Tools from the old world

[CanUK]

Although I haven't used it, the metabo drill driver looks a bit gimmicky to me.

Personally I would not use a drill/driver to drive screws in when I have an impact driver to hand. Also, once you get the feel for an impact driver you really don't need any torque control (anything expensive or brittle I would tend tend to finish off with a hand screwdriver anyway).

Would you really use the angle attachment feature or is it just a filler?

I noticed that a makita 10.8 volt set with a drill driver and impact driver can be had for under £150 with no silly extras. I haven't looked at specs or reviews, but if it was the better drill, it would be the one I would choose.


Or, for a tad more you could get http://www.toolstop.co.uk/makita-dk18027-18v-lxt-lithium-ion-6-piece-cordless-kit-3-x-3ah-batteries-p59601 ?

(but I may be slightly biased towards Makita)

Do you mean this kit?

http://www.screwfix.com/p/makita-10...d090d-impact-driver-exclusive-twin-pack/64833

First things that jump out at me with the Makita are:

- 1.3AH batteries (vs 1.5AH)
- 50 minute charge time (almost double).
- Less torque; 24Nm and 90Nm (vs 28Nm and 105Nm)

So lets assume I can find it at the same price, and ignoring the free extras with the Metabo (torch and angle attachment), what am I missing from the equation to sway me towards Makita?

Angle attachment (and probably the torch) might not get used often, but probably one of those things you're happy to have when you need it. And if I only had the tools I needed all the time I probably wouldn't be on this forum

 

[N.I.]

Do you mean this kit?

http://www.screwfix.com/p/makita-10...d090d-impact-driver-exclusive-twin-pack/64833

First things that jump out at me with the Makita are:

- 1.3AH batteries (vs 1.5AH)
- 50 minute charge time (almost double).
- Less torque; 24Nm and 90Nm (vs 28Nm and 105Nm)

So lets assume I can find it at the same price, and ignoring the free extras with the Metabo (torch and angle attachment), what am I missing from the equation to sway me towards Makita?

Angle attachment (and probably the torch) might not get used often, but probably one of those things you're happy to have when you need it. And if I only had the tools I needed all the time I probably wouldn't be on this forum

I looked at http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Makita-LCT204W-10-8v-LITHIUM-ION-LI-ION-Impact-Driver-/150497446164?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item230a58c914 (and if you like pink it can be had for £135 all in).

As I said before, I didn't take the time to compare specs (left that to you), and am simply giving you another angle to look at it.

Do take the quoted specs with a pinch of salt and also look closely at reviews (the makita gets fantastic reviews on Amazon).
There may be differences in quality of the bearings, brushes, the quality of the chuck and the hammer mechanism - things that effect long term life.
Also look at the cost of replacements and addons. Allow 3 years for the life of a li-ion battery.
Makita generally do not have class leading specs in their cordless line up and seem to focus more on ergonomics and power to weight ratio.

I have had good luck with Makita and Bosch tools over the years and would be slightly biased towards them. I have no experience with Metabo.

Having said all that, the 50 minute charge time is a bit of a deal killer for this range.

 

[CanUK]

I looked at http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Makita-LCT204W-10-8v-LITHIUM-ION-LI-ION-Impact-Driver-/150497446164?pt=UK_Home_Garden_PowerTools_SM&hash=item230a58c914 (and if you like pink it can be had for £135 all in).

As I said before, I didn't take the time to compare specs (left that to you), and am simply giving you another angle to look at it.

Do take the quoted specs with a pinch of salt and also look closely at reviews (the makita gets fantastic reviews on Amazon).
There may be differences in quality of the bearings, brushes, the quality of the chuck and the hammer mechanism - things that effect long term life.
Also look at the cost of replacements and addons. Allow 3 years for the life of a li-ion battery.
Makita generally do not have class leading specs in their cordless line up and seem to focus more on ergonomics and power to weight ratio.

I have had good luck with Makita and Bosch tools over the years and would be slightly biased towards them. I have no experience with Metabo.

Having said all that, the 50 minute charge time is a bit of a deal killer for this range.

Good info thanks!

I've got a couple of Metabo corded drills, an electric die grinder, and a couple of 4.5" angle grinders. I'm really happy with them, so I'm still leaning towards the Metabo kit, but you've given me some more things to consider.

 

[Mitkoasd]

Hey guys greetings from Bulgaria! What you'll say about this tool brand http://www.stahlmayer.de/ I've never heard it before and now i have a offer for this ratchet http://prodavalnik.com/treschotka-schalmaer-i16071849 for 30 euro.

 

[Blöckw@rt]

Looks like typical/ordinary Taiwan stuff….

 

[Hawk321]

Hey guys greetings from Bulgaria! What you'll say about this tool brand http://www.stahlmayer.de/ I've never heard it before and now i have a offer for this ratchet http://prodavalnik.com/treschotka-schalmaer-i16071849 for 30 euro.

Typicall china stuff...not worth the money. Don't like companies who try to fool people with the name
Stahlmayer

sounds like

Stahlwille


@Meskin

Great ratchet...1:1 Stahlwille, except the handle...but to be honest, I like that Garant handle more.
How much have you paid for?

 

[Miskin]

Mitsubishi and Wiha
Mitsubishi Drilling System
View media item 28911with Wiha Torx driver
View media item 28912...and the usual trick...
View media item 28914Wiha is the most common companion of Mitsubishi Drilling Systems. Also Wera "borrows" some Torx drivers to the Japanese. Never seen a Japanese Torx driver inside a Mitsubishi box.

 

[mfredom]

Hello,
I bought this box spanner on ebay

View media item 28974
Stahlwille made in France ? or fake ?

 

[CanUK]

Hello,
I bought this box spanner on ebay

...

Stahlwille made in France ? or fake ?

That's interesting. I would have said an older rebranded Facom maybe, but the shape isn't quite right I don't think. Maybe by SAM or one of the others?

I'd be surprised if it was fake though; Seems like a lot of trouble to go to, to fake a tool and get the country obviously wrong. Does it appear to be good quality?

 

[mfredom]

Yes, it has good quality.
i found 2 other brand : kstools and stanley and certainly other.

View media item 28976View media item 28975
Thanks.

 

[Monte]

All that for £150. Would be general household/home-garage use and the odd project (build a shed, a little decking etc). I've got several corded drills and a pillar drill so I don't think I need anything too serious or expensive, and compact is nice.

Anyone have experience with this kit? Any suggestions for something comparable for similar (or less) money?

if you need/want the angle attachment you won´t find anything cheaper....a set with a angle drill/driver will cost more...and the angle attachments which can be inserted in the chuck are worthless...

did you check them out in a store ?

Angle attachment (and probably the torch) might not get used often, but probably one of those things you're happy to have when you need it. And if I only had the tools I needed all the time I probably wouldn't be on this forum

- a torch is always necessary.....
- angle attachment comes in handy more often if you have one....
- 4.0 AH battery available from Metabo
- Metabo: 3 years warranty on battery too !!

(the makita gets fantastic reviews on Amazon).

there are many reviews like this: "i just received this tool today and its the best and longest lasting tool in the world !" ....

Hey guys greetings from Bulgaria! What you'll say about this tool brand http://www.stahlmayer.de/ I've never heard it before and now i have a offer for this ratchet http://prodavalnik.com/treschotka-schalmaer-i16071849 for 30 euro.

Looks like the standard BGS Technic, SW-Stahl or Wisent tools.....








Wiha ball end torx bits

 

[willhollin]

Fellas,

I'm considering buying the Metabo Max12 10.8V combo kit:

- PowerMaxx maX 12 Li PRO Drill/Driver
- PowerImpact maX 12 Li Impact Driver
- PowerLED maX 12 Li Work Light
- Chuck
- Angle attachment
- LC 40 Charger
- Heavy Duty Tool case
- 2 x 1.5 Ah Li-ion maX 12 Batteries

All that for £150. Would be general household/home-garage use and the odd project (build a shed, a little decking etc). I've got several corded drills and a pillar drill so I don't think I need anything too serious or expensive, and compact is nice.

Anyone have experience with this kit? Any suggestions for something comparable for similar (or less) money?

I briefly owned the same kit not so long ago, it was my first purchase of one of these small voltage compact kits. The problem I found was the large grip didn't suit my hands and soon ached after moderate use. I would consider the Dewalt kit if I was to purchase another one...

I'd rather have a compact 18v from someone like Makita.

 

[N.I.]

there are many reviews like this: "i just received this tool today and its the best and longest lasting tool in the world !" ....


]

Haha.

Although to be fair it is quite surprising that there are no negative reviews yet. Generally people are quicker to moan about a product than to praise one.
And if you look on Amazon.com, where there are 121 reviews, the negatives are compaining about it being defective out of the box or receiving a used/ returned item rather than a new one.

Honestly I am more surprised you haven't suggested Festool yet!

 

[CanUK]

if you need/want the angle attachment you won´t find anything cheaper....a set with a angle drill/driver will cost more...and the angle attachments which can be inserted in the chuck are worthless...

did you check them out in a store ?

Unfortunately there's not much in my area for tool stores. The only place nearby I've seen a Metabo tool for sale is Costco.

Have you seen or used one that you could comment on your impressions?

- a torch is always necessary.....

Agreed, and I have an amazing little Princeton Tec that has followed me up mountains, diving, on sea rescue operations, backpacking, sailing passages and racing, and occasionally into the garage

- angle attachment comes in handy more often if you have one....

Watch this space for a new kitchen (kidding).

- 4.0 AH battery available from Metabo

I saw that, and was tempted, but for the way I'd be using it I think for my £150 it would be better to get two tools with 1.5AH batteries than one tool with 4.0AH.

I've looked though to see if the 4AH battery can be retrofit, but can't find any info on that. Do you hapen to know?

there are many reviews like this: "i just received this tool today and its the best and longest lasting tool in the world !" ....

What's the problem there?

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/ZXN6tgE4g_4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

 

[CanUK]

I briefly owned the same kit not so long ago, it was my first purchase of one of these small voltage compact kits. The problem I found was the large grip didn't suit my hands and soon ached after moderate use. I would consider the Dewalt kit if I was to purchase another one...

I'd rather have a compact 18v from someone like Makita.

Hi Will,

Any particular reason why the Dewalt offering, or is it just the ergonomics? I have reasonably large mitts so that alone is probably not a concern for me.

How did you feel about the quality and functionality of it in general?

I'm leaning away from 18V for now because I think it's overkill for me. I'm not going to be using it on jobsites, and I have corded drills, hammer drills, screwdrivers, and a monster Meddings pillar drill, so I'm not stuck if I need a bit more grunt. I'm liking the idea of the smaller size for small/awkward spaces or overhead work etc.

 

[shoturtle]

There are time that you want to use a drill driver over an impact driver. On trim panel and soft wood impack can crack the wood. Right tool for the right job.

But the fit and build of the metabo is first rate. I was considering it before i pick up my 12v bosch.

 

[CanUK]

There are time that you want to use a drill driver over an impact driver. On trim panel and soft wood impack can crack the wood. Right tool for the right job.

But the fit and build of the metabo is first rate. I was considering it before i pick up my 12v bosch.

Ok cheers. I'm going to sleep on it and see if I'm still as eager tomorrow.

 

[JackB]

Why can't people stop posting **** made in Taiwan ??
General comment, not anything to to with the previous post..

 

[William Payne]

Why can't people stop posting **** made in Taiwan ??
General comment, not anything to to with the previous post..

I think asia geographically is part of the old world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_World

 

[willhollin]

Hi Will,

Any particular reason why the Dewalt offering, or is it just the ergonomics? I have reasonably large mitts so that alone is probably not a concern for me.

How did you feel about the quality and functionality of it in general?

I'm leaning away from 18V for now because I think it's overkill for me. I'm not going to be using it on jobsites, and I have corded drills, hammer drills, screwdrivers, and a monster Meddings pillar drill, so I'm not stuck if I need a bit more grunt. I'm liking the idea of the smaller size for small/awkward spaces or overhead work etc.

For me it was the ergonomics yes, but the fit and finish was good. The reason for the Dewalt was purely down to grip size and balance of tool with the battery at the bottom, there is also the Hitachi kit in that size too.

 

[CanUK]

Why can't people stop posting **** made in Taiwan ??
General comment, not anything to to with the previous post..

I think asia geographically is part of the old world.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_World

Just to add to what William has rightly said; One of the elements that has made this thread great is that, while there is certainly a preference of interest in European-made tools, there has also been a fantastic amount of tolerance and objectivity when discussing tools made in Asian (and other non-European) countries.

 

[CanUK]

For me it was the ergonomics yes, but the fit and finish was good. The reason for the Dewalt was purely down to grip size and balance of tool with the battery at the bottom, there is also the Hitachi kit in that size too.

Thanks Will

 

[Alx]

WOW, great promotional pictures, and best of luck in your new business venture, Alx!

For international customers looking to purchase Hazet tools, where do you fit into the picture? For a North American customer, how different is it to purchase from you versus others? Maybe this isn't an easy question to answer....

Thanks and sorry for the late reply! I will get back to you on this in a moment.

 

[Alx]

Since the novelty of having a good camera on me has not yet worn off, I was taking some photos of Hazet 600N and decided to throw Snap On spanner in the works (pun intended). Here's very amicable, non-scientific mini photoshoot of the World's Best Spanner and Snap On ;-)

 

[Hawk321]

Haha.

Although to be fair it is quite surprising that there are no negative reviews yet. Generally people are quicker to moan about a product than to praise one.
And if you look on Amazon.com, where there are 121 reviews, the negatives are compaining about it being defective out of the box or receiving a used/ returned item rather than a new one.

Honestly I am more surprised you haven't suggested Festool yet!

Hehe...I moan the whole time...because I'm german.

 

[CanUK]

Since the novelty of having a good camera on me has not yet worn off, I was taking some photos of Hazet 600N and decided to throw Snap On spanner in the works (pun intended). Here's very amicable, non-scientific mini photoshoot of the World's Best Spanner and Snap On ;-)

Amazing pohtos Alx. I'm a bit embarrassed by my own efforts now

I've seen both those spanners before of course, but one thing I hadn't picked up on before is that SO bend the beam to achieve and angle at the ring end. No comments on wheter that's actualy good or bad, but it seems like an afterthought.

Also impressive how much thinner the Hazet open end is, although I think in the German magazine test the Hazet 13mm actually measured thicker than the SO at the open end. Was it a different model Hazet in the test, has one of the companies altered the design, or is it specific to the smaller sizes I wonder?

 

[Alx]

For international customers looking to purchase Hazet tools, where do you fit into the picture? For a North American customer, how different is it to purchase from you versus others? Maybe this isn't an easy question to answer....

The main difference to others is that tools is an extension to my main business that has been successfully delivering mission critical parts to customer across the globe for the last 8 years. I do aggressive pricing, have a working business as a back up and stand behind all products I supply. Try me

 

[Alx]

Amazing pohtos Alx. I'm a bit embarrassed by my own efforts now

I've seen both those spanners before of course, but one thing I hadn't picked up on before is that SO bend the beam to achieve and angle at the ring end. No comments on wheter that's actualy good or bad, but it seems like an afterthought.

Also impressive how much thinner the Hazet open end is, although I think in the German magazine test the Hazet 13mm actually measured thicker than the SO at the open end. Was it a different model Hazet in the test, has one of the companies altered the design, or is it specific to the smaller sizes I wonder?

Thanks! Amazing what camera and lightbox can do! LOL

I've checked open ends of the rest of them and Snap On is actually thicker than Hazet from 13mm onwards. I don't have all SO sizes to compare but 14, 15, 17 and 19mm are all visibly thicker than their Hazet counterparts. Hazet has thinner box-end as well on all spanners throughout the range.

Personally I prefer Hazet's "I" profile to Snap On's almost sword-like handle. The finish on SO is not perfect either: the handle is actually wavy on the edges from all the information pressed on it - size, part number, SO logo - something you don't get with Hazet.

And then there's price... 10-piece Snap On SOEXM710 is almost £350 from the dealer in the UK, whereas Hazet is "mere" £79 for 8 pcs and a little more for 12 pcs.

 

[aag14V]

I bought a set of 1/2 "Elofort, older production. Elora looks identical, as much variation in quality?



Elora ratchet:



New Elofort not similar Elora. Old is better, just finishing is lower than in Elora???
Please give us your opinion.
thanks

 

[Blöckw@rt]

If you want the best, you got it !
Nothing more, nothing less.........

 

[Blöckw@rt]

Please give us your opinion.
thanks

The classic line (still available) from Elofort is just the same like Elora with a cheaper finish. The "new" ratchets and sockets are China or Taiwan stuff.

 

[shoturtle]

Ok cheers. I'm going to sleep on it and see if I'm still as eager tomorrow.

One more thing to add, while the 90 degree adapter looks gimmicky. It really works. It lets the drill get into tighter spots. That was one of the things the metebo rep was showing me in a real work mock up of a wooden drawer.

 

[CanUK]

One more thing to add, while the 90 degree adapter looks gimmicky. It really works. It lets the drill get into tighter spots. That was one of the things the metebo rep was showing me in a real work mock up of a wooden drawer.

Cheers - the order is in - might be here by tomorrow.

 

[shoturtle]

It is really a good combo set. You get allot more ability then just a standard drill and impact combo set. Chuck is easy to remove, when needing just a driver or attaching the 90. And the impact drill is one solid unit. Metal chassis on both tools.

 

[shoturtle]

PS,

the only real reason I went with the bosch set was that my bosch rep I deal with form work, sweeten the deal and gave me 2 demo HC batteries for the set.

 

[CanUK]

It is really a good combo set. You get allot more ability then just a standard drill and impact combo set. Chuck is easy to remove, when needing just a driver or attaching the 90. And the impact drill is one solid unit. Metal chassis on both tools.

Yeah I think what clinched it for me was that, at least in this price bracket, I didn't spot anything that was obviously better in any measurable terms. The extras in the kit sweeten the deal for me, as does the possiblity of upgrading to the 4AH battery if it fits (I found one site that suggests it does) and should I need it.

I'm pleased with my other Metabo tools (610 drill, se2800 screwdriver, a pair of W8 angle grinders, and a ge710 die grinder), so I don't imagine I'll be disappointed with these.

I'm definitely grateful though for the info and suggestions here; Even if I didn't change my mind, it gave me more to consider and I feel better/more confident about my choice as a result.

 

[shoturtle]

The biggest battery for the 12v is a 2.2 ah battery. The 4ah is for the 18v stuff.

 

[CanUK]

The biggest battery for the 12v is a 2.2 ah battery. The 4ah is for the 18v stuff.

This is a 10.8V system despite the "12" in the name, and they do indeed now have a 10.8V 4AH battery (google "Metabo BS12 Pro 10.8V")

 

[shoturtle]

nice, did not know about that 4.0 battery in 10.8v. That will really give the drill and impactor allot of run time.

 

[CanUK]

nice, did not know about that 4.0 battery in 10.8v. That will really give the drill and impactor allot of run time.

Yeah - the kit I've ordered comes with 1.5AH batteries, which should suit me fine, but the option is there if I feel the need to upgrade.