My new eyeshields are Lexan (polycarbonate) so they should take a pretty big hit without shattering. Certainly better that any plastic eyeshields supplied with the later block grinders made after about 1965.
"Pre-Block" Grinders--Where's the Love?
- Thread starter exmaxima1
- Start date
My new eyeshields are Lexan (polycarbonate) so they should take a pretty big hit without shattering. Certainly better that any plastic eyeshields supplied with the later block grinders made after about 1965.
atch
Well-known member
A couple available; one near Chicago and one near Peoria. I have no connection to either; just letting GJ folks know about them.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/198039388475673/?ref=search&referral_code=undefined
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/166917134889074/?ref=search&referral_code=undefined
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/198039388475673/?ref=search&referral_code=undefined
https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/166917134889074/?ref=search&referral_code=undefined
Neither of those grinders are Pre-Block, as you can quickly see from the switch locations. But that 1/2hp Block for $100 is a pretty good deal.
Harley94
Well-known member
Here's some more information from 1952 catalog
drivesitfar
Well-known member
without reading all 200+ posts can you guys say if there is a common method of cleaning and updating these great old Craftsman grinders?
I've got a pre block that sat in a barn for years before the house sold and since i've got it i've had it on a shelf for another about 5 years and I'd like to use it now.
if I plug it in and it works would I need to do much more than cleaning and changing the wheels or what would you upgrade?
last question. how does the pre block 1/3 HP compare to the 1/2 HP commercial block?
I've got a pre block that sat in a barn for years before the house sold and since i've got it i've had it on a shelf for another about 5 years and I'd like to use it now.
if I plug it in and it works would I need to do much more than cleaning and changing the wheels or what would you upgrade?
last question. how does the pre block 1/3 HP compare to the 1/2 HP commercial block?
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seber
Well-known member
In theory, horsepower is a fixed system but. Once Sears started using fake numbers, everything went to hell. I was given a block grinder that stated 1/4 hp. It barely had enough power to turn the wheels. Put a tool against it and it would give up. Since that one predates the junk numbers, I'd guess it is just what it says. The amperage would indicate an inefficient 1/3 hp or normal 1/2 hp.
drivesitfar
Well-known member
thanks and kinda what I thought. I've got a couple Thor 1/4 HP grinders that probably have more power than an imported 1/2 HP you can buy for under $100 at a hardware store new now.
ALL: any tips on cleaning up cause I usually just plug these in and use them?
ALL: any tips on cleaning up cause I usually just plug these in and use them?
Old Radar
Well-known member
What ever you do, don't use a de-greaser to remove muck from the badge. The red disappeared in seconds and the black was fading fast. 
I did this over a year ago and I'm still hoping mattblast will soon be able to print on metal...
Here's a link to my minor resto up-thread. It also has a link to Pendragon1998's very detailed restoration.
I did this over a year ago and I'm still hoping mattblast will soon be able to print on metal...
Here's a link to my minor resto up-thread. It also has a link to Pendragon1998's very detailed restoration.
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drivesitfar
Well-known member
82: I think pre blocks ended in early 60’s when Sears changed companies that made their famous block grinders.
Radar: thanks for the tip
All: anybody else have a checklist of what they do to a pre block before plugging it in and using it after they buy it if it’s a bit dirty?
Radar: thanks for the tip
All: anybody else have a checklist of what they do to a pre block before plugging it in and using it after they buy it if it’s a bit dirty?
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
I'm interested in finding one of these. I'm working on restoring a Craftsman Drill Press right now, and ended up buying a grinder pedestal so I could utilize some of the stuff I purchased for the drill press to restore the pedestal at the same time. I probably overpaid for the pedestal at about $100. Was hoping, in time, I might be able to find a 1/2 hp model from 1954 to 1963 for $100 - $150, but the ones I've seen so far are asking much more than that. Are these getting to be desirable enough to justify over $200?
The model I'm interested in looks like it was released in 1954. And it looks like 1964 was the year they changed from the toggle switch mounted on the horizontal portion of the base to the vertical surface. They also changed the horizontal, bar-mounted tool rests to more of a bracket design.
1953: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/2698.pdf#page=49
1954: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/1759.pdf#page=47
1963: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/4409.pdf#page=25
1964: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/2874.pdf#page=25
One question--for those that have these grinders, do you find it is difficult to find 7" wheels? Given that most stuff today tends to be 6" and 8", does being a 7" size limit the functionality at all? I suppose you could always just throw on a 6" wheel even if it would be undersized...
The model I'm interested in looks like it was released in 1954. And it looks like 1964 was the year they changed from the toggle switch mounted on the horizontal portion of the base to the vertical surface. They also changed the horizontal, bar-mounted tool rests to more of a bracket design.
1953: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/2698.pdf#page=49
1954: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/1759.pdf#page=47
1963: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/4409.pdf#page=25
1964: http://vintagemachinery.org/pubs/222/2874.pdf#page=25
One question--for those that have these grinders, do you find it is difficult to find 7" wheels? Given that most stuff today tends to be 6" and 8", does being a 7" size limit the functionality at all? I suppose you could always just throw on a 6" wheel even if it would be undersized...
lafester
Well-known member
That pedestal is sweet, never seen one like that.
For this grinder, check the inner flanges and see if you can even remove them. If not, I would leave the inside alone until you really need to get in there.
For this grinder, check the inner flanges and see if you can even remove them. If not, I would leave the inside alone until you really need to get in there.
lafester
Well-known member
It is pretty hard to find a specific model within a reasonable time frame, let alone for a bargain price. The parts are worth about $400 if complete with lamp so keep that in mind.
I like 7" wire wheels, but finding a fine wire is almost impossible. Medium and coarse are no problem. 8" wire wheels are much easier to find, but the speed starts getting a little much for small parts. Stone wheels are not a problem to find, but special 3m type wheels do not exist in 7". For those I would probably take off the guard and run open anyway.
I like 7" wire wheels, but finding a fine wire is almost impossible. Medium and coarse are no problem. 8" wire wheels are much easier to find, but the speed starts getting a little much for small parts. Stone wheels are not a problem to find, but special 3m type wheels do not exist in 7". For those I would probably take off the guard and run open anyway.
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AtlasRearden
Well-known member
I picked this stand up:
Now I just need a grinder to put on it... Found the one I was looking for, but the guy selling it would not budge on the price. And I'm not looking for a "bargain" necessarily, but just a fair deal. This particular one was in pretty rough shape, albeit functional, complete, and not major damage. But just seemed a little rich. I'm in no hurry, so I guess I'll get a better feel for it as I look. For all I know, maybe he was justified in sticking to his price.
Regarding the stand, does anyone know if the column was originally painted? Or are they bare metal like the drill press?
Now I just need a grinder to put on it... Found the one I was looking for, but the guy selling it would not budge on the price. And I'm not looking for a "bargain" necessarily, but just a fair deal. This particular one was in pretty rough shape, albeit functional, complete, and not major damage. But just seemed a little rich. I'm in no hurry, so I guess I'll get a better feel for it as I look. For all I know, maybe he was justified in sticking to his price.
Regarding the stand, does anyone know if the column was originally painted? Or are they bare metal like the drill press?
lafester
Well-known member
Pics and price would be helpful. I don't know of any dps that came with bare metal. Stands came in blue/grey, bronze and black.
Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk
Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
Got it-thanks.
Regarding the grinder I was looking at, attached are the pics. He was set on $220.
The more I'm reading into these, I also like the 3/4 HP from '69-'73.
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macgee
Well-known member
Atlas,
Just a heads up, This seller has a long history of flipping machines on craigslist but he never checks the machines but asks very high prices even if its not even running well or incomplete. He's a professional flipper with 100's of ads on your local craigslist. Not saying don't buy but Its a buyer beware with him; I've had friends burned by him.
If that grinder has bad bearings he probably wouldn't tell you and he'll still won't lower price. He traditional lists his location as Bell Gardens but recently been changing it around, making his ads look a little different but easy to tell as he uses the same phone number and always lists his them at $0 price and says firm. A lot of his items stay for sale for years and just keeps re-posting them.
These are a lot of his items but not all:
https://losangeles.craigslist.org/d/tools/search/tla?max_price=0&query=firm
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AtlasRearden
Well-known member
That seems about right per my experience. Thank you for the heads up.
I'm not in a hurry, so will keep hunting around.
lafester
Well-known member
Re: "Pre-Block" Grinders--Where's the Love?
It is just hard to beat a cast iron grinder with aluminum.
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Sounds like you made the right choice. I have both and the pre block is my favorite although I use the 3/4 more. The 3/4 is also worth more and harder to find.
It is just hard to beat a cast iron grinder with aluminum.
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FrankLee
Well-known member
Here's a 115.6965 for sale on fbmp near Toledo. It's missing the plastic quench tray. It may be a little steep, but the original paint is very nice.
https://www.facebook.com/marketplac.../?ref=search&referral_code=marketplace_search
https://www.facebook.com/marketplac.../?ref=search&referral_code=marketplace_search
Attachments
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
Re: "Pre-Block" Grinders--Where's the Love?
Is the '69-'73 3/4 hp considered "block" or "pre-block?" I like how it has the rounded mailbox top, cast iron base, but moves up to the 8" size. And the way those moveable toolrests are designed, it seems like you could fabricate some things to mount aftermarket tool rests without altering the machine.
Unfortunately, I only have room (if that) for one grinder, so would like something that is versatile.
Is the '69-'73 3/4 hp considered "block" or "pre-block?" I like how it has the rounded mailbox top, cast iron base, but moves up to the 8" size. And the way those moveable toolrests are designed, it seems like you could fabricate some things to mount aftermarket tool rests without altering the machine.
Unfortunately, I only have room (if that) for one grinder, so would like something that is versatile.
drivesitfar
Well-known member
Atlas: I can't recall which year the BLOCK started but about 1960 or 1961 sounds about right. I also like the first blocks too cause they still have the rounded tops and metal eye shields which it sounds like yours does.
Laf: thanks for the tip on cleaning up my old 1/3 HP Pre block if I decide to use it on my little military cabinet.
Laf: thanks for the tip on cleaning up my old 1/3 HP Pre block if I decide to use it on my little military cabinet.
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
Here's a 1/2 HP "mailbox" style for sale with a pedestal on ebay. Sight glass is cracked and needs to be cleaned up, but would probably be a nice one for someone. If I was in Indiana, I'd take a look at that one, but too far away for me. Maybe a little on the pricey side, but cool that it comes with the pedestal.
lafester
Well-known member
I think that is a pretty fair price for what you get. The guy is crazy to sell through ebay though with all the fees.
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
I'd like to find one of these. This is from the 1969 catalog, and looks like they made them almost the same way for about 5 years.
lafester
Well-known member
Yeah, that is a great one but they are pretty rare.
I think the cast iron 1/2 hp is a better machine and slightly easier to find.
I think the cast iron 1/2 hp is a better machine and slightly easier to find.
Old Radar
Well-known member
cajunfirehawk
Well-known member
cajunfirehawk
Well-known member
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
Yep, I would definitely buy a 1/2 hp model if one became available in my area for a decent price.
What year did the "Pre-Block" end and the "Block" begins? In about 1975, it looks like the rounded "mailbox" style ended and they became the squared off block look.
I'd like to find one of these. This is from the 1969 catalog, and looks like they made them almost the same way for about 5 years.
That's not a Pre-Block, as you can tell by the location of the power switch. There were also 2 versions of the roundtop block, and both were 3/4hp with 8-inch wheels. The earlier model had fairly plain end covers, while the later version had the "Princess Leia Hair Buns". I had the 2 pictured below, but sold them recently.
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AtlasRearden
Well-known member
Those are nice ones! Thanks for sharing. Can I ask what you sold them for?
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
As I've been looking at these, a few things have stood out in identifying the years.
1963
- Last year the power switches were on the horizontal surface of the base.
- Last year the horizontal rods for the tool rests extended from the quench tray of the 1/2 hp model
- Must be the last year of the 1/2 hp all-cast-iron model (85 lbs!)
- No 3/4 hp model
1964
- Power switch moves to the vertical surface of the base.
- 1/2 hp model design is changed (most noticeably, no horizontal bars for the tool rests attached to quench tray).
- Appears to have started using cast aluminum housings
- No 3/4 hp model
1966
- They introduce a 3/4 hp model, but the design is way different--looks like a regular grinder instead of the "mailbox." At 70 lbs, it's pretty beefy, and it is the first to offer 8" wheels.
1968
- The offering looks pretty much the same as 1966
- This is the last year of that rounded 3/4 hp model
1969
- The 3/4 hp model design changes to reflect more of the look of the old 1/2 hp model from 1963. Those horizontal bars that the tool rests mount to are back. But the aluminum in the design makes it a lot lighter--58 lbs.
- The rest of the offering seems similar
And I see what you're saying about the "Princess Leia Hair Bun" end covers, which appeared to pop up somewhere in the early 70's.
But I still can't say I'm really clear on when "Pre-Block" ended, and "Block" began.
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cajunfirehawk
Well-known member
Ask the Torqueman, he likely has the intel you desire...
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
I'm pretty sure this has to be a line from Mad Max: Thunderdome...
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls... Grinding time's here.
I will seek out this Torqueman.
cajunfirehawk
Well-known member
Not at all, he is the subject matter expert on craftsman block grinders on this forum, in this 120 pg post about craftsman grinders, here are just HIS posts alone, speak w/him, trust me on this, he knows more than all of us combined.
https://www.garagejournal.com/forum/search.php?searchid=44289301
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Old Radar
Well-known member
If you are asking when the actual shape changed to a squared off block, as opposed to the "mailbox" block (which differs from the Pre-Block), the Sears Spring-Summer Catalog of 1974 gives the first depiction of the square block for 3/4 & 1/2hp models. It also still offers the mailbox blocks for 1/2 & 1/4hp models. The 1973 Fall-Winter Catalog shows all mailboxes.
This website is a treasure trove of Sears catalogs from 1940-2010 and includes some from Montgomery Wards and J.C. Penny as well.
https://christmas.musetechnical.com/ShowCatalogPage/1974-Sears-Spring-Summer-Catalog/0696
This website is a treasure trove of Sears catalogs from 1940-2010 and includes some from Montgomery Wards and J.C. Penny as well.
https://christmas.musetechnical.com/ShowCatalogPage/1974-Sears-Spring-Summer-Catalog/0696
AtlasRearden
Well-known member
I actually noticed the same thing in 1974 when it went to the squared off block. I naively assumed that anything before that could potentially be a "Pre-Block," as a term used on this forum. But then I see folks say "That's not a Pre-Block." I'm just trying to understand what year marks the progression from "Pre-Block" to "Block," so I can use proper terminology and post in the right spots.
lafester
Well-known member
I believe it started with the flat tops but then included all of the aluminum frame grinders since the internals are about the same. Pre blocks are the cast iron version.