Tools from the old world

[paslemeilleur]

 

[Monte]

Gedore DIN 894 wrenches in 22mm + 24mm

 

[Monte]

Bessey Classix F-clamps 160x80mm

 

[paslemeilleur]

 

[Lasu]

Blow gun + 1x with a long tube.

 

[Model A Fan]

Gedore DIN 894 wrenches in 22mm + 24mm

Is it considered cheating if you LIVE in the old world?

I was amazed at the cost of German tools in Germany...much cheaper than having to get them in the US (obviously). But they were quite reasonably priced.

 

[dutchgray]

That Hultafors pry bar is the best tool to remove nailed on back panels from flat pack cabinets like IKEA PAX.

Unfortunately they are not very durable if you put them under any real load, you can permanently deform them very easily.

The full size version snapped across the nail pulling hole on me.

 

[Nobody-named-Olli]

I think that‘s an issue with most, if not all, of the flat stock type pry bars. I have a Stanley “WonderBar” that flexes an awful lot under heavy load. That’s why I have classic hex stock pry bars as well.

That little Hultafors will never see such loads.

Kind regards,
Olli

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

Is it considered cheating if you LIVE in the old world?

I think the difficulty level for obtaining old world tools (except for the big name brands) probably goes something like this.

1. In Germany
2. In the big EU countries
3. In the other EU countries
4. USA (because you're a big market)
5. UK (small market, trade impediments)

 

[KnurledNut]

I always thought of dogbone wrenches as being gimmicky but I found this Witherby intriguing and couldn't pass it up for $2.00.
It has a deep offset profile that when combined with the flex makes its quite functional.
The thick H-shaped beam with interrupted high-polished web is very substantial and feels great to hold.
I've already used it to get at a bolt on my bench grinder tool rest that's in an awkward location while I was cleaning this thing up.
Interestingly its fractional, not metric.
Raised lettering on the beam state Drop Forged and Germany on the front and a manufacturing code on the back.
The center web is cleanly stamped with the name and model on the front and the 4 sizes corresponding to each side on the back.
Wave spring washers on both sides of each head provide swivel tension.
Sizes: 7/16, 1/2, 9/16, 19/32 & 5/8, 11/16, 3/4, 7/8.
10-3/4" OAL.

 

[Qualitytools]

I always thought of dogbone wrenches as being gimmicky but I found this Witherby intriguing and couldn't pass it up for $2.00.
It has a deep offset profile that when combined with the flex makes its quite functional.
The thick H-shaped beam with interrupted high-polished web is very substantial and feels great to hold.
I've already used it to get at a bolt on my bench grinder tool rest that's in an awkward location while I was cleaning this thing up.
Interestingly its fractional, not metric.
Raised lettering on the beam state Drop Forged and Germany on the front and a manufacturing code on the back.
The center web is cleanly stamped with the name and model on the front and the 4 sizes corresponding to each side on the back.
Wave spring washers on both sides of each head provide swivel tension.
Sizes: 7/16, 1/2, 9/16, 19/32 & 5/8, 11/16, 3/4, 7/8.
10-3/4" OAL.

I like it, it doesn’t appear to be bulky like others I have seen and the fact that it has a slight bend is a plus. Thanks for sharing.

 

[four.cycle]

@KnurledNut - Witherby was the name of an importer out of Trumbull, Connecticut - they imported and put their name on all manner of tools from Germany, Britain, and elsewhere.

 

[silkman]

I think the difficulty level for obtaining old world tools (except for the big name brands) probably goes something like this.

1. In Germany
2. In the big EU countries
3. In the other EU countries
4. USA (because you're a big market)
5. UK (small market, trade impediments)

Exactly.

I'm in 3. right now, the "others". Most of the prices I see on idealo I can't get because most German online shops wont ship outside Germany, or will ship to 2. only. Or they will charge 30-45eur shipping to 3. that makes it prohibitive to buy 1-2 tools.

Eg, no PB Swiss or Stahlwille for me. There are local reps in Greece that sell x3 the idealo price and carry no stock, you have to order what you want and they'll have it in 3 months.

I think it comes down to hidden agreements (the sort that Philips pioneered a century ago) between companies, distributors (yes, we still have these) and shops. Eg, SBD will say to Amazon de, you can put that Dewalt combo on sale but you won't ship to SE European countries. 2-3 years ago Dewalt power tools used to be half price in Bulgaria than Greece, don't know if that's still the case.

Yup, Europe is different from the USA.

 

[dutchgray]

I think that‘s an issue with most, if not all, of the flat stock type pry bars. I have a Stanley “WonderBar” that flexes an awful lot under heavy load. That’s why I have classic hex stock pry bars as well.

That little Hultafors will never see such loads.

Kind regards,
Olli

I didn't mean flex, I meant permanent bending.
Of the full sized flat bars, the only ones that have held up have been Vaughan.
I have tried (or people I work with have tried), Hultafors, Roughneck, Estwing, Stanley, all those are not good enough.

I should dig out my small hultafors bar and photograph how bent the end is, done with one handed use only, it was really not very strong at all.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

most German online shops wont ship outside Germany, or will ship to 2. only. Or they will charge 30-45eur shipping to 3. that makes it prohibitive to buy 1-2 tools.

Interesting. No trade impediments, just retailers' choice. Maybe I should reorder my list to put USA one higher.

Eg, no PB Swiss or Stahlwille for me. There are local reps in Greece that sell x3 the idealo price and carry no stock, you have to order what you want and they'll have it in 3 months.

In my country we also suffer inflated pricing, even for big brands supplied by many retailers. Less mainstream brands will often only have 1-2 retailers. Because importing things yourself can be a hassle or risky, they can lift the prices. On a recent order I saved 35% by buying direct from Amazon Germany, that's after paying for postage too.

 

[epiphany]

I think the difficulty level for obtaining old world tools (except for the big name brands) probably goes something like this.

1. In Germany
2. In the big EU countries
3. In the other EU countries
4. USA (because you're a big market)
5. UK (small market, trade impediments)

Even in germany you need to order most of the stuff from the internet.

The big brands ( Stahlwille, Hazet, Gedore ) are not available in the big hardware store chains. Most hardware stores have their own brand or use one or two different brands of average quality. For example BAUHAUS is selling their own brand WISENT and MATADOR stuff. Most of the MATADOR stuff is not M.i.G. anymore. OBI is selling their own brand LUX and PROXXON. TOOM is selling their own brand TOOM and PROXXON. HAGEBAU is selling their own brand CONNEX and PROXXON. They often have a cheap third line. Sometimes the hardware stores rebrand stuff. For example OBI is selling pliers from NWS rebranded as LUX PRO tools. One, just one out of five BAUHAUS stores is selling HAZET torque wrenches. They even have iFixit stuff. Two brand exceptions are WERA and KNIPEX. You can nearly buy WERA or KNIPEX everywhere, sometimes more of the whole range, sometimes less. Can't even remember when WERA became so popular here. If you want to buy a KNIPEX TwinGrip plier, it's only possible @ OBI, all other stores don't have them.

Smaller hardware stores for professionals sell the big brands, but the prices are horrible.

 

[Nobody-named-Olli]

I didn't mean flex, I meant permanent bending.
Of the full sized flat bars, the only ones that have held up have been Vaughan.
I have tried (or people I work with have tried), Hultafors, Roughneck, Estwing, Stanley, all those are not good enough.

I should dig out my small hultafors bar and photograph how bent the end is, done with one handed use only, it was really not very strong at all.

No need for a picture, I believe you when you say so!

We’ll see how it goes for me.

Kind regards,
Olli

 

[Nobody-named-Olli]

For “in-store” shopping experience in Germany (NRW) I recommend https://www.tbs-aachen.de/

Stahlwille, Gedore & Hazet on display. Also gas & dry ice available.

For me it’s too far for regular quick trips, but the last time I was there it was an all-round pleasant experience with a lot of Stahlwille, Gedore & Hazet available/ on display. + Aachen‘s old town is always worth a visit.


And in the south/ greater Nuremberg area (Bavaria): https://www.dorner-gmbh.de/

Highly, highly recommended. Hand tool focus is on Gedore, Knipex, (…) (Hazet, Stahlwille not so much, but still possible to order.) Besides that, steel stockist, woodworking and metal working machinery. Stihl dealer. Bosch, Duss, (…) again, highly, highly recommended, can’t praise them enough!

Kind regards,
Olli

 

[Monte]

Is it considered cheating if you LIVE in the old world?

maybe a little bit



Kungs motorists snow shovel

 

[epiphany]

Used my ice scraper to remove a big pile of snow in front of my car, was probably a hilarious scene for those that drove by.


Here are some rebranded items from big hardware store chains.

LUX Tools mechanic's nippers ( NWS )


WISENT ratcheting screwdriver ( FELO )

No COO on the package or the screwdriver. Homepage says it's from germany. All bits are marked with *Germany*.

Compared to the previous design, they really improved this. The bitholder cap don't open to easy anymore, switching the direction is way easier with the big switch and the ratcheting mechanism feels better. Downside, it's more difficult to take out the bits now, there is one or more magnets holding the bits in place and the cap don't open really much. Here is a picture of the old design...


WISENT VDE screwdrivers ( FELO )

Funny again, no COO on the package, but the screwdrivers are marked.

Don't ask me why i did buy this. Still need to test it...

 

[epiphany]

Here is a maybe not so fair price comparison between different sellers...

Hardware store ( without a big chain in the background ) 106,48 + 19% consumption tax = 126,71 Euro


Hardware store ( with a big chain in the background ) 59 Euro


Amazon 48,90 Euro

 

[Monte]

Amazon often is not the cheapest. OK you have to add shipping (4,90€) to this offer but if you buy several items from that store it might be cheaper (free shipping for orders over 75€) in the end since Amazon has the shipping built into the price.

 

[Monte]

Stahlwille bottle opener

 

[Monte]

Meister chalk line reel




Most likely Spain:

30m

SOLUTION PUSH System: Allows the line to be removed quickly without turning the handle. ANCHORAGE: Hardened hook with bent tips: Offers the possibility of being nailed to edges. USEFFITTINGTank for

zententools.com

 

[lu787a]

Does anyone have the PB Swiss 605.2? I'm interested in the dimensions of the bend. I can only find overall length.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

PB Swiss 605.2? I'm interested in the dimensions of the bend

I make it 34mm based on scale measurement on the image, relative to the 125mm length.

 

[Monte]

Ruko step drill bit 20-30mm

 

[jimf]

Does anyone have the PB Swiss 605.2? I'm interested in the dimensions of the bend. I can only find overall length.

PB Swiss 605.2: Bend = 1.3525 in (34.35 mm)

605.1, 605.2 and 605.3 shown for reference.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

I believe those in the Philips are unusual in having the same driver both ends, offset by 45 degrees.

 

[YesIHaveAHammer]

Flexible shaft nut drivers comparison

I bought the Wera 391 7mm for hose clamp use, and found it not actually very flexible. So I bought another two German/Europe made models to compare. I've only used the spring shaft type previously.




Wiha SoftFinish 372 (01438)


Stahlwille 12506 7


I wasn't able to source the Felo Ergonic 429 070 40 in my country. I like the handles, but the flexible portion of the shaft looks concerningly short. So no further comment about this one.

All the shafts are externally a ~9mm hard flexible plastic. There is no lack of nor noticeable difference in torsional rigidity in use. The Wera and Stahlwille have a fine coiled appearance and texture, suggesting a wire underneath. Deviation at the tip possible from straight ahead before significant resistance is encountered:

1. Stahlwille - 87mm
2. Wera - 69mm
3. Wiha - 50mm

The stiffness within the movement range goes in the same order, with the Stahlwille being significantly easier to bend. This was at in house room temperature, but I don't believe it's the plastic giving the rigidity so this wouldn't matter. Interestingly, the Wera 393 S flexible bit driver has the same flexibility as the Stahlwille, despite having the same measurements as the Wera nut driver here. The lengths of the flexible portion of the shafts are Wera and Stahlwille 117mm, Wiha 98mm.

The outer diameter of the sockets is 11mm on all. The Wera's full internal depth of 10.8mm is hex shaped. The Wiha has 8mm of hex depth and a total depth of 14.5mm. The Stahlwille has 5.7mm and 14.5mm respectively. I can't see any of this making any difference in use.

The internal width of the sockets are Wera 7.06mm, Wiha 7.15mm, Stahlwille 7.04mm. Fit on fasteners wasn't noticeably different initially, but revisiting and comparing side by side after taking those measurements, the Wiha does have a little bit more play.

Usual comments about the handles. The Wiha and Stahlwille are similar sized and rubbery, the Wera is a little small (but perfectly adequate for this size of driver) and mostly hard. End markings on the Wera are very good, Wiha good, Stahlwille quite poor. They're all also marked on the socket, Wiha good, and the others fair. Varying anti-rollaway design, some of them probably work better.

Overall for my envisaged use and personal preference, the Stahlwille wins. If you don't need to maximise flexibility, I think you'd be happy with any of them. If you had a couple or a set stored together, you might want want the Wera or Wiha for the better markings.

 

[Monte]

Wiha crimping tool for closed barrel ring terminals

 

[Monte]

Bayha scalpel

 

[Monte]

Autosol cleaning and polishing "tools"

 

[Monte]

Roth Lange (Jokari) cable knive + wire stripper

 

[superautobacs]

Habero club hammer and Beta cold chisel.

(Why cant I attach more than one photo using GJ on my mobile phone!?)

 

[genog]

I have a useful pair of Goldenberg nippers
....made in France

 

[DAustin]

Does anyone know if Stahlwille put out a catalog for VW Type 1 Beetle tools like Hazet did?

 

[littlebean]

Does anyone know if Stahlwille put out a catalog for VW Type 1 Beetle tools like Hazet did?

I hadn't even thought to ask this, glad someone else did

 

[DAustin]

I hadn't even thought to ask this, glad someone else did

I found this so far

TheSamba.com :: Accessories/Memorabilia/Toys - View topic - Stahlwille Tool General Thread

Classified ads, photos, shows, links, forums, and technical information for the Volkswagen automobile

www.thesamba.com

 

[silkman]

Roth Lange (Jokari) cable knive + wire stripper

Monte, you think the Knipex ergostrip tool is made by Jokari? It looks very similar