date of production.

Thirdly, keep in mind that Plomb also had contracts with the US Army Air Forces, specifically with the Air Corps, and its contracting agency was located at Wright Field, which they used in short form ("WF") to indicate the same customer that Wright had. Without any documentation specifying how to mark their tools, it looks to me like Wright and Plomb took different approaches.

Finally, the Marine Corps belonged to the Navy, and Navy contract codes all started with an N. Plomb had several Navy contracts, with Aeronautics (NXSA), Ships (NXSS), and Supplies & Accounts (NXSX). None with the Marine Corps (NOM).

EDIT: For the Jeep guys out there, if you’ve ever wondered how or why Willys used “NOM” as a designator for the MB’s it built for the Marine Corps, that’s why.
Found an "MC" marked tool today and wanted to bump in case there was any new info. Only comments on MC codes that I could find so far were on ratchets. Saw "AB" and "BB" codes on Alloy Artifacts, but no "MC"s.

The wrench I found also had some large voids on the back side. Would they have been original? Overall the wrench did not seem to be in such bad shape that these could have been from rust.
 

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