The Best Light Fixture Ever!

[pbon]

Sorry for any confusion - I was referencing the integrated LED you listed before: https://www.ledlightingwholesaleinc.com/DM-ST4FT40W-50K-p/dm-st4ft40w-50k.htm that are $40.15 each(when you break down the 4-pack) and are dimmable.

I use these or their predecessor. The look is identical and I bought from the same website but they were made by James. Have 30 of them and like them. Well made, easy to install, good light and I like the diffuser. Of course if one of the strips inside goes, you may not be able to order a new one online like you can for a fixture using replaceable LED tubes, and they cost more than the bare fixture and 2 tubes. I had no problem paying extra for the finished look and for my DIY use, I expect them to last long enough.

 

[jpcjguy]

I use these or their predecessor. The look is identical and I bought from the same website but they were made by James. Have 30 of them and like them. Well made, easy to install, good light and I like the diffuser. Of course if one of the strips inside goes, you may not be able to order a new one online like you can for a fixture using replaceable LED tubes, and they cost more than the bare fixture and 2 tubes. I had no problem paying extra for the finished look and for my DIY use, I expect them to last long enough.

Thanks for the feedback. That reasoning is what I was thinking. Maybe buy 1 or 2 spares. I like the fact that they are dimmable also!

 

[pbon]

Dimming requires running an cable. 18-2 insulated works and can go in the same raceway in switch box. Door bell wire also works but is not rated to be in the box or raceway. I did not want separate dimmer boxes but some don’t mind. Wireless dimming may be possible but I don’t know anything about what parts would be needed to do that. Anyway, since I needed an extra cable, I ran twice as many feet of wire. There is a not so common more expensive 5 wire romex made for this with ground, 14-2 and 18-2 all in the same cable.

 

[Trans damm]

I have a small 1 car garage 12x24 with front to back vaulted ceilings /\ 16’ at the high point. I was thinking about doing the new led recessed lights for a clean install. Anyone have any insight on using recessed in a garage? I’m worried about the angle of the roof displacing the light output. They are fairly expensive but since the garage is small I think 8-10 could get the job done. Appreciate any info. I plan on putting a lift in so lower hanging shop lights won’t work

 

[pbon]

Not a great choice for the height and output you get from cans. But if all you do is park in the garage it does not matter.

 

[jpcjguy]

Dimming requires running an cable. 18-2 insulated works and can go in the same raceway in switch box. Door bell wire also works but is not rated to be in the box or raceway. I did not want separate dimmer boxes but some don’t mind. Wireless dimming may be possible but I don’t know anything about what parts would be needed to do that. Anyway, since I needed an extra cable, I ran twice as many feet of wire. There is a not so common more expensive 5 wire romex made for this with ground, 14-2 and 18-2 all in the same cable.

Emailed my inspector and he said I could use this wire and run it along the romex:
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Southwi...3R-Shielded-Security-Cable-57573144/202316266

 

[jpcjguy]

So I am ready to pull the trigger on ordering lights.
I think I am going to go with these lights for the dimmable feature:
https://www.ledlightingwholesaleinc.com/E5SLB35D4-850-p/e5slb35d4-850.htm

Below is what I feel is a reasonable compromise in number of fixtures and fc for my purposes - being part gym, part quad/toy storage and working bay.

I also figure the splitting the garage lighting into 3 switches - gym area, center bay and lift bay. Lighting might be a little strong on the gym side but I plan on doing dimmers. Can't believe I am looking at 30 lights!!!
The bay is the 12ft wall section that has an internal 4/12 pitch that I need to account for - maybe add a couple side lights?

What do you all think? I feel like I could analyze this for every and really don't want to do it again...

 

[rok_hunter]

All of the recommendations here have been for 4'-8' tube or strip-style lighting. I found an LED lighting site that offered a free lighting analysis that seemed to use the exact same 3d program recommended by Platonic, and that guy recommended four UFO-style lights for my 30x40x12. His results only offered 40 foot-candles of illumination, but I don't know what work plane he selected. I've been reading reviews on these style of lights and the people who get them seem to absolutely love them.

All that to say if I go to UFO style lights, I'll certainly use more than four. Has anyone here used these style lights and have input about if they're any better for illuminating a barn/workshop than the tube or strip-style lights?

 

[HeadsUp]

Don't forget to take into consideration shadows with fewer fixtures.

 

[Platonic Solid]

rok_hunter - Integrated LED Linear highbays are easier on the eyes than UFOs due to LEDs being spread out over a larger area. UFO's are likely to have shorter life due to driver getting baked by the LEDs and LEDs getting baked by themselves. Oddly, UFO's are usually more expensive on a lumens per $ basis. They are a viable option, just not what I would recommend with a 12ft ceiling.

If this is a functional workshop aim for 93fc+ @ 30" workplane. With 12ft ceiling, max fixture spacing = 12ft., thus anything less than 12 fixtures 3x4 pattern will yield uneven illumination regardless of lumen output. If your walls and ceiling are bare wood you won't have the benefit of reflected light and may require more fixtures.

 

[rok_hunter]

Platonic, thanks for chiming in! I was going to send you a direct message with an offer to drop a few $$ your way for an analysis/recommendation until I saw the message that you were stepping back from all this for a bit.

I've been playing with the visual-3d site you referenced and semi-sort-of settled on a 4x4 pattern, but finding the right LED light info to give me an accurate fc, and estimating reflectivity for my interior (it'll be spray foam insulation), has been a challenge.

Since you specifically mentioned high bays I went to one of the big box websites and found a 2' high bay, 11,550 lumens at 5000k, and manually punched those numbers into the Visual Interior tool in a 3x4 layout on 10' spacing, and it spit out 100fc on a 36" workplane, which is my bench height. It only dropped to 99fc at the 30" you mentioned.

Without a full-blown expert analysis I think that'll get me into the ballpark I want without breaking the bank (those high-bays are $63/ea at HD).

One last question for you if you don't mind though: is there a benefit to sticking to 4' tube/strip style lights for even light distribution instead of a 2' high-bay, or does the high bay design enable them to "spread" the light like a 4' device would?

Thanks for the outstanding info and support you've poured into this thread, I can't imagine the hours you have invested in it!

 

[Platonic Solid]

rok_hunter - At 12' 4ft strip lights are not your best value. You're in the right ballpark with the high bay you mentioned. I still do fee based layouts (price starts at $200) and as weather warms up here in CT I'll do less of them in favor of my own construction projects.

 

[02chuck]

I started back at pg 110 reading through the posts to try and be come educated. (Still in over load) I have a 50x80 ag building. I put a metal ceiling (white) in it last year. I found Iron **** had a project similar to mine. Platonic Solid recommended looking at the 40x60x16 project. He put up some Envirolite 18000 lm lights up and that looked pretty good I tried the Visual Interior Tool but did not have the specs for this light. I am figuring that I could do a 4x8 grid with this light selection.
Opinions Please

Thanks

 

[16again]

Platonic Solid, can you answer a question for me?
18x24 garage 10’ ceiling.
These light fixtures were recommended by the lighting company in your Best light fixture thread, Pro Lighting.
Will they be adequate for my garage?
Thank you in advance for your guidance.
Bob


https://www.prolighting.com/t443ssubcxx00p0-18w5k.html



Sent from my iPhone using Garage Journal

 

[Platonic Solid]

16again - Yes 3-Lamp strip lights are good for your 10' mounting height.

 

[16again]

16again - Yes 3-Lamp strip lights are good for your 10' mounting height.

Awesome! Thank you.

 

[ccpanel]

...
and manually punched those numbers into the Visual Interior tool...

How did you manually enter numbers into the tool?

The amount of light threads is insane.

Im probably going with these;
omniraylighting.com/products/copy-of-4-36w-5-472-lumen-v-series-w-hardware-12-year-warranty-free-shipping?variant=29432579784792
up high and these;
omniraylighting.com/products/new-4-36w-4-800-lumen-light-w-hardware-12-year-warranty-free-shipping?variant=12121144000626
interspersed and in my lower section.

28x60x16 enclosed with additioanl 12x60x9 machine room space under an apartmetn all inside a 40x60 metal.
on each end is a 40x20x16 awning that I am assuming will need 60fc
the rest and my OLD eyes means i am guessing I need over 80fc in the whole main shop area.
Contractor moving dirt tomorrow to FINALLY start

 

[rok_hunter]

Ccpanel, at the bottom of the visualizer tool you should be able to either select the exact light fixture you're testing or, if you can't find it like I couldn't.....enter wattage, # of bulbs and lumens per bulb and hope it comes out close LOL.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[PNWguy]

The visual-3d.com tool is great, but the list of fixtures is absurd, especially if you're not 100% familiar with their catalog.

Is this fixture similar enough to a LED ready T8 fixture and LED "bulbs" that I can use it for my layouts (16 x 30 x 12 and 32 x 40 x 12)?

https://www.beeslighting.com/MNSL-L48-2LL-MVOLT-40K-80CRI-M6

Lithonia Lighting CMNS L48 2LL 840 2-Light LED Striplight, MVOLT, White, 4-Foot, 120V-277V

 

[ccpanel]

Ccpanel, at the bottom of the visualizer tool you should be able to either select the exact light fixture you're testing or, if you can't find it like I couldn't.....enter wattage, # of bulbs and lumens per bulb and hope it comes out close LOL.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

It must be because of my Luddite ways and refusal to upgrade to the hated win 10(no comments-not teh right forum) that I can not directly enter data.
ive been messin around and faking the light based on ~lumens to get a feel.

I also created a google sheets doc with table so i could compare value to lumens and dollars per x and lumens per ***...etc... to find out where to spend my mites and pennies to the best(lowest) amount possible.
contractor coming today to start moving dirt so i gotta get my post count up to post the shareable link.

 

[ccpanel]

heres the link to google table. download it to your own file to be able to edit. this is in view only mode since im using it
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ghPfX0MWx4qWJwZvT-FPMXgBDzyzANYZ4qVRF7Nb4BM/edit?usp=sharing

 

[Supra97]

Hi there. This is my first post. My 30x28x12 garage will start construction in July. Any thoughts/feedback on the attached layout? Left bay will be used for service bay with lift and workbench at the front. Right bay will be only used to park. 8 total light fixtures represented by the squiggly lines. Was planning to go with Prolighting Techbrite 3-bulb T8 fixtures 5000K.

 

[Innovate1]

30 x 40 with 14 ft ceiling.

Platonic Solid recommended these (Thanks!):
https://www.ledlightingwholesaleinc.com/HB-90W320605-L-D-2-p/hb-90w320605-l-d-2.htm

12000 lumens 2 fixtures for $108
125 lumens/watt
5 year warranty 50,000 hr rated life
---------------------------
Prolighting recommended these 4 tube high bays:
https://www.prolighting.com/commercial-lighting/ledready/ledret8hiba/b4144ssumxx-18w5k.html
10,692 lumens $99 each
144 lumens/watt
5 year on bulbs/1 year on fixture 50,000 rated life
--------------------------------
Then I looked up this non-high bay 3 tube fixture from prolighting:
https://www.prolighting.com/brands/techbrite/led-ready-fixtures/t443ssubcxx00p0-18w4k.html
7380 lumens $54 each
137 lumens/watt

So the non-high bay are cheaper per lumen than the high bay. The high bay looks to have a reflector built in. Any other reason to not just use a few more of the 3 tube non-high bay.

The tube fixtures allow replacement of the bulbs when they go out. The first fixture does not. But at half the price maybe I don't care. I could buy a spare or two and still be money ahead.

I have had some early LED bulbs go out in a month. I expect most are better than that now but still would like to be able to change bulbs. But for the price I could buy a whole other set of the first for only a little more than the second one so thinking I will go with the first. Anyone have experience with it?

I will have 3 in one section and 9 in the other. I suppose if I have a failure I can put it in the 3 fixture section or just get 3 new fixtures so they match.

 

[Platonic Solid]

heres the link to google table. download it to your own file to be able to edit. this is in view only mode since im using it
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ghPfX0MWx4qWJwZvT-FPMXgBDzyzANYZ4qVRF7Nb4BM/edit?usp=sharing

To discourage poor fixture choices I'll quote myself from your other thread with the same spreadsheet in it:

I'd reject nearly every fixture (bulb) on your list. Need frosted lenses.

Also those angled arrays behind a clear lens makes it even worse as the LEDs are more likely to shine directly in your eyes.

 

[Platonic Solid]

30 x 40 with 14 ft ceiling.

Platonic Solid recommended these (Thanks!):
https://www.ledlightingwholesaleinc.com/HB-90W320605-L-D-2-p/hb-90w320605-l-d-2.htm

12000 lumens 2 fixtures for $108
125 lumens/watt
5 year warranty 50,000 hr rated life
---------------------------
Prolighting recommended these 4 tube high bays:
https://www.prolighting.com/commercial-lighting/ledready/ledret8hiba/b4144ssumxx-18w5k.html
10,692 lumens $99 each
144 lumens/watt
5 year on bulbs/1 year on fixture 50,000 rated life
--------------------------------
Then I looked up this non-high bay 3 tube fixture from prolighting:
https://www.prolighting.com/brands/techbrite/led-ready-fixtures/t443ssubcxx00p0-18w4k.html
7380 lumens $54 each
137 lumens/watt

So the non-high bay are cheaper per lumen than the high bay. The high bay looks to have a reflector built in. Any other reason to not just use a few more of the 3 tube non-high bay? ...

Yes, your math is wrong.

12000 Lm @ $54 vs 8000 Lm @ $54 ($50.22 after GJ discount) makes the 3-lamp strip fixture more expensive.

 

[Innovate1]

Yes, your math is wrong.

12000 Lm @ $54 vs 8000 Lm @ $54 ($50.22 after GJ discount) makes the 3-lamp strip fixture more expensive.

You are correct. I was comparing the two prolighting fixtures but didn't say that. The LED warehouse lights are obviously a better deal on lumens/$.

A little nervous about the actual life of them but perhaps unfounded. Given that the lumens/watt is good hopefully the design keeps the LED and driver components cool enough to get somewhere close to their claimed 50k hours life. At 8 hrs a day and 200 days a year (a wild guess of use) that would be a little over 30 years and likely longer than I will be around to use them. Wasn't able to find much on reviews for them or the company that makes them. Still, I am leaning to going with them based on your recommendation.

The LED warehouse lights don't say anything about hanging hardware and I didn't find the individual parts on their website. Prolighting has them listed for additional cost. I need to contact LED warehouse to find out if they are included.

 

[Platonic Solid]

Still, I am leaning to going with them based on your recommendation.

I've never had one in my hands so I can't necessarily "recommend" this particular fixture. It is an amazingly low price for a UL and DLC listed fixture. And the output is more suitable for your mounting height. There are many similar output linear highbay fixtures that are more expensive. If you want mounting brackets, you might want to keep looking.

 

[Innovate1]

I've never had one in my hands so I can't necessarily "recommend" this particular fixture. It is an amazingly low price for a UL and DLC listed fixture. And the output is more suitable for your mounting height. There are many similar output linear highbay fixtures that are more expensive. If you want mounting brackets, you might want to keep looking.

Not too worried about mounting brackets/hanging hardware. Just need to find out if it is included or I need to get them too. Thanks for all your help with this!

 

[02chuck]

I posted earlier about what I found and if that light selection would work. included more data this time.

I have a 50x80x16 building, figure I will suspend the lights at 15'
Iron **** had found these lights:
https://envirolite-led.com/ProductDetail.dmx?wid=722ce5a1-6e2f-4ef5-b2fc-7d48d8d05dcb

And had some good results. I found the light on the EnviroLite site but it did not have the specs to put in the Visual light tool.

I also found this similar light on special: $87.39 vs $134.45
https://envirolite-led.com/ProductDetail.dmx?wid=fc8f9b97-e2bf-4fba-a020-15044ff79298

Will this work?
Thanks

 

[Platonic Solid]

02chuck - I thought the Envirolite IES was on their site, but that link doesn't work. I have it from a previous project here (link). I renamed it to a txt file. Just "save page as" and rename back to IES.

Edit: To answer your question - Yes this fixture will work for your space. Qty.25 5x5 pattern

 

[02chuck]

Yea I had the same problem trying to get the specs.
Thank you for running the calcs. 5x5 it is.
That will save me 7 fixtures over my guess off of other projects

Thanks again
Chuck

 

[Platonic Solid]

02chuck - 4x6 works pretty good too = yields ~90fc @ 30" work plane

 

[02chuck]

How over lit will it be at 4x8. I break down the shop by 20x25 bays. So I was thinking of the 4 lights per bay. Rarely will they all be on at the same time. I tried to convert the file you included and came to the conclusion i am lame.

Thanks
Chuck

 

[jpcjguy]

So is there a recommended orientation of the 4' LED lights for a lift bay? (Right image in pic)
As you can see from the tool they have them lengthwise front to back and 12 lights (based on a flat ceiling but I have a 4/12 interior pitch). This will give me 86 fc and with the door open, only the center 1 (maybe 2) will be covered.
Just wondering if having them widthwise would be better?

 

[pbon]

Since I like doors up when possible, I installed my lights just outside the outer tracks, closer to the walls than is ideal. For the middle, where the 2 doors are only about 1’ apart, I hung the light between the inner tracks for the doors. I also hung these lights so they dropped down just below the tracks. My other lights are mounted to the ceiling.

In the rear, I have a row that is perpendicular. I do more automotive work in the rear. I could have tucked a row across the very front but did not see the need. Not good photos but you get the idea. 24x30 with 9.5’ ceilings (12.5’ over lift) and 6x15 bumpout on one side.

 

[ShadowRuleZ]

For guys who flush mounted, are you guys hanging the strip lights using toggle bolts or some other way?

 

[pbon]

These lights weigh very little but if all you have is drywall, you may want to use an anchor. My garage is an old carriage house so there is barn board under most of the drywall. For anchors, I like those white plastic anchors you screw into the drywall and then screw a screw into. Toggles also work. I like the standard push in plastic anchors the least but even they should be fine for a light.

 

[Platonic Solid]

How over lit will it be at 4x8. I break down the shop by 20x25 bays. So I was thinking of the 4 lights per bay. Rarely will they all be on at the same time. I tried to convert the file you included and came to the conclusion i am lame.

Thanks
Chuck

Using 70|50|20 Ceiling|Wall|Floor reflectance 4x8 = 120fc @ 30" work plane
Using 20|20|20 ... = 105fc ...

70|50|20 = Ceiling painted flat white|Walls painted eggshell white|concrete floor
20|20|20 = Bare wood ceiling and walls

Steel structure would be somewhere in between the 2.

 

[Platonic Solid]

So is there a recommended orientation of the 4' LED lights for a lift bay? (Right image in pic)
As you can see from the tool they have them lengthwise front to back and 12 lights (based on a flat ceiling but I have a 4/12 interior pitch). This will give me 86 fc and with the door open, only the center 1 (maybe 2) will be covered.
Just wondering if having them widthwise would be better?

Pitched ceilings require more trial and error testing per situation. There's no simple rule that I can apply. Space needs to be modeled in Dialux to be sure.

 

[02chuck]

Platonic Solid thanks for the calcs. I have the white ceiling, but not the painted walls. These are fixtures that can be dimmed if I am over whelmed by the light.
I will follow up once I have them up.
Thank You for the help
Chuck