Running Low Voltage Network Wire

[TX63CONV]

I am in the process of gut renovating a house. I have a contractor that is doing the plumbing, framing, electrical, etc.

However, I am going to run the network cable and coax cables for the various rooms myself, with the help of my cousin who is a network IT guy.

The question for the forum: Are there codes/things I should be aware of before I start drilling holes into studs? Obviously, I'll have an electrical and I assume plumbing inspection prior to sheetrock but I want to make sure I dont raise any red flags.

Thanks

 

[ishiboo]

I am in the process of gut renovating a house. I have a contractor that is doing the plumbing, framing, electrical, etc.

However, I am going to run the network cable and coax cables for the various rooms myself, with the help of my cousin who is a network IT guy.

The question for the forum: Are there codes/things I should be aware of before I start drilling holes into studs? Obviously, I'll have an electrical and I assume plumbing inspection prior to sheetrock but I want to make sure I dont raise any red flags.

Thanks

Mostly no. Some locales have basic codes/rules in place, most of those are commercial-only. But most stay out.

Couple things:

1. Keep the low voltage separated from the high-voltage. If they appear in the same box, it must be divided.

2. Don't string low voltage cable immediately next to high voltage, it will couple noise onto the low voltage. Not a safety issue and not as relevant in todays digital age, but still a good rule. I usually run 120 down one side of the stud cavity, and low-voltage down the other. Perpendicular intersections between the two is not as bad if needed.

3. Don't stuff wires in HVAC vents because it's easy, it must be plenum wire if you do.

4. Holes in top/bottom plates usually need to be sealed to prevent fire movement. Your inspector will want to see orange expanding foam, or red fire caulk here. Orange expanding foam is the easy way to go. I seal up just about all my holes even if not required, it keeps air movement to a minimum and keeps wires/etc. from vibrating at the bottom of holes with deep bass

5. Don't be afraid to run more wire than you need. I usually do a minimum of one quad-shield RG6 and two Cat5E to each potential TV/computer location. Cat5 can be used for other functions too - you can use one for an infrared repeater, audio (with balun), HDMI (requires two, Cat6 suggested), USB, etc. Run 3/4" conduit to "popular" TV locations as well to future proof.

 

[tomstin]

5. Don't be afraid to run more wire than you need. I usually do a minimum of one quad-shield RG6 and two Cat5E to each potential TV/computer location. Cat5 can be used for other functions too - you can use one for an infrared repeater, audio (with balun), HDMI (requires two, Cat6 suggested), USB, etc. Run 3/4" conduit to "popular" TV locations as well to future proof.

Totally agree on this point!!!

 

[Macgyver_ga]

Run more cable than you think you'll need. When they were building my house, I came one evening after the crews left with some friends and ran speaker wires, extra coax, and HDMI cables in my living room, out to my screened porch, the master bedroom, and the master bath. I did this before all the drywall went up, I made sure to put in low voltage boxes (orange or green) so the electrical inspector could distinguish. I WISH I WOULD HAVE RUN MORE THAN I DID. In the last few years I've run more wiring except I've had to fish it through the walls. I ran speaker wire out to the garage, and a 50ft RCA cable from my "office" to the living room so I can play my music on the computer through the surround sound system in the living room.

Go buy a 400ft spool of in-wall speaker wire and go ahead and run it while you can in case you want to add surround sound later.

 

[Aceman]

My boss recently mentioned that talking to his satellite guy, that he recommends all copper RG6, not the copper clad. Something about regular coax is copper clad and it corrodes so when your satellite guy shows up, he ends up stringing all new coax around the house since the corroded copper clad doesn't pass the signal properly.

I'm no LV expert, so I'm just passing this info along.

 

[mrb]

remember all in wall wire must be rated as such (CL-2) dont run the clear parallel type speaker wire, most of it is not in wall rated

 

[Tech Guy]

Use an RG6 with solid copper core and a 95% copper braid and you should never have a problem

 

[TX63CONV]

Thanks guys for all the information. I am running multiple Cat6 wires to both the upstairs and downstairs living room for future use as well as a Cat6 and coax to my daughters room (who is only 5). I also plan to run wire for surround sound in the ceiling and coax outside....all for future use.

What I probably need to do some more research on is the sealing when i drill through the top plate to the second floor--can I find at the local HD/Lowes?

Lastly, when drilling through 2x4 studs, what is the maximum size bit I should use? My plan is to have the downstairs office as the central access point for all the Cat6 but was going to run the coax and then split off as I go.

A friend turned me onto www.monoprice.com for all the networking/home theater needs...

 

[Tech Guy]

I usually go with 3/4" holes in the studs.

 

[cowboyjosh]

If you do speaker runs to a rack location for distributed audio, make sure you run at least 1 CAT 5E to the volume control locations, that way you can use a processor to control that zone; its much more intuitive then just a regular knob volume control.

 

[jeffmoss26]

Run pull strings in case you decide to add more cables later on!

 

[ishiboo]

Thanks guys for all the information. I am running multiple Cat6 wires to both the upstairs and downstairs living room for future use as well as a Cat6 and coax to my daughters room (who is only 5). I also plan to run wire for surround sound in the ceiling and coax outside....all for future use.

What I probably need to do some more research on is the sealing when i drill through the top plate to the second floor--can I find at the local HD/Lowes?

Lastly, when drilling through 2x4 studs, what is the maximum size bit I should use? My plan is to have the downstairs office as the central access point for all the Cat6 but was going to run the coax and then split off as I go.

A friend turned me onto www.monoprice.com for all the networking/home theater needs...

I would run coax to the living room as well.

You can find sealer at any hardware store... it's orange "fire block" foam (no more fire-resistant than the yellow stuff, just colored orange) or red fire caulk.

I do a lot of the foam so I have a $40 gun, and then the cans are $15 but 28 ounces. You can also use only a partial can so you get a lot more for your money.

For the holes, I would do more than 1" in a 2x4, 3/4" would be better. Don't be afraid to drill multiple holes one above the other, before you take out a bigger hole.

 

[Teken]

On a tangent: I always find it funny and interesting that code will insist upon a person / builder use this fire caulk. Yet, they fail to realize this has no real world effect against a fire.

It will reduce the odds of fumes, gas, and vapor from penetration the next zone / area. But, the reality is that you're standing on a wooden structure which clearly burns!

If the code or the person was even remotely serious about a fire event. They would be using fire rated drywall, insulation in all interior walls, and under all floor joists.

All of the above I have done in my home in stages . . .

Teken . . .

 

[paranoid56]

who still runs RG6? cant say i have used any of that in 5 years. i have cat6 on all my runs

 

[cderalow]

who still runs RG6? cant say i have used any of that in 5 years. i have cat6 on all my runs

if you have any of the regular cable providers (comcast, verizon etc) they will require rg6 to any place you plan on having a set top box. ditto the satelite guys.

even with Fios, TV signal is carried over RG6, and the RJ45 on the set top boxes are used for diagnostics

 

[ishiboo]

On a tangent: I always find it funny and interesting that code will insist upon a person / builder use this fire caulk. Yet, they fail to realize this has no real world effect against a fire.

It will reduce the odds of fumes, gas, and vapor from penetration the next zone / area. But, the reality is that you're standing on a wooden structure which clearly burns!

If the code or the person was even remotely serious about a fire event. They would be using fire rated drywall, insulation in all interior walls, and under all floor joists.

All of the above I have done in my home in stages . . .

Teken . . .

Actually the science proves very much otherwise.

The purpose is not to block fire, but to slow its spread. Drywall does this very well, wood also does it well until the moisture content is gone. Having a solid top plate vs a bunch of holes could make a substantial difference in how fast a fire would spread from floor to floor.

That's why "fire block" foam is NOT fire proof, it's the same as the yellow foam. Light it up and it'll burn like a roll of newspaper. BUT, stuffed in a hole, it burns on the surface and keeps air and hot gasses from expanding up to the next floor.

All-in-all, it's a couple bucks to give you potentially substantially more time to evacuate in a fire.

 

[TX63CONV]

I would run coax to the living room as well.

You can find sealer at any hardware store... it's orange "fire block" foam (no more fire-resistant than the yellow stuff, just colored orange) or red fire caulk.

I do a lot of the foam so I have a $40 gun, and then the cans are $15 but 28 ounces. You can also use only a partial can so you get a lot more for your money.

For the holes, I would do more than 1" in a 2x4, 3/4" would be better. Don't be afraid to drill multiple holes one above the other, before you take out a bigger hole.

Should I use pvc to run my cables between floors? Otherwise my cables will be stuck in the firestop insulation.

 

[ishiboo]

if you have any of the regular cable providers (comcast, verizon etc) they will require rg6 to any place you plan on having a set top box. ditto the satelite guys.

even with Fios, TV signal is carried over RG6, and the RJ45 on the set top boxes are used for diagnostics

Cable, satellite, OTA. Basically all TV uses RG6 as the current cable technology.

RG6 is like Cat6... the current common standard for multi-channel video transmission. It's going to be a while before we see that change.

I'm starting to run HDMI (via 2 Cat6) and infrared to each TV, and then putting all the satellite boxes/Mac Mini HTPCs/etc. in a common area. I still run RG6 to each location though.

 

[ishiboo]

Should I use pvc to run my cables between floors? Otherwise my cables will be stuck in the firestop insulation.

You don't really have to pull cables once they're in, there are normally enough bends/etc. in a normal run that you can't pull a new cable using an existing one. All my walls (even interior) are insulated as well which makes it more difficult.

I would only use conduit in conduit runs, the cables can and should be sealed by the firestop.

 

[aandpdan]

My two cents, check with your inspector on the fire block. My inspector won't accept any "foam" fire rated or not. Even the 3M fire caulk won't pass as it's only "tested" but not approved to any standard.

I had to use a black firebrick and mortar caulk around the wires instead.

 

[TX63CONV]

My two cents, check with your inspector on the fire block. My inspector won't accept any "foam" fire rated or not. Even the 3M fire caulk won't pass as it's only "tested" but not approved to any standard.

I had to use a black firebrick and mortar caulk around the wires instead.

My plan is to do this after the electrical is in. I will obviously ask my contractor but I assume I could follow what the electrician did.

I just dont want to do all this work, then have the electrical inspection done and get flagged.

 

[cderalow]

My plan is to do this after the electrical is in. I will obviously ask my contractor but I assume I could follow what the electrician did.

I just dont want to do all this work, then have the electrical inspection done and get flagged.

either ask your electrician, or do as he does.

that's the easiest way around it.

he can't blame your work if you're using the same method that he is.

 

[bimmerZ5]

Lastly, when drilling through 2x4 studs, what is the maximum size bit I should use? My plan is to have the downstairs office as the central access point for all the Cat6 but was going to run the coax and then split off as I go.

A friend turned me onto www.monoprice.com for all the networking/home theater needs...

when i was running cat5e through my house, i recall reading somewhere that the local code specified that any holes drilled into studs should not exceed 40% of the width of that stud, unless it was reinforced in some other way. i wasn't sure what "other" way was, so I just made sure my holes were well below 40% of the stud width. like some one else said, don't hesitate to drill multiple holes.

also, after trying various tools, i found that the Irwin "Speedbor" bits (looks like augar bits) make drilling through studs very quick and clean. I recommend getting a set.

I love monprice ... used a LOT of their cables/jacks/wallplates/etc... and they all seem to be pretty good. customer service has been good too. I highly recommend them.

 

[Teken]

Actually the science proves very much otherwise.

The purpose is not to block fire, but to slow its spread. Drywall does this very well, wood also does it well until the moisture content is gone. Having a solid top plate vs a bunch of holes could make a substantial difference in how fast a fire would spread from floor to floor.

That's why "fire block" foam is NOT fire proof, it's the same as the yellow foam. Light it up and it'll burn like a roll of newspaper. BUT, stuffed in a hole, it burns on the surface and keeps air and hot gasses from expanding up to the next floor.

All-in-all, it's a couple bucks to give you potentially substantially more time to evacuate in a fire.

I agree its better than leaving a gaping hole there. I think the other benefit would also to keep any small bugs from freely roaming up and down the structure . . .

Teken . . .

 

[Jimmyn]

One thing you'll want to do is to put steel plates on the studs where the holes for the wires are. These go on the edge of the stud and are covered by the wall board so that no one drives a nail into the wires. You can find these at any hardware/home improvement store. They're 1-1/2 inches wide and about 2 inches long.

 

[bimmerZ5]

One thing you'll want to do is to put steel plates on the studs where the holes for the wires are. These go on the edge of the stud and are covered by the wall board so that no one drives a nail into the wires. You can find these at any hardware/home improvement store. They're 1-1/2 inches wide and about 2 inches long.

that's a good point and i forgot. additionally, i recommend cutting a mortise so the plates sit flush with the surface of the stud where the drywall will go on top of. this way your wall is perfectly flat and you don't have to use shims. at least, that's what i did, and it made a big difference compared to other parts of the house where the walls were built by someone else that didn't cut a mortise for the metal brackets.

 

[TX63CONV]

My plan was to run the coax from room to room by splitting it—(a) entry point to 3 way splitter1 (b) 3 way to Office1, Office2 and 3 way splitter2 (c) 3 way splitter2 to LR, Master BR, 3 way splitter3 (d) 3 way splitter3 to Upstairs LR, Outside, Upstairs BR.

After doing a little further research, I am concerned about any kind of loss of signal as I run from splitter to splitter. However, I wanted to avoid 7 coax runs emanating from my entry point.

Thoughts?

 

[bimmerZ5]

My plan was to run the coax from room to room by splitting it—(a) entry point to 3 way splitter1 (b) 3 way to Office1, Office2 and 3 way splitter2 (c) 3 way splitter2 to LR, Master BR, 3 way splitter3 (d) 3 way splitter3 to Upstairs LR, Outside, Upstairs BR.

After doing a little further research, I am concerned about any kind of loss of signal as I run from splitter to splitter. However, I wanted to avoid 7 coax runs emanating from my entry point.

Thoughts?

I don't know all the technical details, but when I was replacing my house from RG-59 to RG-6, I was told by everyone (including the guy from the cable company) to minimize the use of splitters and only use top notch splitters if you absolutely have to. I was told the ideal way is to have one splitter at the location where the coax comes in from the street to the house, and from there to have straight cables directly to the locations you want to distribute coax. The cable company guy (Cox Comm.) told me they specifically don't like having splitters anywhere else because home-owners/residents often will add splitters between the wall and the devices (cable box + cable modem, for example) and when there's a signal problem, the first thing they do is check the splitters. If there are splitters elsewhere, it just makes it that much more of a hassle to troubleshoot the problem.

Anyway, i don't know the technical details to explain exactly why, but just sharing what I was told.

 

[cderalow]

Point of source to drop should always be done. Especially if it's a new build.

 

[TX63CONV]

One last question....maybe it should go in the general forum....when I make my runs, I am going to have to go through the plywood side of one of the engineered floor joists. Any issues with drilling through this?

It's hard for me to visualize without the electrical in what is acceptable and what's not.

 

[cderalow]

the pre-engineered joists should have dedicated locations that are provided as knockouts for electrical cabling.

if not, you'll have to lookup the manufacturer of your joists and their requirements for drilling holes.

 

[Teken]

I don't know all the technical details, but when I was replacing my house from RG-59 to RG-6, I was told by everyone (including the guy from the cable company) to minimize the use of splitters and only use top notch splitters if you absolutely have to. I was told the ideal way is to have one splitter at the location where the coax comes in from the street to the house, and from there to have straight cables directly to the locations you want to distribute coax. The cable company guy (Cox Comm.) told me they specifically don't like having splitters anywhere else because home-owners/residents often will add splitters between the wall and the devices (cable box + cable modem, for example) and when there's a signal problem, the first thing they do is check the splitters. If there are splitters elsewhere, it just makes it that much more of a hassle to troubleshoot the problem.

Anyway, i don't know the technical details to explain exactly why, but just sharing what I was told.

All of this is spot on . . .

Teken . . .

 

[sselander]

Place an ethernet line next to the coax.
If you get an Internet TV, it will require an Ethernet connection.
Wired is obviously preferred over wireless.

You may want to have a few places in the house for a wireles access point (requires Ethernet and power) Commercial buildings use POE (power over Ethernet) for electrical power to the access points. Try to put at least one on each floor somewhere up high.

Take lots of pics before the sheetrock goes up also.

 

[TX63CONV]

the pre-engineered joists should have dedicated locations that are provided as knockouts for electrical cabling.

if not, you'll have to lookup the manufacturer of your joists and their requirements for drilling holes.

I'll look again....thanks

 

[ishiboo]

I'll look again....thanks

It's usually pretty simple. Basically, you want most of the holes to be in the middle of the web. You can drill small holes for wire on any of the wood I-joists without concern. Multiple holes should be next to each other horizontally, not vertically. If you get above 2" then consult the joists engineering specs for requirements.

NO holes, notches or anything else in the wood chords at the top or bottom of the joist.

 

[cderalow]

It's usually pretty simple. Basically, you want most of the holes to be in the middle of the web. You can drill small holes for wire on any of the wood I-joists without concern. Multiple holes should be next to each other horizontally, not vertically. If you get above 2" then consult the joists engineering specs for requirements.

NO holes, notches or anything else in the wood chords at the top or bottom of the joist.

I've got some engineered joists in my house that you can't drill anything through, so it's not always simple.

otherwise, correct.

 

[ishiboo]

I've got some engineered joists in my house that you can't drill anything through, so it's not always simple.

otherwise, correct.

I have never seen a joist you cannot drill through. None of the wood I-joists for sure, which is what I specified when I said that.

Did you confuse a joist with an engineered truss or beam?

 

[SeattleKent]

After the wiring is done and before the sheetrock is up, take a video of each wall. I did this ten years ago when my house was built. I've used the video probably 20 times for
* determining exactly stud location
* how does that high voltage wire run
* where do the water pipe run
* where did I bury that speaker wire in the wall

It has been a big help.

 

[buzz4041]

My plan was to run the coax from room to room by splitting it—(a) entry point to 3 way splitter1 (b) 3 way to Office1, Office2 and 3 way splitter2 (c) 3 way splitter2 to LR, Master BR, 3 way splitter3 (d) 3 way splitter3 to Upstairs LR, Outside, Upstairs BR.

After doing a little further research, I am concerned about any kind of loss of signal as I run from splitter to splitter. However, I wanted to avoid 7 coax runs emanating from my entry point.

Thoughts?

Run each cable as a homerun back to your tie in location. Here is where you can install your splitters and connect as needed. You may need to have a powered splitter so keep that in mind when planning homerun location.
If your engineered joist are LVL beams then look closely at them as they have knockouts that are designed into them just for the purpose of fishing wires through them.

 

[Macgyver_ga]

After the wiring is done and before the sheetrock is up, take a video of each wall. I did this ten years ago when my house was built. I've used the video probably 20 times for
* determining exactly stud location
* how does that high voltage wire run
* where do the water pipe run
* where did I bury that speaker wire in the wall

It has been a big help.

Good idea ^^^ I didn't do a video but I took lots of pictures when my house was under construction. They're also uploaded to my facebook so I can't really ever "lose" them because they're stored "in the cloud." I went to the house just about every evening when it was under construction to monitor the progress. I have gone back to those pictures a number of times to look at stud locations, pipes, wires, etc when doing projects.