sheet rock mud

[Mainiac Mat]

After a careful look at my checkbook, I have decided that I have to mud and tape the rock myself.

I've done it twice before and have the tools... I just hate doing it and **** at it.

Last time I did this type work was for my basement woodshop ceiling and I used the low dust mud, to avoid tracking it all over the house. This created a heavy dust that fell to the floor and didn't cloud up in the air, but it was hard to spread smooth and I don't think I need to go that route again.

I may pick up a couple different size knives so I can put the mud up in thin coats, going wider each time and see if I can skip sanding all together.

Any recommendations on which type of mud to use? Seems like there are more flavors on the shelf than I remember.

 

[dogdog]

It doesn't really matter, normal green bucket is fine...

first two coat I usually use straight out from the bucket.

The last coat.. I mixed it well with a heavy duty drill or mud mixer/paddle on a different bucket with a bit of water so it gets a smoother coat.

remember once you added water you can't keep that batch stored for long...maybe 4 months?

if you have done right, minimal sanding is needed between coats. but that takes experiences or some one shows you da tricks.

My first mudding experience, I put on two bucket and sand away one and the dam wall is still crooked.

 

[mike93lx]

premix, lightweight. don't get the regular weight stuff, especially for a ceiling. it will be way harder on your arms and shoulders.

make sure you use paper tape, not fiberglass with premix. if you really want to use fiberglass (it is inferior, but it does stick on its own and you can't get bubbles), you have to use hot mud (90min or less)

 

[NORDFORD]

Mesh tape. Blue lid. Thin your last coat. The enemy of of good is better.

 

[sleek98]

Just about finished with my basement drywall. I used all purpose for the taping then swapped to lightweight for the top coats. Added water to all coats to smooth it out, had to add water to the all purposed to get it thin enough to run through the banjo.

I opted to spend the 80 bucks for a power sander and it made sanding easy.


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[Bert_]

You can wet sand with a sponge.

 

[Will Allen]

Just about finished with my basement drywall. I used all purpose for the taping then swapped to lightweight for the top coats. Added water to all coats to smooth it out, had to add water to the all purposed to get it thin enough to run through the banjo.

I opted to spend the 80 bucks for a power sander and it made sanding easy.


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Closest to the truth so far. I've mudded many houses over the years. Green bucket for the tape coat. Blue bucket after that. It always needs to be thinned a certain amount.

If you don't have a banjo it is a good idea to get the tape wet first.

If you don't have much experience just use more but thinner coats. The most common mistake is gobbing it on too thick which makes it a bear to sand.

 

[mike93lx]

Mesh tape. Blue lid. Thin your last coat. The enemy of of good is better.

Mesh tape with premix is the wrong combo. Doesn't matter if it has worked for you before

 

[The Cobbler]

^^^ concur

 

[nadogail]

I buy powdered quick setting 10 minuet mud and mix in small batches. I use a wide tape knife, followed by a damp sponge.

 

[karoc]

I did my house and garage yrs ago, and you can tell it. Even with the pop corn ceiling could not hide my mistakes. The biggest mistake I made was not adding water to the compound to thin it out so that could tape and float it easier. For the tape I use a 4" blade then to a 6"-8" blade for the next coat of mud. I bet there are some good Youtubes out now days that would help. No Youtube nor internet when I did mine.

 

[ArtisanFarms]

Technique is more important than the flavor of mud you choose. It will be almost impossible to avoid at least a light sanding between coats.

Try a 4" knife for all of the screws. Pull almost all of it off with the knife when you apply it. It will shrink and dimple a little on drying. Give it a light sanding and a quick second coat with a 4" knife. Again scrape almost all of it off after you apply it. It is two steps - dab on a fairly thin coat and then a second pass to scrape most of it off.

For your taped seams on the tapered edge, lay down a fairly thick bedding layer, knife in your tape with a 4" knife, removing most of the excess and than use either a 4" or 6" knife to apply a thin top coat. Once it is dry, sand and apply a thin second top coat with a 4" knife, and feather it out with 6" knife or two passes of your 4" knife. Sand when dry. If you are careful, you will have something that is shop grade paintable at this point.

For the taped seams on flat edges, follow the same procedure as for tapered seams, but you will probably need a third coat feathered out with an 8" knife or two passes, one on each side of the center line of the tape with a 6" knife.

Every coat should be as thin as you can get away with to minimize the amount of material you need to sand off.

If you're concerned about dust, hang plastic in the door and after you finish sanding sweep, damp sponge or vacuum up the walls and floor and put a fan in an open window to vent the remaining air borne dust.

 

[Mainiac Mat]

I just learned something new ... what a drywall tape banjo is ... so it was worth getting out of bed this morning

Now another question for the forum... does a banjo make the job a lot easier? And is there any one style/brand of banjo that works especially well?

 

[Will Allen]

I just learned something new ... what a drywall tape banjo is ... so it was worth getting out of bed this morning

Now another question for the forum... does a banjo make the job a lot easier? And is there any one style/brand of banjo that works especially well?

A banjo makes it go very fast. You need to practice a little to get the mud consistency right but once you get past that it will cruise.

 

[sleek98]

I laid 1100 feet of tape for my basement. I wouldn’t have made it without the banjo. I have the style without a roller and if I did it again I would likely spend the extra 20-30 and get the one with a roller to help bed it in. The banjo needs decently thin mud. Took a case by the time I figured out how thin I really needed it.

As stupid as it sounds I did the bathroom without the banjo since it’s a little time consuming to clean and I didn’t have it all ready when I did the rest of the basement. It was about 125 foot of tape and it took me almost as long to lay that 125 by hand as it did to lay the other 1,000 feet with the banjo. The ceiling is so much nicer, you can pull out 4-5’ and slap it up on the ceiling and it sticks. It’s hard to explain but I saw the guy who usually does my finishing do it. You can do a 10 foot seem in a min or so. I usually get 30-35 feet laid then bed it in with the knife and refill the banjo.


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[matt_i]

I was boggled by the choices.

I just used "all purpose" premixed compound and

Strait-Flex **** Tape

I just scoop mud into a small pan for filling & taping, it needs about 1/2-3/4 of a "shot" of water mixed into it.

The biggest thing for me was watching guys tape an acre of drywall in a building where I work to subdivide the warehouse. 12" trowel on each side of a joint that's not tapered.

 

[spudley]

The blue or green premix takes a fair amount of time to dry and I don't heat 24/7 so I tried using 45 min bag mix but the best I could do was about a gallons worth and it'd start getting set. So I switched to 90 min and two coated about 700 sq ft in two days working at an easy pace alone.

The bag mix dries faster and much harder than premix. I found that out cleaning the pan and knives.

First coat I use 6" knives and switch to 12" for the second coat. Made the second coat creamier.

 

[Mainiac Mat]

So how's this sound for a plan...

>buy a bucket of green lid and a bucket of LW blue lid.
>use green lid (all purpose) in a banjo to set the paper tape on walls
>use blue lid (light weight all purpose) in banjo to set paper tape on ceiling
>cover tape on walls with a coat of green lid.
>cover tape on ceiling with a coat of light weigt.
>switch to blue lid for final coat on both walls and ceiling
>sponge sand
>Prime with PVA primer
>Ultra pure white ceiling paint
>paint walls with either water based enamel or latex.

 

[Will Allen]

So how's this sound for a plan...

>buy a bucket of green lid and a bucket of LW blue lid.
>use green lid (all purpose) in a banjo to set the paper tape on walls
>use blue lid (light weight all purpose) in banjo to set paper tape on ceiling
>cover tape on walls with a coat of green lid.
>cover tape on ceiling with a coat of light weigt.
>switch to blue lid for final coat on both walls and ceiling
>sponge sand
>Prime with PVA primer
>Ultra pure white ceiling paint
>paint walls with either water based enamel or latex.

I don't know why you would not use green on the ceilings but to each his own. Otherwise you have a good plan.

 

[Bogie1632]

So how's this sound for a plan...

>Prime with PVA primer

Personnally, I'd switch this up with either USG First Coat or Tuff-Hide. A recent remodel I helped on looks fantastic on both new walls and those that were patch/modified. YMMV.

V/R
Bogie

 

[sleek98]

I think you need to use the green lid for the taping layer, even on the ceiling, as it has glue in it to help the paper stick.


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[Will Allen]

I think you need to use the green lid for the taping layer, even on the ceiling, as it has glue in it to help the paper stick.


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Exactamundo. That's why it is harder to sand. But sanding is not required until after the final coat which is done with Blue lid.

 

[Bogie1632]

I think you need to use the green lid for the taping layer, even on the ceiling, as it has glue in it to help the paper stick.


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Actually, the blue lid Plus 3, light weight, offers less shrinkage and is recommend for embedding tape.

V/R
Bogie

 

[sleek98]

Actually, the blue lid Plus 3, light weight, offers less shrinkage and is recommend for embedding tape.



V/R

Bogie

Didn’t realize the plus 3 was recommended for taping too. If so then using that on the ceiling should work.


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[Will Allen]

Didn’t realize the plus 3 was recommended for taping too. If so then using that on the ceiling should work.


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I don't think it sticks as well and I never use blue for taping or a base coat but getting into a blue/ green mud battle is just like getting into which pickup is better fight. In the end people will believe what they want to believe.

 

[kaymccampbell]

I like USG EasySand 20. Trowels nicely. Lets me do multiple coats in a day.

 

[PelicanPines]

Back in the day... a squirt of dishsoap was a thing... is it still a thing?

 

[Will Allen]

Back in the day... a squirt of dishsoap was a thing... is it still a thing?

I'm sort of a dinosaur as I started doing this stuff back in the early 1970's. I've never heard nor seen anyone using soap in the mud.

 

[mike93lx]

Personnally, I'd switch this up with either USG First Coat or Tuff-Hide. A recent remodel I helped on looks fantastic on both new walls and those that were patch/modified. YMMV.

V/R
Bogie

I tried first coat based on a recommendation here and hated it. It flung absolutely everywhere and I didn't find that it hid any better then regular primer.

The last coue times I put myself through the pain of drywall, I thinned down mud a ton and rolled on a layer, then scraped off all the excess. This filled in any little texture from the paper and left a nice, smooth finish.

I recently hired out my ceilings. 40 sheets with a veneer plaster coat for $3k. Looks so much better. I am done with drywall now

 

[Glemon]

I am not a pro, just have done a few diy projects over many years, including whole rooms, ceilings, walls, many patches. What is the advantage of paper tape over mesh?, maybe I am doing it wrong but paper tape seems to pop up here and there when you put it on, mesh stays put, I always use mesh on corners and beveled edge of drywall, tape if I need to go thinner without beveled drywall edges.

As I have slowly progressed in my drywall skills definitely agree you can save a lot of sanding with lighter coats, and a wider blade definitely helps for wall seams. and the technique described for screw holes was spot on.

If you want to avoid dust sponge works well to knock off ridges and high spots between coats, but I can't get a good finish unless I sand the topcoat.

 

[couch67]

So how's this sound for a plan...

>buy a bucket of green lid and a bucket of LW blue lid.
>use green lid (all purpose) in a banjo to set the paper tape on walls
>use blue lid (light weight all purpose) in banjo to set paper tape on ceiling
>cover tape on walls with a coat of green lid.
>cover tape on ceiling with a coat of light weigt.
>switch to blue lid for final coat on both walls and ceiling
>sponge sand
>Prime with PVA primer
>Ultra pure white ceiling paint
>paint walls with either water based enamel or latex.

I've been DIY'ing 30 years and done my share of drywall. I had never thought of buying a banjo. After thinking back of all the messes I've made with paper tape and cutting out bubbles in the tape, I wish I had bought one along the way!

 

[mepstein]

It can be really cheap to hire out if you find the right person.

 

[manwithtools]

Back in the day... a squirt of dishsoap was a thing... is it still a thing?

Yep, I used to do that as well. I've found now that a good power mixing of the pre-mix mud helps make it go on much easier.

OP, if you get the chance, go watch some pro's do it and pay close attention to their technique. They don't waste time or motion. They also don't sand between coats and they sand very little after the final coat. Just remember less mud is better, it's always easy to add more but it's a pin to sand it off.

 

[Will Allen]

Yep, I used to do that as well. I've found now that a good power mixing of the pre-mix mud helps make it go on much easier.

OP, if you get the chance, go watch some pro's do it and pay close attention to their technique. They don't waste time or motion. They also don't sand between coats and they sand very little after the final coat. Just remember less mud is better, it's always easy to add more but it's a pin to sand it off.

The biggest mistake they make is gobbing it on thick and then wonder why they have to sand for a week.

Thinner layers, more of them. Much easier for the inexperienced.

 

[mobetta]

I am a Pro. I generally do multi fam overhauls on buildings 40-100 years old

stick on mesh tape is designed to be used with setting(hot) compound.
I prefer fibafuse drywall tape for flats and tapers, paper for inside corners.

I use a $35 Homak plastic banjo. It cleans up easy even with hard hot mud in it- just throw it in a bucket for a few hours.mix mud too wet and the fibafuse will pull right through the mud.

I only use the green lid mud (or hot mud) I find it much smoother to work and very durable. the blue is way to soft IMO. I do have several thousand dollars of sanding equipment tho.

for a garage I think a fella can do a 3 coat job with virtually no sanding. just tape it, scrape it, smooth it, scrape it, smooth again.... Its a garage for crisss sake.....

I think USG firstcoat is way to splattery-goes everywhere- but it does cover well.
Glidden gripper is a great Gen purpose primer. Or a PVA drywall primer from a PAINT store.

 

[Daniel Dudley]

Go on You Tube. Watch videos. Talking about mud is like talking about ***. Much easier to watch. Find a video that looks like something you can do, and follow what that person does.

If I told you what I do, it wouldn't work for you. But if you were here, I could show you.

 

[Broken_Hammer]

I always understood you needed "setting compound" to set tape. When I remodeled my house (thousands of feet of tape) I did 1 closet (55 feet) with green mud and mesh tape. The rest I set the tape with durabond 90 or easy sand 90 and paper tape. Then two coats of green .

I'm not an expert. I've always understood "setting compound dries harder and is more resistance to cracking. That is why you set the tape with it. The drywall mud is for finishing.

What do the pro's use? I don't think I ever saw a video or a remodel by a professional that was using mesh tape.

 

[mike93lx]

I always understood you needed "setting compound" to set tape. When I remodeled my house (thousands of feet of tape) I did 1 closet (55 feet) with green mud and mesh tape. The rest I set the tape with durabond 90 or easy sand 90 and paper tape. Then two coats of green .

I'm not an expert. I've always understood "setting compound dries harder and is more resistance to cracking. That is why you set the tape with it. The drywall mud is for finishing.

What do the pro's use? I don't think I ever saw a video or a remodel by a professional that was using mesh tape.

You only need it with fiberglass tape (mesh). Paper is just fine (and stronger too) with either mud

 

[PelicanPines]

Yep, I used to do that as well. I've found now that a good power mixing of the pre-mix mud helps make it go on much easier.

OP, if you get the chance, go watch some pro's do it and pay close attention to their technique. They don't waste time or motion. They also don't sand between coats and they sand very little after the final coat. Just remember less mud is better, it's always easy to add more but it's a pin to sand it off.

I restored a Victorian house 20+ years ago... I had a fabulous finish contractor... he swore by the practice...

He also never used premix...

My walls were all plaster lath except for the kitchen and bathroom interior walls... Smooth as glass... he skim coated everything. He also put a fresh skim on all the ceilings... which were later painted with ceiling flat white.

I honestly can NOT remember ever seeing him without his stilts...

 

[Higgins]

I like USG EasySand 20. Trowels nicely. Lets me do multiple coats in a day.

Kay, If I have a small project, I'll drop down to SS 10. If REAALY in a hurry, SS5. Ditto on easy to sand.

I never let my friends know about the SS product line. Normally i'd use 40 for quick taping ............... LOL! After all these yrs. they never knew! Other wives would pick on their husbands for taking so long to do projects !!

AL