Roll Cage Installation Tips?
- Thread starter bulletpruf
- Start date
txvwnut
Well-known member
I want to say the rule book didn't look like that 20 years ago and it did state no halo bars, I see now they are allowing them.
aka Larry
Well-known member
They have changed the rules over the years, and you are correct that halo bars were not allowed back in the day. My current race car does utilize a halo.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Got started yesterday. Main hoop was too narrow so I stretched it out a bit.
My buddy Lee bent up some spreader plates and they got welded in.
Fitting the boxes took quite a bit of time, but they're finished and tacked into place.
My buddy Lee bent up some spreader plates and they got welded in.
Fitting the boxes took quite a bit of time, but they're finished and tacked into place.
rust in the eye
Well-known member
"Grinder and paint makes me the welder that I ain't!"
Pretty sure this is verboten regarding the cage welds
Pretty sure this is verboten regarding the cage welds
M.Brane
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Stitch/plug welded cage supports on the front bars of the RX-7 tied to the subframes, and boxed to the sills. There are additional plates underneath for jacking.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Headed over to the shop today with my buddy Lee and we got the main hoop and halo tacked into place.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
The angle is off on the down bars; they need more of a bend. Any recommendations on a somewhat reasonably priced tubing bender? Maybe the Speedway - https://www.speedwaymotors.com/3rd-...der-and-1-Die-Set,6614.html?sku=91084112-1.75
M.Brane
ALLIANCE MEMBER
We have a JD Squared hydraulic bender. It's spendy, but worth it IMHO. We've used it for more than cages. Made myself a nice topcase rack for the bikes out of leftover 1" DOM from the cage braces.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
If I do JD Squared and go with the manual version, it's about $600 + tax and shipping with the pedestal and dies. That's more than I'd like to spend, but it looks like a nice piece of gear. I can always convert to hydraulic later.
iagsxr
Well-known member
A manual bender like a JD2 has to be anchored to the floor. It's a PITA unless you have a spot that you can leave it set up.
There has to be a race car shop in your area that can rebend your bars.
iagsxr
Well-known member
The main drawback of that bender is that it's slow. I know people who have built dirt cars with one though.
Reread the fine print. 1 3/4" wall thickness capacity is .110", which is fine for a dirt car. Can't remember, are you using .120" or .134"? Not to say I've never used a tool past it's capacity, but I wouldn't buy one knowing it's going to be every time I used it.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
I was going to order the JD Squared bender, but the lead time is 4 weeks. Too damn long.
iagsxr
Well-known member
Try these guys:
iagsxr
Well-known member
Or, how far off are the bends? A lot or just needs tweaked?
Call the guy who bent the cage. Find out what the centerline radius is of the die he used. Let's say it's 6.5". Cut two 6.5" circles out of 3/4" plywood and one out of 1/2" Then cut two 10.5" circles out whatever plywood you have the most of. Glue it and screw it together with the big circles on the outside. You now have a limited use die.
Clamp the die in a vise. You and your buddy each get on opposite ends of the tube and push. If the bend just needs tweaked you'll be surprised how much you can move it.
Call the guy who bent the cage. Find out what the centerline radius is of the die he used. Let's say it's 6.5". Cut two 6.5" circles out of 3/4" plywood and one out of 1/2" Then cut two 10.5" circles out whatever plywood you have the most of. Glue it and screw it together with the big circles on the outside. You now have a limited use die.
Clamp the die in a vise. You and your buddy each get on opposite ends of the tube and push. If the bend just needs tweaked you'll be surprised how much you can move it.
zimman
Well-known member
I've had two JD2 benders and almost destroyed the first one. I bent the top arm and had to drive back down to Ocala to get one made. LOL
Anyhow they're good pieces and we actually used the manual pull bar on the second one. 1.625" CM so was almost easy to bend. 1.75" would give you some nut drops manually but only did that big stuff back in the day.
Zim
zimman
Well-known member
How and where far off are they? Sometimes you can use a rachet strap and draw it in if it's a width issue.
Zim
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
I think we need to re-do the A pillar bars. They're tacked in place and the angle doesn't look terrible, but they're not tight up against the A pillar at all. To fix them, we need to start over, and that requires asking someone to bend up a few bars, or me buying a tubing bender, and it's always nice to have an excuse to buy new tools.
I need to buy more tubing anyway because the dash bar is too short.
I ordered tubing bender from Amazon; would have gone with JD Squared, but the 30 day lead time is too much. Anyway, the tubing bender is $225; it's a Woodward Fab clone and I bought a Woodward Fab die for $400 from Summit.
I need to buy more tubing anyway because the dash bar is too short.
I ordered tubing bender from Amazon; would have gone with JD Squared, but the 30 day lead time is too much. Anyway, the tubing bender is $225; it's a Woodward Fab clone and I bought a Woodward Fab die for $400 from Summit.
zimman
Well-known member
Welcome to full time chassis work. LMAO.
First thing you should do is bend a 90* and mark the beginning of the bend where the follower die is and then a mark at the end. Then hang it on the wall. This will help you immensity to "see" all your bends visually. It's a visual aid. All those computer aided drawing programs are great but this hunk of steel is better. If you have some extra metal bend a 45* also.
Zim
aka Larry
Well-known member
What we did on my buddies Lincoln was to start with EMT since it's way cheaper than DOM. We were able to bend, tweak, bend, tweak until we got it just right then transferred the marks onto the actual DOM so we only had to bend it once. It was most helpful on the A-pillars for sure due to multiple bends on multiple planes.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Working on rear down bars. Rules say 45 degrees is optimal but you can deviate a bit. I’m landing the down bar at about 55 degrees but it’s in compression not shear so that’s what I went with. 45 would put me further back in the trunk area. Hard to get to to weld and it would be in shear.
HF bender comes in handy for the bends.
HF bender comes in handy for the bends.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Down stays are tacked in. 53 degree angle.
Drivers A pillar bar redone from scratch; much closer to A pillar now. Used an Amazon bender; Woodward fab clone with a Woodward fab die. Had to fab a mount to mount it to the vise. Bending is definitely a 2 person job. Swag Offroad makes a nice hydraulic upgrade.
Harbor Freight notcher is marginal at best. Needs a slight mod to center it and runout is horrible. But it still makes an acceptable notch. May see about upgrading that too.
Drivers A pillar bar redone from scratch; much closer to A pillar now. Used an Amazon bender; Woodward fab clone with a Woodward fab die. Had to fab a mount to mount it to the vise. Bending is definitely a 2 person job. Swag Offroad makes a nice hydraulic upgrade.
Harbor Freight notcher is marginal at best. Needs a slight mod to center it and runout is horrible. But it still makes an acceptable notch. May see about upgrading that too.
iagsxr
Well-known member
Is that all it came with for a handle?
My first JD2 bender was manual. The handle that came with it was at least twice as long. Still tore the soles off a pair of shoes one time bending a bunch of 1 3/4" x .095".
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OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Yeah, that's it. We're using 1 3/4" x .120". I'm not a small guy, but I still have to put a lot of effort into bending. I should probably buy or make a longer handle.
aka Larry
Well-known member
That's the same manual bender my buddy and I used on his Lincoln Lemons car. We added a 6 foot cheater bar and it worked WAY better as far as the effort required to bend the tubing.
txvwnut
Well-known member
Welp glad to see their quality hasn't changed. I bought one of those over 20 years ago and it was as you described. I tossed it in the scrap barrel and bought a couple of these https://lowbucktool.com/ .Harbor Freight notcher is marginal at best. Needs a slight mod to center it and runout is horrible. But it still makes an acceptable notch. May see about upgrading that too.
Bodj Built
Well-known member
How does that work on tougher material like 1.75"x.120 DOM or 4130?
txvwnut
Well-known member
Cuts it like butter.
Bodj Built
Well-known member
Have you tried making different cradles for the tube to sit in so you can notch at different angles?
txvwnut
Well-known member
Not needed. If you need to change the angle you take more bites on the opposite side of the tube. For really steep angles you just miter the angle in your saw then nip the sharp corner off.
Bodj Built
Well-known member
Ah I see. So it'll get you a ballpark notch that would be good enough for MIG, but, if I'm picturing it correctly, may not be tight enough for TIG on the steeper notches.
txvwnut
Well-known member
It's good enough for tig as well and the fit up is really good. You don't need that precision machine fit that the high dollar notchers make.
Bodj Built
Well-known member
Need? No. Want? Yes.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Progress continues, but not at warp speed. Dash bar is tacked in place. Diagonal needs final fitting.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
Diagonal finished, tacked into place, then I cut/ground the tack welds holding the cage to the boxes. Then cut/ground the tack welds holding the boxes to the floor, and dropped the cage down. Now we can get at spots on top of the cage that need welded.
OP
bulletpruf
Well-known member
I was out of town last weekend, but managed to get back after it today. My buddy Lee fully the top of the cage, and then I painted most of it with roll cage paint. From there, we put the cage up on the boxes, and Lee welded the boxes to the floors, and then he welded the cage to the boxes. Took a bit of persuasion to get the cage back in place once the top was welded, but ratchet straps and a porta-power made quick work of that.
Next steps - the dash bar is crooked, so that needs to be fixed. Shouldn't be too difficult; it's just tacked into place now.
From there, I'll work on fitting the harness bars and the door bars.
Next steps - the dash bar is crooked, so that needs to be fixed. Shouldn't be too difficult; it's just tacked into place now.
From there, I'll work on fitting the harness bars and the door bars.
aka Larry
Well-known member
Looks good man!
Ohmthis
Well-known member
You guys are making good progress. I’ve enjoyed following along.