If anyone can find the Porto Power episode please post a link
The vintage Blackhawk Thread
- Thread starter johnnybentwrench
- Start date
3baygarage
Well-known member
I didn't catch that!
thehorse13
Well-known member
The episode has them poking around a property in a tall grassy area near a barn from what I recall. I realize this is almost every episode over the last 15 years but I when they yanked it out, I knew that Blackhawk prices were about to go through the roof.
don long
Well-known member
They have called me twice trying to come and film. I keep turning them down
thehorse13
Well-known member
It's a shame that someone ruined this set by removing the black baked finish from all the tools. I'm sure that everyone here has seen this on the bay by now. Priced in the usual ridiculous zone.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
I don't shop or even peruse on eBay, so thanks for posting.
In addition to stripping the "Satin Black" enamel finish, I suspect the case has been repainted. I also suspect the decal of being reproduction. I suppose it's possible for the finish and the decal to be original, but if that's true, it must have been kept in a hermetically sealed compartment and never used, because I have never seen a "C" case or a Quick Disconnect era decal on any size case in that mint-y condition.
Lastly, note that most of the sockets are 12-pointers. Set No. 32-C came with 6-point sockets. The "C" in 32-C is for the case designation. Set No. 32-CD came with 12-point sockets, the "D" in 32-CD signifies "Double-Hex" instead of hex. I suppose it's possible they came that way from the factory by mistake, but Set No. 32-C is supposed to have five (5) square sockets and fourteen (14) hex sockets. Together with the other features (stripped black enamel, perfect decal, condition of case), I would suspect the whole thing was cobbled together to look impeccably original and preserved, and the seller just didn't know (or care) about the set numbering scheme not matching the socket configuration.
EDIT: Well, after looking at the eBay photo close-ups, the finish on the case and the decal look like they could be original, amazingly. Still not sure what's going on with the 32-C/number of points on the sockets mismatch. Maybe someone found this case with some of the tools and put it together with tools and sockets found later and not original to the case.
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four.cycle
Well-known member
That particular decal (for the 32-C set) is not currently shown in the offerings from Jim's Engine Decals
Yes... it's possible. As highly unlikely as it is, it is possible.
Still looks kind of sketchy to me. Looking at the seller's other items, it doesn't look on the surface like this is an ebay seller who's in the business of refurbishing tools.
Might have just been a super-lucky find, but it's just a bit too clean.
Yes... it's possible. As highly unlikely as it is, it is possible.
Still looks kind of sketchy to me. Looking at the seller's other items, it doesn't look on the surface like this is an ebay seller who's in the business of refurbishing tools.
Might have just been a super-lucky find, but it's just a bit too clean.
thehorse13
Well-known member
I looked closely at all of the photos. I'm almost certain that the decal is real. I've looked at so many Blackhawk water decals, I can spot a Jim's Engine vinyl or any other repop a mile away.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
^ Agreed. I went and looked and edited shortly after I posted.
thehorse13
Well-known member
I was also going to say that I second your theory about how this mixed up mash of shiny stuff came to be in this original case. I've seen this countless times with nugget tools and even sets from other manufacturers.
As for the seller, I believe this is yet another case of incorrect valuation based on some random closed auction searches. Surely we would have remembered this thing showing up here for the obligatory, "What's it worth?" thread.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
Funny how the near-perfect shiny tools cast doubt on the originality of the set, being, as 4.c put it, almost 'too clean', too good to be true, and yet the box and decal are in original condition. They don't help it from a traditionalist's perspective and might even hurt it.
It's a very odd case for valuation and interesting to discuss the process of valuation to begin with.
In my opinion, the mint box and decal alone, empty, no tools, might demand ~$100 from the right Blackhawk collector. Someone with a partial set or a near complete set, for example, but a crappy case with a crappy decal or no decal or no case.
Now picture that same case with that same decal showing up with most or even just half those same tools but in decent to even well-worn original satin black finish. We'd be salivating about one of the most well-preserved partial Q.D. sets ever found, and it would be worth a healthy ~$150+ to the right Blackhawk collector.
Heck, I can even see a collector paying ~$150+-ish for that set right now, even with the shiny finish-less tools, thinking they would refinish them with black enamel.
I can even see a certain kind of buyer who doesn't know much of anything about Blackhawk beyond the name or care about the un-original shiny finish or the wrong sockets being attracted to the whole set as is and springing for ~$150+-ish.
But only a collector, Blackhawk or not, with extremely deep 'money is no object' type of pockets would spring for $379. That price would definitely be anomalous spike, not a going rate.
Full admission and reminder that I found a Blackhawk No. 32-CD set at a flea market several years ago. The box had little to no finish left and the sockets were encrusted with box rot. In short, it was far too gone for preserving, but I tricked it out in outlandish fashion instead. Link here:
www.garagejournal.com
I offered it here for a hefty 'just gotta have it' price of $350 and it now resides somewhere out in Colorado. Link here:
www.garagejournal.com
It's a very odd case for valuation and interesting to discuss the process of valuation to begin with.
In my opinion, the mint box and decal alone, empty, no tools, might demand ~$100 from the right Blackhawk collector. Someone with a partial set or a near complete set, for example, but a crappy case with a crappy decal or no decal or no case.
Now picture that same case with that same decal showing up with most or even just half those same tools but in decent to even well-worn original satin black finish. We'd be salivating about one of the most well-preserved partial Q.D. sets ever found, and it would be worth a healthy ~$150+ to the right Blackhawk collector.
Heck, I can even see a collector paying ~$150+-ish for that set right now, even with the shiny finish-less tools, thinking they would refinish them with black enamel.
I can even see a certain kind of buyer who doesn't know much of anything about Blackhawk beyond the name or care about the un-original shiny finish or the wrong sockets being attracted to the whole set as is and springing for ~$150+-ish.
But only a collector, Blackhawk or not, with extremely deep 'money is no object' type of pockets would spring for $379. That price would definitely be anomalous spike, not a going rate.
Full admission and reminder that I found a Blackhawk No. 32-CD set at a flea market several years ago. The box had little to no finish left and the sockets were encrusted with box rot. In short, it was far too gone for preserving, but I tricked it out in outlandish fashion instead. Link here:
Restored "Customized" Blackhawk Q.D. Wrench Set 32-CD (ca. 1930)
Presenting “Black Hills Gold” Source Notes I bought the original set in neglected, rusted, but restorable condition at the Collingwood Flea Market in Collingwood, NJ. It included the “C” type attache-style case, and most of the handles, attachments, and sockets, which were 1/2-inch...
www.garagejournal.com
I offered it here for a hefty 'just gotta have it' price of $350 and it now resides somewhere out in Colorado. Link here:
Tricked-out vintage Blackhawk wrench set
I have to sell off some stuff, starting with a customized OOAK ca. 1930 "Quick Disconnect" era Blackhawk 32-CD wrench set. Here is a link to a GJ thread with plenty of pictures dedicated to its restoration: http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=154765&highlight=Vintage+Blackhawk...
www.garagejournal.com
thehorse13
Well-known member
Lugz, you're as meticulous as I am when it comes to looking at a set like this. I sat here going through all of these points as I contemplated what I would pay, if anything, for this set.Funny how the near-perfect shiny tools cast doubt on the originality of the set, being, as 4.c put it, almost 'too clean', too good to be true, and yet the box and decal are in original condition. They don't help it from a traditionalist's perspective and might even hurt it.
It's a very odd case for valuation and interesting to discuss the process of valuation to begin with.
In my opinion, the mint box and decal alone, empty, no tools, might demand ~$100 from the right Blackhawk collector. Someone with a partial set or a near complete set, for example, but a crappy case with a crappy decal or no decal or no case.
Now picture that same case with that same decal showing up with most or even just half those same tools but in decent to even well-worn original satin black finish. We'd be salivating about one of the most well-preserved partial Q.D. sets ever found, and it would be worth a healthy ~$150+ to the right Blackhawk collector.
Heck, I can even see a collector paying ~$150+-ish for that set right now, even with the shiny finish-less tools, thinking they would refinish them with black enamel.
I can even see a certain kind of buyer who doesn't know much of anything about Blackhawk beyond the name or care about the un-original shiny finish or the wrong sockets being attracted to the whole set as is and springing for ~$150+-ish.
But only a collector, Blackhawk or not, with extremely deep 'money is no object' type of pockets would spring for $379. That price would definitely be anomalous spike, not a going rate.
Full admission and reminder that I found a Blackhawk No. 32-CD set at a flea market several years ago. The box had little to no finish left and the sockets were encrusted with box rot. In short, it was far too gone for preserving, but I tricked it out in outlandish fashion instead. Link here:
Restored "Customized" Blackhawk Q.D. Wrench Set 32-CD (ca. 1930)
Presenting “Black Hills Gold” Source Notes I bought the original set in neglected, rusted, but restorable condition at the Collingwood Flea Market in Collingwood, NJ. It included the “C” type attache-style case, and most of the handles, attachments, and sockets, which were 1/2-inch...
I offered it here for a hefty 'just gotta have it' price of $350 and it now resides somewhere out in Colorado. Link here:
Tricked-out vintage Blackhawk wrench set
I have to sell off some stuff, starting with a customized OOAK ca. 1930 "Quick Disconnect" era Blackhawk 32-CD wrench set. Here is a link to a GJ thread with plenty of pictures dedicated to its restoration: http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=154765&highlight=Vintage+Blackhawk...
Without running another load through the same wash cycle, I would likely stop at 100 bucks for everything as it sits. I will remind everyone that I am a notorious cheapskate and it is very rare that I will wander into lavish spending territory. Well, except this one time when a Blackhawk Red Rover followed me home. lol
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
Oh, I wouldn't even spend that. If I ran into it at the flea market I would probably find myself trying to shell out a few twenties. I'm not any of the notional buyers I characterized above, but I do believe they are out there. Maybe even here on GJ. If it sells, let me know.
four.cycle
Well-known member
Since my last post in this thread five hours ago, six more prospective buyers have added it to their "watch list".
The BOX appears to have a degree of "normal wear and tear" - the rust stains on the inside speak to that. It is inexplicably clean - as though it may have been stored somewhere remote from the tools themselves.
This "set" was cobbled together. The contents do not match the descriptions from the catalogs.
The BOX appears to have a degree of "normal wear and tear" - the rust stains on the inside speak to that. It is inexplicably clean - as though it may have been stored somewhere remote from the tools themselves.
This "set" was cobbled together. The contents do not match the descriptions from the catalogs.
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Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 24).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 23).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 21).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 20).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 19).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 16).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 15).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 1.2 dr SAE socket set (ebay 388129521976 14).jpg -
Blackhawk 32C 32 pc 1.2 dr SAE socket set 1926 Blackhawk catalog pp 15.jpg -
1924 Schafer Co. catalog Blackhawk ad pp 441.jpg
don long
Well-known member
I'd like it just for the case and the Ell tool but not at that crazy price
thehorse13
Well-known member
My approach on this specific overpriced item would be simply to acquire the case but only if I could get everything for 100 bucks or less. The contents would then be liquidated with the goal of getting the case for free or next to free. Unfortunately, this thing will never sell to anyone sane at the current asking price. I also think that the seller is delusional and cannot be cured. She keeps raising and lowering the price in the 400ish zone after starting in the mid 500s.
PS
If I did get the lot for my price I'd of course give the T11 to Don Long. I know he's been after one for as long as I've been chasing missing tools from my Blackhawk merchandiser.
four.cycle
Well-known member
sold for "best offer" this morning:
thehorse13
Well-known member
Ooof. Someone took a bath.
don long
Well-known member
Some body got a nice box!!!
d42jeep
Well-known member
And with a best offer, the actual selling price is unknown. 
These little guys were found inside a Craftsman Crown set at a recent estate sale.
-Don
These little guys were found inside a Craftsman Crown set at a recent estate sale.
-Don
four.cycle
Well-known member
exactly.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
True, but priced at $379, I wouldn't expect them to accept a low ball. If I had that kind of interest, and I wanted to spend that kind of money, I would've offered $250, hoping they'd see some light, and if they balked, $300. But I can't see the seller letting it go for much less than $250 with that kind of asking price. This is all speculation, obviously.
four.cycle
Well-known member
^ Clearly no GarageJournal.com member who is reading this thread bought it. 
On the other hand.... ebay buyers are a screwy lot.... you just never know what they might do.
On the other hand.... ebay buyers are a screwy lot.... you just never know what they might do.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
Probably not. Unless @don long was being cheeky sneaky.
If you had written...
I would tend to agree.
But, if you had written...
I would disagree. There are a few big spenders on here. One in particular, who has the largest collection I have ever seen photos of, is a flat out buyer. He doesn't pinch pennies. And if he looked at it like I looked at it, i.e., best case and decal we have ever seen, valued at least at $150+, $100 more to get to 250+ does not at all seem like the kind of stupid money to lose sleep over. Or maybe the mainly lurker in Colorado who plopped down $350 for my "Black Hills Gold" set bought it. He didn't seem to mind, either.
I would still not consider those going rates, but I am not as quick as some to classify these kinds of buys as "crazy," either.
Hello,
so I have this Blackhawk wheel aligment machine, but the thing is I cannot find anything about it online, I looked everywhere but I haven't found at least one image of this machine. I know the big thing is for showing and the small one is for measuring on the wheel. The only other electric thing I found online from Blackhawk was ignition system tester in persian language. First, I want to ask if anybody has ever seen this and if so, if you don't have any documents for it or at least some other pictures? Lastly on the image of the socket, I want to ask if you know what type of socket it is? The white one looks like italian socket but the black one is for connecting to the machine for the other side of the car and the second machine has only the same black one, but I couldnt find any cable that would look like this on the internet. Thanks for all replies.
so I have this Blackhawk wheel aligment machine, but the thing is I cannot find anything about it online, I looked everywhere but I haven't found at least one image of this machine. I know the big thing is for showing and the small one is for measuring on the wheel. The only other electric thing I found online from Blackhawk was ignition system tester in persian language. First, I want to ask if anybody has ever seen this and if so, if you don't have any documents for it or at least some other pictures? Lastly on the image of the socket, I want to ask if you know what type of socket it is? The white one looks like italian socket but the black one is for connecting to the machine for the other side of the car and the second machine has only the same black one, but I couldnt find any cable that would look like this on the internet. Thanks for all replies.
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Smokeshow69
Well-known member
I agree with your comments as well! There are a lot of high level collectors who wouldn’t blink an eye at this price and who don’t post on here very often if at all. I casually rub elbows with petrolina collectors on another forum and those dudes will pay thousands of dollars for signs and other big time collectibles related to their pursuits so an over priced socket set that is in nice condition is mere pocket change for them. To each their own… I wouldn’t pay this amount for this socket set but if I was to say find a rare piece of plomb or Proto, would I???Probably not. Unless @don long was being cheeky sneaky.
If you had written...
I would tend to agree.
But, if you had written...
I would disagree. There are a few big spenders on here. One in particular, who has the largest collection I have ever seen photos of, is a flat out buyer. He doesn't pinch pennies. And if he looked at it like I looked at it, i.e., best case and decal we have ever seen, valued at least at $150+, $100 more to get to 250+ does not at all seem like the kind of stupid money to lose sleep over. Or maybe the mainly lurker in Colorado who plopped down $350 for my "Black Hills Gold" set bought it. He didn't seem to mind, either.
I would still not consider those going rates, but I am not as quick as some to classify these kinds of buys as "crazy," either.
y'sguy
Well-known member
So, even tho I follow this thread with interest. I am not a collector. I would still like to know the outcome of the originality and (if) modification of the set recently sold on EBAY. All I read was conjecture. Was it genuine, restored missing stuff, or repainted? I just wanted to know the conditions and if it was authentic.
thehorse13
Well-known member
The box itself is legit and original. The tool set is not original to the box, and someone decided to remove all of the black paint from the tools.
don long
Well-known member
Rest assured guys. I did not make that purchase. I already have a a 32C and a 32CD set
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
I've said it before in opposition in pricing discussions here before, and I'll say it again. The instinct as buyers to hold prices down is counter-intuitive to the hobby. Of course everyone wants to buy low - typically in uninformed markets, where buyers know something sellers don't, such as garage sales, estate sales, fleas. But in informed markets, we want to sell high, whether we're actually selling or not. Who wants their collection to be of low value? There's a switch in my head that goes from tool scrounger and tool hound, when I am looking, to curator, when I am showing and telling - and eventually, selling.
Not to be picky, but we don't know that's true. Most of the sockets are incorrect, as I first pointed out, but the 911X ratchet, 610 speeder, 500 brace, 3310 tee-handle, T10 and T60 extensions, 110X Ell handle, 128 and 130 spark plug sockets, T2 uni joint (or one of them, anyway), T11 valve lapper (or one of them, anyway) all belong to No. 32 (C, and CD) sets, and could all be original. The No. 32 (C and CD) sets changed from mid 1920's to 1931, dropping some things (e.g., T15 half speeder), but adding others. Seller said it was found like this at an estate sale. The presence of two each T2's and T11's jibes jibes with the idea I originally suggested, that the PO had at least a partial set and was collecting the rest over the years, including a couple extras. It's unfortunate that he seemed to be interested in the set, and was determined to complete it, but was less than scrupulous about the socket configurations and the finish. That could be ameliorated with 6-pointers and, as I suggested, some black enamel.
thehorse13
Well-known member
I would have loved to have the box given the original shape but it was priced way outside of the realm of reason for me. Very likely it's part of a garage jewelry display where the buyer doesn't care about the 100% completeness or destroyed finish of the tools that are with the box.
Yea, I know that some are correct and when I say correct, I'm simply pointing to the known configurations we see in the catalogs. I'm aware that things didn't always follow what we see listed.
Private Lugnutz
Well-known member
Almost everything is correct except the double hex socketry. But yes, buyer either wanted just the near perfect box and decal, or is less than strict about the finish, or may even like the look of the bright polished tools in the black box, irrespective of original specs. If I forget I know the original finish, or I put myself in the place of a collector who cares less about that, it is a very attractive toolset. The tools really pop against the black.
thehorse13
Well-known member
All we have to do now is wait for the GJ member who made the purchase to fess up.
Smokeshow69
Well-known member
It must have been OTGAll we have to do now is wait for the GJ member who made the purchase to fess up.
d42jeep
Well-known member
This New Britain looking Blackhawk 1/4” drive ratchet came in a S-K set yesterday. Does anyone collect Blackhawk tools of this vintage?
-Don
-Don
bmwrd0
Well-known member
It might be of greater interest in this thread, Don:
www.garagejournal.com
Blackhawk New Britain Ratchet Timeline
I posted this under both “General Tool Discussion” as well as “Vintage Tool Discussion” to try to reach as many of you as I could. I’m on a quest to find some information that I hope someone here can provide. I have a set of New Britain Blackhawk ratchets that I’m trying to pin down a...
www.garagejournal.com
d42jeep
Well-known member
Thanks! Good idea.
-Don
-Don
Oldtuleguy
Well-known member
- Joined
- Nov 4, 2017
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No I have several alreadyIt must have been OTG
Blackhawkfan
Active member
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- Dec 17, 2023
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What I sometimes do when I find ridiculously overpriced items, I make an ridiculous underrated offer... 