HannibalLecter
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2023
- Messages
- 402
The Facom Tools Thread.
- Thread starter Dave455
- Start date
Yes.
To make a really good tool store you need someone running it who actually understands the product, and this guy obviously does.
Here are a couple of stills from his promo, which show the owner, and a bit more of the shop.
Edit - here is a link to one of several youtube pieces about the shop. This one is primarily about wrenches. Great if you speak Greek, but it’s a good run through of Facom’s comprehensive range, even if you don’t.
Last edited:
HannibalLecter
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2023
- Messages
- 402
Yes, I have spoken to, him twice on the phone, approachable, humble and accommodative guy. And good on the warranties and prices
When folks ask about “warranty” for KoKen, I usually point out that I’ve never found a faulty KoKen tool.
Sometimes though, you need quick support, and I must admit that this is one of the attractions of KoKen for me in the U.K. Their presence here is huge (probably bigger than in the U.S. as they have been here for decades) and the dealer support is excellent.
If I need something in a hurry, I often receive it the next day.
HannibalLecter
Well-known member
- Joined
- Aug 26, 2023
- Messages
- 402
That is true and I'm not a professional, but waiting 4 months if i want a zeal socket, or not being able to have tools with a call is a bummer. Thankfully mister worker is from now a koken distributor for Europe, so I'll have another source except from amazon Japan
I thought I should post a picture of my midget O/E’s too!So this thread got me offa my a$$ and out to the shop to get some pics of my small number of Facom pieces.
All sitting on my Hazet Assistent.3 161 series made in France, a J153 and a set of midgets. No COO of the little guys, but I have had them for over 20 years so I assume made in France.
These are just a little larger than some other midget wrenches, so much like the Snap On “mini tip” screwdriver set they are shown with, these are just perfect for working on small equipment, rather than electronics or somesuch.
I like these so much I have two sets, one in the shop, and a “clean” set in the house.
Really? I've never seen Koken in a garage in the UK, or known anyone that uses it. Professionally its mostly SO then some mac, occasionally Teng, usually with a sprinkling of cheap brands around the side of the good stuff, then occasionally Beta, elora, etc filling in gaps. For diyers its mostly halfords, draper, sealey, laser etc. I honestly don't know where I would even buy Koken in the UK, not on primetools, not much showing up on amazon.
Thanks for sharing, some interesting posts there.
I saw your post about the pullers and the failing packaging, how good are the pullers? I was looking at a set last week when I broke a cheap puller
I think, going from memory, KoKen first started turning up in the bike world. That was certainly where I first encountered it, but it was a bit niche. Then I started to see it in the Agrilcultural world. Once I’d started to buy it I found others who had.
Yes, professionally, I think Snap On is still the most common single manufacturer, but KoKen features among those who make up the rest.
Where do you buy it? The same place you have bought most decent tools since tool shops mostly disappeared - online! I’ve historically used Consolidated Tools in Manchester, but UK Tools probably have a stronger online presence.
cbracer
Well-known member
Got these what must have been at least 10 years ago, maybe longer...... I really do like them more than Wera or Wiha
kyrbz
Well-known member
I thought I should post a picture of my midget O/E’s too!
These are just a little larger than some other midget wrenches, so much like the Snap On “mini tip” screwdriver set they are shown with, these are just perfect for working on small equipment, rather than electronics or somesuch.
I like these so much I have two sets, one in the shop, and a “clean” set in the house.
I picked up a set of those many years ago at Epstein's. I really like them as well and wish I would have bought 2 sets. Especially because they were much cheaper than what other places were selling them for
kyrbz
Well-known member
Some Facom Flare Nut wrenches.
Facom make two styles of these.
The No.42 are the usual pattern. I don’t own any of these.
The No.43 are different, and incorporate a “web”. I find these very good, as they are considerably more rigid than the “open” style above.
Aside from the obvious use on pipe unions, these work incredibly well if you are working on a threaded shaft that you can’t get a closed wrench over. They were obviously designed with that use in mind.
Although I bought a small set of these, I think I’ve only ever used the 10mm, and occasionally the 11mm.
Facom make two styles of these.
The No.42 are the usual pattern. I don’t own any of these.
The No.43 are different, and incorporate a “web”. I find these very good, as they are considerably more rigid than the “open” style above.
Aside from the obvious use on pipe unions, these work incredibly well if you are working on a threaded shaft that you can’t get a closed wrench over. They were obviously designed with that use in mind.
Although I bought a small set of these, I think I’ve only ever used the 10mm, and occasionally the 11mm.
That's actually genius! Really love how out-of-the-box Facom can be. Depends on how tight the tolerances are, but those should be more rigid than even the Snap Ons offerings.Some Facom Flare Nut wrenches.
Facom make two styles of these.
The No.42 are the usual pattern. I don’t own any of these.
The No.43 are different, and incorporate a “web”. I find these very good, as they are considerably more rigid than the “open” style above.
Aside from the obvious use on pipe unions, these work incredibly well if you are working on a threaded shaft that you can’t get a closed wrench over. They were obviously designed with that use in mind.
Although I bought a small set of these, I think I’ve only ever used the 10mm, and occasionally the 11mm.
I think in the torque test second test of flair wrenches, both Proto and Mac were more rigid then Snap-on. Snap-on had the least clearance with the nut, too little from my point of view. Whenever they actually test Stanley products they almost always finish first or second. They make best of class stuff. No compromise required, and frequently a better value and it’s available.
richfinn
Well-known member
Koken Tools | UKtools
UKTools.com is the UKs Leading distributor of Koken Tools. Visit our Koken Shop and browse 1000s of products at a great price with fast delivery.
www.uktools.com
Yes, they seem to be rigid.
I must admit that, all other factors being equal, I find it hard to beat Snap On flare nut wrenches. It would be interesting to compare the Facom No.42 with the Snap On.
However, Snap On don’t offer the “web” design, and you’re right, the design is more rigid than than the open style - IF it’s suited to the job you are doing, which isn’t always the case.
Hazet also offer a similar style of wrench, but in a limited range of sizes. I think Facom offer 7mm to 19mm.
Yes Snap on is exceptional for sure. But lets say they also offered this design with the extra bolster/web - in that case this would surely be stronger than their existing regular flare nut wrenches? Or it could have a more narrow head at least...Yes, they seem to be rigid.
I must admit that, all other factors being equal, I find it hard to beat Snap On flare nut wrenches. It would be interesting to compare the Facom No.42 with the Snap On.
However, Snap On don’t offer the “web” design, and you’re right, the design is more rigid than than the open style - IF it’s suited to the job you are doing, which isn’t always the case.
Hazet also offer a similar style of wrench, but in a limited range of sizes. I think Facom offer 7mm to 19mm.
Yes, I think you’re right, the “web” design is inherently more rigid than the open style.
Snap On already make two styles of flare nut wrench though, not to mention a variety of crowfoot wrenches, so I can’t see them adopting this style.
Out of interest I measured the head size of the three 10mm flare nut wrenches I own.
Snap On actually have the widest head at .771”. Hazet are smaller at .745”, and Facom the smallest at .735”
I would have liked to compare an old Britool, but I don’t have any that small, or even metric. The Britool is the heftiest - a comparable size Facom weighs 3 1/2 oz, the Britool weighs 7oz!
Chrome Vanadium Cody
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2021
- Messages
- 663
Store near me had this 10mm 40R series Facom open end ratcheting wrench. I’ll try and see if it can speed things up in any low access situations.
Those Facoms should be the go-to on motorcycle brake bleeders.
Looks like they'd prevent slipping off and scraping up the Aluminum Brembo master cylinders as I've done on my bike.
My first Facom tool and my first tool of this design. I bought this 12pt x 6pt No.76 wrench at Amazon Global Store for the very reasonable price of $17.86, shipping costs and tax included. It shipped from an address in France. Amazon had sizes other than 17mm, but this one was the bargain of the bunch. This style of wrench is not popular in the USA, and I don't have an immediate need for it, but it will be useful to me in the future I am sure.
I don’t know what I like more, the wrench or the 2cv. Lovely combination!Facom adjustable wrench I keep in the tool roll of my 2CV
I don’t normally buy small wrenches (less than say 3/4” A/F) used. They tend to have proportionally more wear than larger wrenches, and the cost savings don’t justify their purchase. (The opposite applies to larger wrenches, but that’s a different story).
I was tempted by these Facom open enders last week though. They are the “low profile” No.31‘s for a start, which are quite costly new. These examples have little to no wear, and they are also the older French made ones.
Relatively few manufacturers make these low profile wrenches, and even fewer do them really well. Probably only Snap On and Facom make wrenches I really like. KTC Profit are superb, but they are smaller overall.
You always feel you have something a bit special with these older Facom’s.
I was tempted by these Facom open enders last week though. They are the “low profile” No.31‘s for a start, which are quite costly new. These examples have little to no wear, and they are also the older French made ones.
Relatively few manufacturers make these low profile wrenches, and even fewer do them really well. Probably only Snap On and Facom make wrenches I really like. KTC Profit are superb, but they are smaller overall.
You always feel you have something a bit special with these older Facom’s.
Those are beautiful, the way they played with the grinding and the rougher inner part looks very futuristic although they're older.I don’t normally buy small wrenches (less than say 3/4” A/F) used. They tend to have proportionally more wear than larger wrenches, and the cost savings don’t justify their purchase. (The opposite applies to larger wrenches, but that’s a different story).
I was tempted by these Facom open enders last week though. They are the “low profile” No.31‘s for a start, which are quite costly new. These examples have little to no wear, and they are also the older French made ones.
Relatively few manufacturers make these low profile wrenches, and even fewer do them really well. Probably only Snap On and Facom make wrenches I really like. KTC Profit are superb, but they are smaller overall.
You always feel you have something a bit special with these older Facom’s.
Yes, it looks as though after forging (and maybe broaching) they gave them an extra pass on the surface grinder.
The result is a slim but also perfectly flat wrench, which you need in some applications.
The extra machining steps (as well as the lower volumes) account for these wrenches being historically slightly more expensive than standard.
Facom still manufacture this pattern, but I don’t know if the quality is as good as the originals.
I could not resist for long...
Everything seems quite nicely made. I expected the cle-a-pipe wrenches would have off-corner engagement and was surprised to see them straight. The fancy forged pipe wrenches do have it.
Must say - I also expected a higher polish finish. Were the older French made tools polished more?
Everything seems quite nicely made. I expected the cle-a-pipe wrenches would have off-corner engagement and was surprised to see them straight. The fancy forged pipe wrenches do have it.
Must say - I also expected a higher polish finish. Were the older French made tools polished more?
Regarding the polish - here is a comparison between the 10mm Facom XL wrench and the USAG 285X. The USAG is supposed to be the same as the MAC rbrt wrenches. I guess that's why it is polished so much better. To be fair the Facom finish will probably get scratched less, but I expected a more satin finish (Stahlwille), while in actuality it is very matte (you can almost feel the grit - guess that does make it less slippery...).
Chrome Vanadium Cody
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2021
- Messages
- 663
I have a set of these and they do have off corner engagement but it’s very mild and hard to notice compared to most wrenches these days. I can’t quite tell whether yours are the same or not based on the photo. But mine are late period French made if that helps
On my new 76-series cle-a-pipe wrenches the "OGV" off-corner-engagement design is clearly visible on the 12-pt socket end, but not on the 6-pt socket end. My wrenches have "OGV" stamped on them.
I could not resist for long...
Everything seems quite nicely made. I expected the cle-a-pipe wrenches would have off-corner engagement and was surprised to see them straight. The fancy forged pipe wrenches do have it.
Must say - I also expected a higher polish finish. Were the older French made tools polished more?
Nice purchases!
The No. 75 (6 point x 6 point) have never had off corner engagement. Yes, I always thought that was a little odd, as they are marked “OGV” which I always thought was Facom‘s off corner engagement.
I find however, that the fit of these wrenches is really very good. As new, they are painted inside, but in use this soon wears off revealing a very durable finish. I often use mine for clamping tools to my mill and drill, and the clamp nuts show no real wear.
With regard to finish, the top and bottom wrenches below (13 and 19) are French made, the mid one (17) is Taiwan. The French made are perhaps a tiny bit higher polished, but even among those the 13 is brighter than the 19.
I would have said that the French combination wrenches were a little brighter than the Taiwan ones, but comparing my French made 14mm with a Taiwan 15mm, there really isn’t anything in it.
The 440 might even be a little higher polished. They look better in reality than they seem to photograph.
Last edited:
That is very interesting.Regarding the polish - here is a comparison between the 10mm Facom XL wrench and the USAG 285X. The USAG is supposed to be the same as the MAC rbrt wrenches. I guess that's why it is polished so much better. To be fair the Facom finish will probably get scratched less, but I expected a more satin finish (Stahlwille), while in actuality it is very matte (you can almost feel the grit - guess that does make it less slippery...).
I have seen some USAG tools that were not as highly finished as their Facom counterparts, but that’s obviously not the case here.
Doubly interesting as USAG are often a frac cheaper than Facom where I am…
neophyte
Well-known member
The 1990s+/- cle a pipes had a very smooth, but satin mat finish.I could not resist for long...
Everything seems quite nicely made. I expected the cle-a-pipe wrenches would have off-corner engagement and was surprised to see them straight. The fancy forged pipe wrenches do have it.
Must say - I also expected a higher polish finish. Were the older French made tools polished more?
Earlier versions at one point actually had the ends fully polished, similarly to Hazet wrenches, with just the center in a mat finish.
Those look to be slightly rougher.
I’ve seen older Facom wrenches with visible grind marks under the plating, so finish on Facom stuff sometimes varies even if from the same time period.
Well, despite no off-corner engagement, the tools seem very high quality to me - not disappointed at all.
Well, the Facom 10mm cost me about 7€ and the Usag around 10€. I got a 27% discount on the Facom, otherwise it would also be 10€. Both still super affordable compared to MAC branded ones. The Facom is more all-around useful with a less agressive profile and 12 point end, while the USAG is probably best for rusty fasteners.
USAG 285X set is just a crazy good deal at the moment. Pretty much the best wrenches on the market that can compete with the best of Snap On and Wright, but for a fraction of the cost.
Well, the Facom 10mm cost me about 7€ and the Usag around 10€. I got a 27% discount on the Facom, otherwise it would also be 10€. Both still super affordable compared to MAC branded ones. The Facom is more all-around useful with a less agressive profile and 12 point end, while the USAG is probably best for rusty fasteners.
USAG 285X set is just a crazy good deal at the moment. Pretty much the best wrenches on the market that can compete with the best of Snap On and Wright, but for a fraction of the cost.
Chrome Vanadium Cody
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2021
- Messages
- 663
dutchgray
Well-known member
Facom 1" drive ratchet head
I need to make a handle for it.
I need to make a handle for it.
That’s interesting. You made me look closely at my Facom 76 wrenches, and I discovered the six-point end has the same subtle off-corner engagement. I hadn’t noticed that before.
Now I’m wondering if there’s something about F-22’s photos that hides the same off-corner feature, or if his wrenches totally lack that.
I could photograph the end of one of my 76 wrenches later if there’s any interest. I acquired mine recently and they’re not French-made.
F-22: what sizes are the wrenches you photographed? I’m guessing 8, 10, and 13 mm from the blurred text and because those sizes would make sense for most general purposes? (I’m wondering if the off-corner engagement is only on larger sizes or something, but I’ll have to check mine when there’s daylight.)
I just had a look at the least used of my Facom No. 75’s.
I have always assumed that it didn’t have the “off corner” feature, but on close inspection I think I’m with Chrome Vanadium Cody above, it’s “mild’ but the feature is there.
As far as I can tell it’s the same thing on my newest Taiwanese made tool, so it’s not a COO thing, but rather a feature of these tools.
The off corner engagement was a newish thing when I bought the first of these No. 75 wrenches, so maybe Facom just went with the minimum that worked?
The profile certainly seems to work, and there’s no doubt that some manufacturers seem to exaggerate this feature, which won’t actually do much to improve it’s function.
I have always assumed that it didn’t have the “off corner” feature, but on close inspection I think I’m with Chrome Vanadium Cody above, it’s “mild’ but the feature is there.
As far as I can tell it’s the same thing on my newest Taiwanese made tool, so it’s not a COO thing, but rather a feature of these tools.
The off corner engagement was a newish thing when I bought the first of these No. 75 wrenches, so maybe Facom just went with the minimum that worked?
The profile certainly seems to work, and there’s no doubt that some manufacturers seem to exaggerate this feature, which won’t actually do much to improve it’s function.
That looks like the current model.Facom 1" drive ratchet head
I need to make a handle for it.
Handles should be readily available from Facom.
Making your own is perfectly feasible, but to make a good job of it (and certainly if it was chrome plated) I think you would be in to more than Facom want!