The Concrete Underground

[OHSCrifle]

Wood framed houses have tremendous forgiveness for surprises. Very easy to double a joist, or cut and remove... Concrete is far less adaptable after the fact.

This project is also a good testimonial to why an architect charges real money, for a complicated project. Distilling a set of plans down to "enough" versus endlessly detailing every inch is an art.

 

[tacostand]

You can imagine how much fun I am at parties.

Oh, we know.

The stair looks absolutely fantastic, Doug. Great job!

 

[ConCretin]

Once I had figured out the stair rails, it occurred to me that I could use the same system to solve another design dilemma.

As you've probably noticed, I have a lot of glass;



Without going to a more exotic (i.e. expensive) curtainwall system, I basically had two choices ; storefront or factory built windows.

Storefront is something you'd see on a commercial building. Rectangular aluminum extrusions are joined together into a framework to receive glazing. This is a clean simple method unless you want operable windows and doors. In that case, pre-manufactured door or window units are installed in openings framed out with the extrusions. This tends to look blocky and interrupts the flow and symmetry I was looking for.

So I opted for individual full height fixed panel windows and sliding doors manufactured by Arcadia. This gave me the look I was going for and had the added benefit of better thermal performance over storefront. Ventilation is provided by awning windows and sliding doors. The problem arises when the sliding doors are on the elevated levels where the only thing between you and a fall to your death is an insect screen.

My solution was more glass rails;



I utilized the structural tubes that flank all of the windows by drilling and tapping them to accept the glazing clamps.





Then used masonite templates to provide dimensions to my glass company.



Here is the rail in the Master bedroom. It needed two panes and a center post due to the 9' width



I also used this at the top of the stairs in the house



This seems like a good solution. It maintains consistency throughout the house and doesn't block the view. It does mean more glass to keep clean though. As you can imagine, I'm getting pretty good at that!

 

[BoilermakerFan]

So the house is really equal parts concrete and glass...

 

[camaroz1985]

Maybe rename it "The Silica Underground"

 

[spike99250]

Maybe rename it "The Silica Underground"

No, then OSHA will be all over him about making dust and keeping up with the new regulations

 

[TurtleValley]

"My solution was more glass rails;"

absolutely brilliant solution! Where were you 6 months ago when we were sorting out our design!! Absolutely a great solution to tall floor level windows.

 

[railroadjim]

Another tool to scan/see through concrete

Fantastic build! Glad to hear you are doing well.

I use the Milwaukee sub scanner and it works quite well for rebar although it is overkill for just a stud scanner.

https://www.milwaukeetool.com/instruments/inspection-and-detection/2291-20

I think the kit is around $300? Not a "pro" tool compared to actual GPR, but not bad..

I just found another new option out there that works with Android phones. No experience with it, but it looks pretty neat and is relatively cheap.

https://walabot.com/diy

They say:

• Find plastic & metal pipes, studs and wires
• See 4 inches/10 cm deep
• Works on concrete and drywall

 

[TwoBytes]

It's been said by lots already, but I'm so glad you're back Doug!

 

[ConCretin]

So while we are on the subject of stairs, let me bring you up to speed on the more mundane staircase that take you to the second floor of the main house. This set is more conventionally framed and clad with oak treads and risers. I milled the 1 1/2" deep treads with a dado to receive the 3/4" thick riser for a nice tight joint.



I matched a stain to the rest of my millwork and applied it. I followed this with several coats of poly before installation.



Installation was relatively straightforward but still took some time to get everything to fit nicely.



I didn't want any exposed fasterners so everything was glued and screwed from behind.



We applied Ram board as we went to avoid damage.



It's a long staircase due to the 12' distance between floors.



The most interesting part of these stairs is how well they demonstrate my OCD. Due to the length of the staircase and the configuration of the floors, the bottom of the stringer was going to intrude into the hall ceiling below resulting in a short section of sloped drywall in the middle of my tall linear hall. I would have had to move for sure!

Soooo, I did what any other slightly deranged person would do. I split the stringer into two sections. The bottom section would terminate on the door header below and the upper section would hang on a trapeze. Yes, I said trapeze. The sketch below shows what I dreamt up.



If all my math worked out, the hall ceiling would fit up into the gap in the stringer and my sanity would be preserved. Here you can see the trapeze in place and the section of stringer I eliminated. The steel frame that supports the upper stringers is bolted to the wall on one end and suspended from threaded rods on the other.



What you see in the pic below are the back of a riser and the underside of a tread. The clearances between the drywall and the stairs were tiny but it all worked.



And when it was all done, no slope.... You can see where it would have been relative to the light fixture you can see in both photos.



I spent a ridiculous amount of time dreaming this solution up, figuring out how to make the math work and building it. After all that work, you'd never even know it was there. Sometimes making things simple is really complicated.

 

[Zippercat]

Wow! Amazing job on the stairs. i can’t imagine the stack of paper with engineer stamps that would have been required for that if you had a city building department involved.

 

[Finallygotit]

Fantastic execution!

 

[gasgas17]

My knees hurt just thinking about installing all those treads and risers, especially all screwed from behind. I have done a few sets that way and it's very time consuming.

 

[Brian R]

I swear I think I would use some of that glass (that you used in front of second story sliders and at top of stairs) instead in lieu of wall to show everyone my handiwork.

Well done.

 

[DarrenF]

awesome!

 

[gooned]

Never disappointed with your solutions, keep it coming...

 

[red]

" Sometimes making things simple is really complicated." -LLWillysfan

And sometimes the execution is so perfect, you make it look simple or so easier to do.
(The details you provide prove otherwise)
Which is the true sign of a master craftsman.
You amaze me with how your expertise crosses the traditional boundaries of the trades.

 

[TomcoPDR]

Amazing

 

[shortykorte]

What they said.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[quattro_sinko]

I spy a Kreg pocket hole jig. Every time I use mine, I feel as though I am assembling model pieces, regardless of what I'm making. The stairs look beautiful!

 

[LaneRover]

Very nice solution and excellent end result!

 

[Wilbur]

Dang. Have read this thread off and on since +/- approx when you started. Brilliant job. I just finished a 1 year remodel of our house that we GC'd to "save money"....*ahem*....and the wife and I were ready to burn it to the ground a few times (well me more than her! ha). The typical remodel....lets get rid of the rugs and put in hardwood.....well we should get tile for the kitchen.....but those cabinets will look like hell....and the counters....yuck.....and you know...it would be so much better if the tile flowed into the bathroom....lets redo the bathroom.....well the upstairs bathroom now looks like ****....*sheesh* After a year not a single thing is the same in the house, well....the original sheetrock was left, some of it anyway. SMH.....

Love your attention to detail and the solutions you found. Great location too - love Maine and your spot on the river is A+++.

I'm sure you're familiar with this but as I have literally NOTHING to offer you for insight (you're miles ahead of me....) and just in case....I can at least recommend Sprayway Glass Cleaner....it's at Wallyworld, HD, Lowe's etc. and is a foam based cleaner. Tons better than Windex etc.

Thanks for the tons of posts, pictures, insights and commentary. I really feel like I went to school reading this. Thank you very much!

 

[Kriesel]

Just finished reading from beginning to end for the first time. Excellent work on the house! Look forward to your continued progress.

 

[gasgas17]

We also had some actual garage related progress - the garage doors are in!



They are manufactured by Raynor and consist of anodized aluminum frames with insulated glass panels. The work shop door is 9' wide;



The garage is serviced by an 18' door;



They look as good from inside;



The photos really don't do the doors justice - they are really beautiful. The glass looks mirrored but they are just tinted grey to match the rest of the glass in the house.



As I mentioned in a prior post, we converted the 9' door to a sliding configuration while maintaining the appearance of a overhead door.



If you recall, overhead door tracks would have conflicted with the bridge crane,lift and skylight. My overhead door company ordered some high strength hardware and engineered a custom set up. I'll post some details of the install when I get a chance to get some pics.



The glass paneled doors really let in some much needed natural light. The work shop really is mostly underground after all.

Would you happen to know what the R-value is on these garage doors and whether they are Raynor's residential or commercial line? We are building a Garage Mahal/cottage in witch the garage door will actually be the main window and we plan to install one of those screen garage doors behind for use during bug season, transforming the indoors to outdoors when desired.

 

[AZpilot]

Words cannot describe. Great stuff. I envy.

 

[LaneRover]

Awesome doors!

Did you have to do anything different with the seal at the bottom of the 9ft door since instead of going straight up and down when it opens and closes it now could/does rub?

 

[ConCretin]

Thanks to everyone for their continued interest and comments.

I can at least recommend Sprayway Glass Cleaner....it's at Wallyworld, HD, Lowe's etc. and is a foam based cleaner. Tons better than Windex etc.

Thanks Wilbur. I'll give that a try for sure. As you can imagine, I've had to set aside a few weekends a year dedicated to window washing. I probably do a fair impersonation of a professional at this point with all the squeegee's hanging off my belt, at least until you see my pathetically slow production. I still haven't mastered that swoopy back and forth thing.

Would you happen to know what the R-value is on these garage doors and whether they are Raynor's residential or commercial line?

The doors are Raynor Av200's, which are from their commercial line. I looked it up but didn't see a published R value. I did use 1/2" insulated glass.

Did you have to do anything different with the seal at the bottom of the 9ft door since instead of going straight up and down when it opens and closes it now could/does rub?

Good question. The bottom seal is just the standard bulb type. It probably wouldn't stand up very well to daily use but the door is not used very often. Mostly to get project vehicles in and out. I plan to install a steel threshold at some point that should impart less wear than the concrete.


I still have a bunch of stuff to bring you all up to speed on - I just need to find and organize the pics. Current efforts are a bit more mundane but I'll share some of that as well.

 

[ODIS]

So very interesting. Thanks again for this thread!

 

[readhead]

Could the sliding door be placed at a slight slope so that when it slides shut it would sit tight on the gasket? Place looks great.

 

[gasgas17]

The doors are Raynor Av200's, which are from their commercial line. I looked it up but didn't see a published R value. I did use 1/2" insulated glass.

Thank you for the response! Do you find that they feel cold to stand in front of more so than any of the other glass area's of the house?

 

[ConCretin]

Could the sliding door be placed at a slight slope so that when it slides shut it would sit tight on the gasket?

There isn't really a gasket on the end of the door. I used the sweep type weather-stripping around the perimeter of the door opening like a conventional overhead door would use. I installed a roller on both sides of the door at the bottom that holds the door against the sweeps. Admittedly, my weather-stripping detail could probably be improved upon.

Thank you for the response! Do you find that they feel cold to stand in front of more so than any of the other glass area's of the house?

I wouldn't say that I notice much of a difference standing there. The biggest difference is probably the weather-stripping. An overhead door will never seal as tightly around the edges as normal door or window. Also, the garage door frames are not thermally broken like the doors and windows in the house so I do notice occasional condensation or frost on the interior surface of the aluminum.

 

[readhead]

I was thinking that as the door slid shut the bottom gasket would land tight on the floor. Like an overhead door comes down at an angle and closes tight against the jamb.

 

[ConCretin]

I was thinking that as the door slid shut the bottom gasket would land tight on the floor. Like an overhead door comes down at an angle and closes tight against the jamb.

Oh Ok. Now I get it. It would provide a tight seal without dragging all the way across. The door can also be adjusted for level. If I angled the track and then lowered the high side of the door back to level...... I need to think about that one.

 

[MEngineer]

That is the way our milking barn doors have always been (with the sloped track) but with the addition of a counter weight so that the door doesn't slam shut on you from the mass of the door.

 

[Motoman1100]

Sometimes making things simple is really complicated.

This is the absolute truth.

 

[wssix99]

Oh Ok. Now I get it. It would provide a tight seal without dragging all the way across. The door can also be adjusted for level. If I angled the track and then lowered the high side of the door back to level...... I need to think about that one.

We have a lot of old fire doors in the City like this. The trick is that they need to have a counterweight to balance them, so they slide smoothly. (Just need to get out the trig book or slide rule to figure the weighting out...)

 

[JimVonBaden]

For those of you just joining us, you may have missed this;



Which lead to this;



And then there was;



And finally this;



There was quite a discussion on here about railings which included many great suggestions. My primary consideration was the the railings not distract from or hide the concrete steps, which lead me towards glass. I also wanted the railing to be clean and simple which lead me to use simple aluminum posts to support the glass. This is what I ended up with.



I hope those who suggested far more elaborate solutions are not disappointed.



I provided the design to the railing manufacturer who supplied the posts ready to accept glass. I simply tapcon'ed the posts down to the concrete and made masonite templates.



I actually used the template to set subsequent posts so one size glass would fit all the openings.



I sent the templates to a local glass company that provided 3/8" tempered glass for the std 1/2" for the landing at the top. The glass had small holes drilled at the anchor locations for a built in safety pin. The panels slipped right in and in a few hours I was done.

One more detail to share. Before we sheet rocked, I installed a few boxes under the stairs.



A few led step lights facing upward and we have this.



The lights are on a timer that comes on at dusk and since the stairs are very visible from the front door, it makes for a bit of drama.

Welcome back Doug! You were definitely missed!

No surprise that your stairs are about as perfect as I have ever seen!

 

[Brian_WK]

Don't go sliding down that railing OUCH!

Awesome project!

Brian

 

[JohnDoeRSA]

Amazing...words cannot describe... All the best and thanks for sharing and keeping it up to date....

 

[ConCretin]

As I've slowly finished up, I've enjoyed going back to see where we started and how we got here. I thought you might as well and for those of you who haven't had a free weekend to kill reading this whole thread, maybe you'll get a kick out of it too. Since this is the Garage Journal, I'd thought I'd show you an actual garage.

This was the original plan. I ended up adding a compressor closet to the left of the shop bathroom and a few other revisions. The shop on the right is about 28x28 and the garage to the left is 24x24.



First we had to dig a hole;



Foundations soon followed;



We eventually got the floor in;



ICF and AC walls took awhile



Roof beams;



Lite deck;



EIFS on the exterior;



Gravel ballast on the rubber roof



And finally we could move inside. Insulation and metal studs.



The ICF overhangs the rigid insulation and Z furring so I could attach 1/2" plywood under the drywall in the shop. Since I didn't plan on hanging stuff on the garage walls, I just used furring strips

My goal for the garage was to have it be free of all clutter and very clean. I drywalled the ceiling before mounting the door opener so I wouldn't have to mud around it.

This is what I call the mud-closet. Despite the size of this place, I never did fit in a mud room, so a closet in the garage is the next best thing.



I lined the entire closet with plywood so I could attach shelves, etc where ever I wanted.

So how about the finished product. You will never see as boring a garage as this one and that's exactly how I wanted it.

Here is the wall with the mud-closet;



The white door to the left leads into the house. The brown door to the right leads into the storage room under the Guest suite.

This is the back wall;



The door is for the compressor closet I added. I stubbed out an air outlet for tire maintenance. You might notice the hot and cold hose bibs for washing cars. I'm plan to swap out the individual hose connections for a two into one hose connection. Didn't know they existed when I did it.



I'm still using my beat up old Campbell Hausfield compressor. There's plenty of room for a bigger one though! I've got plenty of power run and even have a drain in the floor for the compressor tank drain. Also some storage .

Finally the wall that separates the garage from the shop;



Well that's the garage. We park the daily divers in there and that's about it. I love driving in to a clean uncluttered space.

I'll keep plugging away to get you all up to date. We're not that far behind at this point.