Pole barn shop build setting ?

[sweetk30]

Friend is having a pole barn shop built . Guy doing building said he just dumps dry concrete mix in the hole and set pole and backfill with dirt .

I always was under the impression its wet mix for concrete and then set .

Seems wierd like it could let the posts drop if the dry mix gets wet . The frost line around here is 48inch .

Whats the general rule for setting these poles ? Thanks for the help .

 

[The Cobbler]

I do dry mix for fence posts , the moisture in the soil will cure it, but it is compromised strength wise Im sure for bearing posts .

 

[juddspaintballs]

I thought the point of concrete in the hole was to create a disc/rock at the bottom of the hole the post can't punch through when weight is bearing on it. What's actually around the post doesn't matter as much as long as it's compressed and holds the post from lifting. I've heard fine crusher run is best in most climates because it lets water drain away from the post but locks in tight to keep it from moving.

 

[blackdak8]

All of the Amish built pole barns around our area pour one bag in bottom of hole dry, set pole, backfill with dirt. They use in ground rated treated 6x6. I asked them a while back when picking up a load of lumber at their lumber yard. They said the mix gives it a better base to help prevent settling and dirt backfill lets water drain away to prevent rot compared to setting in concrete filled hole.

 

[karoc]

This is such a good question which I think there are several answers. I am speaking without personal experience but what I am going to do when I start on mine. Going to have person with 12" auger to go down 4', I am going to take post hole digger and bell out the hole about 12" from bottom. Then pour about 6-8" wet concrete(bag mix) let it dry. Set the post and put in little of original dirt( no organic material) and pack it down as I fill in. I am also considering buying some of those sleeves for post but still on fence with that. I have watch so many Youtubes on how others do their Pole installs that it really only varies little. Some uses those tubes fill with concrete then purchase those metal brackets that they bolt poles to which was installed while concrete is wet. But to me if Amish doing it as blackdak8 saying then that's good for me. As they say there is more than one way to skin cat( don't know where that saying comes from) but it fits

If I may add, talking with our bug guy at work he said to spray the post that be in ground with termite treatment then mix in with dirt as I pack it down.

 

[matt_i]

I think its a timesaver for a builder. But acceptable for some reasons.

As slowly as moisture enters the concrete from the earth around it, it probably develops good strength. I've mixed a couple of bags of 5ksi bagged concrete in a 5 gallon bucket and with the amount of water they specify and its unworkable in that state. I had to add just to get it to the consistency I could trowel it flat.

Its not very scientific as I would guess that next to none of those installs get dug up later for post-mortem analysis. While we're betting, I bet that provisions for uplift get missed a lot more than provisions for downforce....

 

[kj_mustang]

If it has to be inspected, you do what the local officials require. Mine required poured concrete in each hole and to be inspected before poles were set.

 

[Loose Nut Buster]

I agree w/ mustang on local code inspections but not necessarily with the code itself since they sometimes are based on the inspector and not on science as the new saying is.
Yes sir thank you glad u approved. Now I can continue.... on my common sense and others proven experiences, like a corner stone and fill it up method from 100 yes ago.

Sent from my SM-T387V using Tapatalk

 

[nadogail]

No matter how you decide to set your posts, I guarantee that someone will disagree with how you chose to do it.

 

[CraigStu]

I like the pour in some concrete to the bottom and let it set. Then the post on top of that, and fill w/ dirt, tamping it as it is thrown in the hole. My last conversation w/ a contractor he said no more sticking the post in the hole and filling w/ concrete. Everyone thought that if the concrete was slightly above ground level and the top was tapered some, water would run away from the post. Apparently it has been found that no matter what, water gets inside the concrete, keeps the post wet since the water can't wick away, and the post rots.

 

[lakeroadster]

The best way... pour the footers. So... do it the best way.

Here where we live there are cactus growing in the yard. I'm betting dry concrete mix in a hole 3 foot deep, covered with native soil, would still be dry 10 years from now.