Wamsutta
Well-known member
I believe that Proto, Wright, and USA Williams are, but not S-K yet.
SK QC Issues
- Thread starter azchrisf
- Start date
I believe that Proto, Wright, and USA Williams are, but not S-K yet.
buckwheat_la
Well-known member
For the sake of argument (and hijack of the thread) what details can you list that make those better than Gearwrench quality wise?
BDT/NWMN
Well-known member
Well, the part that makes it a ****** to verify the quality or flaws in the current SK line is finding them in area stores... I had an interesting discussion with one of the Tool Salesmen at ACME Tools in Grand Forks, ND a while back.
The prior owners of SK apparently did a good job of trashing the distribution network. So now there are distributers that will not have anything to do with SK. Some retailers that have a desire to sell SK now lack that distribution network.
Stuff ordered on the internet can be old stock that should have been scrapped. Billy-Bob's Basement Warehouse might offer this stuff at a great price; but I would rather buy from an authorized retailer/dealer.
I have faith that Ideal/SK will continue with their efforts to fix the glitches.
BDT/NWMN
Well-known member
To answer that plain and simple: There are some of Us that do not like using Chinese hand tools; stuff that was made to sell for dime store prices.....
nmantas
Well-known member
I think their round heads that tick like a fine Swiss watch put them there, socket and wrench issues not withstanding.
keep posting!
the more people see and read your stuff, the more dumb stuff you say, the more people realize what you are like. there is a whole "nother" page you can fill up.
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i flip the page and here it is. you can't make this **** up folks. he thinks sk is dime store stuff. best way to prove your ignorance is put it in black and white.
AceofSpad3s
Well-known member
- Joined
- Oct 1, 2014
- Messages
- 1,808
I like how what started off as valid complaints about SK's finishing compared to other other higher end brands ends up devolving into people saying SK are somehow after the same market as harbor freight and craftsman
dthor68
Well-known member
Wow, I just recently looked at their prices, they are darn near Snap-On prices. And other than the military the entire country is price conscience.
Not near S-O pricing when you actually BUY them. I assume you are looking at SK's list price which is far above street price. You think the avg. Joe is going to find S-O at 50% off list on a regular basis?
The ignorance shown in this thread is reaching epic proportions. Even for GJ...
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Negen
Well-known member
Check prices from retailers that carry new stock like hje. For some reason manufactures do not list or sell items at retail prices. My SK 94515 set was bought for 110$ the new lp90 ratchet is about 50$ but is listed at 90$ for some reason. It would be nice to be able to buy straight from sk at retail prices instead up the marked up fake prices they have on their site.
Sent from my G8141 using The Garage Journal mobile app
Here's an idea...
If SK REALLY is concerned about quality, why not visit every single past distributor location and offer to replace any pre-Ideal tools with current production? That's assuming SK truly thinks that current production is superior to that of the 'bad days'.
This would result in a couple of positive things...
1) Get any 'old junk' off the street so it doesn't continue to tarnish the current Ideal/SK reputation.
2) Puts SK in front of the old disgruntled distribution network, face to face, and shows good faith, that the current SK is DIFFERENT than the old. Would go a long way in repairing those damaged relationships.
If SK Eric is reading this, tell mngmt "you're welcome" from me.
If SK REALLY is concerned about quality, why not visit every single past distributor location and offer to replace any pre-Ideal tools with current production? That's assuming SK truly thinks that current production is superior to that of the 'bad days'.
This would result in a couple of positive things...
1) Get any 'old junk' off the street so it doesn't continue to tarnish the current Ideal/SK reputation.
2) Puts SK in front of the old disgruntled distribution network, face to face, and shows good faith, that the current SK is DIFFERENT than the old. Would go a long way in repairing those damaged relationships.
If SK Eric is reading this, tell mngmt "you're welcome" from me.
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I know it’s hard to believe, I mean it’s on GJ I know, but the premise that everyone looks at some flash rust or the coating on the inside of a socket as a issue is silly. The best and most effiecient thing SK can do is handle these “issues” on a individual basis.
It would literally be impossible to purge the marketplace of old stock, that stuff has been sold for pennies on the dollar to every secondary market available. The saying “What have you done for me lately” speaks volumes, todays consumers don’t care about pre-ideal, they want to feel good about today’s purchase, so SK stepping to the plate to make those consumers happy is what will drive there reputation.
I haven’t read all the replies, unless I’ve missed it, I’m curiously awaiting SKErics pictures concerning there manufacturing process, maybe that will explain some of the internal socket broaching that seems to drive people crazy around here.
Then it will continue to be death by 1,000 cuts I'm afraid. But perhaps not. Perhaps they are making money hand over fist and are content with their current state of affairs.
I'd really be interested in SK's YOY sales figures since being taken over by Ideal. Especially compared to pre-Ideal sales figures. As a private company that info is not publicly available, unfortunately.
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Interesting, but my guess is that the disparity is due to price point. I'm more interested in the historical sales data within SK.
Perhaps they are making money hand over fist and are content with their current state of affairs.
I’d say there presence on GJ, the one place that has run off there fair share of tool reps speaks volumes in regards to how they are willing to handle the current “state of affairs”.
@SKEric Lol... I warned you when you first joined, Good Luck and I’m awaiting some manufacturing insight into SK tool world. I can personally appreciate the fact that My SK tools Old and New have served me well, the Brand has a whole has very little threads concerning broken tools here at GJ, if you could hire some better painters to coat the smaller sockets, we would all appreciate it... LOL.
The warranty is a curse ad much as a selling point.
SBD doesn't seem to be hit hard with purists trading in Asain items on the US made items yet and retailers do not seem to be bombed with the buckets of flea market junk getting traded in.
I am not sure of details with each retail chain but it seems checks were placed to prevent a rush on frivolous warranty claims.
SK has their version of this also. New stock, authorized retailer would be an outlet to trust.
Joe's day old bakery and random stuff liquidators with pallets of stuff from a 10 years closed hardware store, maybe not. The stuff found in grandpa's long lost wood tote in the collapsed barn, no.
I won't fake an answer here for anyone but one model is working and the other not so well.
Consumer expectations checked against reasonable precautions for abuses.
SBD doesn't seem to be hit hard with purists trading in Asain items on the US made items yet and retailers do not seem to be bombed with the buckets of flea market junk getting traded in.
I am not sure of details with each retail chain but it seems checks were placed to prevent a rush on frivolous warranty claims.
SK has their version of this also. New stock, authorized retailer would be an outlet to trust.
Joe's day old bakery and random stuff liquidators with pallets of stuff from a 10 years closed hardware store, maybe not. The stuff found in grandpa's long lost wood tote in the collapsed barn, no.
I won't fake an answer here for anyone but one model is working and the other not so well.
Consumer expectations checked against reasonable precautions for abuses.
What does having a rep on GJ have to do with their sales numbers?
Then it will continue to be death by 1,000 cuts I'm afraid. But perhaps not. Perhaps they are making money hand over fist and are content with their current state of affairs.
.
Huh... You have been hammering this thread from the get go, concerned with SK’s customer service, making suggesting that they exchange “All” pre ideal tools in the Market or they will “continue to be death by 1000 cuts” (quoted for clarity). I guess I missed how you intended the above quoted comment was addressing “sales numbers” only.. Weird.
You edited my post and only copied part of it. But thanks for playing...
"Then it will continue to be death by 1,000 cuts I'm afraid. But perhaps not. Perhaps they are making money hand over fist and are content with their current state of affairs.
I'd really be interested in SK's YOY sales figures since being taken over by Ideal. Especially compared to pre-Ideal sales figures. As a private company that info is not publicly available, unfortunately."
By "current state of affairs" I meant the amount of money they are making. I thought it was pretty clear...
As far as "hammering this thread", I dont know what you mean. The amount of posts or the nature of my posts? Either way, apparently I've crossed some Hiball censorship line. Apologies
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You edited my post and only copied part of it. But thanks for playing...
"Then it will continue to be death by 1,000 cuts I'm afraid. But perhaps not. Perhaps they are making money hand over fist and are content with their current state of affairs.
I'd really be interested in SK's YOY sales figures since being taken over by Ideal. Especially compared to pre-Ideal sales figures. As a private company that info is not publicly available, unfortunately."
By "current state of affairs" I meant the amount of money they are making. I thought it was pretty clear...
As far as "hammering this thread", I dont know what you mean. The amount of posts or the nature of my posts? Either way, apparently I've crossed some Hiball censorship line. Apologies
Lol... Ok, I copied and pasted your response after you quoted me and jboulder in regards to only addressing the individual claims versus all the Pre-ideal tools that may or may not be a issue. The “State of affairs” reference was in the 1st paragraph, not your second paragraph where you first introduced “sales number”. Thanks for playing? Ha.. I’m out.
Please go back and Re-Read post #138, and then Come back and tell me how "clear" your "current state of affairs" meaning is.
Then it will continue to be death by 1,000 cuts I'm afraid. But perhaps not. Perhaps they are making money hand over fist and are content with their current state of affairs.
I'd really be interested in SK's YOY sales figures since being taken over by Ideal. Especially compared to pre-Ideal sales figures. As a private company that info is not publicly available, unfortunately.
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buckwheat_la
Well-known member
Sure, you don't like Chinese/Taiwanese tools. So for you it is a principle and not about quality. From a quality stand point they seem to be every bit as good or better than the domestic stuff. If you are ok with that than awesome, good for you.
Negen
Well-known member
It would be nice if the sockets and other tools had some sort of date code on them or something so we could know if these issues are truly from older stocks or not.
Some of the Taiwan brands turn out decent stuff. But I only own one rail of 13 piece torx sockets from them made in China and this is probably bottom barrel stuff. Not sure how anyone can compare sk to gear wrench.
Sent from my G8141 using The Garage Journal mobile app
Some of the Taiwan brands turn out decent stuff. But I only own one rail of 13 piece torx sockets from them made in China and this is probably bottom barrel stuff. Not sure how anyone can compare sk to gear wrench.
Sent from my G8141 using The Garage Journal mobile app
Wamsutta
Well-known member
I wasn't comparing the tools directly. I was comparing their customer base, or "demographic" as some people call it.
buckwheat_la
Well-known member
Well lets start with the chrome.
Gearwrench
-solid chrome with no blemishes. Very few people here complain about poor Gearwrench chrome
-consistent broaching/tooling
-lifetime warrantee (seems to be with little hassle)
-strenght seems to be comparable (if not superior) to SK
-price point is better than half that of SK
So there is my comparison.
Negen
Well-known member
Is that the China or Taiwan gear wrench? My gear wrench torx have off detents that don't fit on all my ratchets proper.
Sent from my G8141 using The Garage Journal mobile app
ssdave
Banned
I'm glad you're happy with it.
I've had a lot of SK, and been pretty happy with all of it. Some I used for several years in a professional environment working both automotive and equipment repair; those old SK wrenches took a real beating and never broke or wore out a single one. I did crack a few sockets; every brand I've owned has had that happen, and SK was no more prone to it than others. SK warranted the cracked sockets without any hassle.
I've had less Gearwrench, and I have not been satisfied with a single piece of it I've owned. Most of it was ratcheting wrenches, and every one of them that I've used, failed. A few sockets I've owned have "stretched" or fit poorly. Similar to Craftsman, or maybe even a bit less durable.
You do have one thing that I agree with; the chrome on Gearwrench has been okay. Looks slightly different than the Matco, SK, Proto 500, and SO chrome, has a "slick" or shiny look to it, but seems to wear okay.
You’ve picked a bad example to make your point, haven’t thought it through, or have exceeded your bandwidth. If anything Gearwrench markets to a broader demographic. Gearwrench has some truck distribution to sell to professionals but also markets to the DIYer with through mass distribution channels like Advance Auto. Eg https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p...ch-set-8920a/10703429-P?brandName=Gear+Wrench
Show me where I can get SK wrenches for an average of $2.25/per. Bonus points if I can drive there within 15 minutes of my home.
SK is definitely targeting up market and trying to compete with the truck brands, Proto, Williams, Wright etc. It is tough space and they aren’t sitting in the pole position. The business strategies of Ideal Industries is very different from those of Apex. To lump them together is ignorant. Quibble with their execution, but at least acknowledge what their strategy is. From what I’ve seen from SK Eric they seem to have some good people who believe in the product and strategy. Time will tell if that is enough.
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BDT/NWMN
Well-known member
That stuff is made to sell for a cheap price.. It is about principle and quality as well.
Wamsutta
Well-known member
The bottom line is I'm trying to get S-K to improve their quality, no matter how you interpreted my comments. Maybe I don't have the words in the right place, but my heart is there.
Can anyone tell me what their (Ideal/SK) strategy is? Not a guess, but actual facts?
How many routes does SK service in relation to the other truck brands? What is their Industrial/Govt. sales channel like? What is their highest volume sales channel for avg. consumers?
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buckwheat_la
Well-known member
Ok, but my point is that quality wise I have not seen any proof that SK is doing it better....
You will call this a guess and disregard it, but here goes my assessment.
Facing the realization that Sears was dying and Craftsman’s future was uncertain, Ideal, a major producer of Craftsman screwdrivers, among other products, realizes they had to find a demand for their production capacity. Enter SK. Ideal buys SK as a strategic investment to supplement their other businesses and to diversify into a full line business. Core to their strategy is domestic production. They are building/trying to build a franchise truck distribution channel but also distribute through online channels and through some other independent retailers. Given Apex’s killing off Armstrong, they are almost certainly pursuing gov contracts. I haven’t checked QPLs but that could be done. No doubt they face hurdles to executing this strategy. It’s a different business from the other Ideal businesses, the bad blood with some distributors ay be worse than appreciated.
By contrast, it’s clear Apex has abandoned domestic manufacturing and is working to streamline/consolidate their branding behind the Gearwrench label. They are killing off many of the other labels.
buckwheat_la
Well-known member
Fair enough. Would love to see side to side comparison on strength.
Same here. Nearly every piece of GW I've owned was a complete POS. Gave up on them years ago...
mudflap
Well-known member
Happens every day... The youngsters coming out of Tech schools love Gearwrench and Carlyle. And they use them on the job every day...and they hold up just fine along side of us old timers "vanity tools"... Would that qualify as a "comparison" ...? Bottom line is... No distribution, no support, no warranty, QC issues, etc...SK is getting their a55 handed to them by some of the better offshore brands... and they are doing it at a lower price point..and thats a fact....The End.
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M_George
Well-known member
We've given the Asian manufactures the last 25+ years to perfect their skills while shutting down all of our plants. Most of the old pro's are retired so they aren't here to mentor the younger generation as they were in years past. With that said, we have a lot of catching up to do and need to support our workers through good times and bad so they can regain all of those lost skills.