Torque Test Channel Open End Wrench Testing Part 2

[Torque Test Channel]

Come on man, that would be a test on a flawed tool... I know that you wouldn't use an out of spec tool during a repeatably test.

The most rewatched part of this video (timestamp 6:18)

That's the thing, you dont know they are out of spec until you exchanged money for em, we test what we're sold.

 

[Jswain]

I only really use open end wrenches for line sets or places I can't get the box end in...the Irwin's aren't a replacement for box ends.



Every time you put a wrench on a fastener there are multiple factors at play...it's not as though grip or spread individually results in a fastener coming off or not. That's why I appreciate TTC's test, he has come up with a test that all wrenches can be equally tested in, not just a pass/fail based on whether something breaks or not.

I never said I didn't appreciate the test. TTC never charges me a dime to watch their videos. But wrench spreading is a big part in how the open end of a wrench either loosens or fails to spin a tough fastener.

You said it yourself you've felt them spread. If an open ended wrench is the only tool for whatever reason, what is your next tool of choice? A wrench that will take more torque without spreading. I'm just compiling all your findings...

 

[ItsNemo]

I never said I didn't appreciate the test. TTC never charges me a dime to watch their videos. But wrench spreading is a big part in how the open end of a wrench either loosens or fails to spin a tough fastener.

You said it yourself you've felt them spread. If an open ended wrench is the only tool for whatever reason, what is your next tool of choice? A wrench that will take more torque without spreading. I'm just compiling all your findings...

I said the Irwin's (at least if I can't use the box end or a socket or whatnot)...they don't spread nearly as much as an open end when getting on er'

 

[WhataTool]

If a wrench spreads, it rounds a bolt sooner, if it's a poor jaw design - it rounds a bolt sooner. If its tolerance is way over, it rounds a bolt sooner. So testing which wrench rounds over stuff sooner seems to make sense to me

 

[dchawk81]

I only really use open end wrenches for line sets or places I can't get the box end in...the Irwin's aren't a replacement for box ends.



Every time you put a wrench on a fastener there are multiple factors at play...it's not as though grip or spread individually results in a fastener coming off or not. That's why I appreciate TTC's test, he has come up with a test that all wrenches can be equally tested in, not just a pass/fail based on whether something breaks or not.

I gotcha. I have a set of Tekton line wrenches that feel dubious enough that I'm always cringing and considering upgrading. Lol. I don't dare use a regular open end. But I also don't have that Irwin either.

I've been known, when it's an air line fitting, to simply cut the air line so I can use a box end then replace the air line or throw a patch in. Steel brake lines it's pucker up and hope.

 

[Olafur]

The only real test information pertaining to an open end that I would find useful is at what point it begins to spread.
Any other numbers are suspect imo.

They all begin to spread the moment any torque is applied to them. It happens in linear fashion, assuming the spread isn't so much the wrench goes back to 'normal'. Meaning, there is no tipping point where the wrench starts to spread.

Considering the video for these mostly European wrenches, I bet it would be possible to get good idea about the max torque reading for each wrench just by measuring the spread with digital caliper or micrometer @ some low torque (10% of max) in comparison to others.

 

[ItsNemo]

I gotcha. I have a set of Tekton line wrenches that feel dubious enough that I'm always cringing and considering upgrading. Lol. I don't dare use a regular open end. But I also don't have that Irwin either.

I've been known, when it's an air line fitting, to simply cut the air line so I can use a box end then replace the air line or throw a patch in. Steel brake lines it's pucker up and hope.

Yeah, line wrenches it seems like it's snap-on or nothing based on every test I've seen. I have a set from mastercraft back when they were gearwrench clones, they're...ok....but the Irwin's are almost a sure thing in comparison.

Air lines I've never had any that tight when it's normal brass...for black steel pipe (how I did my compressed air system), I just lean into a bigger pipe wrench lol that obviously doesn't work on more delicate things like brake lines.

 

[dchawk81]

Hey they worth at LEAST $0.25 in scrap metal

This statement is dubious at best.

 

[M635_Guy]

This statement is dubious at best.

On that, I think we can all agree

 

[dchawk81]

Yeah, line wrenches it seems like it's snap-on or nothing based on every test I've seen. I have a set from mastercraft back when they were gearwrench clones, they're...ok....but the Irwin's are almost a sure thing in comparison.

Air lines I've never had any that tight when it's normal brass...for black steel pipe (how I did my compressed air system), I just lean into a bigger pipe wrench lol that obviously doesn't work on more delicate things like brake lines.

I don't think they were factory installs. I'll put it that way. If they were, it was the 6 years in the quarries and weather that sealed them more than normal.

Some are anticlimactic even with cheapie wrenches though so.

 

[Olafur]

That's the thing, you dont know they are out of spec until you exchanged money for em, we test what we're sold.

Glad to see your feedback here. Many thanks for your work. Please keep it up, much appreciated.

 

[Torque Test Channel]

On that, I think we can all agree

This statement is dubious at best.

Listen guys, i know what i got.
OBO

 

[dchawk81]

Listen guys, i know what i got.
OBO

So do we. Everyone in the Urrea FB group says that's too much. Final offer.

 

[M635_Guy]

For the record, I was laughing from the moment the King **** broke (very clear that was a surprise) all the way through the comments/jokes - easily the funniest stuff I've seen on the channel.

 

[CR888]

Soft nuts will favour thicker wrenches. This test I think would be a little more useful if comparing similar thickness wrenches. How can u compare a thin wrench to one twice its thickness and then say the thicker type won or is better. In reality pound for pound it could be worse.

 

[Etchase]

Stanley sure makes great tools. I congratulate them. Hope to see their line wrenches tested. They will probably crush it too.

 

[dukefx]

What was up with the Stahlwille?! I couldn’t get over that. I have never pushed them that hard but they have seemed really stout to me. Kinda threw me for a loop with that one.

Gearwrench is also surprising. It performed way better than I thought it would.

Not surprised about Wright/Williams/Proto. Mine have been fantastic.

I own a lot of Stahlwilles and they should perform similar to a Hazet. Even the tolerances in the video weren't the usual. I'd say it's a bad batch.

I view it as the performance in doing the job, not as a function of it's thickness. If it's not too thick to fit the fastener and doesn't slip off like a thinner wrench might, then I'd say it's the better tool. I don't rate hammer performance as a function of it's weight. I pick one big enough to do the job. I found it amusing that the Torque Test Channel had a rating of ft-lbs/inch of length of impact wrench body, like you'd take a tape measure and calculator when shopping for one. Maybe I just misunderstand.

No shame in carrying unnecessary additional weight for extra sore arms at the end of the day. Some people are into that kind of thing, most people aren't masochists tho.

Grade 5 simulates the real world better because that's what the real world uses, among even harder fasteners.

Testing is supposed to simulate the real world as closely as possible in a controlled setting.

Like I said, it's my opinion about how useful the information from TTC is based on what they're testing.

Grade 5 as real world? The automotive industry uses Class 10.9 and above. 10.9 is the equivalent of grade 8.

Soft nuts will favour thicker wrenches. This test I think would be a little more useful if comparing similar thickness wrenches. How can u compare a thin wrench to one twice its thickness and then say the thicker type won or is better. In reality pound for pound it could be worse.

A valid point. It's like racing cars at the F1 track where we have Ferrari sports cars and a truck designed to haul 7 tons. Testing to failure doesn't provide much useful data either. The hydraulic press channel did it and guess what... the more meat it had the longer it lasted. What a shocker! Tools that are designed to ease fatigue and not slip or break without an extension like the Asahis or Stahwilles would probably be the first ones to go, yet both make wonderful wrenches.

 

[M635_Guy]

Soft nuts will favour thicker wrenches. This test I think would be a little more useful if comparing similar thickness wrenches. How can u compare a thin wrench to one twice its thickness and then say the thicker type won or is better. In reality pound for pound it could be worse.

The data is there for you to do that if that's what you'd like to compare - thickness and PSI generated are there.

 

[dchawk81]

I own a lot of Stahlwilles and they should perform similar to a Hazet. Even the tolerances in the video weren't the usual. I'd say it's a bad batch.


No shame in carrying unnecessary additional weight for extra sore arms at the end of the day. Some people are into that kind of thing, most people aren't masochists tho.


Grade 5 as real world? The automotive industry uses Class 10.9 and above. 10.9 is the equivalent of grade 8.


A valid point. It's like racing cars at the F1 track where we have Ferrari sports cars and a truck designed to haul 7 tons. Testing to failure doesn't provide much useful data either. The hydraulic press channel did it and guess what... the more meat it had the longer it lasted. What a shocker! Tools that are designed to ease fatigue and not slip or break without an extension like the Asahis or Stahwilles would probably be the first ones to go, yet both make wonderful wrenches.

What's your source that all automotive fasteners are grade 8 and up?

Neither of my 2 semis nor my 2 POVs are exclusively 8 or higher.

 

[cherrybomb]

If a wrench spreads, it rounds a bolt sooner, if it's a poor jaw design - it rounds a bolt sooner. If its tolerance is way over, it rounds a bolt sooner. So testing which wrench rounds over stuff sooner seems to make sense to me

We all choose how much we want to spend,what brands and length features we prefer. We all have different tolerances for failure. Some are pro,some are home gamers.Some have a disadvantage in a region of the Country.Technique and prep is important, I.M situation I have up graded a certain problem size instead of loosing confidence in my favorite and go to wrench.And remember we all come here to learn,compare notes,thoughts and hopefully decide for yourself, I got this covered or before next time maybe I should???

 

[dukefx]

What's your source that all automotive fasteners are grade 8 and up?

Neither of my 2 semis nor my 2 POVs are exclusively 8 or higher.

It's called European standards

 

[dchawk81]

It's called European standards

No source then.

 

[2ndGearRubber]

What's your source that all automotive fasteners are grade 8 and up?

Neither of my 2 semis nor my 2 POVs are exclusively 8 or higher.

Not exclusively, but for any actually loaded fasteners. The stuff holding the bumper on can be whatever. Exhaust, again, basically anything will work. The suspension bolts, caliper bolts, etc are generally 10.9. The stud and lugs are usually lower grade. Engine bolts are again typically 10.9 even stuff like timing cover bolts.

 

[KnurledNut]

@Torque Test Channel
I would like to see how a combination open-end/line wrench fares in this test.
They have a much thicker open end.
Snap-on, Cornwell, Mac, V8, etc...

 

[plinker]

@Torque Test Channel
I would like to see how a combination open-end/line wrench fares in this test.
They have a much thicker open end.
Snap-on, Cornwell, Mac, V8, etc...

IME they work better, though if you try hard enough you can still round off/distort flare nuts with the open end. Also saves having two wrenches in you hand and/or pocket when futzing with stuff.

 

[dchawk81]

Not exclusively, but for any actually loaded fasteners. The stuff holding the bumper on can be whatever. Exhaust, again, basically anything will work. The suspension bolts, caliper bolts, etc are generally 10.9. The stud and lugs are usually lower grade. Engine bolts are again typically 10.9 even stuff like timing cover bolts.

100% not what was said by that other poster.

I'm not stupid or naive. I work on stuff.

 

[M635_Guy]

I'm not stupid or naive. I work on stuff.

None of those things are mutually exclusive.

Kidding aside, standards vary in all kinds of ways, and he didn't say "all automotive fasteners were 10.9 and up." I read his point as wondering why you'd pick Grade 5 vs. Grade 8 as your preferred testing medium.

I feel like what you're asking for when you were talking about harder bolts, etc. boiled down to "Test for spread", which is covered (I believe) in what TTT is doing since the point at which the soft fasters fail is all the torque/psi the wrench can apply before the fastener could act as a part of the equation. I'm not sure how they'd put a metric beyond pass/fail to a certain point without spreading since they've already covered the amount of torque the wrench design itself can generate before the fastener becomes the dominant factor in the equation. It wouldn't make sense to me that wrenches that do well in the TTT testing would be worse when faced with fasteners made of harder material. At the point where the wrench isn't able to generate more torque you should probably be switching to a spline/6-point closed end anyway.

I mean, they work on stuff too, and it's pretty clear they chose their current approach for a reason.

 

[Grokew]

I remember when he botched the pliers wrench test, by not adjusting them properly. Haha. Other than that, good stuff.

 

[cherrybomb]

Sometimes TTC raises some blood pressure

 

[Benito]

Soft nuts will favour thicker wrenches. This test I think would be a little more useful if comparing similar thickness wrenches. How can u compare a thin wrench to one twice its thickness and then say the thicker type won or is better. In reality pound for pound it could be worse.

It's scored by performance per wrench thickness as well. Does anyone watch the vid before complaining?
But if we all petition all the brands to make them the same thickness that would be neat too

 

[M6erfan]

It's scored by performance per wrench thickness as well. Does anyone watch the vid before complaining?
But if we all petition all the brands to make them the same thickness that would be neat too

Here? On TGJ?? Usually most don't make it past the thread title

 

[MarcSeattle]

Maybe I missed it but I'd like to know how the psi number relates to the torque on the fastener. Anyone know?

 

[dchawk81]

Maybe I missed it but I'd like to know how the psi number relates to the torque on the fastener. Anyone know?

They calculated it based on an IR231 under the assumption that there was truth in advertising back then.

The numbers aren't necessarily accurate per se. It's relative performance.

 

[Benito]

They calculated it based on an IR231 under the assumption that there was truth in advertising back then.

The numbers aren't necessarily accurate per se. It's relative performance.

You're thinking of the ft-lbs they show in impact wrench testing. The PSI shown in the wrench testing is bolt tension PSI, and they give the divider in the video for torque wrench ft-lbs and Nm I believe.

 

[WWheeler]

I think you guys are missing their actual ranking and only looking at bolt tension PSI. The Gearwrench comes in 17th! Yes high psi but also the widest jaws by far, 9.5mm. The average is like 7.5-8. Making its performance per its thickness poor

Their ranking system is complete bananas.
According to their overall ranking the King **** broke and came out 25th out of 38 tested so far.
The ONLY part of TTTs open end testing to be considered IMHO is the PSI score and compare that to cost (and their listed cost is often extremely different than a quick search of amazon or google will find you)
The rest of their ranking system, clearance, hardness, and PSI to clearance, etc, is less than meaningless to real-world use.

 

[Benito]

The ONLY part of TTTs open end testing to be considered IMHO is the PSI score and compare that to cost (and their listed cost is often extremely different than a quick search of amazon or google will find you)
The rest of their ranking system, clearance, hardness, and PSI to clearance, etc, is less than meaningless to real-world use.

By this logic a pipe wrench is the best combination wrench in every scenario.
Throw a 3/4" thick jaw on any wrench and it will turn wide stuff regardless of design. But on a thin bolt head that data point alone is meaningless if it's contacting only the 1st 1/4". Which is why performance per thickness of the jaw should be considered

 

[dchawk81]

You're thinking of the ft-lbs they show in impact wrench testing. The PSI shown in the wrench testing is bolt tension PSI, and they give the divider in the video for torque wrench ft-lbs and Nm I believe.

I thought they used the same conversion factor. The impact testing is just PSI converted to ft-lbs.

 

[dchawk81]

By this logic a pipe wrench is the best combination wrench in every scenario.
Throw a 3/4" thick jaw on any wrench and it will turn wide stuff regardless of design. But on a thin bolt head that data point alone is meaningless if it's contacting only the 1st 1/4". Which is why performance per thickness of the jaw should be considered

Clearance is important too considering the only smart time to use an open end is when there ain't any. Otherwise throw the box on that sucker.

 

[WWheeler]

By this logic a pipe wrench is the best combination wrench in every scenario.
Throw a 3/4" thick jaw on any wrench and it will turn wide stuff regardless of design. But on a thin bolt head that data point alone is meaningless if it's contacting only the 1st 1/4". Which is why performance per thickness of the jaw should be considered

1) TTT's ranking system didn't think so
2) The only times I've found a thinner open end is needed are not high torque applications, like holding a hose end when changing a fitting/coupler/etc. Even the cheapest tappet wrenches work just fine for that. Having a thicker jaw with more purchase on a fastener is more beneficial for way more common use applications IMHO.

 

[Benito]

1) TTT's ranking system didn't think so

Performance by jaw thickness is accounted for in the points though