Tools from the old world

[superautobacs]

Man, how often do you come across a bin full of Grip-on locking pliers like that. I only see heavily used/abused, old, cruddy Vice Grips and the Chinese fair at the fleas I've gone to.

The Hazet screwdriver has a nice shape to it. A very soft, cushy handle? And I agree with Billymade--first thing I thought was, "Wiha?"
BTW, from the soft handles that you have, which one is has the softest, form-fitting handle? Felo?

 

[superautobacs]

The Belzer "super-block" are nice too ! Unfortunately you see such sweet things seldom nowadays...
Except at the flea market

(ps: from which issue of factory gear mag (?) is the pic ?)

I don't have the answer, but it's narrowed down to either one of these two magazines:

Published in 2003 (covers 26 brands and 397 items, 1cm thick)
ISBN-10: 4891071559
ISBN-13: 978-4891071554

or

Published in 2001 (415pgs, 3cm thick! )
ISBN-10: 4487795818
ISBN-13: 978-4487795819

Sadly, the likelyhood of being able to order a new book--slim to none.

 

[bredes]

Hi Monte, I'm new at the garage journal.Sorry about my english, I'm from Brazil and a like tools.There are Belzer's tools made in Brazil.What would you like to know about Belzer in here?
http://www.coopertools.com.br/catalogo_pdf.cfm

 

[DS-21]

Hm speak about torque wrenches Monte, I rarely find any worth buying but yesterday there was two of them! But not a single open-end/flex-box wrench at this weekends flea-markets!!
The 1/2" Hazet is a 1980s West German I beleive, but the 3/4" I can't identify - Anyone? Seller said he had it for his VW Bug's flywheel nut.

There was also a blue Bosch "professional" Bohrhammer that caught my eye, but it was "made in PRC"! Maybe that's the reason it was lying there

Ps. that Belzer super blocks look nice! I have a few Gedores that looks very similar. If I visit every flea-market I'll hope I soon have a set

 

[Monte]

Those remind me of Wiha stuff.... I wonder who the OEM for Hazet is or do they made screwdrivers "in house"?

afaik they don`t make their own. Some were definately from Witte ("Ultra" series). Here is the picture from the Witte design patent file :

Hazet Ultra ^

The newer "Hexanamic" screwdrivers looks a bit different (grey tip instead black, different hex bolster) , so maybe the newer ones are from Wiha .

@superautobacs:
The handle is like the others, with a "hard" rubber surface. The only really soft handle screwdrivers are the Felo "Ergonic" drivers.

Thanks for the info regarding the magazines ! I`ll see if i can get them ...

 

[Monte]

Hi Monte, I'm new at the garage journal.Sorry about my english, I'm from Brazil and a like tools.There are Belzer's tools made in Brazil.What would you like to know about Belzer in here?
http://www.coopertools.com.br/catalogo_pdf.cfm

Olá!
welcome on the board !
If you own brazilian made tools (or others) please post them ! Belzer, Gedore, Bellota, Mayle, Corneta, Tramontina, Vonder...

I already have my first question ! Do you know where the connection between Belzer-Germany and Belzer Brazil is , or why they use the Belzer name ?

 

[Monte]

Hm speak about torque wrenches Monte, I rarely find any worth buying but yesterday there was two of them! But not a single open-end/flex-box wrench at this weekends flea-markets!!
The 1/2" Hazet is a 1980s West German I beleive, but the 3/4" I can't identify - Anyone? Seller said he had it for his VW Bug's flywheel nut.

There was also a blue Bosch "professional" Bohrhammer that caught my eye, but it was "made in PRC"! Maybe that's the reason it was lying there

Ps. that Belzer super blocks look nice! I have a few Gedores that looks very similar. If I visit every flea-market I'll hope I soon have a set

The other wrench has a english inscription so maybe something from the UK or US, maybe from "Sturtevant Richmont" or CDI .

yeah the entry level hammer is or was made in prc . A newer one i saw was made in russia, the higher priced ones are from germany or switzerland. But Bosch has a good name in hammers, also angle grinders.

Gedore pic borrowed from superautobacs

Williams wrench

 

[Monte]

Pferd key files

 

[bredes]

Olá!
welcome on the board !
If you own brazilian made tools (or others) please post them ! Belzer, Gedore, Bellota, Mayle, Corneta, Tramontina, Vonder...

I already have my first question ! Do you know where the connection between Belzer-Germany and Belzer Brazil is , or why they use the Belzer name ?

Monte,
I was reading all pages of this topic and I saw that you have a amazing collection of tools, congratulations!!!
I will try to find out something about the relationship between Belzer Brazil and Belzer Germany, then a post what a discover.Next sunday I will take some pictures about any handtool that I've got, then i post here.

 

[Monte]

@bredes:
Thanks !
yeah some pics of your tools and also garage if you have would be cool ! I already can imagine the pics with some palm trees in the background




Some punches from:
PB, Belzer, Hazet, E-Top, Rennsteig, Promat, Format (new), Format (old), Dako

misc. punches/chisels:

Facom automatic center punch, Rennsteig and Sandvik-Belzer punch, soft face punch from Halder, E-Top chisel, brass punch, Stahlwille chisel

 

[norry]

I'm always on the lookout for good German (and Swiss) tools here in the States, and found something interesting I should mention here.

There was a big old Wiha set on - of all places! - Amazon. It was $126 for 40 "3K Cushion Grip" screwdrivers, low enough that I was worried it was made at the Vietnam factory mentioned on Wiha's website. But when I emailed Wiha some months ago, this was the response I got:

"The tools in the set, 46099, are made in Germany. The sets are assembled
together in the USA."

I asked what -was- made at the Vietnam factory, and was told that:

"Our "Basic" pliers line with the red dipped handles are changing over to
Vietnam."

IMHO a 40 piece German-made screwdriver set for $126 seems pretty decent, but I haven't bought the set myself. Monte, care to comment? Where does 3K fit into the Wiha product lineup? I assume it's not the highest-end thing they make, but is it some sort of bargain special or is it made to typical Wiha standards?

 

[superautobacs]

Monte,
Nice stuff. I like the sleeved Belzer punches.





Norry,
Assuming that you haven't read through these, I think each of them provide useful information, some more than others, pertaining to the screwdrivers and the company itself:

http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27187&highlight=wiha+screwdriver+set
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=29370&highlight=wiha+screwdriver+set
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=25207&highlight=wiha+screwdriver+set
http://www.garagejournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33119&highlight=wiha+screwdriver+amazon&page=4
http://toolguyd.com/2009/02/wiha-40-piece-cushion-grip-screwdriver-set/

 

[101% Loko]

Hi Monte, I'm new at the garage journal.Sorry about my english, I'm from Brazil and a like tools.There are Belzer's tools made in Brazil.What would you like to know about Belzer in here?
http://www.coopertools.com.br/catalogo_pdf.cfm

+1

Don't speak english, but...

Belzer ITMA > Gedore > "New" Belzer (CooperTools)

Fotos (Pics):

Chave Philips (Screwdriver) Belzer-ITMA 3/16 x 3" (PH1)

My Belzer Tools:

My Gedore Tools:

Soquetes 24mm Gedore x Drebo (2º Line Gedore) x Belzer:

Gedore:

Drebo:

Belzer:

 

[norry]

Norry,
Assuming that you haven't read through these

You assumed correctly! Yeah, I was tired last night after being on the job for 12 hours, otherwise the whole 'search button' idea might have dawned on me. Thanks for the links, very helpful and looks like a good set!

 

[Monte]

I'm always on the lookout for good German (and Swiss) tools here in the States, and found something interesting I should mention here.

There was a big old Wiha set on - of all places! - Amazon. It was $126 for 40 "3K Cushion Grip" screwdrivers, low enough that I was worried it was made at the Vietnam factory mentioned on Wiha's website. But when I emailed Wiha some months ago, this was the response I got:

"The tools in the set, 46099, are made in Germany. The sets are assembled
together in the USA."

I asked what -was- made at the Vietnam factory, and was told that:

"Our "Basic" pliers line with the red dipped handles are changing over to
Vietnam."

IMHO a 40 piece German-made screwdriver set for $126 seems pretty decent, but I haven't bought the set myself. Monte, care to comment? Where does 3K fit into the Wiha product lineup? I assume it's not the highest-end thing they make, but is it some sort of bargain special or is it made to typical Wiha standards?

@norry
Superautobacs posted a nice summary of threads on the board here about Wiha. I personally can`t comment since I use Wera, but generally you hear good comments here and also on german forums. The screwdrivers which you`ll normally see here from Wiha is their "soft finish" line. The "3K" doesn`t appear on their german website. The USA website says that they use "CVM tool steel" for the 3K series and "CRM-72 tool steel" for the "soft finish" line. They also offer other handle designs and colours which are not on their website and are made specially for their retail/wholesale customers.
The price seems to be a introductory offer to make the name more well known. A low price can be archieved due to the amount of tools produced, high productivity and fully automated robotic manufacturing. Here`s a pic from Wiha`s plant where robots are used for the handle/screwdriver production and printing.

The regular "soft finish" Wiha on the left, the yellow/red version is the insulated type, on the right a "Promat" version for a industrial supply wholesaler with a different combination of soft/hard components.

A different handle, more rectangular. On the right the normal version, in the middle the insulated version, both sold in a "Home Depot" like store, on the left the "Holex" version sold through a industrial distributor.

On the left the regular version again, in the middle a rebadged "Proturn 3K" version sold through another "Home Depot" style store. On the right a different handle, i guess this one is from Wiha too, there are several similarities among all these screwdrivers.

"Solido" brand "Proturn 3K" driver sold in Austria through a wholesaler (thanks chreese for the pic)

This one from "Atorn" looks like Wiha too:

Proturn 1K

Proturn 1K insulated

Proturn labelled "W-Kronen" (wholesaler)

Hard handle version still made by Wiha.

Different hard handle version rebadged as "Promat" also from Wiha (these were once available in red from Wiha)

 

[Monte]

@101% Loko

Obrigada pelas fotos !

faz-me lembrar:
reminds me of:

 

[Moose-LandTran]

I love translucent orange handles..

 

[Monte]

me too

green isn`t too bad either

 

[Monte]

Gedore water pump pliers:

 

[superautobacs]

Although from the New World, I like translucent amber/orange handles, too!

Vaco:

I'll add an old, green Bahco screwdriver later on as well.

 

[Vinko]

I just read through the entire thread Reminds me that I'd really like a Fein detail sander, variable speed. How's it compared to the Festool?

 

[DS-21]

...and me
How about a vice-thread for european vices; here my favorite; 1940s Bofors

 

[Monte]

the requested vices:

"Heuer Front"

older "Heuer"

"Leinen"

noname angle vice

"AMF" angle vise

 

[Monte]

some more vices from our garage...

"Peddinghaus" vice:

unknown vice:

woodworkers vice:

 

[Vinko]

Anyone got any Stahlwille pullers? I'm going to start searching ebay.de for them.

 

[DS-21]

the requested vices:

You have a nice workplace monte. I like the "Leinen" type.
Anyone who knows about Paramo vices? I have this "no 5", it's a Made in England so that's a plus, but I would prefer a bigger one. Like the blue "Big Papa" seen in another thread

 

[ZRX61]

You have a nice workplace monte. I like the "Leinen" type.
Anyone who knows about Paramo vices? I have this "no 5", it's a Made in England so that's a plus, but I would prefer a bigger one. Like the blue "Big Papa" seen in another thread

I have one of those in pieces right now, awaiting paint & reassembley

 

[Monte]

@vinko: can`t comment on the stahlwille ones, mostly you see "Kukko" brand here (80% market share) www.kukko.com

@ds-21: i only know "Record" from England. Your Paramo vise looks similar !?


Vise manufacturers in europe:

Italy:
fza-morsificio (Leinen /Ursus/FZA brands)

France:
Dolex

sambre et meuse

Switzerland:
Gressel

Turkey:
Kanca

Germany:
Ridgid/Peddinghaus
Schlegel
Heuer

There is also a manufacturer in Spain , i think it is Irimo.
I don`t know if the Record vises are still made in England ?



vise from a former company where i worked. Probably "Peddinghaus" brand

vises from the apprenticeship workshop at the Airbus airplane factory:

older "Schlegel" vice with lift:

"Oval" vise:

"Heuer" fold-away vises:

 

[zed]

Monte any suggestions for a bench grinder?I'm thinking for a nebes C-200M here is the link:

www.nebes.it

http://www.nebes.it/stage/main/prod...tegory1=1&idcategory3=303&lastone=303&level=3

many thanks!

 

[Monte]

@ Zed:
never heard of Nebes. But the machines do look nice ! "Made in Italy" also should ensure good quality.
Bench grinders which are maybe recommendable too come from "Scantool" (Denmark) with their Scantool/KEF/Arboga brands www.scantool.dk

In Germany you`ll find "Flott" and also Metabo often as well as older "AEG" brand grinders. Industrial type machines are available from "Greif" and "Rema". Maybe an alternative to look for a used machine.



I personally have this grinder:

older Bosch (approx. 25 years) bench grinder from my former employer:

"Greif" grinder www.greif-grindrobot.com

"Rema" www.reichmann.com/

"Flott" www.flott.de/

Metabo

 

[Moose-LandTran]

I don`t know if the Record vises are still made in England ?

I believe the larger ones are still made here, i think the smaller ones are made overseas, China i assume.

Mine was made in England:

Monte, do you know who makes vices for Hazet? Or are they made in-house by Hazet?

 

[DS-21]

What about a good old used quality grinder? Over here this kind of old bulky equipment is quite plentiful, I guess situation is the same around the globe? Here a mid-sized 1960s Arboga, I got it for the same price as a new PRC substitute. It replaces a 1940s machine, nothing wrong with that one except it didn't have the fans. Arboga Maskiner made machinery in Arboga from 1930s to 1990s. I don't know where today's grinders and drills with Arboga name on them are made... Pic 2 is a 1980s. The like new 1970s big one at pic 3 I missed by 5 minutes...

@Moose: That's the one! Is it Record's biggest vice?

Keep pictures coming Monte! 10eur Flea-market vice: Gemere, a german? I doubt it's a keeper for me, I bought it as a trade-vice. There is an old gent here who have the biggest of Bofors vices, I can have it if I get him two good smaller. Not shure if the Gemere will please him, yet

 

[Moose-LandTran]

@Moose: That's the one! Is it Record's biggest vice?

I believe it's their second-biggest, or around that. The only one bigger is an 8", but they also make another 2 or 3 6" vices, mine is a 6".

I also want an 8" Record, Just as soon as i find one for cheap..

 

[Zorro13]

@ Monte: I like your vise **** show

So cool to see high quality heavy duty stuff. The Heavy Duty Wiltons in the US are not bad but they don't look as nice and sophisticated

 

[superautobacs]

Indeed. Vice **** for sure. I see some interesting designs and features on some of those vices.

I'll post some pics of mine one of these days (I hope); interestingly, it's a Brazilian brand.





Here's a Heyco water pump type plier. I'm wondering if this was part of an auto kit? It's very light in weight.

Monte,
Is Wuro and Athlet the same company? Turnus and Kukko is related?

 

[Monte]

I believe the larger ones are still made here, i think the smaller ones are made overseas, China i assume.

Monte, do you know who makes vices for Hazet? Or are they made in-house by Hazet?

This Record vice has a sticker "Sheffield England" on it maybe this is still from England click ? The other vice has no sign of origin: click
This one has "Made in England" cast in click, the swivel base also click, i think i can read "made in England" where the spindle is: click.
ps:
The chisels are also still "made in Sheffield England" click, this one too click,and also the pipe vice click, Bolt cutter too click the Irwin/Jack handsaws are from Denmark click,




The older Hazet vices were from "Heuer" . In the new 2009 catalog they have different vices which looks like the "Kanca K2" vice which looks close to the Heuer.

pic from the Hazet page:

Kanca K2: Link to Kanca: click

old Hazet version:

Heuer Front:

The price changed from 147,25 € (2007 catalog) to 160,65 Euro (2009) + v.a.t.




@ds-21: Nice Arboga grinders ! Looks heavy duty !
Here is a Arboga brochure click with grinders similar to yours, the last page says "Made in Denmark by Arboga A/S"

These ones from "Creusen" (Netherland) looks nice too:
http://www.creusen.nl/

But never heard of "Gemere" . A google search showed no usable results. But from the inscription its from the german language area.

@zorro13:
some pics borrowed from a german forum:

I like this one from Ridgid-Peddinghaus:

@superautobacs:
maybe from a car kit, but also sold regular - "Heyco 300" is the name of your pliers and still made. Similar looking pliers were also sold by others, a similar style is still offered by Gedore:

Yes Athlet is the brand Wuro sells their tools to the retailers. They also manufacture for others like "CK", NWS or VBW

Kukko ("Kleinbongartz & Kaiser") bought the company "Eduard Gottfried Ferne" in 1998 with their Turnus (clamps, hand vices ) and Winkelgreif (Tin snips) brands. In 2003 they bought "Groote" and added steel numbers and letter stamps to their lineup. In 2005 they took over the production of "Heinz Schlieper Werkzeuge" (HSW Schraubendreher) and added screwdrivers to their lineup. Kukko invented the puller in 1919 and offers the largest selection of pullers in the world. From this tiny puller for speedometer pointers for $15.- to this "Goliath" 60 ton puller for ~ $ 16.000.-

 

[bmwpower]

Those Heyco's look like my BMW pliers.
I also have a Paramo like the posted.

 

[Monte]

@zed:

Are you into metal working ? If so i recommend a belt grinder. Will make your life much easier...

some more pics of the Leinen vise:

jaw width 125mm . Capacity 21 cm.

replaceable jaws:

precise dovetail guide

**** back

 

[Zorro13]

@zed:

some more pics of the Leinen vise:

jaw width 125mm . Capacity 21 cm.

Monte,

that's exactly the one I'm looking for. Any idea for how much they go used?

 

[MadMark]

Where are those stahlwille deep offsets on sale?