Snap-On Quality Control On Diagonal Pliers...The Hell?

[Skin]

Snap-On doesn't make their own pliers. Heck almost none of our beloved USA made tool companies make their own pliers. Germany and other nations kick our **** with pliers

Snap-On makes their own, i actually really like their other pliers a lot. They make some of the most impressive slip-joints you'll find and i also like their needle nose. They just cant seem to manufacture a decent pair of diagonals.

Matco has a source for USA pliers as well, not sure who but their hose pinch pliers, heavy duty slip joint and diagonal, mini pliers, and 11" needle nose sets are USA. Then they have a Knipex rebrand line (red handles) and an orange handled line that consists of their own brand that i think are Taiwan.

I know Cornwell is all imported and i think most of MAC is as well.

 

[Brownsfan]

Snap-On makes their own, i actually really like their other pliers a lot. They make some of the most impressive slip-joints you'll find and i also like their needle nose. They just cant seem to manufacture a decent pair of diagonals.

Matco has a source for USA pliers as well, not sure who but their hose pinch pliers, heavy duty slip joint and diagonal, mini pliers, and 11" needle nose sets are USA. Then they have a Knipex rebrand line (red handles) and an orange handled line that consists of their own brand that i think are Taiwan.

I know Cornwell is all imported and i think most of MAC is as well.

Some Cornwell are. Part # with CCL are USA by Channellock. Part # with cpl are import. The # after CCL is the same as Channelock. Only differance is orange grips. Pricing is suprisingly similar.

 

[jeep450]

I know Cornwell is all imported

Nope. Channelock makes several items for us.

 

[SantaAna12]

Knipex.

 

[Xavis00]

Our PowerEdge™ cutters cycled more than 5,000 times
through hardened music wire without significant wear, and the
tips still aligned. Using the latest CNC technology, our exclusive
cutting edges have a top flat surface that tapers from back to
front, providing more cutting surface by the joint for tough work
and fine tips for delicate wire. Hold the Snap-on cutter up to
the light and you will see a slight relief back toward the joint,
and tips that come together perfectly. The Snap-on PowerEdge™
tapers from back to front for power where you need it (by the
joint); finesse where you want it (at the tip). Old fashioned
hand finished edges cannot match Snap-on durability.

That's a quote from a Snap-On plier flier. As it has been said, they're deigned that way.
Source: http://www.snapon.com/industrial/flyers/Marchpliersv5_rev.pdf

 

[shampoop]

I have those exact same 87cf pliers and they are awesome! They are supposed to be that way. They're designed to do the heavy duty work. I use my traditional style channel lock dikes for really thin plastic etc. Just try cutting a coat hanger with your normal ones, then use the 87cf on them, takes like half as much effort. Same thing goes for battery cables.

 

[OEXL16B]

We do make our own pliers. Yours have more gap than i have ever seen in any of the cutters. I also sell knipex and they have zero gap. I sell the knipex 10-1 vs the snap on cutters like you guys are talking about.. those would go in the warranty pile because they look useless for sure.

Now I'm confused. The YouTube video says the gap between the cutting edges are intensionally designed that way, yet you're saying the pliers in the opening post are a defect?

 

[G1GRANDEUR]

Now I'm confused. The YouTube video says the gap between the cutting edges are intensionally designed that way, yet you're saying the pliers in the opening post are a defect?

I don't know if it's normal or not, but I just checked my new pliers, and it was not bad as what OP posted. Mine had slight gap on the middle and close to joint area.

 

[PowerGenGuy]

I have the 87cf, they have a relief toward the joint, they cut well, never had a problem not even with multistrand conductor. Use them and you will see that they cut! However, must admit that Klien makes a better ****, IMHO compared to other brands. Used a Klien for 15 or so years, started getting sloppy at the joint so I gave snappy a try.

 

[Skin]

Now I'm confused. The YouTube video says the gap between the cutting edges are intensionally designed that way, yet you're saying the pliers in the opening post are a defect?

A gap is intentional but its not supposed to be running up almost the entire length of the cutting edge.

Update: Got the 312CP High Leverage cutter today, its the best of the 3 and the only one that functions as a side cutter should. For those saying this is correct, it isnt. Even the second pair the one MrMark was claiming was fine, has trouble cutting through thin gauge wire and will absolutely not cut through anything thats made of woven fibres (rope/electrical harnesses etc). It just mashes down because the edges dont meet save the extreme tip portion.

 

[OEXL16B]

A gap is intentional but its not supposed to be running up almost the entire length of the cutting edge.

Wouldn't be easier for monitoring quality control if there was no gap?

 

[Skin]

Wouldn't be easier for monitoring quality control if there was no gap?

yep but then they couldnt use fancy names and catch phrases like "Power Edge!" and "See the light!"

 

[shampoop]

Wow, finally looked at the pics on my computer, definitely looks like too much of a gap. I'll check mine tomorrow for comparison.

 

[Murphy4570]

Just checked my pair of Snappy dikes, yep there's a slight gap from the middle to the back, increasing as you get farther back. I've never had an issue with them though. These were made around 2006-7, as I bought them in 2007. Have USA printed on them, faded. Why Snappy didn't stamp the logo into these things I dunno. That annoys me.

 

[MrMark]

A gap is intentional but its not supposed to be running up almost the entire length of the cutting edge.

Update: Got the 312CP High Leverage cutter today, its the best of the 3 and the only one that functions as a side cutter should. For those saying this is correct, it isnt. Even the second pair the one MrMark was claiming was fine, has trouble cutting through thin gauge wire and will absolutely not cut through anything thats made of woven fibres (rope/electrical harnesses etc). It just mashes down because the edges dont meet save the extreme tip portion.

Skin, I can't tell from your pictures because the light shinning though may make it look like a huge opening when it isn't. I believe you if you say the gap is too big to cut. I used my 87cf last night after seeing this and there is a slight gap that stops somewhere just above the middle. We are only talking about a few thousandth's gap here. When you cut 12 gauge copper wire at the base it just kind of shears it but when you move up a little toward the middle it snaps it off.

I love these things but respect your opinion. I like the Klein and Knipex too. I have some Craftsman Professional that are great as well. I still like the SO the best although the Klein is really tough. The Knipex would be last, honestly. I've had two of the 10 inch cutters chip on me and I really don't see them as anything special. Cobra's, MiniBolt Cutters and PlierWrench are something special; dikes not so much.

 

[mazdarules]

I had the same crappy experience with Snap on 86CF diagonal cutters... I had to get them replaced 3 times in as many months due to poor quality control (excessive gap, too much play in the hinge, etc). I know for a fact that my experience was not an isolated incident because other co-workers have had the same issues with snappy side cutters. I use diagonal cutters everyday for aviation lock wire and I have relegated my snap on 86cf's to back up duty for my knipex diagonal cutters at this point.

 

[GTO]

I have both the 87CF and the High Leverage 388CF and they both have a paper thin gap up until the pointed end where it comes together.
Both of mine cut fine.

 

[MBeaty]

can you please explain how the second part of your sentence is supposed to work???? if there is a gap, even a small one the wire will not be cut! I suppose once you make the cut, you are supposed to "pull" on the wire until it breaks? wiggle it maybe?

It would all depend on what the cutters were designed to cut. If it is a soft ductile material, than a gap would be bad, because you could possibly have to make a two part cut for fine stranded wire. But for a harder material, having a gap would be fine because shearing of the material would finish the cut rather than the blade cutting. Look at any surface cut on a metal shear, you can clearly see the line where the blade cleanly cut the metal, but the majority of the edge consists of the fracture where the metal sheared. I would guess that snap on was attempting to use this effect on the pliers.

You can clearly see the difference between the "cut" portion on the very top of the edge and vastly larger fractured portion.

 

[dr_clyde]

I never really looked for a gap before, but sure enough, my 2009 87CF pliers have them. They have always worked fantastic. My buddies all have them, and cut springs and hardened wire, and their's are from a newer batch than mine. They all work well. Although, I am a big fan of Knipex's mini bolt cutters for tough jobs.

 

[woody 73]

Unfortunately it happens from time to time that you will receive a bad batch of tools; send them back and explain the problem.

Not sure if you have ever heard this expression but it goes like this: **** HAPPENS"...

Woody

 

[infinite97]

Knipex > * for pliers. Can't beat those crafty Germans

 

[infinite97]

I have some similar to these, they're friggin awesome.

 

[franzdom]

I think these are new, they look very tempting also. I only see them on ash's site.

73-02-160 box joint these are smallish though:

 

[Ken81590]

This thread got me to buy 3 knipex pliers over the SO 3 piece special. You got me to look closely at the dikes and they were all gapped like yours. The knipex dikes are the best I have ever owned/seen. My SO dealer had knipex on the truck so yours might too.

 

[grahm]

The gap near the pivot is by design. The end if the cutter is for finer work towards the pivot is for heavier work. If for some reason the gap was ground too big warranty the tool, maybe they had a bad batch.

 

[FLRover]

Snap On pliers are the worst I have ever seen much less owned. I hate mine with a passion. Wish I had bought Klien as I love my wire strippers they make.

 

[franzdom]

I loved SO pliers until I found NWS and Knipex, now I only have a few SO pliers.

 

[Skin]

Snap On pliers are the worst I have ever seen much less owned. I hate mine with a passion. Wish I had bought Klien as I love my wire strippers they make.

I think they make a very good grippy plier (needle nose/slip joint). Also some very good wire strippers (PWCS9 and 7). Not a fan of the "talon grip" needle nose though.

 

[Monte]

 

[shampoop]

Here's my input on the subject to try and be fair and balanced. I have the same 87cf pliers.

I tried to duplicate the light through the jaws trick and couldn't do it very well. This is with my phone, but it's actually brand new top of the lineish with a good camera on it. With the naked eye, I could see a slight gap going probably about 2/3 the way up the cutter, however this mostly disappeared when you squeezed it.

These are a few example cuts I took demonstrating cuts of fine things that are difficult to cut with dikes. The cut that went all the way through was with 2 hands, the cut that didn't go completely through at the base was with one hand. And keep in mind I have pretty skinny forearms. I'm far from Popeye.

 

[billymade]

Your pictures arn't showing up; would really like to see them... to see what you are referring to! Thanks!

 

[shampoop]

Thought I'd give an update. Got some new standard klein side cutters (for free) and ended up comparing them to my snap on 87cf cutters (which are in nearly like new condition) side by side. The kleins are better in every way. They even cut heavy gauge harder wire easier. The only advantage I'd give to the 87 cf cutters is that they seem like they would last a lot longer for cutting lots of larger hard wire than the kleins just because they are so beefy and seem to utilize leverage more than sharpness for their cutting power.

 

[cj7365]

Not completely sure but I think that may be the way they are designed?

key word in this quote is "think" :tard:

 

[cj7365]

can you post a link on what kind, how much, and where to purchase, bitte

 

[Monte]

can you post a link on what kind, how much, and where to purchase, bitte

160mm "VBW" heavy duty side cutters: http://vbw.de/vbw_uk/index1.htm

"Samstagsales" is the only company i know who sells VBW in the USA, but they don´t list these pliers
http://www.samstagsales.com/vbw.htm#pliers

also available as "Stahlwille":

 

[neonnblack]

 

[Hammell]

My pliers are a set of Fuller I got from Home Depot. Told myself Id upgrade to Snap-on or the like when I wear them out. Still working fine after 15plus years. Nothing like the photos posted. Side cutter gets the most use and is still going strong. Snap on makes some great stuff but some stuff is highly overated.

 

[bsaint]

Ive used the SO ones the OP posted. Maybe people are too stupid to understand SO doesn't make electrician tools, they make mechanic tools. Using these wires correctly, I've never had an issue. I recently wired up a trailer and trailer harness, replaced a temperature sensor probe and connector, and wired up a new speaker set.

If I try stripping Profibus Belden 2 conductor cable, they **** balls.

 

[KU_MechE]

There's no question, the gap is a manufacturing error. The pliers pictured above were not manufactured to the engineer's design, therefore, should be replaced.

 

[tank4114]

i also own the diagonal pliers op posted and mine also have a slight gap at bottom, not as big as yours though and they work great i haven't had a problem cutting through anything at the base of the pliers with one hand.
my next pliers purchase though will be knipex cause i don't own any yet and would like to try them