Trenching bucket width

[rslaback]

I'm contemplating running electricity to a cabin that on our lot that my wife uses as a quiet place to write her sermons. It will give me a bit of a reason to own my mini excavator. If I do this I am planning a couple of runs of PVC conduit. One for electricity and one for future proofing (or internet).

I know I don't really want to trench it with the 12 inch bucket that came on the machine (but I could). I was originally thinking that a 4" bucket would be ideal but I see most trenching buckets are 8" in width. I'm kind of thinking that 8 and 12 are too close together to really justify a different bucket.

I was able to find a supplier that makes a 4 inch bucket that really just looks like a wide ripping tooth. There really isn't a difference in the cost between the two buckets. Is 4" too narrow for a 24" deep trench?

 

[larry4406]

What is your soil like?

If nice soil you could rent a trencher.

I think I had a 16” when I trenched to the barn.

Machine was free weekend rental.

 

[dcg9381]

I was able to find a supplier that makes a 4 inch bucket that really just looks like a wide ripping tooth. There really isn't a difference in the cost between the two buckets. Is 4" too narrow for a 24" deep trench?

What size is your single conduit run? I'd think 4" is fine for most single conduits.

Here, we really use the narrow bucket because the ground is full of rocks, so a narrow bucket has it's advantages. Some places we've got huge slabs of limestone on top of a slab of flint, in those cases, you have to rent a 24" rocksaw, which is not fun and not cheap...

 

[Old tool guy]

Rent a ditchwitch.

 

[rslaback]

What is your soil like?

If nice soil you could rent a trencher.

I think I had a 16” when I trenched to the barn.

Machine was free weekend rental.

Sand.
I live about 200 feet from the lake's edge, all the houses have basements and no one around here has sump pumps in their houses. It could pour rain for days and the yard would be dry enough to mow within 3 hours of the rain stopping.

 

[rslaback]

Rent a ditchwitch.

no

 

[larry4406]

Sand.
I live about 200 feet from the lake's edge, all the houses have basements and no one around here has sump pumps in their houses. It could pour rain for days and the yard would be dry enough to mow within 3 hours of the rain stopping.

Since it’s sand, will the trench sides stay after digging or will cave in?

 

[rslaback]

Since it’s sand, will the trench sides stay after digging or will cave in?

I've played with it digging holes with my 5 year old nephew who loves construction and the edges of the holes seemed to stay pretty well.

 

[Spareparts]

I would use the 12" bucket, you already have it and in the sand it is going to fall in a little any way.

 

[larry4406]

If you have to get in the ditch for any reason, wider will be better.

I would use the 12” bucket you have.

Run fiber for comm since it’s in the same ditch and no separation (noise interference). Also fiber is better against lightning.

 

[Bert_]

I have no idea how far you're going. Unless it's tight quarters, a trencher will run circles around a mini ex.

 

[finn]

I’d use the 12” bucket in sand, but try digging parallel to the run.

Looks like 18 to 24” deep, depending on what you’re burying

I think my bucket is around 18” and it worked well in sand. I didn’t have a lawn to repair, though. I doubt a trencher would have worked any better in my dry sand, but I already had the mini and bucket, so I didn’t even think about renting something else. Mine would have taken longer if I rented a trencher, drove to town to pickup and return it, etc than it took to dig and backfill, etc.

Be aware that if this is your first rodeo, there’s a learning curve for getting a pretty trench, although this is one of those jobs where you literally bury your mistakes.

 

[Hank11]

I’d go with the 12. The extra spoil will push back in easy enough.

 

[Old tool guy]

I have no idea how far you're going. Unless it's tight quarters, a trencher will run circles around a mini ex.

What part of “no” don’t you understand? #6. Seems like a no brainer to me but apparently it’s not even up for consideration. I guess he really wants a new toy.

 

[tarmy]

Use the 12” and add a couple extra conduit for future projects. Every time I have a treacherous open…12”…I add a 1” water line, couple of 3/4 or 1” electric conduit and in a trench to the dock a comms conduit and propane line for a BBQ and fire pit on the landing. My trenches are all a ***** to dig as we have a lot of volcanic rock so the cost is nothing and save future headaches. I have managed to use almost every buried conduit to add tree lights and various other honey do items.

 

[matt_i]

My free advice is to start early and even prep the conduit into as many glued sections as you can do, save precise fitting for the ends. Once you open up the ground, if it ever collapsed overnight (from drying out) or strong rain you are really in a pickle. Trench, get in and get out as fast as you reasonably can without making mistakes but keep the pedal on the work ethic.

 

[jblnut]

I dig trenches with my small bucket at 24” around here and like the extra space. The alternative is the 6’ wide bucket on the Cat 330 so a 24” bucket already looks goofy lol.

I’d agree about running extra sleeves since the trench is already open. Conduit is cheap compared to doing it a 2nd time.

 

[firebirdparts]

Sounds like a lot of work to me. I'd much rather just rent a trenching machine.

I never operated a 4" excavator, but my expectation would be that dirt wouldn't come out of it. Wall effects don't scale anywhere in life. They are important.

 

[CGT80]

Damn....6 feet is pretty wide for a cat 330. I have used a 78" bucket on a cat 349 and it was a lot of weight with wet/heavy dirt. About 3 scoops for a super 10 at max weight in komnifornia.

12" is fine. The smallest bucket for the cat 420f2 backhoe was 12 or 18 inches and our yanmar vio 35 only had down to a 12" bucket.

A wider trench can be compacted more easily with a single track or tire vs a real narrow one.

 

[rslaback]

What part of “no” don’t you understand? #6. Seems like a no brainer to me but apparently it’s not even up for consideration. I guess he really wants a new toy.

He already owns the new toy.

 

[chipdog4]

What the boom width? If it's wider than 4", then your boom will be widening the trench.
There's also the problem of the material not having enough weight and sticking in a narrow bucket when you try to empty.
I'd stick with the 12"

 

[rslaback]

What the boom width? If it's wider than 4", then your boom will be widening the trench.
There's also the problem of the material not having enough weight and sticking in a narrow bucket when you try to empty.
I'd stick with the 12"

I hadn't considered the boom width. It seems like it would be around 100mm but the coupler area is definitely wider.

 

[CraigStu]

My mini-ex came w/ a 20" bucket. I bought an 8". One problem w/ the 8" is the dirt likes to pack in there and not drop out. 2nd problem is that the digger and the attachment ears are all mounted onto a plate that is maybe 14" wide so digging beloew ground level the plate messes up the sides of the trench. It will get cut down before my next use. I think you will be just fine w/ a 12".

 

[czarjl]

I would use the 12" bucket, the little bit of extra width will help with ease of installation and won't make an appreciable different once back filled.

 

[manwithtools]

Just use the 12" bucket, it will work fine. I agree with others, a second conduit just in case for the future is a good decision.

 

[pcmeiners]

With a 12" bucket hope you have a compactor, or you will need a place to store the excess dirt ( a lot) until it naturally compacts, in about 30 years.

 

[manwithtools]

With a 12" bucket hope you have a compactor, or you will need a place to store the excess dirt ( a lot) until it naturally compacts, in about 30 years.

With sandy soil as described by the OP, compaction should not be an issue.

 

[Jackfre]

Stick with the 12”. For a trench of any depth you will find it hard enough to work in. Also, Once you open it you will want to add to it. Elec, water, gas, soil pipe? You need some separation between them. Add a tracer wire. I had the 12” bucket on my BX23. It was like emptying Lake Tahoe with a tablespoon, but it got the job done.

 

[zkdiesel]

This is a joke thread correct?

 

[racecougar]

This is a joke thread correct?

???

 

[zkdiesel]

???

4” bucket? Hand him a hand gardening shovel?

Pins 4” wide on his rc toy excavator?

 

[racecougar]

I don't think the OP was joking. It sounds like he was asking for info/opinions on what to do.

 

[pcmeiners]

With sandy soil as described by the OP, compaction should not be an issue.

So you think the OP has special sand which does not sink over time, unlike the sand the "professionals " use which needs compaction, which would sink for decades without it.

 

[manwithtools]

Dramatic much? A 12" Wide x 24" Deep trench backfilled with sandy soil and a sprinkling from a garden hose is not going to sink for "decades".

 

[pcmeiners]

Sprinkling water from a garden hose is not going to force sand to compact appreciably, it would sink if the sand is submerged in water, that is the only way it is not going to need compaction which is impractical due to the amount of water needed and the time involved.

 

[manwithtools]

Sprinkling water from a garden hose is not going to force sand to compact appreciably, it would sink if the sand is submerged in water, that is the only way it is not going to need compaction which is impractical due to the amount of water needed and the time involved.

Okay, you win...

 

[mm08822]

A 4" bucket is at least as much work as an 8" or 12" wide. At least the same number of strokes with the backhoe. Probably more if chasing spoils. Unless you can borrow the 4" bucket, I wouldn't spend any $ on getting one.

Unless you have very rocky (and large rocks) soil, a ditchwitch will make easy work of trenching. If that means renting one, get the next size up (longer arm and wider chain) than what your trench appears to need.

The only advantage I can think of for a tractor is for backfilling and maybe putting select fill in the trench (if needed). A trencher is ususaly a smaller footprint and width.

 

[manwithtools]

A 4" bucket is at least as much work as an 8" or 12" wide. At least the same number of strokes with the backhoe. Probably more if chasing spoils. Unless you can borrow the 4" bucket, I wouldn't spend any $ on getting one.

Unless you have very rocky (and large rocks) soil, a ditchwitch will make easy work of trenching. If that means renting one, get the next size up (longer arm and wider chain) than what your trench appears to need.

The only advantage I can think of for a tractor is for backfilling and maybe putting select fill in the trench (if needed). A trencher is ususaly a smaller footprint and width.

The OP already owns a small mini excavator. That's why he doesn't want to rent a trencher or a tractor.

 

[mm08822]

The OP already owns a small mini excavator. That's why he doesn't want to rent a trencher or a tractor.

I know, but it doesn't mean it's the best for this job. His wallet, his decision.

 

[manwithtools]

His wallet, his decision.

Or it could be "His wife, her decision"

As in "You already have an excavator, why do you need to rent a trencher?"