Vintage Air Compressors

[Old Faithful]

a small leak to me would suggest it is badly rusted

what that ultimately means is the tank is 'thin' at the bottom and it is at the end of its service life

welding up this small leak does in no way repair the tank

I expect you would find that the tank is full of rusty shale if you look in it with a scope light unless it has been up-ended and cleaned out recently but it is still 'done'

these long flexible shaft LED inspection lights are cheap at places like Princess Auto or Harbor Freight, everyone needs one of these for all kinds of tasks

Thanks for your input - Tank issues invariably seem to be what pushes sellers to get rid of these old machines, I find... What boggles my mind is why no one considers propane tanks as a replacement, considering these are tested to much higher pressures and that propane is inherently dry and propane tanks should therefore be much less affected by corrosion in the long run...

I am still waiting for a response from the seller regarding the shell thickness - the tank supports and style suggest this should have a fairly thick shell, wouldn't you say, in which case an explosion shouldn't be as much an issue as simple leakage? Just wondering...

Regarding tank inspections - I took apart the burnt out compressor yesterday on that newer tank that I got for my old Sears Best restoration project, which I purchased simply based on the clear sound the tank was making, and it does have some flaking rust mainly on a narrow bottom band - I was surprised to see the tank is bare steel inside, no surface protection of any kind! You'd think they would have thought about condensation if it was such a big deal! Sanding the tank on the outside to prep for painting revealed a very thin coat of paint with no primer whatsoever, and even rust in places under some of the stickers!!! Made in America, eh! They sure don't build things they used to I'm sure that old Ingersol Rand compressor has a better tank

Anyway, the rust inside looked much worse with the 'cheap' inspection camera I recently acquired than how it looks like when viewed though one of the holes with light in the other one... The problem with these inspection cameras, I find, is they have a very narrow field of view and shallow depth of focus... Anyway, it turns out the rust appears fairly uniform (some flaking) and concentrated on a fairly narrow band at the bottom, so I'm considering acid washing and coating with rust paint before pressure testing it...

Any better ideas to restore an old tank and protect it from further corrosion? If I were rebuilding an old, venerable machine I would definitely get myself an overbuilt galvanized tank or at least try to get one... Bare steel seems to be such nonsense for compressor tanks!

I'm also keeping on the lookout for large propane tanks for that very purpose... It seems here that these old propane tanks are snatched from scrap yards and recycled by companies, as you can't even buy them off scrappers, who seem to have some sort of exclusive deals with recyclers...

 

[Old Faithful]

I am still waiting for a response from the seller regarding the shell thickness

Well the whole matter is all academic now - as I said previously I live in a deal-poor area where supply is low, prices are high and decent deals like this compressor (advertized with NO information about them and only a very poor picture) are snatched right away and sellers don't even bother answering inquiries... The other 'deals' I got because I was lucky enough to catch the ads soon after they were posted and I happened to be nearby, and look how much work they involved

Bottom line - one doesn't hunt for vintage machinery to save money but for the love of old machines and their embodiment of simpler times and honest to goodness craftsmanship*

* I'm also in the process of fixing a 30 year old restaurant espresso machine, found some NOS brass gauges for it, still hunting for parts for that project, among others...

 

[don long]

I'll jump in here with my new 1919 USACO compressor find
I was surfing on C/L when I came upon an old ad with the picture of the old compressor. It had been posted for 2 months. When I made contact with the fellow I found out that he still had the compressor.
I was in the truck within minutes and after an hour drive I arrived at the place, Struck a deal and loaded her up

I also came home with this old drill press

 

[Old Faithful]

I'll jump in here with my new 1919 USACO compressor find
I was surfing on C/L when I came upon an old ad with the picture of the old compressor. It had been posted for 2 months. When I made contact with the fellow I found out that he still had the compressor.
I was in the truck within minutes and after an hour drive I arrived at the place, Struck a deal and loaded her up

I also came home with this old drill press

Hey that's not vintage, that's an archeological find!!!

Sent from my SGH-I317M using Tapatalk

 

[toddjb]

I have query for all those in the know on these old compressors.

I have the opportunity to pick up an old (guessing 40's based on the motor) Ingersoll Rand T30, 80 gallon, 1HP compressor. Owner says it still runs strong but "takes longer" to pressurize.

When I asked to to clarify he said it just takes a long time to fill up when it's empty.

Here's a couple of questions (coming from a guy who currently has an oil-less cman 25 gallon compressor from the 90s)

Would taking a long time to pressurize be indicative of just having a large tank?

Or is it under powered with just having a 1hp?

Or is that pump not adiquiate for that large of a tank?

I see they still sell the T30 model - if it's a seal or diaphragm issue are the parts interchangeable?

Also being that old the tank is presumably a lot thicker than modern compressors, should I actually worry about emptying it out when I'm done for the day? Do people actually do this? Is there another way to combat condensation build up that leads to rust? If I'm honest I never empty my craftsman.

What other than a slow build should I take into consideration when looking into this?

Also, I'm looking at building a 3 sided lean-to on the outside of the garage to house it - any concern with storing it "outside"?

That was a lot. Sorry. I love restoring old machinery, but this is my first jump into compressed air, outside of owning one, and that thing is too heavy for me to go into the purchase blind.

 

[redmondjp]

First consideration is condition of the tank (plenty of reading on that topic here in other threads).

Second, LOL, a 1HP compressor on an 80-gallon tank? OF COURSE it's going to take a long time to fill - so this doesn't necessarily indicate a problem. However, if it really is only 1HP, you're going to be using the tank volume to run high-flow tools, as 1HP isn't going to cut it for any continuous use (longer than a few minutes). I'm assuming that it's a 2-stage pump. You can put a ball valve on the tank output so you can keep the tank pressurized (assuming no other leaks) so it doesn't have to pump up from zero every time you want to use it (that will help it live a lot longer life, not that it hasn't already).

Have you listened to it run, starting from zero pressure? Any knocking sounds that go away once the pressure has built up a bit? That indicates rod bearing slop. I can't comment on how far back you can get parts for the T30 pump and what changes (if any) have been made over the decades.

Also, what does the crankcase oil look like? Looks like a mocha = water in oil. Oil in tank = leaky compressor rings. You may want to skip this one if it has knocking sounds and/or any oil issues.

Yes, you can keep it outside. Many people do. You can run a thinner-weight oil in the crankcase if you are in a cold climate, and/or use a heater on the compressor crankcase (like they do on some refrigeration compressors - or I have used a magnetic block heater on my compressor that is kept outdoors).

How much would you have to give for such a vintage compressor?

 

[toddjb]

Thanks for the reply. Compressor will cost me a little over $100.

And yeah, the T30 is a two stage.

As to the Horse Power, keep in mind that they don't make horses like they use to. This is a huge motor. I have an original 1HP motor on a 40's 20" bandsaw, probably weighs 80lbs and will cut through anything I throw at it. That being said - I still know nothing about compressors. So as long as the motor isn't being bogged down, the HP isn't as much of an issue as the pulley ratio, right? Because the RPM would be the same. At least that makes sense in my mind.

As to hearing it run, I have not, and will listen closely for what you are describing. It's a bit of a drive and I'd rather not do it twice so I'm trying to go into the purchase as educated as possible.

Would I check oil in the tank by just blowing out some air?

Thanks for the thoughts.

 

[redmondjp]

Yes, if you can get the tank drain open, hopefully only water (which often looks white due to tiny air bubbles in it) comes out. If mostly oil, and the oil level in the pump crankcase is low, that indicates tired rings. But heck, for $100 if it doesn't make abnormal knocking sounds, and it makes air, it's hard to go wrong on that.

And I know what you are saying on the older motors - a 5HP motor from back in the 1940s is as big as a 25HP one is today! So that 1HP is probably equivalent to at least a modern 3HP one (my opinion, I don't have any test data to back that up).

 

[toddjb]

Perfect. Thanks

 

[Old Faithful]

Hey folks, so in my quest to find another vintage compressor I found this but have no info on it. It appears to be some sort of homemade machine, any ideas what it could be and its specs?

 

[Old Faithful]

I couldn't resist this beauty... For 20 cannuck dollars what did I have to loose? The flywheel by itself was worth it to me so I'm now the proud owner of yet another old machine to restore

Turns out the pump is an old refrigeration compressor made by Frigidaire and with a motor running at 1725 RPM with a 6 to 1 pulley ratio it is definitely the most silent compressor I've ever heard... Can hardly hear it over the quite hum of the electric motor

As for output... At less than 300 RPM I doubt it will push more than 1 or 2 CFMs, even if the pump is practically 18" high and 5" wide at the head and 8" deep

 

[yossarian19]

Anyone know what either of these are? The inline unit I know is a CH sold by sears, I *Think* the V unit is as well.
The inline came on a 30 gallon tank with a 230 / 15 amp motor (4.6 HP).
The "V" I got, with a 60 gallon tank, for $50. It seems fine but I don't know anything about it. It's got a name tag saying Craftsman # 283-18100 but that number turns up nothing at all.
Basically...
If I'm going to keep one and sell the other (assuming they both work) which one do I want?

 

[Old Faithful]

Anyone know what either of these are? The inline unit I know is a CH sold by sears, I *Think* the V unit is as well.
The inline came on a 30 gallon tank with a 230 / 15 amp motor (4.6 HP).
The "V" I got, with a 60 gallon tank, for $50. It seems fine but I don't know anything about it. It's got a name tag saying Craftsman # 283-18100 but that number turns up nothing at all.
Basically...
If I'm going to keep one and sell the other (assuming they both work) which one do I want?

I have no opinion on the first one but I'll tell you this: I'd keep the one that produces the most SCFMs with the youngest tank with thickest wall thickness (check the tank plate). Make sure you inspect the tank, this is what mostly fails on these old compressors. And do yourself a favour and resist the urge to say 'I can fix this' unless the price is really, really good. Replacing is doable but not trivial and quite labour intensive!

Your second one, I have one whose pump looks exactly like yours (mine has a 2 HP motor using 12A instead of your 15A) and I've measured its output at 8 SFMs at 90 PSI so I'm happy with it. It was essentially in great condition and a great buy IMO (at least for my area) considering it only required minor repairs and elbow grease and the aforementioned tank, which is still operational but that I am in the process of replacing with a younger tank in better shape (recuperated from a worn out airless compressor)

If yours came with the '3 HP' motor (from the specs I would surmise it is a 3HP motor - the 4.5 rating is useless), you may be in luck and gotten the rare, larger 3" bore pump that can produce up to 10.5 SCFMs at 90 PSI (or so). The more standard dual cylinder 2.75" dia by 2" stroke pump produces anywhere between roughly 4.5 and 8.5 SCFM depending on motor and motor pulley size. What is your main and motor pulley size and can you determine bore size? Cylinder wall at the thinnest is roughly 3/16"- 1/4" if that helps.

I acquired two of these similar inline compressors. The first one was a great buy at $30 because apart from elbow grease and minor work, it 'only' needed a tank (it is still operation with the bad tank but I'm not taking chances). The second one I got for $40 and thought I was making a good deal but upon closer inspection it turns out not only the tank is bad but also one of the crank main bearings surfaces is shot (not just replacing the needle bearing) so it essentially became a $40 door stop, which may be a source of replacement valves and a spare motor and other miscellaneous parts.

I still can't understand why they didn't make tanks like they do hot water tanks, with internal zinc plate coating. In any case, if you have an inspection camera I strongly recommend you remove one of the pipes and inspect the tank, most folks selling them online think they're great, they're not! In other words, tanks are problem #1 with these compressors, at least from my experience looking at several of them over the past 6 months. You can still find parts for the pumps such as valves, gaskets and drive belts.

Honestly, if I could get deals like the one you got for the V pump compressor in my area, I'd jump on it provided it was operational. How much did you pay for the inline compressor and what needs to be done on it?

 

[yossarian19]

The inline compressor, with 30 gal tank & 230 / 15a motor, was $30. It's the 3" bore. It leaked a lot of oil from the crankcase seam & needed some valve mounting threads heli-coiled. Also needs unloader valve installed. I've re-sealed & heli-coiled it, haven't hooked up control components yet. I decided to cheap out and not replace anything on it, just minimum repairs to make it work for now.

I'm still not sure what that V-twin compressor even is, so I'll probably try and set the inline up on the 60 gallon tank and cobble the V-twin onto the 30 gallon and then sell it.
The 2.5 hp, direct drive, oil free, 11 gallon POS I've got is obviously going to go as well.

 

[Old Faithful]

The inline compressor, with 30 gal tank & 230 / 15a motor, was $30. It's the 3" bore. It leaked a lot of oil from the crankcase seam & needed some valve mounting threads heli-coiled. Also needs unloader valve installed. I've re-sealed & heli-coiled it, haven't hooked up control components yet. I decided to cheap out and not replace anything on it, just minimum repairs to make it work for now.

I'm still not sure what that V-twin compressor even is, so I'll probably try and set the inline up on the 60 gallon tank and cobble the V-twin onto the 30 gallon and then sell it.
The 2.5 hp, direct drive, oil free, 11 gallon POS I've got is obviously going to go as well.

Wow! That was definitely a super bargain, at least for where I come from (Montreal area). Really difficult to find anything in my parts that isn't worn out and seriously overpriced...

For the pressure control, if you can clean out the contacts with a small file you'll be ahead, did that on mine and now it works great. The one way valve fell apart after a few minutes from weakening after 40 years. The rivet holding the gasket together just popped loose, so I took it apart and tapped a screw and it now works as good as new now. Sure beast buying a new one for $40.

I saw exactly ONE compressor similar to yours in the past 6 months (only 50km away) and by the time I saw the ad (the same day) and got a response from the seller later in the day it already had someone interested in it and by the time I was able to get back to the seller for an appointment it was already reserved for pick up the next day and seller told me he'd let me know if it was still available. Of course it was gone the next day. 25 years old, 20 gallon tank, 10.5 SCFM, 220V/15 amp motor, listed at $150.

I'm now looking at 40 year old one like my 'good one', asking price is $120, tank in unknown condition, seller can't or won't tell me anything about it, insists I take a look. Trouble is, it's more than 200km away and by the time I get there to take a look I'm already out $25 and that's just one way... Not counting the 'fun' of having to go through 4 bridges and the horrendous traffic problems we've been having around Montreal so it looks like I'm going to have to pass on that one too.

Glad to see you got yourself such a great deal

 

[fatman12]

I was given a Tecumseh T.P. Co. model 500-B Compressor pump and cant find any info. How much oil to fill. no drain or sight glass. seems to pump ok. Cleaned one litre of oil out of air tank

Thanks

 

[Old Faithful]

The way the head is configured and the amount of oil, I would say it's an old refrigeration compressor, which means it's meant to circulate the oil back into the pump, so the first thing I would do is open that thing to inspect its condition and make sure it has enough oil in the crankcase.

 

[fatman12]

I checked the oil in the pump and was 1/2 inch from bottom. I am not sure how full the pump should be and would compressor oil be ok.

Thanks

 

[On-Wheel]

It be great if someone would post pictures of this The Dayton Compressor Co unit.
https://fredericksburg.craigslist.org/tls/5295397912.html

 

[vintage garage]

I've got a Brunner 939 air compressor in absolute original condition. I'm wanting to learn more about the compressor and how to keep it running for another 100 years. Can anyone help or point me in the right direction?

 

[don long]

I've got a Brunner 939 air compressor in absolute original condition. I'm wanting to learn more about the compressor and how to keep it running for another 100 years. Can anyone help or point me in the right direction?

Keep it well lubed
I love those old compressors that sit on that ornate tank.

 

[vintage garage]

What type of oil do I use?

 

[don long]

Here is the old compressor that I am working on


before

before

 

[redmondjp]

What type of oil do I use?

Non-detergent 30W will work fine, or you can buy compressor oil at most home centers (for about 4x the cost).

 

[vintage garage]

Can I put 30W in the inboard and outboard bearings on the old motor as well?

 

[vintage garage]

Anyone know where I could find one of these?

 

[Old Faithful]

Can I put 30W in the inboard and outboard bearings on the old motor as well?

These old motors usually have bronze sleeve bearings that require just a few drops of SAE 20 motor oil every now and then, but they usually have a spring loaded cap for lubrication, I wasn't able to make out whether your motor is of that design. Larger motors of this type would use 30 weight.

Most compressor motors use ball bearings that are usually good for "life", in other words usually for about 5 years of normal use or decades under residential use. In other words their grease usually lasts as long as the ball bearings themselves, but you'll notice if they need replacing by the gravely sound the balls make they make when they're worn (the balls typically chip or develop flat spots).

 

[Old Faithful]

Anyone know where I could find one of these?

Aha, so it is indeed a cap for a sleeve bearing... Good luck finding a replacement! Perhaps a donor from an old furnace motor? It will look different but may be usable. You'd have to look and see.

 

[Old Faithful]

Here is the old compressor that I am working on


before

before

That is an exceptionally nice paint job here! How did you prep it to get to that point? Acid cleaning? Electrolysis? Bead blasting? Needle scaling? Tumbler?

 

[Old Faithful]

I checked the oil in the pump and was 1/2 inch from bottom. I am not sure how full the pump should be and would compressor oil be ok.

Thanks

You'd have to take it apart to see how it splashes the oil on its moving part... I haven't gotten to take apart mine yet, project for the dead of winter, still getting my yard cleaned up before the winter surprises me with snow ;-)

FYI I found quite a bit of oil at the bottom of the tank on mine when I did my initial investigation so I presume it will need some sort of way to add oil from time to time; after all these were designed to run in a closed loop. Since it is going to be mostly a conversation piece my main goal is to simply get the thing cleaned up and shined up like don long's vintage machine ;-)

 

[don long]

That is an exceptionally nice paint job here! How did you prep it to get to that point? Acid cleaning? Electrolysis? Bead blasting? Needle scaling? Tumbler?

First I dismantled it completely. Then It went into my blast room where I hit it with 80 grit garnet.
I blew it off and took a 3" grinding disc with 36 grit pad to it to remove all the casting seams. Then with a 50 grit pad I ground as much of the sand pitting out of it Then with my 3" sander I ran an 80 grit sand paper over the entire unit and repeated it with a 150 grit
Now it was ready for the 1st coat of automotive primer. Then back to sanding it with 220 disc and back to the primer again Then I wet sanded it with 600 and gave it 2 coats of PPG automotive paint

 

[Evolution-VII]

My uncle just gave this to me... anyone would know which brand this is and have more infos about it?

 

[Detective Coating]

I wouldn't quite say mine is vintage but anything older than me is antique! Picked up this beaut for $160 at a local auction from a paint company that went out of business. Ingersoll Rand 40hp rotary screw. 153 cfm I would love to completely restore it but it's our daily workhorse now. Thankfully we only had to unseize the minimum pressure valve with some Kroil and a BFH and change the oil ($300 -_- )

 

[Old Faithful]

I wouldn't quite say mine is vintage but anything older than me is antique! Picked up this beaut for $160 at a local auction from a paint company that went out of business. Ingersoll Rand 40hp rotary screw. 153 cfm I would love to completely restore it but it's our daily workhorse now. Thankfully we only had to unseize the minimum pressure valve with some Kroil and a BFH and change the oil ($300 -_- )

Man, it never ceases to amaze me the kind of deals you guys keep getting!

Or perhaps I should say, count your blessings, this is the "lucky find" thread so it seems, because in reality, what are the odds of anyone finding these unique pieces of machinery anywhere? Pretty slim for most of us I would presume

 

[Old Faithful]

Evolution-VII, I can't reply with quote, your pictures are too huge - but on the tank it probably says "Brunner". With 1/2 HP motor and looking at the size of the pump it sure wont push a lot of air, though.

 

[yaidunno]

Here is the old compressor that I am working on

Top notch work as usual Don. The compressor is looking awesome!

 

[Detective Coating]

Man, it never ceases to amaze me the kind of deals you guys keep getting!

Or perhaps I should say, count your blessings, this is the "lucky find" thread so it seems, because in reality, what are the odds of anyone finding these unique pieces of machinery anywhere? Pretty slim for most of us I would presume

Believe it or not, I just found another local auction with the exact same compressor! Guess who is getting a backup one

 

[Bigbandguy]

The one with the black tank looks like one I saw as a kid that had been made from a re-purposed refrigerator compressor. I don't remember a lot about it but it sure looked like that. There may have been one old unit that was suitable for that kind of re use. That sort of thing dates back to the tag end of the depression era when make do was the order of the day.

 

[tischrocks]

Anyone looking for a Kellogg 331tv, 80 gal tank and 5 hp single phase motor. I'm looking to down size. Can post some pictures in a day or so.

 

[wmchurch]

Trying to identify this beast. It was my fathers, believed to be from the 20's. The tank split about 30 years ago and it was sitting for a few years. I stripped it 20 years ago and freed it up by just pouring some Marvel in the cylinders and letting it sit. Painted it, made a new gasket out of cork and then it sat for that time.

I'd like to do a proper rebuild of it and get her running again, but don't know much about it. I don't have access to the original motor or anything else. I know it was a torquey little ****** and was big but I think it was only 110v ( I could be wrong, I was a child when it worked ).

Any thoughts?