neophyte
Well-known member
Fluorescent tools are a new trend in tools.
I presume there may be dome specific regulation for the tools, maybe FOD regulations in aerospace.
Klein and Proto both make some Fluorescent tools as well.
The Facom Tools Thread.
- Thread starter Dave455
- Start date
I presume there may be dome specific regulation for the tools, maybe FOD regulations in aerospace.
Klein and Proto both make some Fluorescent tools as well.
ultgar
Well-known member
The one in the middle is the black nickel plated 40 series that came in the 2000pc collector set release during the Facom/Ferrari partnership.
These specially plated tools were never available for purchase separately. The McLaren 40ti wrenches were. The earlier ti wrenches were more gold in color but had plating issues. Facom changed the plating to what is shown. My remaining stock is from the tail end of their production (2000-2001??).ultgar
Well-known member
Facom and USAG pliers - the USAG version without the return spring is $13 cheaper. Obviously everything else except for the name on the tools is the same. Made in France.
The black one was so shiny I didn’t even realise it was black!The one in the middle is the black nickel plated 40 series that came in the 2000pc collector set release during the Facom/Ferrari partnership.
Never seen one of those either!
The Titanium ones are just superb. I remember them being introduced.
Chefjpd
ALLIANCE MEMBER
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I've always admired the Facom No. 41 wrench.
For anybody not familiar with Facom numbering (which I admit is probably most folks) these are combination wrenches with an offset box end.
I realised a few years back however, that they are slightly more than that, as they are just a fraction longer, and just a fraction thicker too.
I recently had an opportunity to purchase a relatively old, but unused set. As ever, I can resist everything except temptation!
Included was every wrench from 6 to 19mm, less 10 and 12. All but three are sealed in the original packing. I'm thinking these are probably at least 40 years old, so that's quite impressive.
They had belonged to the sellers Father, and he just wanted them to go to someone who appreciated them. Price paid was just under half new price, which seemed very fair. New No. 41's would have off corner (OGV) box ends, and a more shiny finish, but would of course be made in Taiwan.
The question now, is whether to unseal the sealed ones...?
For anybody not familiar with Facom numbering (which I admit is probably most folks) these are combination wrenches with an offset box end.
I realised a few years back however, that they are slightly more than that, as they are just a fraction longer, and just a fraction thicker too.
I recently had an opportunity to purchase a relatively old, but unused set. As ever, I can resist everything except temptation!
Included was every wrench from 6 to 19mm, less 10 and 12. All but three are sealed in the original packing. I'm thinking these are probably at least 40 years old, so that's quite impressive.
They had belonged to the sellers Father, and he just wanted them to go to someone who appreciated them. Price paid was just under half new price, which seemed very fair. New No. 41's would have off corner (OGV) box ends, and a more shiny finish, but would of course be made in Taiwan.
The question now, is whether to unseal the sealed ones...?
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ultgar
Well-known member
Was looking for some pics of an old wall panel set I had for the 41 series and found this comp photo of the std vs ti wrenches. 
ultgar
Well-known member
440 Series Combination Wrenches (Gen 2) - the 440 series combination wrenches first appeared in the 2008 catalog, replacing the long running 40 series. Facom essentially slimmed down their old 40 series, making it more comfortable in the hand and offering improved accessibility at both ends.
In 2014 (10 years ago), the engineers at Facom made further improvements to the 440 wrenches, making the open ends up to 15% slimmer for even better access to fasteners. See pictures above on how to quickly distinguish between early and late 440 series wrenches (Gen 1 vs Gen 2). The difference is so subtle, especially in the smaller sizes, that most people wouldn't notice. The 17mm size shown here is a full 1.0mm thinner at the open end with Gen 2 (6.6mm vs 7.6mm)
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Some of my Facom No. 44 open enders. These are the later Taiwan made, but are really very nice. They have a distinctive "ring", and are nice to use. Not costly either.
I prefer separate open end and box end wrenches in my shop, so these complement the metric Stahlwille I also have. The Facom, although looking quite dull in this picture are actually quite a bright chrome. Much more so than the satin Stahlwille.
Here is another No. 44 (bottom) compared to an original French made one (top). Although the design is slightly different, the finish on these tools is absolutely identical, suggesting that the manufacturing is very consistent, and the QC standards quite high.
I prefer separate open end and box end wrenches in my shop, so these complement the metric Stahlwille I also have. The Facom, although looking quite dull in this picture are actually quite a bright chrome. Much more so than the satin Stahlwille.
Here is another No. 44 (bottom) compared to an original French made one (top). Although the design is slightly different, the finish on these tools is absolutely identical, suggesting that the manufacturing is very consistent, and the QC standards quite high.
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Apologies in advance for infecting the Facom thread with USAG!
Just for comparison to the post by @Dave455 above, here are the equivalent USAG 252N wrenches. It's probably safe to assume these came out of the same factory in Taiwan as Dave's Facoms. They are well made, and beautifully finished. I haven't used them much but at $4/wrench they were a very good closeout deal I could not refuse.
The one older one is likely made in Italy, that came from the classifieds here.
Just for comparison to the post by @Dave455 above, here are the equivalent USAG 252N wrenches. It's probably safe to assume these came out of the same factory in Taiwan as Dave's Facoms. They are well made, and beautifully finished. I haven't used them much but at $4/wrench they were a very good closeout deal I could not refuse.
The one older one is likely made in Italy, that came from the classifieds here.
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ultgar
Well-known member
Throughout the year, USAG sends out "flash sales" of items they want to reduce inventory on. The 5pc metric set (8-17mm) was the one that was on sale last year. These are the same as the Facom 44 series. The USAG ones have a US warranty.
No apologies needed!Apologies in advance for infecting the Facom thread with USAG!
Just for comparison to the post by @Dave455 above, here are the equivalent USAG 252N wrenches. It's probably safe to assume these came out of the same factory in Taiwan as Dave's Facoms. They are well made, and beautifully finished. I haven't used them much but at $4/wrench they were a very good closeout deal I could not refuse.
The one older one is likely made in Italy, that came from the classifieds here.
I have the Facom up to 22mm too. That's about the largest size I need in an O/E as a lot of grinder attachments use it.
Yes, obviously the same basic wrench, and that's presumably why they changed the design, so they could mark them up as either. I can't remember the exact timings, but I think Facom bought out USAG before SBD bought Facom, so had presumably been planning a shared range for some time.
In the U.K, although we have tools from all over, USAG are fairly rare. I think they are better known in Italy, and areas of Italian influence.
With either name on they are decent tools though. For $4 / wrench you can't go wrong, but I didn't pay a lot more for mine at regular price, although it was a little while back.
440 Series Combination Wrenches (Gen 2) - the 440 series combination wrenches first appeared in the 2008 catalog, replacing the long running 40 series. Facom essentially slimmed down their old 40 series, making it more comfortable in the hand and offering improved accessibility at both ends.
In 2014 (10 years ago), the engineers at Facom made further improvements to the 440 wrenches, making the open ends up to 15% slimmer for even better access to fasteners. See pictures above on how to quickly distinguish between early and late 440 series wrenches (Gen 1 vs Gen 2). The difference is so subtle, especially in the smaller sizes, that most people wouldn't notice. The 17mm size shown here is a full 1.0mm thinner at the open end with Gen 2 (6.6mm vs 7.6mm)
Just last week, I was explaining to my snap on guy how I far prefer the Facom 440 to my Flank Drive+ wrench’s, and how the Facom are massively better value, at around 1/4 the price. The 440 takes a wrench and adds some innovation, it’s one of the few I’ve tried that positively differentiates.
Apologies in advance for infecting the Facom thread with USAG!
Just for comparison to the post by @Dave455 above, here are the equivalent USAG 252N wrenches. It's probably safe to assume these came out of the same factory in Taiwan as Dave's Facoms. They are well made, and beautifully finished. I haven't used them much but at $4/wrench they were a very good closeout deal I could not refuse.
The one older one is likely made in Italy, that came from the classifieds here.
I have some older USAG offset box end wrenches, and they have the same "vanadium USAG extra" lettering in a parallelogram as yours does, but it says "made in italy" on the other side (in very tiny letters if I remember correctly, so tiny it's hard to read if the forging wasn't perfect).
Can confirm USAG is more well known here in Slovenia than Facom, though you can find both. Obviously, Italy is right next door to us, so Beta is also somewhat common...
I've recently been replacing the wrenches in my "road box".
Historically I had Facom No. 40's, a mixture of original French made and later Taiwanese, but with some "gaps" and a couple getting worn.
I started by "filling the gaps" with 440's, but ended up adding a complete set from 7 to 19mm, and a 22 for angle grinders! I don't think they are better than Snap On, you're comparing with the best in the business there, but they are incredibly good, especially for the price.
You can't, unfortunately, take price out of the equation, and there's no way I'd ever want to leave a comparable number of Snap On wrenches in my vehicle. I wouldn't really want to use Snap On for some of the stuff I do with my mobile tools anyway, such as bolting up fence posts or other outdoor tasks.
I added a few of the 440 XL's as well, in the sizes I use a lot. I might add a couple more, but it's easy to add too much to a road box, and it becomes another bench box.
The 440 XL's are superbly made. The steel, the manufacture, and the finishing all appear faultless. My guess is that these are made on an incredibly modern production line, and there is no hand finishing (or variation) in the process.
Even the lettering is crisp and consistent.
I wasn't sure about the open ends when I first got these. I'm not a huge fan of these fancy open jaws, and these seemed too sloppy.
But if you look closely at how they engage a fastener they really do transfer the load to a greater area, and they seem to work superbly in practice.
The 440 XL's (and the USAG equivalents) score very highly on the quality / price ratio. Although in fairness I have to include the Williams Supercombo up there with them!
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Stubby1743
Well-known member
My 3/4" drive 1 11/16" 12pt socket.
ultgar
Well-known member
I have a Price File highlighting Facom & USAG tools marked for clearance. Currently sending it out by email recent customers. Deepest discounts ever offered on many items (some up to 80% off regular sale price). Current and classic (made in France) Facom including some Ferrari and McLaren collector items. All items are NEW. The link and price file will not be posted on my website until sometime in June.
If you'd like the price file (Excel format), please message me with your email address. Photo screen shot for the first few lines of this 5500 line price file.
If you'd like the price file (Excel format), please message me with your email address. Photo screen shot for the first few lines of this 5500 line price file.
Attachments
Stubby1743
Well-known member
Two finds at my local car boot sale yesterday.
The 26mm combi has, unfortunately, been slightly ground around the open end.
The 26mm combi has, unfortunately, been slightly ground around the open end.
What is a car boot?Two finds at my local car boot sale yesterday.
The 26mm combi has, unfortunately, been slightly ground around the open end.
Stubby1743
Well-known member
It's a flea type market in a field where people turn up with items to sell in their car boots (trunks for those of you in The States). Items are spread out on the ground or on tables that the sellers have brought with them.
mobiledynamics
Well-known member
I got my Facom Flare Nut's in last week.......might give my SO flares a run for top tier
I recently had the opportunity to buy a new, but old stock, Facom socket set.
It was advertised as having a scratched box lid, and had obviously been sitting on a dealers shelf for some years, but the tools were unused.
I almost didn’t buy it, as the sockets are 12 point which I have something of an excess of. However, the tools are French made with “OGV” profile sockets (definitely the sweet spot) so I weakened!
Price was the equivalent of $134, which seemed fair. The ratchet needed stripping and cleaning as the grease had gone hard, and I gave the box a quick go with cutting polish which improved it considerably.
The ratchet is the older pattern J.151A. I don’t own any other Facom ratchets of this style, but I quite like it. The handle is a harder plastic than it looks, and the mechanism is quite smooth.
It’s a 72 tooth mechanism, which was very fine tooth for the time. With this in mind, I oiled it with thin SAE 10 oil, but I think it needs something a frac thicker.
The set appears in my 2001 catalogue.
It was advertised as having a scratched box lid, and had obviously been sitting on a dealers shelf for some years, but the tools were unused.
I almost didn’t buy it, as the sockets are 12 point which I have something of an excess of. However, the tools are French made with “OGV” profile sockets (definitely the sweet spot) so I weakened!
Price was the equivalent of $134, which seemed fair. The ratchet needed stripping and cleaning as the grease had gone hard, and I gave the box a quick go with cutting polish which improved it considerably.
The ratchet is the older pattern J.151A. I don’t own any other Facom ratchets of this style, but I quite like it. The handle is a harder plastic than it looks, and the mechanism is quite smooth.
It’s a 72 tooth mechanism, which was very fine tooth for the time. With this in mind, I oiled it with thin SAE 10 oil, but I think it needs something a frac thicker.
The set appears in my 2001 catalogue.
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Found this thread yesterday and am slowly reading it!
Took pics of the FACOM tools I've acquired over the decades. Half of them are from the Griot's Garage era. Everything's French.
- 22mm/24mm offset OGV box wrench - don't remember where I got it, possibly Harry Epstein's, trying to flesh out a Craftsman Professional set
-13mm nutdriver - just got it for $4 (before shipping) from Harry Epstein's. A bit long!
- 3/8" drive Palm Control ratchet. I like the thickness of the grip, and the stiffness of the handle makes me realize that other ratchets I use must be flexing. Beefy and strong!
- Allen key/ball-end set. Nice organizer, and when the fasteners get small, the accuracy of their sizing shines.
- T5L locking pliers. I never really found a use for them, but they are nicely made for sure. Lately, I've found a simple use for them, hence the wear.
Below, Craftsman 11mm, Pratt-Read 1/2". and FACOM 13mm nutdrivers:
Took pics of the FACOM tools I've acquired over the decades. Half of them are from the Griot's Garage era. Everything's French.
- 22mm/24mm offset OGV box wrench - don't remember where I got it, possibly Harry Epstein's, trying to flesh out a Craftsman Professional set
-13mm nutdriver - just got it for $4 (before shipping) from Harry Epstein's. A bit long!
- 3/8" drive Palm Control ratchet. I like the thickness of the grip, and the stiffness of the handle makes me realize that other ratchets I use must be flexing. Beefy and strong!
- Allen key/ball-end set. Nice organizer, and when the fasteners get small, the accuracy of their sizing shines.
- T5L locking pliers. I never really found a use for them, but they are nicely made for sure. Lately, I've found a simple use for them, hence the wear.
Below, Craftsman 11mm, Pratt-Read 1/2". and FACOM 13mm nutdrivers:
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The French manufacturer seems to be or have been Pradines, which was owned by the Deville Group.
The Pradines brand went back to 1865.
Snap-On seems to have fully taken over the Pradines brand in 2021.
Deville Group also manufactures plastic and steel parts for the automotive industry, and still does, with just the tool division being purchased by Snap-On Europe/Bahco.
Snap-On Europe still seems to use the Pradines brand, at least in Europe.
Some of the Bahco tools Epstein Tools had were branded “Bahco Pradines”
Pradines is a “Commune” in France.
Pradines, Lot - Wikipedia
en.m.wikipedia.org
Ah! Exactly what I got from Harry Epstein, some Bahco-Pradines pruners for about $17 maybe ten years ago, and they feel like they'll last forever.
Same here. I bought a pair of Craftsman linesman pliers last year to tug tough weeds in the yard -- no way the Knipex are going out to play in the dirt!
Looks like its helper approved........I have one of these.......ur going to love them.FACOM FCM501A locking pliers from Amazon US, from a seller in England, made in France.
Approx. 10 inches/250mm long, helpers interfered with perspective on these pics.
tiredoldironworker
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jun 14, 2024
- Messages
- 243
I got one on Amazon a few months ago and it's really versatile and very useful.
ultgar
Well-known member
Yes I really like the sockets and also the ratchet. But there would be more verastility if the ratchet in the kit also had an insert to make it a standard 1/4" square drive capable. The sockets already are, as you show.
I found something similar to what I mean online. Maybe it is possible to source the correct sized ones:
I finally broke down and bought a FACOM hammer. Amazon US, shipped from England for free, $21.85 plus tax.
345 grams/12 oz. Graphite handle, they say. I can say the handle is contoured nicely.
345 grams/12 oz. Graphite handle, they say. I can say the handle is contoured nicely.
Are these still made in France?I finally broke down and bought a FACOM hammer. Amazon US, shipped from England for free, $21.85 plus tax.
345 grams/12 oz. Graphite handle, they say. I can say the handle is contoured nicely.
I find the French pattern hammer head very iconic. Almost all hammers here are the cross peen pattern.
I could not find one thing indicating country of origin.
Balog
Well-known member
So I’ve been seeing the Facom 75s and became convinced I should get one to try out. But for some reason the 10mm is really hard to find? Grainger skips that size, Amazon UK only has the 12point, Amazon US does list one but I’m a bit concerned if the listing is accurate etc. I’d think 10mm would be the most common?
The Facom 75 is the 6 point version (12 point is the No.76) so Amazon might be a bit confused.
Although I have occasionally bought Facom on Amazon, I have only done so on the basis of a really cheap deal.
Generally there are better sources, but I appreciate Facom is not well known in the U.S.
10 and 13 are probably the sizes I use most in these wrenches. Great to chuck in a pocket if you just need to change a battery or something, without worrying about small pieces getting lost!