Seal Coating a driveway

[nate379]

Because the mods refuse to delete my thread after i have asked i am removing all my posts.

 

[gsport]

for what it's worth.. i had mine coated less than two years ago and it's already flaking off. cost me $1400, not sure what i'm going to do this time, maybe just recoat the flakie spots myself.... and do let it dry out

 

[Matt M PA]

I had ours sealed last summer and it's coming off in spots too. The guys said that the stuff they use is so much better than what you can buy at the hardware store, etc.

Thy did hot seal all the cracks, some of which have opened a little...but nothing that wasn't expected.

These guys also do not recommend hot coating, thyensay it makes no difference...but I'm not so sure about that.

They did a great job edging, etc in preparation....but thus far longevity is not quite what I expected...but they recently said they were stopping by to touch up any areas that have issues.

I think a good coating will protect the surface, keep moisture from getting underneath through the cracks and prolong the useful life of your asphalt.

 

[ridgwel]

Keep in mind that asphalt needs to be rolled periodically...like when they laid it down. Take a look at some asphalt airport runways and you'll see that they crack faster than highways....that's because of the rolling heavy traffic on the highways. If you can find someone that puts down an asphalt rejuvenator (a product that acutually penetrates the top 1/2" of the asphalt instead of just coating it), you'll see better performance. Driveways are like asphalt air strips....not much rolling action.

 

[Herb]

Why bother seal coating? If your base was properly prepared there shouldn't be much of an issue with cracking. Town roads are never seal coated and they see a lot more traffic than a driveway ever will. I think seal coating just makes money for the guys that apply it and the stores that sell it, althought it does look nice when finished. Your nickel.

 

[dirttracker18]

Keep in mind that asphalt needs to be rolled periodically...like when they laid it down. Take a look at some asphalt airport runways and you'll see that they crack faster than highways....that's because of the rolling heavy traffic on the highways. If you can find someone that puts down an asphalt rejuvenator (a product that acutually penetrates the top 1/2" of the asphalt instead of just coating it), you'll see better performance. Driveways are like asphalt air strips....not much rolling action.

Every air strip I have seen was concrete. Are there some that use asphalt elsewhere?

 

[mslisaj]

Interesting subject. Had a new driveway put in about six years ago. They did a beautiful job of preparing the grading and subbase. But here we get snow and freeze and thaw cycles so a few cracks are inevitable. But with that said I had my driveway seal coated three years ago. At that time when I would use either my blower or broom the fines were coming out of the surface. The guy that did the seal coat gave me the same song and dance that his product was better then the five gallon pails from Home Depot. I'm here to say it's the exact same material. Besides it was extremely expensive to have put down. But it did seal in all the fines and I believe the driveway is better for it. For touch ups or repairs I use the bucket material and it goes on and looks exactly the same. In the future I intend on maintaining the driveway myself with the buckets. In my studying of this process putting on this product, a thin coat is better then a thick one. That may account for the flaking.

Hope this helps...................

Lisa

 

[diggerrick]

Two summers ago I gave my driveway (about 2.500 sq ft) two coats of the best seal coat that Menard's carries (supposed to be good for ten years). I think it was on sale for $20-25/bucket before the rebate. It was starting to get bad and I was worried it might already be too late. I had to fill quite few cracks first, but it still looks pretty good now. I have to fill in a depression in the middle by the road where I have ponding this year, then I'm going to put on another coat or two and let it ride for a few years.

I've read that the commercial stuff is better, but I really like the stuff I got at Menards. It doesn't require any stirring, spreads great, and has a little bit of sand filler that works to fill small crevices and gives it a nice non-slick surface when it's wet. The sand also makes it sparkle a little in the sunlight - it looks pretty neat contrasted with the flat black color.

I really don't like the slick glossy commercial stuff very well. It might be great for a busy parking lot, but I don't want it on my driveway.

 

[ZeroSignal]

Ask the experts at this forum.
http://www.lawnsite.com/forumdisplay.php?f=116

 

[mslisaj]

Just wanted to clarify my remark on the pro sealer vs. the Box Store sealer. I went with the guy that did my driveway to his suppler in Medford, Oregon. They filled his tank out of an unmarked tank that was sitting in this trucking companies yard. These guys bring a truck load back from somewhere to fill their tank and wholesale it out to the "seal coat guys". The tank on my contractors trailer held 600 gallons and the bill was $300 to fill it. There was nothing fancy about this stuff. When the sealcoater got to my house he used my garden hose and put about 100 gallons of water into this and then mixed it up and sealed my driveway with this mixture. He did the entire job by hand with a squeegee and it took him about 90 minutes. The kicker about this is I would estimate he only used 100 gallons on my place which is what I figure it would take in five gallon buckets. So I certainly didn't get an exotic mixture of something on my driveway. But it looks good and is wearing nicely.

I have used the bucket stuff and it looks identical and smells the same as what the "pro" used on my place. Just thought I would add this information to this mix............

Lisa

 

[wssix99]

Why bother seal coating? If your base was properly prepared there shouldn't be much of an issue with cracking. Town roads are never seal coated and they see a lot more traffic than a driveway ever will. I think seal coating just makes money for the guys that apply it and the stores that sell it, although it does look nice when finished. Your nickel.

Lot's of wisdom in this comment!

Sealing asphalt is the WORST thing you can do to your pavement. All concrete pavements (cementitious and asphaltic) are intended to let water pass through them and they also "breathe."

Why do people sell sealers, then? Most driveway sealers are made from tar waste products from coal fired power plants. The waste is marketed as a beneficial product instead of toxic waste.

Sealed driveways have worse traction as they don't shed water as fast normal pavement. If you live in an area where the temperatures go below freezing, sealed pavements will crack more as they trap water/vapor in the pavement. That water then leads to cracks during a freeze. Also, once you start down the sealing path, you'll have more maintenance as the old sealer deteriorates.

The best way to maintain an asphalt driveway is to fill any cracks with crack filler to keep water from pooling in the cracks. If you stay on top of any cracks that develop, you can prevent their spread. Any stains can also be de-greased.

 

[metal1313]

any recommendations for removing large oil stains? i used this spary, and one you mix with hot water then let sit and scrub...it worked a little but not much. i am pretty sure im gonna get the lower grade seal coater just to make the area look nice. and the driveway is ****, needs to be redone bad

 

[Unearthed]

Keep in mind that asphalt needs to be rolled periodically...like when they laid it down. .

Ummmm........no.

 

[DZL JIM]

I have a 300' driveway that I have sealed myself 3 times and it needs done again.
I always get the best stuff at Home Depot and it lasts a year at best. I try ti di every 2 to 3 years.
Realing thinking on having it done this time just to see if there is a quality difference.

I don't care about cracks, it's the fines that get worked up and the drive is 10 years old and looks like a gravel driveway. The low bidder I went with used small aggregate, I should have went with the higher bidders that actually do a good job with the asphalt. I know people that have used the higher bidders and their driveways look just as good as the roads and are twice as old.
Live and learn...

 

[mslisaj]

I have to totally agree with this gentleman. Although I didn't actually go with the low bidder but there were two contractors that did my driveway. The man with the talent did all the grading and placed the base and compacted it. The AC guy sent his crew who where in a hurry and really didn't do a very good job at all. The AC quality certainly was lacking there also. If I ever need it to be repaved I'll have them pull the AC, recompact the grade and pave it again. This time I'm going to be a real stickler on the quality and type of mix. I think this makes all the difference in the world..........

Lisa

 

[58Yeoman]

Do it now.

 

[DZL JIM]

I've been told many times that the asphalt wants to 'breathe' and that you should not seal it.
If it was my drive I would never have touched it except for the fine granuals that are coming out, piting the driveway and filling my house with gravel.
If your drive looks fine and is holding up well, I wouldn't touch it till it starts to show issues. Just my opinion.

 

[diggerrick]

I used to work for a small construction company named Kokosing Construction.

I'm pretty sure I remember the parking lot at our office being coated while I was there - but then what does Kokosing know about asphalt anyway???

 

[wssix99]

If that was the case there would be info all over the web about "sealing is bad" and that is simply not the case at all.

Don't really need "traction" on my driveway, it's not like it's at a 20* grade and once there is ice on it, don't matter what is underneath, it's still gonna be slick.

If anything the water will shed faster since it will flow across the top and not pool in all the little cracks/pores.

Don't believe anything you read on the internet!

You don't see much about this as everyone (except you) makes a ton of money. Ask any pavement engineer or road builder and you'll hear the same. (Note - Driveway companies do not build roads.)

Utility Company - Saves $ by not having to pay to put their waste in a dump.
Driveway Sealer Company - Makes $ by selling a free waste product as a "useful" thing
Driveway Sealers - Makes $ by the highly skilled job of spreading tar on a horizontal surface
Driveway companies - Makes $ when they have to come back in 10 years and replace your crackled driveway


BTW - When you shed water off the top, it goes to the sides where it gets under the sealed pavement and freezes in the winter. Look at any aged sealed driveway and you'll see that the edges are spider cracked much worse than the middle because of this. Instead of a normal amount of water at the edges, a sealed driveway sheds 1/2 of the water that hits the driveway off to the sides. Typically, the appropriate drainage is not installed for this type of thing and the useful life of the driveway is shortened.

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Gang:

If you need a good product for your home driveway, I have a solution.
It is excellent for repairing badly checked asphalt, wide cracks or pot-holes.
Much better than cold patch and less costly then a new section of driveway.


Here is a link...
http://legacyindustrial.net/cart/hd0100-asphalt-resurfacerpatch-p-246.html

 

[diggerrick]

This is what I used for filling the cracks & depressions:

http://sealbest.com/rubtrwlcrkflr.shtml

and to seal:

http://sealbest.com/sb1000.shtml

 

[Porcupine]

Interesting discussion - We just had a new driveway put in late last summer - the company took out the existing driveway and fill underneath which was full of bricks, larger stones and a partial asphalt driveway (much to everyone's amazement). They put in clean fill, packed it all and put down the pavement.

After it was all said and done, I was told to build up one side of the driveway edge so it would be less likely to crack (which I did).

I was also encouraged to seal the driveway a few weeks after, which I did not do. After reading countless discussions online, I decided against it - something about letting the asphalt properly "cure" before sealing it.

The company was, and still is asking $180 to seal the driveway. They did my neighbours accross the street and while it looked nice and shiny for a bit, seemed overpriced IMO. A few sprays back and forth and they were done - barely took them 15 minutes once all their equipment was running.

Not sure as to the difference in quality of the product they used versus the over the counter ones, even though they swear the over the counter products are garbage.

None of the sealed driveways in our neighbourhood have alots of cracks at the bottom edges. We have a good grade on our driveway so all the water ends up onto the street where it runs into the storm sewer, and none onto the sides, which also grade away from the driveway.

Not disputing anything anyone has said here, but I am thinking of sealing the driveway later this summer, just not sure which product to use.

 

[tncatadjuster]

Ummmm........no.

+1

Breath? Not if water can freeze, in the same breathing channels. Costa Rica maybe.

 

[SARG]

Lots of bad info in this thread. A little research on the internet will demonstrate that.

I paid over $14K to have my driveway re-done about six years ago.

Coating the driveway protects it from the sun which is what will eventually break down the asphalt bond if left without a coating.

The bigger outfits buy the sealer in a concentrated form in bulk ..... they have their own tanks and create a mix which they then pump into their respective mobile tanks. The fellow I hire uses a mix that is much thicker than the consistency obtained from the "pails". When he deposits some onto the driveway it will actually appear like "soft ice cream" and hold it's peaked shape for a minute.

He told me it lasts longer and folks appreciate the fact .... thereby becoming steady customers to obtain what he offers.

I do not believe that you can obtain "the coal tar" mixture anymore.


I will continue having mine coated every two years.

 

[wssix99]

Lots of bad info in this thread. A little research on the internet will demonstrate that.

I paid over $14K to have my driveway re-done about six years ago.

Coating the driveway protects it from the sun which is what will eventually break down the asphalt bond if left without a coating.

The bigger outfits buy the sealer in a concentrated form in bulk ..... they have their own tanks and create a mix which they then pump into their respective mobile tanks. The fellow I hire uses a mix that is much thicker than the consistency obtained from the "pails". When he deposits some onto the driveway it will actually appear like "soft ice cream" and hold it's peaked shape for a minute.

He told me it lasts longer and folks appreciate the fact .... thereby becoming steady customers to obtain what he offers.

I do not believe that you can obtain "the coal tar" mixture anymore.


I will continue having mine coated every two years.

You'll get your best information from a roadway engineer, not a salesman.

The information about sunlight exposure to asphalt is not correct. (If this was true every single asphalt road in the country would be dissolving under our tires!) What's more likely is that sun/heat will effect the softer asphalt mixes and cause the pavement to ooze and move and maybe even crack. To the extent that a sealer can insulate the pavement from this solar heat, that might be a good thing; however if the pavement is mixed properly, this shouldn't be an issue at all. (The last time I worked hands-on with asphalt, the harder asphalts that stand up to heat were a lot more expensive - and were less common in driveways.)

Its true that the hot mix commercial sealers are a higher quality. Typically, they will include more virgin asphalt and will need special tools and solvents to apply. The stuff in the home store pails is a grab bag and will rely more on substances that can be dissolved with solvents as opposed to heat. ie: these will also be less resistant to oils, etc.

Once a pavement is sealed, it should stay that way to keep water from interacting with the asphalt in a weird way. The catch is that once you seal - you can't go back.

 

[Porcupine]

Does anyone know what the difference(s) are between the mix used for driveways and that used for highways, other than the size of the pebbles used? I know it is a finer mix, but are there other differences?

It's true that I've never seen regular highways "sealed" and only driveways - could it be the mix used?

 

[DZL JIM]

I used to work for a small construction company named Kokosing Construction.

I'm pretty sure I remember the parking lot at our office being coated while I was there - but then what does Kokosing know about asphalt anyway???

I hope this is sarcasm...
And they wouldn't be the first company to seal their office parking lot to impress people. It looks nicer than old, worn asphalt, especially when you're an asphalt company!

My former boss had a LOT of asphalt put down at his house (compound type layout, many buildings, barns, office, etc), and never once sealed it, and last time I saw it (12 years or so after put down) it looked perfect. It never broke down, crumbled or otherwise fallen apart. Mine is 10 years old and looks like a gravel driveway. It's disgusting.

Based on this I will say if the asphalt is done correctly it should not NEED a sealer.
I've never seen them seal roadways, either, and if it would save them from having to rip the entire road out, I imagine they would spend a little $$$ on a sealer, but they don't.

Shop around, get referrals and look at the work the asphalt companies do. And make sure to see a driveway that was not sealed and talk with those owners and get their opinions.
I wish I had done all of these things before writing a large check.
The cost difference between the contractor I used and the next two bids, was that the guy I picked was HALF of the cost of the other 2 bids. I should have seen it then.

 

[gcan]

I can only speak from experience my house is 17 years old and my driveway is over 150' of asphalt. I purchased the house 10 years ago and have never had the drive sealed and from my experience I highly doubt the previous owner / builder spent the extra $.05 to have it sealed when installed.
The drive is in great shape....I feel the only thing a sealer would do at this point is make it shiny and look new.

Just my $.02

 

[gsport]

all the different "ideas" from everyone here.. i'd like to know what or where you're getting your information from..... it seems a few of the GJ guys seem to "know" everything about everything.

 

[Unearthed]

all the different "ideas" from everyone here.. i'd like to know what or where you're getting your information from..... it seems a few of the GJ guys seem to "know" everything about everything.

My "idea" is that driveway "sealers" are for cosmetics, with *some* sealing abilities. If you ever plan to repave (overlay) DON'T USE IT. The new asphalt will slide on it and push and seperate, even with a tack coat.
Asphalt does not need to "breathe". Asphalt cannot be re-rolled from time to time. Roads are sealed sometimes too, its called tar and chip and microseal. Cracks in asphalt let water in, and that is the problem simply. Add some dirt in the cracks that hold moisture and on and on....
My driveway is paved. I've lived here for ten years and it had been paved probably ten or so years prior to that. I've sealed it once abuot five years ago, and the previous owners sealed it too. It is starting to surface crack, and needs sealed again. If I can save enough, I want to tar and chip it. Single shot with rice chips. If not, it will be the junk in the bucket again for a few years.
I have worked on a paving crew for 23 years. Highway, parking lots, driveways. Take my opinions only for what they are worth to you.

 

[gsport]

I have worked on a paving crew for 23 years. Highway, parking lots, driveways. Take my opinions only for what they are worth to you.

thanks, that's all i wanted to know.. where this information is coming from..

 

[Unearthed]

thanks, that's all i wanted to know.. where this information is coming from..

Up until now, none of the information came from me.

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Ok fellas, it's getting deep with misinformation now...

My first company was an asphalt sealing and repair company. The materials we obtained are (and still are) a "coal tar" latex blend. It was and still is pumped into the seal coater's tanks. He then adds black beauty (sand-blasting media) and water. Yes, I said water. The material is concentrated to save money on shipping costs.

The seal coater can "stretch" the material by adding more water then specified and this is where you run into issues. Drive is black today and gone tomorrow.

Make sure you get references that you can take a peek at before committing.

Also... sealcoat should be considered a "coating" a protective coating. Like any coating it wears out and needs to be re-applied every so often. It will benefit your drive by sealing small cracks that get wider with age. It will also slow the break-down of the AC (oil based binder) in the asphalt.
Lastly, it looks nice when coated all black and even.

Today, my company manufactures a product that rehabilitates cracked/damaged asphalt. Here is a link to a short video:
http://legacyindustrial.net/cart/hd0100-asphalt-resurfacerpatch-3-gal-p-247.html

Now everyone jump in and slice me up.

 

[Unearthed]

Ok fellas, it's getting deep with misinformation now...

My first company was an asphalt sealing and repair company. The materials we obtained are (and still are) a "coal tar" latex blend. It was and still is pumped into the seal coater's tanks. He then adds black beauty (sand-blasting media) and water. Yes, I said water. The material is concentrated to save money on shipping costs.

The seal coater can "stretch" the material by adding more water then specified and this is where you run into issues. Drive is black today and gone tomorrow.

Make sure you get references that you can take a peek at before committing.

Also... sealcoat should be considered a "coating" a protective coating. Like any coating it wears out and needs to be re-applied every so often. It will benefit your drive by sealing small cracks that get wider with age. It will also slow the break-down of the AC (oil based binder) in the asphalt.
Lastly, it looks nice when coated all black and even.

Today, my company manufactures a product that rehabilitates cracked/damaged asphalt. Here is a link to a short video:
http://legacyindustrial.net/cart/hd0100-asphalt-resurfacerpatch-3-gal-p-247.html

Now everyone jump in and slice me up.

Hmmmm... interesting product. I'd like to give it the torture test.

 

[workbench]

I had my 6,000 sq ft driveway sealcoated last October with 2 coats for $900. We had a wet winter and it still looks great.

$0.15 per sq ft

Here's what they used:
An emulsion mixture of copolymers and fibrous non-carcinogenic select minerals and fillers – over 5 pounds per gallon. It’s one of the heaviest sealcoat products manufactured. It has a higher latex content provides the key to many of its superior qualities. More latex (vinyl acetate acrylic copolymer) helps keep in suspension the materials that we’ve blended together in the plant and allows for a more flexible finished product

 

[LegacyIndustrial]

Check out our newest repair/resurfacer material for asphalt.

Link:

 

[6768rogues]

Why bother seal coating? If your base was properly prepared there shouldn't be much of an issue with cracking. Town roads are never seal coated and they see a lot more traffic than a driveway ever will. I think seal coating just makes money for the guys that apply it and the stores that sell it, althought it does look nice when finished. Your nickel.

You do not need to seal coat if you have highway grade asphalt in your driveway. Not many people can afford it.

 

[6768rogues]

Asphalt is an oil based product, so gas and diesel drips will dissolve it. Good driveway sealers are coal-tar emulsion and are impervious to oil and gas.

 

[5lima30]

Just be careful there are a lot of "gypsy" scammers out there that will spray your asphalt with a used motor oil mix. Another one that is similar is the "roof coating". They will typically approach the homeowner and tell them that they have material left over from another job in the area. If it sounds to good to be true.....buyer beware!

 

[Chris Adams]

It's interesting to read different opinions on asphalt from different parts of the country.

You guys do know that asphalt 'mixes' vary by climate? By sun exposure?
By rain exposure? By temperature?


By vary, I mean, the 'desert mix' as it is called here, that the city uses on our streets would not last any longer in NJ than the 'wet mix' that NJ uses would last here in the desert?

We have five different types of asphalt mix used within 10 miles of my house.
Each one would react differently to sealing, etc.

I had a brother in law who hauled hot mix, five days a week thousands of location within a 100 mile radius. Ten different mixes, not counting 'special runs'.



On driveways, I have a section (mandated by zoning) of asphalt driveway, linking my concrete drive to the city's street.
That small (25 feet long) section has been destroyed NINE times in 22 years.
By the city, utilities, even cable service.
Each time they destroy it, cut it up, rip it out, they replace it. Every time it changes color, changes texture, and it is 100% up to the utility or government agency just how they will 'repair' it, after they destroy it.

So keep in mind, before you put a bundle into sealer or cosmetic covers, that;
One, not all asphalt is the same. What works for one guy, may not work for you. Do the research, and I mean on YOUR mix, not somebody's in a different climate.

Two, if the city or an agency cuts through it, which happens a lot most places, they will NOT replace it with matching treatments. Serviceable, not matched, is the policy in every city I have ever lived.

Three, anything that can be sold, will be sold by someone without scruples. so yeah, watch for gypsies and profiteers, selling you the wrong, but more profitable product and poorly applying it.