To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

Tools of Japan

To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

SRSemenza

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 26, 2017
Messages
616
I'm guessing that the rubber ring is also there to hide the seam between the hollowed out handles and the caps on the larger ratchets.

It also gives gripping surface to turn the socket with thumb and finger. Same for the ratchet spinners (which work great).

Seth
 

pare

Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2019
Messages
7
Location
UK
Not sure why you would expect screw heads on the top cover? I mostly see that on older production, it's fairly uncommon on modern tools.
Personally prefer the screws through the head into backplate design because if the threads ever strip you've only ruined the backplate instead of the ratchet body. Considering Nepros ratchets aren't cheap throwaways, they're keepers that you hold on to long term, and the screws on the 1/4" and 3/8" ratchets are tiny it'd be an actual improvement to switch to this design if they're going to bother making changes. As I said though I expect it's a form over function choice. I wouldn't say it's uncommon these days either, all my ratchets are modern fine tooth and most of them screw through the head into the backplate.
It also gives gripping surface to turn the socket with thumb and finger. Same for the ratchet spinners (which work great).
At this end of the spectrum/price I'd rather a band of knurling than a rubber ring on their sockets. If quick identification is what they're going for they could add a painted groove as well similar to Wera sockets. Either way don't see the point of a little rubber ring on their ratchet handles, personally would rather they were finished completely smooth if there isn't a need for a groove for the join.
 

tamaraw

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 6, 2022
Messages
843
Personally prefer the screws through the head into backplate design because if the threads ever strip you've only ruined the backplate instead of the ratchet body.

I see your point, I just don't think of it as a very practical issue unless the rebuilder is particularly careless. There are, however, significant functional advantages to putting the screws through the rear:
  • Way more thread engagement in the head (not limited by backplate thickness) = stronger connection and less likely to come loose or be accidentally crossthreaded.
  • Screws with chamfered seats help align backplate during re-assembly.
  • No long unthreaded shank with potential slop/misalignment in the through-hole.
  • The head can potentially be a little slimmer without the need to drill a hole all the way through the sides.
Old Proto, Snap-On, Hazet, Stahlwille, Gedore, etc. are all the way that you describe but the newer gen tools from basically everyone have switched to either screws through the bottom or a snap ring/spring clip (my personal preference). It would be inaccurate to call it "form over function", it's a functional evolution the same way that we now have stronger multi-tooth engagement and higher tooth counts.

I guess Snap-On still makes some of their 1/2" dual 80's the old style with screws through the top of the head. Ko-Ken zeal kind of does it too but the single screw serves as a pivot point for the pawl, so they have a different reason to go all the way through.

At this end of the spectrum/price I'd rather a band of knurling than a rubber ring on their sockets. If quick identification is what they're going for they could add a painted groove as well similar to Wera sockets. Either way don't see the point of a little rubber ring on their ratchet handles, personally would rather they were finished completely smooth if there isn't a need for a groove for the join.
I agree about prefering metal knurling, I have concerns about longevity on the rubber, especially when exposed to fluids. The edges are kind of sharp when you remove the rubber though, I may see if I can bend a brass strip into place or maybe thermo-form plastic as a replacement at some point.

I get what you are saying about paint but I don't think that would hold up to Nepros durability standards, whereas the rubber can be easily replaced or swapped out for different colors depending upon use/wear.
 

worldcargo

Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2023
Messages
18
Vessel impact driver
 

Attachments

  • 0202AEF8-395A-4E14-B099-0153AD24DF41.jpeg
    0202AEF8-395A-4E14-B099-0153AD24DF41.jpeg
    255.9 KB · Views: 124
  • 70E4BD44-4B85-45AC-B9F3-A8C7C4EB4225.jpeg
    70E4BD44-4B85-45AC-B9F3-A8C7C4EB4225.jpeg
    607.5 KB · Views: 49
  • F5FE9386-53E7-4F6E-BD15-B6B2D6558A17.jpeg
    F5FE9386-53E7-4F6E-BD15-B6B2D6558A17.jpeg
    954 KB · Views: 51
  • ACBD5FA6-AD79-4903-9AD5-1AED826D8E29.jpeg
    ACBD5FA6-AD79-4903-9AD5-1AED826D8E29.jpeg
    496.9 KB · Views: 82

pare

Member
Joined
Sep 15, 2019
Messages
7
Location
UK
I see your point, I just don't think of it as a very practical issue unless the rebuilder is particularly careless. There are, however, significant functional advantages to putting the screws through the rear:
  • Way more thread engagement in the head (not limited by backplate thickness) = stronger connection and less likely to come loose or be accidentally crossthreaded.
  • Screws with chamfered seats help align backplate during re-assembly.
  • No long unthreaded shank with potential slop/misalignment in the through-hole.
  • The head can potentially be a little slimmer without the need to drill a hole all the way through the sides.
Old Proto, Snap-On, Hazet, Stahlwille, Gedore, etc. are all the way that you describe but the newer gen tools from basically everyone have switched to either screws through the bottom or a snap ring/spring clip (my personal preference). It would be inaccurate to call it "form over function", it's a functional evolution the same way that we now have stronger multi-tooth engagement and higher tooth counts.
That's fair, as I said before none of this is a big deal, more nitpicking. I just thought as they've bothered to make changes to their 3/8" ratchets it'd be worth changing to the screw through head design as well. I took the fact they hadn't as a form over function choice but as you've outlined there's more to it than that. I've seen people referring to Nepros as heirloom tools, just seems a shame to potentially ruin such nice ratchets because of a little screw versus fitting a new backplate, even though there are disadvantages to the screw into backplate design. As you say ideally people would just take care when rebuilding their ratchet and it wouldn't really matter either way how it's designed but stripping the threads on a ratchet body can and does happen.
I get what you are saying about paint but I don't think that would hold up to Nepros durability standards, whereas the rubber can be easily replaced or swapped out for different colors depending upon use/wear.
Neither are great durability wise, as you say though it's quicker to swap a rubber ring versus reapplying paint. Don't think anything will beat ensuring you buy sockets with stamped sizes and painting them yourself if colour coding/visibility really matters to someone. I get that some people treat Nepros like jewellery and aren't going to want to apply paint to them or anything like that, there's no perfect solution.
 

F-22

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2022
Messages
1,830
I really appreciate my 1/4" Nepros ratchet. Seemed like such an overpriced little thing at first, but now I had the chance to use it a couple times and I love it. The low backdrag is amazing. I'm not sure if Koken is better - yet to try one of those - but I was quite amazed how I can use the Nepros ratchet when most of my other ratchets would just have way too much backdrag (In 1/4" I also have an European Unior and a taiwan made Proxxon).
 

Pexto

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2018
Messages
640
If you like the Nepros, do NOT try the Ko-ken, or you will be like me, wasting a lot of time standing in front of the toolbox deciding which one to pick up. It's definitely a Ginger and Mary Ann situation.

Here are most of my decent 1/4" tools. The Nepros and the Ko-ken are favorites, but so is the very old S-K 40970 that has nearly equal backdrag. The Wera is too gimmicky for me and I wouldn't buy one again. The Titan on the far left (11318, I think) is a fairly new addition and is realy good for the price. It makes me wish that Ko-ken or Nepros made a 1/4" swivel ratchet, as I simply can't justify the price of a Snap-on.

Oh, and a shout out to the Ko-Ken breaker bar, and Nut Grip socket. I only have a 10mm but will be adding more at the next opportunity. The Nut Grip has already saved me a couple of times from dropping a nut in a deep, dark place. It's very helpful both for removal and reassembly in tight spots.

20230424_130400.jpg
 

shibertus

Well-known member
Joined
Nov 13, 2018
Messages
277
Picked up one of the new Koken 1/4” 72 tooth ratchets on a recent trip to Japan. Playing with both in the store, the 72t model seemed to have ever so slightly higher backdrag than the old 36t model. The head on the Koken is smaller and thinner than my Nepros. Really tough choice between these two.

DSC_5876.jpg

DSC_5879.jpg

DSC_5881.jpg

DSC_5882.jpg
 

BigLeagueSmoes

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 10, 2022
Messages
314
Location
Central IL
Picked up one of the new Koken 1/4” 72 tooth ratchets on a recent trip to Japan. Playing with both in the store, the 72t model seemed to have ever so slightly higher backdrag than the old 36t model. The head on the Koken is smaller and thinner than my Nepros. Really tough choice between these two.

DSC_5876.jpg

DSC_5879.jpg

DSC_5881.jpg

DSC_5882.jpg
Beautiful.
 

Jeff

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 10, 2009
Messages
2,706
Location
Sonova Beach
Oh, and a shout out to the Ko-Ken breaker bar, and Nut Grip socket. I only have a 10mm but will be adding more at the next opportunity. The Nut Grip has already saved me a couple of times from dropping a nut in a deep, dark place. It's very helpful both for removal and reassembly in tight spots.
Could you provide more info on the Nut Grip? I would like to check that out.
 

Pexto

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2018
Messages
640
Could you provide more info on the Nut Grip? I would like to check that out.
There's a good cutaway view and description here: https://kokenusa.com/pages/nut-grip-sockets

Basically the two spring-loaded bearing balls hold the nut in the socket, lightly but securely. Very handy for those times when you've got to put a nut back on in a place you can't reach with your hand. Or for disassembly when you're worried the nut might fall off and be lost.

In situations like this in the past I've used bits of tape, or shop rag, or paper towel to try to hold the nut in the socket. And I have a set of little Craftsman magnet inserts that fit up inside a socket to hold the nut magnetically. But all these methods are pretty fiddly and the Nut Grip socket is definitely more convenient.
 

GeoBruin

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2018
Messages
3,747

rick carpenter

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
3,786
Location
Huntsville, East Texas
Anyone know if the Mitutoyo 505-732 150mm Dial Caliper from Amazon is genuine?


Price seems too good... 41% off, "lowest price in 30 days".
Reviews seem legit and there's a price history on camelcamelcamel. It looks like it's just a really good time to buy.

Too bad the inch model isn't going as cheap.

I just got these calipers in today. They look quality-made as I expected with the exception of the plastic flex hinges on the plastic case, which will eventually crack/break. Oh well, maybe I'll rig up a nice case for these metric calipers and my inch calipers. If I hold the head and bounce the slide a little the needle moves (see the pic), but when I open and close it the needle goes back to zero every time. Just shows the nature of the dial mechanism, and that I'll have to be careful with these calipers.

The youtube vid "17 Warning Signs Your Mitutoyo Calipers Are Fake" by Clough42 at


is about digital calipers, but the points in common between his genuine products and my dial calipers indicate I have a genuine Mitutoyo product. All his points about typograpical and printing minutiae jive, as do the points in common between his digital calipers and my dial calipers and the construction/manufacturing of the cases.

All in all, I am very satisfied!

image_67212801.JPG
 
Last edited:
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!

F-22

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2022
Messages
1,830
I just got these calipers in today. They look quality-made as I expected with the exception of the plastic flex hinges on the plastic case, which will eventually crack/break. Oh well, maybe I'll rig up a nice case for these metric calipers and my inch calipers. If I hold the head and bounce the slide a little the needle moves (see the pic), but when I open and close it the needle goes back to zero every time. Just shows the nature of the dial mechanism, and that I'll have to be careful with these calipers.

The youtube vid "17 Warning Signs Your Mitutoyo Calipers Are Fake" by Clough42 at


is about digital calipers, but the points in common with my dial calipers indicate I have a genuine Mitutoyo product. All his points about typograpical and printing minutiae jive, as do the points in common between his digital calipers and my dial calipers and the construction/manufacturing of the cases.

All in all, I am very satisfied!

image_67212801.JPG
Can expect nothing but quality from Mitutoyo. However, I specifically bought the fake digital calipers off of Aliexpress for my own home needs. I think they were 25-30$ at the time. For that kind of money, probably the best calipers on the market - or at least, way better than the generic chinese digital offerings for 15-20$. At least, they are really "absolute", which is a feature I always missed on cheap digital calipers. If you really take some precise measurements, it's best to have something that's true to size to calibrate them anyway (like, if you measure something around 50mm, calibrate them with a 50mm bearing and you'll have a very exact measurement). But that's something that is needed even with a genuine mitutoyo if you really want to be exact. I have genuine higher end Mitutoyos at work, they're nice for having the carbide tips but overall I'd say the chinese ones at home aren't notably worse. Only thing I noticed is that there's some discrepancy between the ID and OD jaws (I think 0.02mm), but that's definitely the hardest thing to grind accurately and it's fine if you know about it.

I really like the digitals for measuring distance differences. Like, if you want to know the difference between two same size holes. You measure the size of one hole, zero the digital caliper, then measure the longest distance between the holes and you directly get the centre distance. Or if you want to know depth differences, like you know something edge is at 25mm, you zero the calipers to 25mm and then you can measure how much higher or lower a different edge is, or how crooked the surface is etc... You can do all this with regular calipers but it requires writing down measurements and calculating, instead of just directly reading it off the calipers.
 

rick carpenter

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
3,786
Location
Huntsville, East Texas
Can expect nothing but quality from Mitutoyo. However, I specifically bought the fake digital calipers off of Aliexpress for my own home needs. I think they were 25-30$ at the time. For that kind of money, probably the best calipers on the market - or at least, way better than the generic chinese digital offerings for 15-20$. At least, they are really "absolute", which is a feature I always missed on cheap digital calipers. If you really take some precise measurements, it's best to have something that's true to size to calibrate them anyway (like, if you measure something around 50mm, calibrate them with a 50mm bearing and you'll have a very exact measurement). But that's something that is needed even with a genuine mitutoyo if you really want to be exact. I have genuine higher end Mitutoyos at work, they're nice for having the carbide tips but overall I'd say the chinese ones at home aren't notably worse. Only thing I noticed is that there's some discrepancy between the ID and OD jaws (I think 0.02mm), but that's definitely the hardest thing to grind accurately and it's fine if you know about it.

I really like the digitals for measuring distance differences. Like, if you want to know the difference between two same size holes. You measure the size of one hole, zero the digital caliper, then measure the longest distance between the holes and you directly get the centre distance. Or if you want to know depth differences, like you know something edge is at 25mm, you zero the calipers to 25mm and then you can measure how much higher or lower a different edge is, or how crooked the surface is etc... You can do all this with regular calipers but it requires writing down measurements and calculating, instead of just directly reading it off the calipers.

Thanks. I specifically bought these dial calipers because I do not need the accuracy/etc such as what you need. I just **** around in the garage and knew from using my old inch dial calipers that Mitutoyo dial calipers will always 'out-perform' the capacity I need.
 

F-22

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 23, 2022
Messages
1,830
Thanks. I specifically bought these dial calipers because I do not need the accuracy/etc such as what you need. I just **** around in the garage and knew from using my old inch dial calipers that Mitutoyo dial calipers will always 'out-perform' the capacity I need.
In terms of accuracy, digital calipers aren't really better. They may make you assume they're more accurate for having a 0.01mm resolution, but if we're reasonable a caliper is not the right tool to use to measure anything below ~0.05mm, it just won't be consistent. Advantage of digital is how easy it is to read and how you can zero it wherever you want, but nothing more. Dial calipers don't need batteries (though digitals last for a long time so it's not really a big issue) but they're also very accurate. Vernier are cool for always being an absolute scale (to be honest, dial too) and very cheap and also just as accurate if well made, but hardest to read (especially in a dimmly lit garage).
 

Reed Prince

Well-known member
Joined
May 30, 2017
Messages
592
Location
Northern Virginia USA
I just got these calipers in today. They look quality-made as I expected with the exception of the plastic flex hinges on the plastic case, which will eventually crack/break.
I use an old Starrett case for my Mitutoyo calipers.

IMG_8350.jpg


In other news, a couple of days ago I was looking on Amazon Warehouse for any 123 block deals and ran across an amazing deal on a set of Mitutoyo gauge blocks, which is something I need about as much as a Nepros Urushi ratchet handle. But for the price it was worth seeing exactly what would show up.


The outer box was a bit worn but the set was still factory sealed.

IMG_8358.jpg



Unfortunately it turned out to be a lower grade 9 piece inch set, not at all what it was supposed to be.

IMG_8361.jpg


Might as well have a little bit of fun with it before it gets sent back.

IMG_8362.jpg
 

Catcher1984

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 10, 2021
Messages
238
Location
Los Angeles
I’ve had the TOP HY49S short adjustable wrench for awhile and love that the screw has little to no slop but was always interested in the Fujiya version.

The Fujiya FLs-53G is similar but different in a few ways. It has 4mm more opening width (53mm Vs 49mm), teeth like indents on the back of the jaws, clear grip around the orange part, and it’s Made in Taiwan (vs TOP their wrench is Made in Japan). But ultimately feels really good and solid.

On a side note I was surprised to find Top had there makers mark underneath the blue grip (that I removed).

I’m probably returning the Fujiya, I thought I needed it for a project but a ridgid tool ended up working better. I only use the Top for large fasteners and tie rods but I enjoy using it every time I do! The only downside is that is doesn’t close all the way stopping at 12mm.

I’ve seen the Lobster crescent wrenches does anyone like those more than either of these?
 

Attachments

  • C1244AB7-E125-4176-BE4D-56BC28282FA2.jpeg
    C1244AB7-E125-4176-BE4D-56BC28282FA2.jpeg
    563.5 KB · Views: 64
  • 4127CE56-5B3E-4D1E-A0D6-9DBAEE95367B.jpeg
    4127CE56-5B3E-4D1E-A0D6-9DBAEE95367B.jpeg
    660.2 KB · Views: 95

krole

Active member
Joined
Dec 11, 2014
Messages
27
Anyone know if the Mitutoyo 505-732 150mm Dial Caliper from Amazon is genuine?


Price seems too good... 41% off, "lowest price in 30 days".

It's honestly not an easy answer with Amazon due to how they stock things. If it's shipped from Amazon, basically they combine products from all sellers so who knows what you actually get. Say sellers A through C are legit. Seller D sells knockoffs with the same SKU. They can all be intermingled so it doesn't matter what seller you get it from.
 

Andres26tnt

Well-known member
Joined
May 11, 2018
Messages
994
Well like I promised here it is. The Pro-auto DR.3D 1/4 ratchet. Part number 3DR-2

No real indication of where it's made, I'm assuming Taiwan.

image_jpeg.jpeg


image_jpeg.jpeg


3d3.jpegimage_jpeg.jpegimage_jpeg (1).jpegimage_jpeg (5).jpeg

the Desing is not much different from a traditional ratchet. Basically, a round mechanism to articulate. the selector is plastic, the front cover is metal, and also opened for ease of movement. The ratchet came in a plastic bag, with no lube. it is super easy to take apart, I lubed it with super lube. I believe this design is not that strong and the back drag is on the high side with only 30t. overall not sure what advantages these ratchets have, only one I can see is the 360-degree movement you can get out of it.

Super unique ratchet for sure
 
Last edited:

tamaraw

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 6, 2022
Messages
843
On a side note I was surprised to find Top had there makers mark underneath the blue grip (that I removed).
I believe TOP typically designs their wrenches with metal handles first and then offers a dipped grip version as an extra. That way they can use a single forging and if the grip does wear out, you can cut it off and still have a functional handle underneath. A very practical approach.

That said, I do quite like the colored grips on mine. The are done quite well with no drip marks and the texture is very matte with no sticky or tacky sensation.
 

rick carpenter

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
3,786
Location
Huntsville, East Texas
Can anyone who is fluent in Japanese please explain this youtube vid for me? My phone translator had problems with the Japanese text.


Looks like Anex and Wera bits fit JIS screws better than Vessel bits. If so, lucky me... I had already ordered me some Anex bits that are coming in next week.

Thanks in advance.
 

Catcher1984

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 10, 2021
Messages
238
Location
Los Angeles
I believe TOP typically designs their wrenches with metal handles first and then offers a dipped grip version as an extra. That way they can use a single forging and if the grip does wear out, you can cut it off and still have a functional handle underneath. A very practical approach.

That said, I do quite like the colored grips on mine. The are done quite well with no drip marks and the texture is very matte with no sticky or tacky sensation.
I’m not really a fan of soft grips because my tools end up getting nasty one way or another. So as soon as I ordered the Fujiyas I just cut the grip off.

Mostly I was dreading what I would find underneath it (like the Engineer Stubby adjustables where they just cut it haphazardly and put a grip on it)

Luckily TOp doesn’t cut corners like that! If anyones in the market for a wide jaw short adjustable I highly recommend them. They also have hyper-zeros which are there premier line, I think that has little to no play/slop in its screw mechanism. It’s how adjustable wrenches should have been designed
 

Madjik Man

Well-known member
Joined
Dec 3, 2015
Messages
1,533
I bought these IPS skinny-jaw pliers at Amazon-US for $24.08 (price includes shipping from Amazon-Japan).
They arrived promptly, 6 days after ordering. The width of the jaws tapers from 4mm down to 2mm. Overall length is 7.5"

DSC01564.JPG

DSC01569.JPG
DSC01570.JPG

I have these. Used them once so far. Love them.
 

JWC86

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 4, 2021
Messages
270
Anyone else seen a big price increase in shipping from Amazon.jp?
Used to be reasonable but the last couple times I put some stuff in my cart and checked it was too high to be worth while.

I just had 4 items in my cart for about 8,000 yen (about $80CAD) and the shipping was 7,500 yen.
Used to be around 1,500-2,000 yen for the same amount of stuff or weight.
 
Last edited:

Pexto

Well-known member
Joined
May 5, 2018
Messages
640
Anyone else seen a big price increase in shipping from Amazon.jp?
Used to be reasonable but the last couple times I put some stuff in my cart and checked it was too high to be worth while.

I just had 4 items in my cart for about 80,000 yen (about $80CAD) and the shipping was 75,000 yen.
Used to be around 15,000-20,000 yen for the same amount of stuff or weight.
In the last 6 months I've had roughly the same experience. Shipping costs for amazon.jp tools used to be 15-20% on an order of, say, a dozen items. Now it's 30-40-50%.
 

Andres26tnt

Well-known member
Joined
May 11, 2018
Messages
994
Anyone else seen a big price increase in shipping from Amazon.jp?
Used to be reasonable but the last couple times I put some stuff in my cart and checked it was too high to be worth while.

I just had 4 items in my cart for about 8,000 yen (about $80CAD) and the shipping was 7,500 yen.
Used to be around 1,500-2,000 yen for the same amount of stuff or weight.
thought I was the only one seeing an increase. bought some items a few months ago with cheap shipping. Now just yesterday was going to purchase some screwdrivers and the shipping was almost 50%. came out to be 174$ for 80$ ish worth of items.
 

Odd-job

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 13, 2017
Messages
2,298
Location
SF Bay Area
I think they have been changing their shipping algorithms to a more per item basis after a flat fee to discourage exchange rate arbitrage and encourage US orders (this was the case on my last order and previous posts in this thread). It might still make sense to eat the shipping on certain higher dollar items if the exchange rate savings more than justify the shipping. Hope this helps.
 
To avoid these ads, REGISTER NOW!
Top Bottom