sberry
Banned
I don't want more bits. Got enuf to keep track of with power drive.
Stepping up from basic tools
- Thread starter FuzzyTiger
- Start date
pizza
Well-known member
hi FuzzyTiger,
i hope you find some tools that you enjoy.
thing is, there is no brand that makes the best of everything, so it really depends on which specific tools you're looking for.
for your consideration, here is a tool junkie's approach:
i read your list of tools, and i think you've found some good stuff.
some thoughts...
if you get a gedore hammer, consider one of the rotband-plus ones with hickory handle. that red metal guard will probably make it last longer.
i have the 500g induction hardened one and like it a lot. if you scroll down a bit below that post, you will see some discussion about the induction-hardened variant.
those picards are ****. i kind of want one.
for metric sockets, i am very happy with my koken zeal set.
i just ordered a nepros set for SAE, but i haven't received it yet.
you mentioned u-joint sockets.. if you are in the market for nice u-joint adapter, look at koken:
for ratchets, i love my koken zeal stuff, and i've got a nepros on the way with that SAE socket set.
i do think that those pb swiss interchangeable blade drivers are an interesting product, and although i've never used them, i'd think they're of good quality. probably about as good as normal drivers, and you can put the blades in a tool roll and have a kit that's way more compact than a normal set. and just like normal drivers, they can be used to reach deeply recessed screws. i say buy a set and give them a try! i have a set of their slotted rainbow swissgrips, and i have to say they're awesome.
a lot of people like Picquic. i have several of them, and they're decent enough, but after using stuff from the likes of companies like wiha and pb swiss, i am not really impressed with the quality of their tips. i seem to get much more slippage and camout. but for a relatively cheap, compact, convenient thing you just leave in a kitchen drawer or your car's glovebox, it's fine.
i hope you find some tools that you enjoy.
thing is, there is no brand that makes the best of everything, so it really depends on which specific tools you're looking for.
for your consideration, here is a tool junkie's approach:
- identify a specific kind of tool you're interested in
- perform google search with a query like: site:garagejournal.com best circlip pliers
- after reading until your eyes bleed, search for youtube videos about the top contenders
- create the 539th thread asking for clarification about who makes the best of some specific tool and ideally jumpstart it by identifying the probable top brands
- buy the tool, put some light oil on it, and hope you can invent an opportunity to use it soon
- if you are bored and have enough time on your hands, continue to read this forum daily to identify more cool tools you weren't aware of
i read your list of tools, and i think you've found some good stuff.
some thoughts...
if you get a gedore hammer, consider one of the rotband-plus ones with hickory handle. that red metal guard will probably make it last longer.
i have the 500g induction hardened one and like it a lot. if you scroll down a bit below that post, you will see some discussion about the induction-hardened variant.
those picards are ****. i kind of want one.
for metric sockets, i am very happy with my koken zeal set.
i just ordered a nepros set for SAE, but i haven't received it yet.
you mentioned u-joint sockets.. if you are in the market for nice u-joint adapter, look at koken:
for ratchets, i love my koken zeal stuff, and i've got a nepros on the way with that SAE socket set.
i do think that those pb swiss interchangeable blade drivers are an interesting product, and although i've never used them, i'd think they're of good quality. probably about as good as normal drivers, and you can put the blades in a tool roll and have a kit that's way more compact than a normal set. and just like normal drivers, they can be used to reach deeply recessed screws. i say buy a set and give them a try! i have a set of their slotted rainbow swissgrips, and i have to say they're awesome.
a lot of people like Picquic. i have several of them, and they're decent enough, but after using stuff from the likes of companies like wiha and pb swiss, i am not really impressed with the quality of their tips. i seem to get much more slippage and camout. but for a relatively cheap, compact, convenient thing you just leave in a kitchen drawer or your car's glovebox, it's fine.
Last edited:
Avenging Bankroll
Banned
nothing
Last edited:
richfinn
Well-known member
I have Wiha (VDE) Wera (chiseldrivers) and Facom (Torx) screwdrivers, been very happy with them, all great value for money and reasonably cheap in the EU
I do have a set of Snap-On picks and mini drivers which to be fair have been worth the extra money for me
Love my Snap-On hard handle ratchet screwdriver that I use with some Japanese JIS bits, and wiha screwdriver bits
Regular screwdrivers are a consumable tool for me, I have worked my way through a few sets in 35 years
I dont bother with the warranty, if it breaks I upgrade to a better tool, if it wears out Its done it's job for me!!
I do have a set of Snap-On picks and mini drivers which to be fair have been worth the extra money for me
Love my Snap-On hard handle ratchet screwdriver that I use with some Japanese JIS bits, and wiha screwdriver bits
Regular screwdrivers are a consumable tool for me, I have worked my way through a few sets in 35 years
I dont bother with the warranty, if it breaks I upgrade to a better tool, if it wears out Its done it's job for me!!
BlakeTheCarGuy
ALLIANCE MEMBER
For screwdrivers I have Snap-on, MAC and Kobalt and Craftsman and as a professional mechanic they work great you rarely ever use a screwdriver anyway at least we don’t at the dealership unless we are doing interior work or something that’s really old that the engine is screwed together instead of bolted together lol. I never caught on to the JIS thing either a regular screwdriver has always worked for me and I have no more room in my screwdriver drawer or in my roll cart either lol so no room for more unless it’s at home.
Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal
Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal
Last edited:
richfinn
Well-known member
The JIS bits I only use on Japanese vehicles, particularly good if your using a cordless driver. I only carry 3 different bits that cover all the JIS crossheads I have run into
Downwindtracker 2
Well-known member
If there is an Princess Auto near you stop by and see if they have anymore OSCA (sp?) hammers, they are Italian and extremely well made.
BlakeTheCarGuy
ALLIANCE MEMBER
I work on Toyota vehicles. What brands do you recommend for the cordless ones? Sometimes it slips if I am using cordless but when I do it by hand usually doesn’t have a problem one of the guys I work with has the Vessel JIS screwdriver that Flat Rate Master on YouTube recommended I have used it once or twice it’s nice.
Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal
TuxThePenguin
Well-known member
Vessel sells bits too, though I haven't tried their bits yet (just MegaDora regular and impact screwdrivers)
Avenging Bankroll
Banned
nothing
Last edited:
richfinn
Well-known member
Had to look them up on my ebay purchase list, but this was the brand, shipped from Europe but a Japanese brand
The website makes no sense but ANEX seems to be the brand
http://www.koyo-industries.jp/product/anex/index.html
Try these guys in the USA
https://chapmanmfg.com/blogs/news/phillips-bits-vs-jis-bits-whats-the-difference
Last edited:
BlakeTheCarGuy
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Cool thanks. I might invest in some now I know what those little dots mean and why the USA made Toyota’s don’t have them I have always wondered now I know.
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
I feel like you're missing a step or two in there I think: "Buy the 'best' tool which all the reviews say is just as good or better than the big brand name one at a fraction of the price and then tell that voice in the back of your head that keeps saying 'Yeah but what if...' to shut up... until you finally give in one day, buy the fancy brand name and realize that it actually wasn't anything special but if anyone ever asks you - you tell them it absolutely was worth it and they just won't understand"
Absolutely. The hickory handle with the induction hardened head is just beautiful. Nothing else will do. Especially not with only a $10 price difference. I just have to wait for it to come back in stock for the size I want.
Those are definitely very nice but the problem I run into on my cars is that there's often no space for an adapter at all. It has to be an actual u-joint socket. Its a huge hassle and on top of that I tend to need the impact u-joint socket on-top of that. I think a lot of that is just on me though. Maybe with a longer high quality ratchet, I'll be able to get enough force in tight areas without needing to squeeze my power tools in there.
Yeah - the Picquic's are pretty much the standard screw driver in Canada. Everyone has one somewhere. They're definitely a step above common screwdrivers (especially ones with interchangeable bits) but they've never wowed me.
measuredtwice
Well-known member
Regarding Vessel JIS bits: This set of industrial JIS bits is made in Japan --> https://absolute-wits-end.com/3-piece-jis-insert-bits/ Each bit is individually marked "Japan". I think some of the consumer level bits are made in Taiwan. I haven't noticed a Thailand COO on their bits but it might be. Some of their fixed screwdrivers are made in Thailand. The seller I linked will charge only $3 for shipping a few sets of bits.
Regarding Picquic: Picquic handles are still made in Canada but the bits are not. Their bits are mostly made in Taiwan. The Robertson bits are made in China (I think all Robertson brand bits might be made in China now). Some of the handles, like the SixPack and the Dash, can hold standard 3" and 2" (respectively) power bits so you can swap them out with the brand of your choice. Some like the Multique have proprietary bits that aren't compatible with standard power bits.
My general advice to the OP: If you are willing to take the time necessary to find deals, then retail prices mean nothing. In that case learn about quality and learn how to find deals, and then be patient.
Regarding Picquic: Picquic handles are still made in Canada but the bits are not. Their bits are mostly made in Taiwan. The Robertson bits are made in China (I think all Robertson brand bits might be made in China now). Some of the handles, like the SixPack and the Dash, can hold standard 3" and 2" (respectively) power bits so you can swap them out with the brand of your choice. Some like the Multique have proprietary bits that aren't compatible with standard power bits.
My general advice to the OP: If you are willing to take the time necessary to find deals, then retail prices mean nothing. In that case learn about quality and learn how to find deals, and then be patient.
d.mcfarland
Well-known member
DIY or tool truck?
Any DIY would be best served by the best fitting screwdriver because a stripped screw is a major issue in my opinion.
For professionals, any tool truck that warranties them out is a win in my book. Mainly because everyone knows that screwdrivers are just mini pry bars.
Avenging Bankroll
Banned
nothing
Last edited:
BlakeTheCarGuy
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Lol I have never used a screwdriver as a pry bar I can’t stand the thought of miss-using a tool I have a variety for sizes in pry bars that I use. My Snap-on guy hasn’t been showing up because we haven’t been able to buy anything because our shop is so slow that we are barely bringing anything home. He has been exempting us from payments luckily I don’t have a payment any way cause all my stuff is paid for. But that also means no warranty right now either so if we do need warranty now we have to call him and meet him somewhere.
Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal
d.mcfarland
Well-known member
Yes, I would agree, but how many $30 screwdrivers do you need if you're buying Snap-on for example. You're saying 2 of every size? That would get pricy.
Bessy
Well-known member
FWIW, as an avid Hobbyist, in Canada, I don't much see the problem with your existing stuff (not knowing the full extent of your set up, that is). Crappy Tire's older tools seem to provide pretty decent bang for buck tools for hobbyist use, and (depending on the store) warranties are usually without too much hassle. I keep an old faded receipt in the car with me for the odd chance they ask for proof of purchase.
Good Quality Items at Crappy Tire include:
- Older (pre-2015) Maximum combo wrenches
- Mastercraft sockets (I've only had chrome chipping issues on maybe three of them in the 15 years or so that I've owned them)
- Ratchets leave something to be desired, I've upgraded the 1/4" ones to Gear Wrench as required, but typically on the clearance racks in smaller stores you will see the old style Maximums with the push button release which seem to hold up.
- Screw drivers are ok, I've really only damaged the smallest sizes. I have a nice set of the maximum acetate handled ones that are solid, but the soft grip mastercrafts are good enough for 90% of my use.
Areas that I've upgraded or plan to upgrade include:
- Pliers - I tend to buy Knipex lately only because for the price that Crappy Tire wants for the new Maximum stuff, I can justify the Knipex. The new Maximums look to be half decent quality, but I've never put them to the test. I keep an eye out at garage sales for older vise grips, but I do keep a cheap set of locking pliers next to the welder that I'm not afraid to burn/abuse as required.
- torx and Allen bits/sockets are soft, so I'd definitely upgrade those as the need arises
- Drill bits are garbage but sold in large enough quantities and cheap enough on sale that I toss them as they wear out.
Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk
Good Quality Items at Crappy Tire include:
- Older (pre-2015) Maximum combo wrenches
- Mastercraft sockets (I've only had chrome chipping issues on maybe three of them in the 15 years or so that I've owned them)
- Ratchets leave something to be desired, I've upgraded the 1/4" ones to Gear Wrench as required, but typically on the clearance racks in smaller stores you will see the old style Maximums with the push button release which seem to hold up.
- Screw drivers are ok, I've really only damaged the smallest sizes. I have a nice set of the maximum acetate handled ones that are solid, but the soft grip mastercrafts are good enough for 90% of my use.
Areas that I've upgraded or plan to upgrade include:
- Pliers - I tend to buy Knipex lately only because for the price that Crappy Tire wants for the new Maximum stuff, I can justify the Knipex. The new Maximums look to be half decent quality, but I've never put them to the test. I keep an eye out at garage sales for older vise grips, but I do keep a cheap set of locking pliers next to the welder that I'm not afraid to burn/abuse as required.
- torx and Allen bits/sockets are soft, so I'd definitely upgrade those as the need arises
- Drill bits are garbage but sold in large enough quantities and cheap enough on sale that I toss them as they wear out.
Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
After some of the recommendations in this thread, I've been looking around and managed to find some of the nicer screw drivers at stores or otherwise and tried them in my hand. I think Vessel is my pick. They just feel nice in my hand.
I also managed to find a Hazet socket, and a couple Wera sockets along with a Snapon. All brand new for no more than a couple dollars each. Not sure why they were so cheap (maybe just because they're odd sizes being cleared out) - but I quite like the Wera's with their knurling. I'll try a few other brands the same way to see which ones ultimately feel the nicest to me.
I just picked up a brand new M12 Milwaukee 3/8 ratchet + 2 batteries and charger for $200. Not a terrible deal and my hands were getting tired anyways.
I also managed to find a Hazet socket, and a couple Wera sockets along with a Snapon. All brand new for no more than a couple dollars each. Not sure why they were so cheap (maybe just because they're odd sizes being cleared out) - but I quite like the Wera's with their knurling. I'll try a few other brands the same way to see which ones ultimately feel the nicest to me.
I just picked up a brand new M12 Milwaukee 3/8 ratchet + 2 batteries and charger for $200. Not a terrible deal and my hands were getting tired anyways.
BlakeTheCarGuy
ALLIANCE MEMBER
Glad you found stuff that works for you. I get all my Snap-on and Mac and Matco at the pawn shops I fill up a box for $10 because they said they are not interested in tools I have also gotten many other brands in there too like Craftsman and SK and lots more. The Vessel screwdrivers are amazing from what I hear so I am sure you will be happy with those.
Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal
pizza
Well-known member
nice, which ones?
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
The Megadora line with the jawsfit, striking cap and the nut turning. I like the handle design and jawsfit really seems like magic. The other features, I'm not sure I really need but might as well have them!
Thats the impact driver right? The big thick steel thing? I have a Tekton one and its definitely handy in a pinch.
As a further update! When it rains it pours!
The last few days I've really been searching for deals and asking around... I got in touch with a friend in Japan and well.. long story short - these will be in the mail shortly:
Plus some other things. That leather handle though! I will probably keep it safe under my pillow.
Edit: One of these too:
Last edited:
pizza
Well-known member
sweet, those look nice
might have to try some eventually
i believe he's referring to the megadora impacta (980) series.
it's like a screwdriver with built-in impact driver functionality.
iirc it works, but it's not as stout as a normal manual impact driver?
and perhaps doesn't turn as many degrees per whack?
anyone have this tool and like it? i think i'd probably just pull out a real impact driver on a stubborn fastener. still, it looks cool.
The last few days I've really been searching for deals and asking around... I got in touch with a friend in Japan and well.. long story short - these will be in the mail shortly:
...
so what's the scoop, is nepros cheaper in japan or what? share some pricing details if you can.
Last edited:
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
Wait - the Impacta drivers turn when you whack them? How does that work? It doesn't look like they have any mechanism to do that.
I think they're slightly cheaper in Japan normally (not anything crazy) but they also have more opportunities for sales or to bargain hunt for them similar to the way people pick up Snap-On stuff in North America for cheap.
On that note I think they might be having a sale right now on their website. It doesn't say 'sale' anywhere but they have a number of ratchets at around $180 and then others that are listed between $60-80 with a "limited stock" notice next to them. Still a little expensive but maybe not more than what is reasonable to spend over a regular tool on treating yourself?
Having said that, mine are actually going to be gifts.
pizza
Well-known member
the mechanism is concealed in the handle. apparently 12° per whack.
see the first page of this pdf
https://www.vessel.co.jp/english/userfiles/handtools/MEGADORA_E.pdf
also look on youtube for some demos
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
Well now that changes everything!! I was thinking they were just like every other company's screwdrivers with striking caps. Just there to help get a better bite or light chiseling work.
I'm glad I haven't ordered them yet. Definitely getting the Impacta's now. Maybe I'll do a mixed set. Some Impacta's and some regular ones.
Thanks!
I'm glad I haven't ordered them yet. Definitely getting the Impacta's now. Maybe I'll do a mixed set. Some Impacta's and some regular ones.
Thanks!
pizza
Well-known member
hex keys from pbswiss don't really interest me, either. so far, i think i like hex-plus from wera the most.
i also like Wiha MagicRing when i need to retain a fastener. also, i really like that Wiha ErgoStar turn-select holder that those keys come with. idk about its longevity yet, but it's the most convenient hex key holder i've used.
hrm, i am definitely impressed with the slotted screwdrivers from pbswiss. the parallel tips are working well for me, and i have not found something better yet. the swissgrip handles also feel great. afaik, they are end game.
for other drive systems, idk. obviously if you want a JIS or JIS-like cruciform (or whatever the hell the new DIN/ISO standard is), maybe you have fewer options.
ok, so what's your favorite? or your favorites for specific drive systems?
and have you used vessel's jawsfit cruciform tips that you mentioned? looks impressive:
but does it chew up screws? would you use jawsfit for general purpose work? would you ever not use it for something?
it looks pimp. i'll probably add a PH2 in the megadora 900 or 930 series to my next amazon.co.jp order so i can try it out.
Last edited:
Avenging Bankroll
Banned
nothing
Last edited:
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
My Nepros stuff just arrived and WOW. 
I didn't know ratchets could be this nice or this small... I didn't know BREAKER BARS could be this nice!
This 3/8" ratchet makes my 1/4" ratchet look huge in comparison.
I've seen nice tools before but never nice tools that made me feel like I had to have them. These have absolutely sold me on the entire product line. Maybe not right away but when I go to Japan, I think I'm going to get the full set of sockets (5.5mm up to 24mm), torx and hex and a full set of ratchets. The mirror finish is good enough to read from.
I think I'm forming some opinions on more expensive tools.
German for things that will be beat on and covered in oil. I've had a couple Wera sockets and extensions I've been using the last couple weeks and I have to say I love the satin finish on them and the way it wears and shows damage. I prefer it over chromed tools which get scratched.
Nepros for new parts or interior work.
My Vessel screwdrivers and Knipex pliers seem to be lost in the mail sadly
but I'm sure they'll be awesome too.
I didn't know ratchets could be this nice or this small... I didn't know BREAKER BARS could be this nice!This 3/8" ratchet makes my 1/4" ratchet look huge in comparison.
I've seen nice tools before but never nice tools that made me feel like I had to have them. These have absolutely sold me on the entire product line. Maybe not right away but when I go to Japan, I think I'm going to get the full set of sockets (5.5mm up to 24mm), torx and hex and a full set of ratchets. The mirror finish is good enough to read from.
I think I'm forming some opinions on more expensive tools.
German for things that will be beat on and covered in oil. I've had a couple Wera sockets and extensions I've been using the last couple weeks and I have to say I love the satin finish on them and the way it wears and shows damage. I prefer it over chromed tools which get scratched.
Nepros for new parts or interior work.
My Vessel screwdrivers and Knipex pliers seem to be lost in the mail sadly
but I'm sure they'll be awesome too.On Nepros.net the "stock limited" ratchets are 36t variants, not the new 90t. I have been lusting after a limited edition wood handle Nepros 90 but at $200 shipped on Ebay....it's a bit much for my blood. I don't know where I would comfortably use a ratchet that nice and expensive in my garage where I'm pretty hard on tools
Congrats on those though, they are seriously pretty pieces that I would be thrilled to own!
toddmorr
Well-known member
not so. they have at least 3 90t compact head 3/8 ratchets, stock limited, all under $80. tempting.
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
Look at the 3/8" stuff and the 1/4" stuff. I think you were looking at the 1/2" stuff which is as you say.
And whats with the half measures?
If you're going to lust after something - lust after this:https://ktc.jp/catalog/index-category/category-list/ntx907jw
Only $22,520.61 and a few months lead time to have the full set custom and hand made for you!
TuxThePenguin
Well-known member
Am I the only one who wants my tools to include 0% wood content, as well as my toolboxes? Don't get the draw of that. In today's day and age where metal ball-bearing drawer slides exist, why would anyone make a wood-on-wood drawer!?!?!?
Edit: Yes, I think it looks nice, but I wouldn't want to use any of that - yet I don't understand the point of buying a tool without wanting to use it. Maybe I'm just too poor to understand the concept.
Edit: Yes, I think it looks nice, but I wouldn't want to use any of that - yet I don't understand the point of buying a tool without wanting to use it. Maybe I'm just too poor to understand the concept.
Last edited:
toddmorr
Well-known member
the feel of wood is awesome. with the right design and wood type it would be very long wearing.
The reason I want it is to have it, not to use it. It is a gorgeous piece that I absolutely would not want to use for real wrenching - I am not a professional and that $200 ratchet is more than the 2 Tekton sets I'm planning to buy for actual use. I just want it as garage art.
but I'm not planning to actually buy it. Dreams remain dreams for now.
OP
FuzzyTiger
Well-known member
There is a place for decorative pieces like that. Gifts for people like us for example. If someone gifted me a piece like that, I'd absolutely appreciate it. Gifts don't need to be practical but they do need to be thoughtful.
If I had a child and they just graduated school and entered the mechanic trade, I think a Nepros ratchet with a the wood handle would be a pretty nice present. Maybe they won't use it but they can proudly display it on top of their toolbox as a reminder that I'm proud of them. No different than a nice pen that you might gift someone starting out in more desk based jobs.
If a mechanic was retiring, one of those lacquered wood show pieces might be more appropriate as a retirement gift.
If you started an automotive business and it's doing quite well and you no longer wrench on a daily basis or ever - one of those box sets might be a great show piece for your office.