So I guess I don’t know $#/% about framing

[Tbender78]

I would make sure you brace your trusses as stated in your truss documents. Lots of times this is overlooked but is necessary. All the bracing is holding the trusses up and ties everything thing together. Makes for a much stronger structure.

Also might help to share your entire truss documents.

 

[Wiebster]

I’m going to do that (share them) because I don’t fully understand some of the symbols. When I called the engineer to talk to him about it, as well as a seasoned home builder friend, neither do they. It’s incredible that they build these trusses but don’t understand how they are installed in the real world. Thanks for the suggestion.

 

[andyvh1959]

When I built my previous garage I hired a friend who knew framing. He did most of the work and I filled in as extra hands. It was a 28.8 x 48 structure with a 3' wide overhang on the north side to provide a covered walkway to the house, standard 1' overhang the other three sides. Worked well with the house and looked good. When we had trimmed the truss tails he asked what I planned for the subfascia boards and I replied with 1x6s. Nope he said, gotta use 2x6s, for that length and the 24" spacing between the trusses it'll give you a much straighter fascia. Reluctantly I spent the extra bucks to get a bunch of long 2x6s, and he was right. Once we got the fasica trim up, it looked straight for the entire 50' fascia run.

When I built my current 24x28 shop this past 2020, I did the same. I had a hired friend do the framing/walls, and got the trusses on the top plate. I did the rest, including stick framing a front hip and rear hip, each at different pitches. For the subfascia I ran a string front to back to create a straight line to trim the truss tails. Then made a hanger bracket so I could get the 2x6s up by myself, and nailed in place once they aligned to another string I ran to make sure they were all straight along the bottom edge. Again worth the extra cost and effort to put them up. Like said above, the initial framing, walls, joists. trusses, sheeting all look like you got so much done so fast. But the small details when it comes to fascia, soffit and trim is what really shows that you did the basics right and got everything straight, plumb and square.

 

[Hank11]

It’s mostly storage upstairs. I’m limited to 30lbs sq ft so I am conscious about even the flooring weight. I was planning on using Advantech osb because it seems stiff for the thickness and at the rate I’m getting this done, it’s water resistant too. I do like the finished floor idea though too. I thought about skipping the dormers until the roof was sheathed but I don’t want to “unframe” anything in the dormer bays. Any suggestions on how to get roof sheathing supports in between the girder trusses that won’t have to be torn out later?

I’m a huge fan of Advantech, its good stuff and worth the slight premium. I floored my upstairs with it and will put hardwood down shortly. But when I stumbled across some tongue and groove yellow pine that was 1.5” thick, I kinda wished I’d just laid that down as the complete floor.

For the sheathing, I’d start at the ends and put as many sheets as gets you near but not to the dormers. Then do the same in the middle. You’re gonna have some cutting and fitting around the dormer sheathing no matter what.

In my mind braces that are just pegged to the ground are not meant to be there but the shortest time.

 

[Lynden]

I agree with Andy. Hire a framer to stop by after work and on weekends. Or a retired framer to stop by as needed. You'll get an extra pair of eyes on the job plus it will put you on a schedule so you don't get bogged down.

 

[Joemctag]

First, check and see if you can get someone to tell you if you have enough temporary and permanent bracing , walls and roof, before covering framing with sheathing , which exposes the building to a lot more wind. Ask an erector if you have to. Outlooks have been discussed at length. You’re going to have to shim or notch or whatever to make it work. If you’re stuck, fall back and do wall or roof sheathing, even if you can’t start at the roof edge. Start 8’ in, or whatever. Forgdt the leanto and main entry canopy for this fall. Deck some of the center attic-truss area if itll help you use ladders or something like getting sheathing on roof. Really should get some help with wall and roof sheathing. Forget the dormers for this fall. They look only cosmetic anyway: don’t light your main room. You can do them next year. If it were me at this date, I would find a way to bridge that center gap between trusses with 2x6s or something and deck right over that whole area. Build the main entrance gable next year. You need to get a nice, simple roof on that building . That’s your priority. Then walls. Check, though, that they say whether you HAVE to sheath walls before roof so the structure doesn’t collapse. You really don’t want to do the outlooks temporarily and re-do them next year, but if it comes down to it….. I wish you luck. Just realize you can only do so much.
Won’t you feel better knowing you can easily leave the dormers til next year?

 

[Wiebster]

I agree with Andy. Hire a framer to stop by after work and on weekends. Or a retired framer to stop by as needed. You'll get an extra pair of eyes on the job plus it will put you on a schedule so you don't get bogged down.

Just had one stop by yesterday that I liked. He also liked the project and thinks I’m very close to getting a roof on this beast. I’m hoping for a bid this week yet to finish up. I’ll assist in any capacity he wants me to. I realize there’s no way for me to get this done yet this fall by myself. I appreciate the suggestion.

 

[Wiebster]

First, check and see if you can get someone to tell you if you have enough temporary and permanent bracing , walls and roof, before covering framing with sheathing , which exposes the building to a lot more wind. Ask an erector if you have to. Outlooks have been discussed at length. You’re going to have to shim or notch or whatever to make it work. If you’re stuck, fall back and do wall or roof sheathing, even if you can’t start at the roof edge. Start 8’ in, or whatever. Forgdt the leanto and main entry canopy for this fall. Deck some of the center attic-truss area if itll help you use ladders or something like getting sheathing on roof. Really should get some help with wall and roof sheathing. Forget the dormers for this fall. They look only cosmetic anyway: don’t light your main room. You can do them next year. If it were me at this date, I would find a way to bridge that center gap between trusses with 2x6s or something and deck right over that whole area. Build the main entrance gable next year. You need to get a nice, simple roof on that building . That’s your priority. Then walls. Check, though, that they say whether you HAVE to sheath walls before roof so the structure doesn’t collapse. You really don’t want to do the outlooks temporarily and re-do them next year, but if it comes down to it….. I wish you luck. Just realize you can only do so much.
Won’t you feel better knowing you can easily leave the dormers til next year?

I think I have to get the overhangs on yet this fall. Holding off on the dormers is probably a good idea although I hate traipsing all over new shingles in the spring. It’s a lot more work to integrate waterproofing on an already shingled roof too. Unless you’re suggesting not shingling until spring? Just underlayment? It really depends on what kind of temperatures we have this September and October.

 

[Wiebster]

I’m a huge fan of Advantech, its good stuff and worth the slight premium. I floored my upstairs with it and will put hardwood down shortly. But when I stumbled across some tongue and groove yellow pine that was 1.5” thick, I kinda wished I’d just laid that down as the complete floor.

For the sheathing, I’d start at the ends and put as many sheets as gets you near but not to the dormers. Then do the same in the middle. You’re gonna have some cutting and fitting around the dormer sheathing no matter what.

In my mind braces that are just pegged to the ground are not meant to be there but the shortest time.

Good to hear about Advantech, looking forward to working with it. I’ve laid thousands of square feet of 1 1/2” tongue and groove and I think I’d take sheet flooring any day. I’ve laid pine, Doug fir, and spruce. It’s a lot more work and time, it squeaks, knots with holes all the way through, bowed boards, the boards cup, etc. It’s great for my purpose I used it for, but would never install it in this attic. Thanks for the thumbs up on Advantech, I appreciate the info.

 

[Wiebster]

I’m a huge fan of Advantech, its good stuff and worth the slight premium. I floored my upstairs with it and will put hardwood down shortly. But when I stumbled across some tongue and groove yellow pine that was 1.5” thick, I kinda wished I’d just laid that down as the complete floor.

For the sheathing, I’d start at the ends and put as many sheets as gets you near but not to the dormers. Then do the same in the middle. You’re gonna have some cutting and fitting around the dormer sheathing no matter what.

In my mind braces that are just pegged to the ground are not meant to be there but the shortest time.

Good to hear about Advantech, looking forward to working with it. I’ve laid thousands of square feet of 1 1/2” tongue and groove and I think I’d take sheet flooring any day. I’ve laid pine, Doug fir, and spruce. It’s a lot more work and time, it squeaks, knots with holes all the way through, bowed boards, the boards cup, etc. It’s great for my purpose I used it for, but would never install it in this attic. Thanks for the thumbs up on Advantech, I appreciate the info

When I built my previous garage I hired a friend who knew framing. He did most of the work and I filled in as extra hands. It was a 28.8 x 48 structure with a 3' wide overhang on the north side to provide a covered walkway to the house, standard 1' overhang the other three sides. Worked well with the house and looked good. When we had trimmed the truss tails he asked what I planned for the subfascia boards and I replied with 1x6s. Nope he said, gotta use 2x6s, for that length and the 24" spacing between the trusses it'll give you a much straighter fascia. Reluctantly I spent the extra bucks to get a bunch of long 2x6s, and he was right. Once we got the fasica trim up, it looked straight for the entire 50' fascia run.

When I built my current 24x28 shop this past 2020, I did the same. I had a hired friend do the framing/walls, and got the trusses on the top plate. I did the rest, including stick framing a front hip and rear hip, each at different pitches. For the subfascia I ran a string front to back to create a straight line to trim the truss tails. Then made a hanger bracket so I could get the 2x6s up by myself, and nailed in place once they aligned to another string I ran to make sure they were all straight along the bottom edge. Again worth the extra cost and effort to put them up. Like said above, the initial framing, walls, joists. trusses, sheeting all look like you got so much done so fast. But the small details when it comes to fascia, soffit and trim is what really shows that you did the basics right and got everything straight, plumb and square.

i would love to have a framer finish this up. I’m not a masochist

When I built my previous garage I hired a friend who knew framing. He did most of the work and I filled in as extra hands. It was a 28.8 x 48 structure with a 3' wide overhang on the north side to provide a covered walkway to the house, standard 1' overhang the other three sides. Worked well with the house and looked good. When we had trimmed the truss tails he asked what I planned for the subfascia boards and I replied with 1x6s. Nope he said, gotta use 2x6s, for that length and the 24" spacing between the trusses it'll give you a much straighter fascia. Reluctantly I spent the extra bucks to get a bunch of long 2x6s, and he was right. Once we got the fasica trim up, it looked straight for the entire 50' fascia run.

When I built my current 24x28 shop this past 2020, I did the same. I had a hired friend do the framing/walls, and got the trusses on the top plate. I did the rest, including stick framing a front hip and rear hip, each at different pitches. For the subfascia I ran a string front to back to create a straight line to trim the truss tails. Then made a hanger bracket so I could get the 2x6s up by myself, and nailed in place once they aligned to another string I ran to make sure they were all straight along the bottom edge. Again worth the extra cost and effort to put them up. Like said above, the initial framing, walls, joists. trusses, sheeting all look like you got so much done so fast. But the small details when it comes to fascia, soffit and trim is what really shows that you did the basics right and got everything straight, plumb and square.

I would love to have a framer finish this up. I’m not a masochist and have not enjoyed the frustration of the past few weeks. It’s really booming up here and everyone is busy building houses or apartments. No time for a small jobs. However, I may have found a guy that is willing to shift some house building schedules around to accommodate me. He thinks it’s only a few days of framing to get the sheathing on the roof. So we’ll see if that pans out.

 

[Joemctag]

I think I have to get the overhangs on yet this fall. Holding off on the dormers is probably a good idea although I hate traipsing all over new shingles in the spring. It’s a lot more work to integrate waterproofing on an already shingled roof too. Unless you’re suggesting not shingling until spring? Just underlayment? It really depends on what kind of temperatures we have this September and October.

To do those dormers, you need a guy inside with a saw on a table , cutting each piece as you measure it and handing it out to you. I actually built 4 small dormers once, but they were necessary: the only windows upstairs. Each dormer has framing, sheathing , window, siding, trim, flashing drip edge shingles paint, etc, Couldn’t you just tear off your shingles when you do them later? They don’t open to the attic space, do they?
It’s really good to hear youve got someone to help think through problems. That way you won’t lose time being stuck on some detail. Again, we’re all rooting for you!

 

[Wiebster]

To do those dormers, you need a guy inside with a saw on a table , cutting each piece as you measure it and handing it out to you. I actually built 4 small dormers once, but they were necessary: the only windows upstairs. Each dormer has framing, sheathing , window, siding, trim, flashing drip edge shingles paint, etc, Couldn’t you just tear off your shingles when you do them later? They don’t open to the attic space, do they?
It’s really good to hear youve got someone to help think through problems. That way you won’t lose time being stuck on some detail. Again, we’re all rooting for you!

Thanks Joemctag! Everyone here is always very helpful. Yes, I can cut the shingles and build them in the spring. They do actually open to the attic, adding about 72 square ft per dormer to the attic floor space and hopefully some light up there. Thanks again. Hopefully I’ll be posting some pictures of progress soon.

 

[firebirdparts]

Rechecked mine more accurately this time. At the wall it’s exactly 4” shorter then the common truss height at same location.

that's pretty much correct, isn't it? You're measuring vertically along a 8/12 slope, right? That sounds good.

On your gable rafter tail, YOU PUT THAT ON so just move it down. Then I think you're golden.

I am all about "cheat and lie" when you have to, but sometimes I don't. Even then, lumber makes me sad. I ripped a bunch of joists to get them all the same size (they were nowhere close) and when installed they were just beautifully perfect. Since then they've warped all to hell and the deck floor looks like I am "shed of doom" level as a framer. And that's without ever getting rained on. These are in the dry.

 

[Wiebster]

that's pretty much correct, isn't it? You're measuring vertically along a 8/12 slope, right? That sounds good.

On your gable rafter tail, YOU PUT THAT ON so just move it down. Then I think you're golden.

I am all about "cheat and lie" when you have to, but sometimes I don't. Even then, lumber makes me sad. I ripped a bunch of joists to get them all the same size (they were nowhere close) and when installed they were just beautifully perfect. Since then they've warped all to hell and the deck floor looks like I am "shed of doom" level as a framer. And that's without ever getting rained on. These are in the dry.

I’m with you! I’ve got a pretty large stack of lumber that I have strapped tight with ratchet straps that is so crooked by now, I’ll be lucky to be able use it for blocking. It’s very frustrating. I now only pick up enough lumber that I can use in a week and try to get it nailed or screwed in place.
Yes, I started installing the outlookers, and I think I’ve got that “in plane” problem solved. My fingers are crossed for a reasonable bid from the framer today or tomorrow and I can put this roof behind me.

 

[Fixr]

I think I have to get the overhangs on yet this fall. Holding off on the dormers is probably a good idea although I hate traipsing all over new shingles in the spring. It’s a lot more work to integrate waterproofing on an already shingled roof too. Unless you’re suggesting not shingling until spring? Just underlayment? It really depends on what kind of temperatures we have this September and October.

I'm not a carpenter or roofer, but just underlayment may get you through just fine until you do the dormers. I once used a scrap of Grace Ice and Water Shield as temporary valley flashing just to get through the winter. In the spring, I looked at it and it was just fine. It was just fine for some years until we re-shingled. YMMV and all that.

 

[billconner]

If you sheath with the Zip stuff, you should be fine Buildings around here with just zip sheathing going on 5 years.

 

[Wiebster]

If you sheath with the Zip stuff, you should be fine Buildings around here with just zip sheathing going on 5 years.

Wow, that is something to consider!

 

[Hank11]

Wow, that is something to consider!

Yes, you can sheath the roof with Zip, tape it per directions and it will be fine when you pick the job back up. I wonder why anyone would not use it. Same for wall sheathing.

 

[billconner]

Yes, you can sheath the roof with Zip, tape it per directions and it will be fine when you pick the job back up. I wonder why anyone would not use it. Same for wall sheathing.

Cost is reason I haven't used it.

 

[Wiebster]

$$$$ in my case anyway. But it might be worth it under the circumstances.

 

[Hank11]

I think if you look at the total system cost for the sheathing and finishing all your door and window penetrations compared to using housewrap and the accessory pieces to go with that for the penetrations. Zip is substantially more water resistant to the point of being waterproof. It does need to be nailed and taped correctly. There’s a little more care and skill involved in the installation, but the resulting project is as good as you can get.

It would be outside of the manufacturers recommendations, but a properly installed zip roof and wall sheathing job could be left exposed for a year or more. Huber recommends six months as the maximum, but I’ve seen people go longer, and there was no apparent degradation.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Cost is reason I haven't used it.

Cost was the reason I did use it on the addition.

The price hadn't gone up at Lowe's like OSB did and I got a military discount on it. Those two reasons put it about $3/sheet more than OSB.

 

[paredown]

Put me in the list of fans--you're doing great!

It's a 'learn by doing' business--my favorite Habitat lead carpenter (60+ years in the union) does all of this stuff in his head but that's where the 100,000 hours gets you. Me--by myself--have to draw it out, think, do it wrong, then redo. It's how you learn.

(Filing away the info about Zip sheathing--I'm skeptical by nature, but I now see the advantages if you can't get it all done before the weather gets you)

 

[billconner]

Cost was the reason I did use it on the addition.

The price hadn't gone up at Lowe's like OSB did and I got a military discount on it. Those two reasons put it about $3/sheet more than OSB.

Interesting. Right now Lowe's shows 7/16 Zip 2 1/2 times more expensive than 7/16 OSB.

On my recent building and any I'm planning I've used tough sawn 1x10 or 12. Not quite as low as 7/16 OSB but still good at 75¢ BF. Lived in 2 different 100+ year old houses sheathed with rough sawn and red rosin paper under wood clapboards and they had worn very well. I have doubts about OSB or Zip lasting as long.

 

[NUTTSGT]

Interesting. Right now Lowe's shows 7/16 Zip 2 1/2 times more expensive than 7/16 OSB.

On my recent building and any I'm planning I've used tough sawn 1x10 or 12. Not quite as low as 7/16 OSB but still good at 75¢ BF. Lived in 2 different 100+ year old houses sheathed with rough sawn and red rosin paper under wood clapboards and they had worn very well. I have doubts about OSB or Zip lasting as long.

That's because I bought mine back a few years when stuff was getting shut down everywhere for C19. I went to Lowes to check on something and spotted the price difference.

 

[snickers muncher]

Grab a Snickers and a Dr Pepper.

This is the best advise.

 

[Wiebster]

still waiting to see if I

Put me in the list of fans--you're doing great!

It's a 'learn by doing' business--my favorite Habitat lead carpenter (60+ years in the union) does all of this stuff in his head but that's where the 100,000 hours gets you. Me--by myself--have to draw it out, think, do it wrong, then redo. It's how you learn.

(Filing away the info about Zip sheathing--I'm skeptical by nature, but I now see the advantages if you can't get it all done before the weather gets you)

Thanks Paredown! I appreciate the encouragement.

 

[Wiebster]

I would love to use the zip system so I did a little research. There’s just no way it’s worth it for me. I paid $21.00 for 5/8” osb at Menards. Lowe’s 7/16” zip is $42.27 PLUS $35 a roll for tape. Now multiply that by over 4200 sq ft. I don’t care how good it is, it’s just not worth it. I also don’t like the idea of 7/16” osb over 24” spans. Plus we get lots of hail here. Those shingles will be getting replaced again before I die…a few times. All those nail holes punched into the zip osb require shingle underlayment on a reroof. Not even mentioning, returning all that heavy osb I have sitting there

 

[Hank11]

Mine was $23.00 a sheet this past spring, its $32.00 locally now.

 

[ddurrett896]

I would love to use the zip system so I did a little research. There’s just no way it’s worth it for me. I paid $21.00 for 5/8” osb at Menards. Lowe’s 7/16” zip is $42.27 PLUS $35 a roll for tape. Now multiply that by over 4200 sq ft. I don’t care how good it is, it’s just not worth it. I also don’t like the idea of 7/16” osb over 24” spans. Plus we get lots of hail here. Those shingles will be getting replaced again before I die…a few times. All those nail holes punched into the zip osb require shingle underlayment on a reroof. Not even mentioning, returning all that heavy osb I have sitting there

I’d zip the walls, 5/8 ply the roof.