Stainless vs zinc hardware

[Locke96]

I’m looking at buying a set of either stainless or zinc plated hex bolts with washers and nuts to keep around the shop for various projects. I found a pretty good deal at wholesalebolts.com. For how much I’m looking at it’s about $100 for stainless, and $45 for zinc.
My question is, is stainless worth paying double? I do a good bit of work on boats, which I only put stainless in. But for other random projects, is stainless worth the extra cost?
Thanks in advance!

 

[The Cobbler]

stainless is nice for some random projects /boats as you say, etc.not neccesary for most projects and not as strong as a grade 5 bolt.

 

[Samh]

I would only worry about having zinc around would be if I regularly worked with stuff that needed it

 

[matt_i]

As The Cobbler mentioned the 18-8 or 304, or even the 316 for that matter is a poor choice for a fastener except if you need it for the overwhelming need for its anti-corrosion properties.

Always apply anti-seize to stainless nuts on stainless bolts, they gall like mad because of the missing oxide layer that prevents this micro-welding.

I would buy with my common use needs. Grade 5 is a good solid bolt to work with.

 

[Millwrong]

I'll re-iterate. Get the plated bolts! Stainless is great for outdoor stuff, but will do nothing but cause you problems when you don't actually need it.

 

[theoldwizard1]

Zinc "plated" is not the same a hot dipped galvanized !

 

[Locke96]

Sorry, to clarify I did mean zinc plated steel vs stainless steel. The grade 5 bolts are not very much more ($6.35 for grade 5 vs $5.44 for grade 2 per 100 pack of 1/4-20x2")
I imagine this would be worth the extra cost. I am looking at getting probably 30 or so of each bolt in 1/4-20, 5/16-18, 3/8-16, and 1/2-13 in lengths from 3/4" to 2 1/2" just for various projects around to keep myself from going to the hardware store and paying $0.75 a bolt for something I can buy in bulk for $.05 a piece. So what do you guys think, is grade 5 my best bet? Y'all can check it out at wholesalebolts.com if you need anything. Its way better than anything I could find on amazon or the sort. Could only really find metric sizes on there.

 

[Locke96]

Also, the stainless is 18-8 stainless

 

[u3b3rg33k]

I've always preferred stainless fasteners when it was an option. most are outdoor applications, and they always come apart without a torch - not leaving stains on paint is nice, too.

 

[DFB]

Grade 5 zinc plated will be fine for basic garage use. It great to have a stock of fasteners around especially if your busy and or a far way from the stores

Years ago I purchased one the big sets with bins zinc plated grade 5 SAE bolts/nuts/washers 1 inch thru 3 1/2" and 1/4" up to 5/8" I still haven't use them all

From my experiences unless you have specific ideas in mind about mechanical assembling something there's no real need go overboard stocking up on a lot of larger sizes and lengths. And consider oxidation too from long term storage after while, depending on the climate humidity.

And I think you will find for bolting together many things you use much more of the smaller stuff 1/4" 5/16" and in the shorter lengths. Full thread is often handy to have as is fine thread too. The unthreaded shoulder portion on the basic bulk hex fasteners can sometimes be an issue depending on material thickness. Or if you needing to thread a fastener into a blind hole.

Other hardware stuff like carriage, lag and allthread are handy to have around too especially for outdoor construction.

I have a little stainless mainly for my motorcycle mostly button head and full thread hex

 

[bad_idea]

I strongly dislike stainless. Will gaul even with anti-sieze. Over time the anti-sieze will wash away and will gaul when you try to take it apart. Grade 5 zinc coated will handle most all uses. It's stronger also.

 

[Primo67]

If you have a Tractor Supply store in your area they are great for stocking up on bolts. They sell them by the pound, I’ve found it to be very affordable place to buy bolts.

 

[Locke96]

Tractor supply sells bolts by the pound? Who knew ill have to go check it out. I'm always near a tractor supply! Yes DFB that's my plan is to buy a big lot of them and have them for years. I was planning on putting them in a big small parts organizer from home depot or a tackle box. So would the grade 5 or stainless be better for long term storage? Where im at right now on the gulf coast it stays humid.

 

[DFB]

Tractor supply sells bolts by the pound? Who knew ill have to go check it out. I'm always near a tractor supply! Yes DFB that's my plan is to buy a big lot of them and have them for years. I was planning on putting them in a big small parts organizer from home depot or a tackle box. So would the grade 5 or stainless be better for long term storage? Where im at right now on the gulf coast it stays humid.

You never been to the bulk bins at TSC? Your going to have a blast then

Grade 2, grade 5, grade 8, Metric

Just keep them in the small plastic bags your going to buy them in

Stainless has it place and though my understanding is also that the tensile rating on SS is not the same, its most likely what you want for your watercraft

 

[ddawg16]

I only use SS for stuff that is going to be on vehicles.

If it's going to be used on the house outside....hot dipped

 

[PoorOwner]

I have heard of stainless gall but have not really seen it, does it only happen when it is torqued is high?

I got some epoxy'd SS rods in the ground and have a SS nylon nut holding down air conditioner, etc. They are only snugged down as there are rubber padding underneath so there isn't real serious torque applied.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

i've never experienced it.

 

[Bretny]

I have seen stainless gaul and i have had to break 1/2in stainless bolts. We now replace with grade 5 zink.

Grade 5 zink is prety standard for a bolt bin. Grade 2 is prety inferior quality

 

[manwithtools]

I have heard of stainless gall but have not really seen it, does it only happen when it is torqued is high?

I got some epoxy'd SS rods in the ground and have a SS nylon nut holding down air conditioner, etc. They are only snugged down as there are rubber padding underneath so there isn't real serious torque applied.

Typically it takes a high torque before galling occurs. Your instance should be fine. It's pretty common depending on the grade and quality of stainless. A little anti-sieze will prevent most occurrences.

 

[bwringer]

The real answer is, of course, "both". Or "all the above", as the case may be.

And yes, the fasteners by the pound bins at farm stores are a really good cheap way to stock up. You just have to pay attention because sometimes people mix things around way too much. Or maybe they let their kids play in the bolt bins. Not sure why this happens, TBH.

 

[u3b3rg33k]

I assume because they can't tell the difference between 1/4-20 and M6?

 

[tonyciambrone]

Rural king has bulk fasteners too...Most of the plated zinc varieties are color coded for that reason...harder to put the red ones in with the green ones and get away with it.

 

[MrSurly]

SS galling happens far too easily. It usually only needs to be snugged, not really 'high torque" to cause it. I despise that 'feature' of SS and the lack of strength compared to plain old bolts. That said, I do use SS for things that need it. I have this "word for the the wise" to offer: you can avoid the galling by simply mixing materials, i.e. SS bolt, zinc nut. it's that simple and pretty much fool proof. If you have an actual corrosive application, use a SS bolt and a bronze or brass nut. Been doing that for ages on various marine applications with great success.

 

[Honkey84]

SS galling happens far too easily. It usually only needs to be snugged, not really 'high torque" to cause it. I despise that 'feature' of SS and the lack of strength compared to plain old bolts. That said, I do use SS for things that need it. I have this "word for the the wise" to offer: you can avoid the galling by simply mixing materials, i.e. SS bolt, zinc nut. it's that simple and pretty much fool proof. If you have an actual corrosive application, use a SS bolt and a bronze or brass nut. Been doing that for ages on various marine applications with great success.

Agreed. I was putting in swing gates at work that had SS hardware and just with hand tools I had a couple gaul.

We use neolube(graphite and alcohol mix) on stainless hardware.

 

[bwringer]

I assume because they can't tell the difference between 1/4-20 and M6?

Nah, that's easy.

Try telling 1/4"-28 and M6x1 apart.



A friend of mine once went into an Ace hardware in search of a couple of M6 bolts for his Suzuki. A motorcycle made in Japan. Where things are metric and always have been.

Despite his clear explanation of what he needed and what he was working on, the old duffer in Ace apparently didn't believe in all this furrin' metric bull pucky, and sold him two fine thread 1/4" bolts.

It took us a while to sort out just what the hell happened.

 

[bonneyman]

Nah, that's easy.

Try telling 1/4"-28 and M6x1 apart.



A friend of mine once went into an Ace hardware in search of a couple of M6 bolts for his Suzuki. A motorcycle made in Japan. Where things are metric and always have been.

Despite his clear explanation of what he needed and what he was working on, the old duffer in Ace apparently didn't believe in all this furrin' metric bull pucky, and sold him two fine thread 1/4" bolts.

It took us a while to sort out just what the hell happened.

He obviously didn't come into the Ace I worked as, cause this old duffer got people the fasteners they needed!

 

[PCustoms]

SS galling happens far too easily. It usually only needs to be snugged, not really 'high torque" to cause it. I despise that 'feature' of SS and the lack of strength compared to plain old bolts. That said, I do use SS for things that need it. I have this "word for the the wise" to offer: you can avoid the galling by simply mixing materials, i.e. SS bolt, zinc nut. it's that simple and pretty much fool proof. If you have an actual corrosive application, use a SS bolt and a bronze or brass nut. Been doing that for ages on various marine applications with great success.

I had 2 1/2" SS bolts into a plain steel (well zinc, but most of it burned off when welded) nuts on my roof rack. Pretty sure even a dap of antisieze during assy.

Went to take things off last fall. Long story short I got it off but now have a weirdly twisted bolt broken off deep inside the inner workings of my rack. Zinc coated would have been a smarter choice there....

 

[u3b3rg33k]

FWIW, my old car has steel exhaust bolts/studs and copper nuts, and the hose clamps are all stainless with steel worm screws (rust holds it in place but never wrecks the threads. never had any difficulty getting those off.

everything i've done outdoors with stainless bolts (mostly lawn machinery) has always been with stop nuts/washers. I assume people over-torque the **** out of it. I don't. never had trouble getting those apart.

 

[rakane]

I use Tefgel on my boat when I forecast corrossion issues. It has worked well.

Meanwhile is a 30' Grady White.

 

[dr_clyde]

I keep a bin of grade 5 zinc hex head in my shop, but a full compliment of SS button head, socket head, flat head, and shoulder bolts. I need to get SS hex head, but I rarely use those compared to button head and socket head.

I prefer to use stainless steel in any application except structural, and then I use grade 8. Almost all my customers want washdown or sanitary grade fasteners, so I have to keep an assortment of stainless on hand.

And stainless fasteners will gall if you even glance at them sideways without anti-seize. No torque required sometimes. I've had hand tight assemblies gall. I use a food grade anti-seize from Loctite that works well.

Grade 5 is a good compromise around the house, but if you are gonna get it wet regularly, you gotta go with SS in my opinion.

 

[86turbodsl]

SS isn't great for fastening jobs that see a lot of force/torque.

I've had brand new stainless 1/2" bolts gall and sieze after one use. IMO, only use it for critical applications where corrosion is key. And probably still one time use.

 

[Locke96]

I just ran by my local tractor supply and the grade 2 zinc coated was $2.99/lb and grade 5 was $4.19/lb. not the $2/lb I was hoping for but still not a bad deal I don’t think for a small stock


Sent from my iPhone using The Garage Journal mobile app

 

[DFB]

Just price up some the prepackaged nut an bolt sets they sell all over to compare to bulk.

 

[APEowner]

You should stock whatever it is you might use the most. I stock grade 8 SAE because that's what I use the most. I also try to plan fastener purchases ahead and buy a box of anything I need. I can generally get a box of good quality fasteners overnight from McMaster-Carr for around the same price or less than a couple of suspect quality from the local big box store.

For all the reasons mentioned above I don't stock or use SS unless the application calls for them.

 

[38Chevy454]

SS fasteners are approx the same tensile strength as grade 2. So as many have said, except for the corrosion resistance in specific applications, the basic grade 5 zinc plated is a better choice for almost all of your needs. I also would consider grade 8 instead of grade 5, it is a better fastener. Grade 5 is stronger due to cold forming. Grade 8 is stronger due to the same cold forming, but then heat treated (which destroys the cold working, but gives through hardened). One old wives tale is grade 8 is more brittle - it is not. It has a much higher yield strength, but less elongation before failure (ultimate strength). If you believe the old wives tale, then use grade 2 which has even less yield and ultimate strength than grade 5, but more elongation. Don't confuse brittle with ductility. They are kind of related but are different characteristics.

I buy the bolts by pound at TSC or similar, as I hate being in middle of a job and have toi stop to run out to hardware store for $2 worth of fasteners. I also keep big stock of used fasteners that are perfectly good to reuse.

 

[isb cornbinder]

We had a very nice Diesel 27 foot Catalina Sailboat. It was fairly expensive, but the builder thought zinc plated fasteners were adequate. I live on the West Coast and the sailboat was in ocean water all year, except for the annual pull-out-inspections. Zinc plated fasteners lasted about 18 months before the rust came through. I went to Pacific Fasteners and bought stainless fasteners and replaced all of the zinc plated I could find. The stainless replacement was not expensive. I spent about 30 hours of my time. There was an additional 10 hours of rewiring the boat because the builder did not use marine grade barrier wire. A full set of AEROQUIP hoses for central greasing and fuel lines completed the job. After sailing for 5 or more years, I hung a FOR SALE sign on the bow. The boat sold in less than an hour at full market asking price.
Not all stainless steel is a low grade for strength. You best advice is free at Pacific Fasteners.

 

[nbpt100]

I think this topic is well covered. I will just add not all zinc platings are the same. I have seen some grade 5 with cheap plating which corrode faster and some with good plating that hold up well. I am not sure how to advise other than just look at a hand full and make sure you don't see discoloration.

Most of the bulk bolts at the big box hardware stores are grade 2. At least where I live.

I think the average customer does not understand the difference between grades. Sometimes you can not find what you need in grade 8 or 5. Metric can be even harder to find what you need.

I was at an auto mechanics shop waiting for a friend and watched a mechanic who just got back from Lowes with a bag of nuts and bolts and proceed to install grade 2 fasteners on the suspension of a pick up truck. I just shook my head.

For good deals on SS hardware take a look at Albany County Fasteners.

Good luck.

 

[ttpete]

I think this topic is well covered. I will just add not all zinc platings are the same. I have seen some grade 5 with cheap plating which corrode faster and some with good plating that hold up well. I am not sure how to advise other than just look at a hand full and make sure you don't see discoloration.

Most of the bulk bolts at the big box hardware stores are grade 2. At least where I live.

I think the average customer does not understand the difference between grades. Sometimes you can not find what you need in grade 8 or 5. Metric can be even harder to find what you need.

I was at an auto mechanics shop waiting for a friend and watched a mechanic who just got back from Lowes with a bag of nuts and bolts and proceed to install grade 2 fasteners on the suspension of a pick up truck. I just shook my head.

For good deals on SS hardware take a look at Albany County Fasteners.

Good luck.

Both Lowes and Home Despot have higher grade fasteners. They're in the drawers. I call grade 2 bolts "mud" bolts and won't have them in the shop. When I'm doing nice work I sometimes use AN fasteners. They are grade 8 equivalent and they come in 1/16" length increments so there'll never be excess length hanging out. They also have lovely thin flat washers and nylock nuts.

 

[DFB]

Ya agree a lot more fastener options often all types head configurations like fillister, stove bolt, counter sink, hex socket, plus different material SS, Brass, Nylon can be found in the "drawer boxes" most stores stock today. vs grade marked steel hex bolts in the bins. But boy you pay for it sometimes.


Here's a bunch of bulk bin fasteners been hanging around my garage for while. A lot of oxidation especially the blue dyed bolts on the left. The shiny fine thread bolts in the front center I had to clean them up last winter they were so bad. A vinegar bath to get rid of some surface rusting and then wire wheel brushed.

Long term storage general zinc fasteners I suggest dust them down with WD or S100 protectant or something similar depending on your storage conditions if you intend on holding onto a large inventory.

 

[BearsFan315]

all depends on application and do NOT mix materials, then you are asking for issues in most cases. 90% i use zinc steel, few places where recommended or exposed i use SS.

Automotive i use the Gr 5 or 8 depending on loading